Post AxBkaABTHhR7CLOoam by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
(DIR) More posts by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
(DIR) Post #Ax2Z7jNQVn6E1wakUa by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-10T22:19:38Z
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If you want to get a sense of what the Matrix network will be like once Matrix 2 is fully rolled out, get yourself ElementX, and try it with an account on the matrix.org homeserver. I haven't had a chance to really stress test it yet. But from what I've experienced so far, it's a *huge* improvement on Matrix 1.0.#decentralisation #chat #Matrix
(DIR) Post #Ax4mftJVlDaWPnIcjY by funkylab@mastodon.social
2025-08-12T00:00:52Z
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@strypey trying to test drive it now for productive use :)have you figured out where they hid the Spaces? Can't really deal with an unsorted list of around 80 rooms, several of them quite active, without the spaces hierarchy
(DIR) Post #Ax4sbvmXF2rQdWMzuC by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T01:07:25Z
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@funkylab > have you figured out where they hid the Spaces?May not be implemented yet, or exposed in the interface. ElementX is a prototype, after all. When it's ready for production all the new hotness will be folded back into vanilla Element, and the Matrix SDK it's based on.
(DIR) Post #Ax5QHrNJJUnRcQAk1w by allpurposemat@mastodon.gamedev.place
2025-08-12T07:24:41Z
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@strypey it really is a UX and performance uplift... if only it supported calls. Having to send a Jitsi link every time is pain :p
(DIR) Post #Ax5ZDja5FTEzsKFpWi by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T09:04:48Z
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@ariedov > isn't the idea to not have to use the centralized server?That's a different thing, P2P Matrix;https://arewep2pyet.com/Which doesn't seem to be getting much development at present.
(DIR) Post #Ax5ZeQVMHVpiWvlvQu by bboett@mastodon.online
2025-08-12T09:09:37Z
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@strypey the ui is nicer indeed, but spaces are missing and (video ) calls are complicated: no calling tone, on the other side, no ringing tone, except if the app is active, but the quality is a hughe improvement, once you contacted your contact through legacy element to inform them that you are about to call :'(
(DIR) Post #Ax5ZojkLb0VP6ShQ0m by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T09:11:31Z
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@allpurposemat > if only it supported callsI'm pretty sure it does. Matrix 2.0 definitely does, as demonstrated by;https://call.element.io/But maybe calling on ElementX only works to client/server combo that also supports Matrix 2.0 calling?
(DIR) Post #Ax5azlJeCXbf6t222S by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T09:24:44Z
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@bboett > spaces are missinghttps://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/115013113977059648> calls are complicatedhttps://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/115015017517521337
(DIR) Post #Ax5b9xNkC8PHQboEAS by allpurposemat@mastodon.gamedev.place
2025-08-12T09:26:32Z
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@strypey indeed that is a pretty good call experience! Sadly afaik not part of Matrix standard… Hence, other clients don't support it, and I can't call anyone (or receive calls on PC since I use a native client over the electron Element app).Also, I looked into self hosting MatrixRTC infra and it looks like it depends on a proprietary service for something called "SFU".So at the moment sadly not a solution, unless everyone you know uses Element X and is on the big matrix.org homeserver.
(DIR) Post #Ax5dUzPQ3MdThjkXBI by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T09:52:47Z
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(1/2)@allpurposemat > not part of Matrix standardNot part of the Matrix 1.0 spec, no. call.element.io is a testbed for Matrix 2.0 calling. ElementX is a testbed for 2.0 features in general, which is why the OP suggests testing it as a preview of a 2.0 experience.> other clients don't support it... yet. They will if they implement Matrix 2.0. Any that don't do that will still work with vanilla Element for 1:1 calling using Matrix 1.0. Even when ElementX functionality is folded back in.
(DIR) Post #Ax5ds9FpcADEtqJ9bU by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T09:56:57Z
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(2/2)> it looks like it depends on a proprietary service@lightweight hosts our Matrix server, and wouldn't have adopted it if there was a single proprietary dependency. I presume SFU = Selective Forwarding Unit. Maybe this one?https://github.com/matrix-org/waterfall> at the moment sadly not a solutionRight. It's a *prototype*. I'm not sure how I could have made that any clearer.
(DIR) Post #Ax5l3HazdpO9dOSk9Q by allpurposemat@mastodon.gamedev.place
2025-08-12T11:17:21Z
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@strypey Please correct me if I'm wrong, but don't these need to be merged into the spec for MatrixRTC to become part of Matrix?https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-spec-proposals/pull/4143https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-spec-proposals/pull/4195This was cited as the main reason when I asked client devs whether it'd be supported.As for the SFU, I found the comment about it: https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-spec-proposals/pull/4195#discussion_r1908722786Looks like I was wrong about it being proprietary, rather it is an open-core project. I guess as long as the part I'm hosting is free, it should be fine...
