Post AyMsOADaSOsIEX6dBQ by a1ba@idtech.space
(DIR) More posts by a1ba@idtech.space
(DIR) Post #AyMku0EyI2b8vCQNxA by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T13:57:27.156246Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
often these quake engines family trees (like that one on Wikipedia) are read like a fan fiction
(DIR) Post #AyMkvGshuAjGp1cDia by lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me
2025-09-19T13:58:08.550315Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@a1ba where's the lewd dammit
(DIR) Post #AyMkzRIV7Wf2HjfSk4 by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T13:58:44.318814Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@lanodan no good lewds, only inbreeding
(DIR) Post #AyMmcbMFkWNIjdf1MW by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T14:14:27.658970Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
also whoever made this family tree iteration is wrong herealice is direct descendant of fakk2 and it's quite easy to check: disassemble the binary or run `strings` or check the wikipedia
(DIR) Post #AyMmdqr5cFnF5ZgEcK by shpuld@shpposter.club
2025-09-19T14:17:20.693008Z
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@a1ba was it documented anywhere? good to know regardless!
(DIR) Post #AyMp5nUptimmgiizOS by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T14:21:36.994488Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld I don't see a direct source on Wikipedia, they just claim that "EA licensed Ritual's engine...", but the binaries themselves refer to Fakk2 a lot. Plus, it has similar if not compatible model formats.
(DIR) Post #AyMp5svFivt5W67elM by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T14:23:24.312244Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld the DLL interface (which still called fgame in Alice, f for fakk I guess) is compatible, as it only has new functions at the end of the struct.
(DIR) Post #AyMpHZf1AGgRFh6Qc4 by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T14:41:58.348637Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
I also wouldn't derive GoldSrc from QuakeWorld tbh.There isn't _a_lot_ of changes between NetQuake and QuakeWorld but Valve got engine license before QuakeWorld was a thing.
(DIR) Post #AyMpHacDcA2SDInhtA by shpuld@shpposter.club
2025-09-19T14:46:49.239528Z
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@a1ba I thought the protocol is closer to qw than nq, while also bringing in things from q2 as well
(DIR) Post #AyMpHerFqCRVN5rlse by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T14:46:23.649337Z
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that's what I meant when I said fan fiction and inbreeding, because it really depends on who you ask and licenses with id seems to include engine updates as well, not to mention FOSS versions where the fork could've taken core ideas from different id's games.
(DIR) Post #AyMqlNYmonmmMfxp9E by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T14:59:57.102095Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld I don't know about older HL protocols, I've only implemented into "current" 48-th protocol.I remember that current HL still handles protocol messages that were in NQ but not in QW and I checked right now, yeah, for example, svc_time is used to send server time to client, which isn't handled in QW. svc_clientdata exists in both NQ and GoldSrc but not in QW, though GoldSrc has completely different format based on their delta compression encoding.Though Valve definitely took prediction from QW and improved it. Not sure what could be from Q2 honestly, they might've took delta encoding but it's completely different in GoldSrc.
(DIR) Post #AyMqxSmVEQng278r0y by shpuld@shpposter.club
2025-09-19T15:05:35.005714Z
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@a1ba prediction is the big thing yeah. I can't remember what engine features it got from q2 or where I heard that, back in the inside3d days probably, so could be rumors. appreciate your insight!
(DIR) Post #AyMrBqIuZV8n2e9ojQ by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:07:34.724117Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld >Not sure what could be from Q2 honestly, they might've took delta encoding but it's completely different in GoldSrc.nevermind, the idea of delta encoding was in QW as well. Though again, delta was completely rewritten by them
(DIR) Post #AyMsNxnGeQgvhQhRUe by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:10:16.997745Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld yeah, nobody could really tell two decades later. Those who knew don't remember and we can only guess.I personally wish they took Q2BSP because hulls are ass. Well, at least they did for Source.
(DIR) Post #AyMsO3qK9yhYSeAy5g by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:14:38.324486Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld >we can only guessnot to mention there is no source code releases of in-between engine versions. Returning to fakk2, it has some functions that GPL release of Quake III doesn't have, but older versions do.I also wish there was larger reverse engineering community around these games, not just developing cheats for Call of Duty but actually preserving these old games. And that's more doable, again because there is GPL releases of most id engines that were licensed to third-party studios.
(DIR) Post #AyMsOADaSOsIEX6dBQ by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:15:58.637050Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld sorry, I can yap about this for hours xD
(DIR) Post #AyMsQUtkXYAAwzwKtU by shpuld@shpposter.club
2025-09-19T15:22:11.668415Z
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@a1ba yeah ikr, baking so many different hulls is just lunacy
(DIR) Post #AyMsVrBH7ZRzVUh1Iu by shpuld@shpposter.club
2025-09-19T15:23:09.444479Z
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@a1ba dont apologize, I love this stuff and not many people know as much as you!
(DIR) Post #AyMtPJLm5ceGne2wz2 by shpuld@shpposter.club
2025-09-19T15:32:59.493585Z
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@a1ba I feel thr fact that the official idtech engines are open source just diverts 99% of the attention away from the proprietary foeks
(DIR) Post #AyMuYKI83kuyHNCi5g by Theuaredead@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:42:35.617590Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@a1ba @shpuld The only thing I've been able to directly pinpoint to Q2 is QGL being used in HL. However, they could have redacted that code or removed that code by the time of Quake's GPL release.The Skybox code also "comes" from Quake 2, but I have no doubt in my mind that it came from the Quake 2 ifdef seen in the Quake code.
(DIR) Post #AyMvCulXrrPYzCJjFY by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:49:27.152355Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld exactly, that's why even HL didn't got good treatment from this side of community for a long time.
(DIR) Post #AyMvEP4WfxG7GhuBbk by Theuaredead@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:48:03.480298Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@a1ba @shpuld This also does NOT include anything changed in SDK 2/HL 1.1, as that had a large refactor to the code. SDK 1/HL 1.0 is very much just Quake (NetQuake at that.) My reverse engineering knowledge comes more so from pre-release HL and 1.0. Have dabbled a little bit into 1.1 era, but not enough to concretely point to things.
(DIR) Post #AyMvFhgCygw5Gk9PRw by a1ba@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:53:33.595834Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Theuaredead @shpuld my friend was reverse engineering leaked nettest1, and it was pretty much netquake to him. Though, he never published anything unfortunately, my only source is like chat with him.
(DIR) Post #AyMwY0ZzY1Oj3IXFWC by Theuaredead@idtech.space
2025-09-19T15:56:50.991278Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@a1ba @shpuld Don't doubt it, I've documented a large chunk of the earliest Half-Life: Day One release and it is just Quake. Valve did as much equal changes to the code as Xatrix did for Kingpin with Quake 2.