(DIR) Post #Ax6RgGmUndIyTd7EkC by exstral@fosstodon.org
2025-08-12T19:14:52Z
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@strypey @ariedov This is incorrect. P2P matrix is about running the whole matrix server on your device, making the network fully peer to peer. By default matrix is federated, which means you are free to select your own homeserver. This is supported by all matrix versions. The homeserver concept is explained here https://matrix.org/docs/matrix-concepts/elements-of-matrix/Hope that helps 💜✨
(DIR) Post #Ax6hqi0G2gLl4CYJPs by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T22:16:11Z
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@exstral> By default matrix is federated, which means you are free to select your own homeserver. This is supported by all matrix versionsYou're right, I misunderstood what @ariedov was asking. My apologies. In answer to the question you actually asked ...Matrix 2.0 is still in the final stages of being standardised and not all software has implemented it yet. Using the ElementX/matrix.org is one way to get an incomplete preview of some of the performance improvements it's bringing.
(DIR) Post #Ax6mM20O7mVTtbnwxc by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-12T23:06:38Z
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@allpurposemat > Please correct me if I'm wrong, but don't these need to be merged into the spec for MatrixRTC to become part of Matrix?You're not wrong, you just seem to be ignoring most of what I'm saying;https://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/115015179764563782FYI It gets hard to keep assuming good faith when replies continually ignore the context of the thread.Is English your second language? Do I need to explain what a "prototype' is? Genuine question, I'm trying to understand the disconnect here.
(DIR) Post #Ax6sQ8U4ZtOosB1ua0 by allpurposemat@mastodon.gamedev.place
2025-08-13T00:14:37Z
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@strypey my bad, it appears I indeed missed that reply! It comes off a little condescending to question my English level, though…My point being: MatrixRTC being a prototype is totally understandable, but that being *the only option* on Element X makes calling most folks impossible. So, my family and I cannot switch to it and are stuck on "Matrix 1.0" (read: what's actually in the spec) clients, at least until "Matrix 2.0" is actually released (despite reading it's finally ready for years).
(DIR) Post #Ax6vVv0Rtu7wfjcen2 by allpurposemat@mastodon.gamedev.place
2025-08-13T00:22:41Z
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@strypey I don't object to the prototype being made available. The new stuff is great and very exciting for an ecosystem I have stuck with for many years! I object to users having no choice whether to use the prototype (staying on unmaintained Element legacy is not an option), leaving behind clients that implement the actual Matrix spec which right now only includes 1.0 calling. It'll be awesome to see this finally merged, so that calls can finally "just work"! Until then, we are stuck on 1.0.
(DIR) Post #Ax6vVwRmXlaL8nQ024 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-13T00:49:15Z
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@allpurposemat> It comes off a little condescending to question my English levelSorry, it wasn't intended that way. Not reading all my replies explains the out-of-context reply I was trying to make sense of.> Until then, we are stuck on 1.0Yes. You can't use 2.0 with full compatibility until it's implemented across the whole ecosystem, which in some cases won't happen until the 2.0 spec is finalised. Sorry that frustrates you.In the meantime ...https://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/115006791923187568We good?
(DIR) Post #Ax7XwnKsK9ngxXQ3ns by allpurposemat@mastodon.gamedev.place
2025-08-13T07:59:41Z
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@strypey we are indeed on the same page :)
(DIR) Post #Ax8d9dUevF6v7ytkBs by tuxsec@fosstodon.org
2025-08-13T20:32:57Z
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@strypeyWhat's so good about it? It's not much faster than regular Element, it doesn't support essential features like threads and spaces yet, and is also missing features like not showing inline images immediately. I have Element and Element X both and I never use X because it just isn't ready for prime time (even though the foundation says it is).
(DIR) Post #Ax8svDmNKSgQaZKia8 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-13T23:29:45Z
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@tuxsec > It's not much faster than regular ElementI have both ElementX and SchildiChat on my Android, both logged into Matrix servers running the latest Synapse (AFAIK). ElementX opens and syncs noticeably faster, by quite a margin. Although the 2 accounts have very different numbers of public rooms open, so I guess it's not an apples with apples comparison.> it doesn't support essential features like threads and spacesNot essential to my use case, also;https://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/115013113977059648
(DIR) Post #Ax8tCUMAwp5yvSJPw8 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-13T23:32:53Z
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@tuxsec > [ElementX] it just isn't ready for prime time (even though the foundation says it is)Where do they say that? This seems very unlikely, given that X is a *prototype*, and when the features are ready for primetime, they'll be folded back into mainline element. Just like the last ElementX.Anyway, even if they say that, I didn't;https://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/115006791923187568
(DIR) Post #Ax9UdBR36MkqMgBT04 by tuxsec@fosstodon.org
2025-08-14T06:32:15Z
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@strypeySorry, not the matrix foundation but the Element company, last year at the Matrix Conference: https://element.io/blog/deep-dive-into-element-x/According to them, EX is production ready and people should not be using old Element anymore. They purposely call it "Classic Element" on their app download page (https://element.io/app) and put it way down on the bottom.
(DIR) Post #Ax9UqD9c1SuFSaEx04 by tuxsec@fosstodon.org
2025-08-14T06:34:36Z
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@strypeyIn any case, you got me to try it again and it's indeed a bit faster while syncing. I'll see if I can remember to use it for rooms without threads :)
(DIR) Post #AxBcWyIQEB31pIcLUO by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-15T07:10:11Z
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(1/2)@tuxsec > According to them, EX is production ready and people should not be using old Element anymoreWell, well. @element have made a liar of me. This is not how the last ElementX development went (as they approached Matrix 1.0), so it's the opposite of what I expected. It's absolutely not true that it's ready for production use, as it's lacking a number of major features (as identified in comments), as well as backwards compatibility with Matrix 1.0 (which we have a right to expect).
(DIR) Post #AxBcli5albrruBe0O0 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-15T07:12:53Z
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(2/2)I'm detecting desperate attempts to satisfy VCs wanting to start seeing a return on the funding they put into Element as a startup. Which means it's more important than ever that the wider community of people using Matrix-based services takes charge of the Foundation, and ensures that it's serving our needs, rather than being beholden to Element's VCs.@matrix
(DIR) Post #AxBeCLXaoEIZkI0SQa by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-15T07:28:54Z
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@tuxsec > I'll see if I can remember to use it for rooms without threadsI use ElementX almost exclusively for 1:1 DMs, and I suspect this is the market they're pivoting to. Leaving the team chat uses cases to other outfits like Gitter;https://blog.gitter.im/2023/02/13/gitter-has-fully-migrated-to-matrix/... ProcessOne (eJabberD);https://www.process-one.net/blog/matrix-gateway-setup-with-ejabberd/... RocketChat;https://www.rocket.chat/blog/federation-at-rocket-chat-the-shift-to-a-native-solution... and so on.#Matrix #Element #ElementX
(DIR) Post #AxBi6ZJL6CKWX2q8ES by tuxsec@fosstodon.org
2025-08-15T08:12:37Z
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@strypeyPlease also note their replies to my comments: https://floss.social/@hywan/115031236968643972Apparently they're actually (finally) working on the missing features, and even close to finishing threads! This is great news, and imho not emphasized nearly enough!
(DIR) Post #AxBjyMVH26VqOydX1s by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-15T08:33:36Z
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(1/?)Hi @allpurposemat, it's been pointed out to me that ElementX is now being called a production-ready replacement for "Element Classic", no longer a prototype (despite being wildly incomplete);https://element.io/blog/deep-dive-into-element-x/A bunch of your comments make much more sense to me now. You were right. My apologies, both for the misinformation, and the terse exchange that ensued when you were confused by it. #MeaCulpa
(DIR) Post #AxBkCc5dsZGcnTRXo8 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-15T08:36:11Z
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(2/?)> As for the SFU ... Looks like I was wrong about it being proprietary, rather it is an open-core projectMy reading of the issue discussion you linked is that a proposed change to the Matrix spec includes a reference to another protocol. It is an open protocol, but not standardised independently of the company who created it. So the concern is the risk of that company enshittifying, and putting future versions of the protocol under a proprietary license (presumably involving patents?).
(DIR) Post #AxBkaABTHhR7CLOoam by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-15T08:40:26Z
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(3/?)But as was pointed out in the discussion, the license on any already published versions of the protocol spec cannot be revoked. Just like the copyright owners of a free codebase can put future versions under a proprietary license, but can't backdate it to versions released under the free license.So if the worst were to happen, the last freely-licensed version of the protocol could be forked by the Matrix stewards for their use, separately, or integrated into the Matrix spec.
(DIR) Post #AxBkm2HcU9fmAXw7MG by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-15T08:42:36Z
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(4/?)But that's very much a back-of-the-envelope understanding. Once again, I could easily be wrong. Take with grain of salt as appropriate ; )
(DIR) Post #AxGEH6nLR3qGRSmfpY by media_dept@mastodon.social
2025-08-17T12:31:57Z
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@strypey I still don't understand if Matrix is noiw banned in Uk along with WhatsApp and Signal and everything?
(DIR) Post #AxHQddXPlswwyInkqO by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2025-08-18T02:25:14Z
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@media_dept > I still don't understand if Matrix is noiw banned in Uk along with WhatsApp and Signal and everything?I haven't heard of any app being banned in the UK. AFAIK they've all rolled out changes to their ToS to cosplay compliance with the Online Surveillance Act.(UK authoritarians euphemistically call it; "Online Safety" Act, but the name I use is more accurate.)