Post AuV7Mc4JDCPKI8EhGa by sleet01@fosstodon.org
(DIR) More posts by sleet01@fosstodon.org
(DIR) Post #AuV6Nyvpan5tXIMLfk by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-26T23:07:58Z
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When Atta queens found their nest, they carry a sample of the symbiotic fungi in their mouth. They then lay a few unfertilized eggs and inoculate them with the fungi to get the culture going. The fungi that Atta grow *can consume their eggs* The queens also lay some fertilized eggs, the first workers and these are kept clean and *not* consumed by the fungi. I'm surprised by this because the fugi is where the eggs of these ants are generally kept. How do they keep it from consuming them?
(DIR) Post #AuV6VN5w9ZJUVGbt0i by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-26T23:09:18Z
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I suspect it's as simple as breaking the eggs, or not keeping them clean of the mycelium? In mature colonies if an egg fails it become more fertilizer easily enough. It'd be nice to know the details of how this works... is anyone familiar?
(DIR) Post #AuV6wgMobjlW5sWlrk by MishaVanMollusq@sfba.social
2025-05-26T23:14:12Z
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@futurebird They cracked the chemical code of “no eat this”
(DIR) Post #AuV7GxxSuiyARYLI0W by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-26T23:17:54Z
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@MishaVanMollusq They are doing gardening on a level that is so far beyond any human idea of farming it's crazy. They manage PH levels, humidity, bacteria (beneficial and not), and groom individual strands of mycelium because they are ants and tiny enough to do that.
(DIR) Post #AuV7J5nminerLkpQFE by waitworry@sakurajima.moe
2025-05-26T23:18:03Z
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@futurebird maybe the fungus just behaves itself as part of the symbiotic relationship
(DIR) Post #AuV7Mc4JDCPKI8EhGa by sleet01@fosstodon.org
2025-05-26T23:18:53Z
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@futurebird Not familiar, but I found one semi-academic article that states some Atta species can excrete antibiotic saliva, and even tune the concentrations to deal with different variations of common fungal threats.I'd assume that they can also prevent their fertilized eggs from being consumed via the same mechanism, although it seems like this aspect of their life cycle has not been the subject of very much research.
(DIR) Post #AuV7OJtfkCsmVq4hP6 by cinebox@masto.hackers.town
2025-05-26T23:19:12Z
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@futurebird @MishaVanMollusq but do they wear tiny sun hats
(DIR) Post #AuV7Pdb3zCihtrzzma by xyhhx@438punk.house
2025-05-26T23:19:26Z
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@futurebird incredible 👀@MishaVanMollusq
(DIR) Post #AuV7VqHtiN9KzuzcrQ by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-26T23:20:35Z
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@waitworry Maybe? The thing is fungal infections are a risk for arthropods in a way that they just aren't for creatures like mammals. This is because we can regulate our body temperature and a lot of that is about limiting what can and cannot "grow" in the human body. This is also why the one part of the human body that does get attacked by fungi are feet and toenails. They aren't warm enough basically.
(DIR) Post #AuV8hdEu9a8lxTmKrg by kevinriggle@ioc.exchange
2025-05-26T23:33:53Z
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@futurebird @waitworry 👀👀👀
(DIR) Post #AuV8rRQcvAmQDtwHY0 by Tharpa@hear-me.social
2025-05-26T23:35:35Z
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@futurebird @MishaVanMollusq Who teaches them this wisdom?
(DIR) Post #AuV9Brfd4111P2h8hE by dx@social.ridetrans.it
2025-05-26T23:39:17Z
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@futurebird I used to play a game called “Atta Ants” and wondered why it was named that. It never occurred to me that “Atta” might be a type of ant.
(DIR) Post #AuVC3DmvlEUFFwgEhk by Lazarou@mastodon.social
2025-05-27T00:11:25Z
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@futurebird @MishaVanMollusq Speaking of Insect Civilisations, (sort of) , are you aware of this dude and his experiences on writing a book about them? I think there is a market for this sort of thing tbh.....us weirdos on Mastodon but it's a market! https://www.centauri-dreams.org/2025/05/09/writing-a-social-insect-civilization/
(DIR) Post #AuVld3rDepVLHEVliK by notsoloud@expressional.social
2025-05-27T06:50:01Z
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@futurebirdPotentially, the fertilization can make the eggs grow some fungicide?Normally, fungi develop resistance quickly enough, but in this case it would lower their fitness.
(DIR) Post #AuVpRjFKLgEDz3dhui by llewelly@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T07:32:52Z
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@futurebird Any idea what percent of newly founded colonies need to succeed (that is, produce additional queens) in order to maintain overall species population?
(DIR) Post #AuVqqm7osk1g6edQ0G by llewelly@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T07:48:36Z
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@futurebird @waitworry I wonder if comparative studies have been done to compare effectiveness of lab rat body temperature regulation for disease prevention, with ant colony temperature regulation for disease prevention?I'd be surprised if the lab rat body temperature regulation wasn't more effective, particularly for fungal disease. But surely the effectiveness of ant colony temperature regulation wouldn't be zero, and it might be closer than expected to what lab rats achieve.
(DIR) Post #AuWHiNs9rlXLKlX4me by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T12:49:37Z
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@llewelly For Atta it’s less than 1/10,000 the success rate is horrible. The queens are like seeds and many do not land on fertile ground. Or there is another ant colony there already. or the birds get them. The strategy is having a queen in every possible location ready to go— so that all locations where an ant colony might be successful are populated. Queens try to get underground and hidden as soon as they are mated. They don’t dither and search for the perfect location.
(DIR) Post #AuWI3arEmb9NgiDPPs by australopithecus@mastodon.social
2025-05-27T12:26:04Z
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@llewelly @futurebird Maybe I'm misunderstanding the question, but isn't this just simple replacement: one new successful colony per old colony?
(DIR) Post #AuWI3bhhdX7MJQlJC4 by llewelly@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T12:41:27Z
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@australopithecus @futurebird imagine an ant species in which an average colony sends out 10 queens. Now imagine half die before founding a colony (let's blame bird predation). Since 5 colonies got founded, only 20% (1 of 5) need survive to produce additional queens, on average. These are all totally invented numbers, I'm asking what real world numbers might be.
(DIR) Post #AuWI3cKhIYJGGN0RyS by australopithecus@mastodon.social
2025-05-27T12:47:22Z
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@llewelly @futurebird Ah, I see, you're basically looking for a} actual numbers of new queens sent out, and b) percent of those that survive long enough to start a new colony.
(DIR) Post #AuWI3dF3uzOd5BNSpU by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T12:53:20Z
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@australopithecus @llewelly The book I’m reading says this:
(DIR) Post #AuWI4VGh38mqdsYWrw by llewelly@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T12:53:30Z
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@futurebird Thank you.in that case, I guess it may be that if some colonies are lost becaue the symbiotic fungus gets out of control and eats all the eggs, that might be tolerated in an evolutionary sense, because the other dangers are so much greater.
(DIR) Post #AuWJ1DhpzNK9G9FbXM by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T13:04:14Z
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@australopithecus @llewelly That’s one of Alex’s photos he has a bunch in this book which is very good: “The Leafcutter Ants” by Hölldobler and Wilson 2011 Absolutely essential for any ant library.
(DIR) Post #AuWLS1VjddFXADUxmK by log@mastodon.sdf.org
2025-05-27T13:31:22Z
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@futurebird @australopithecus @llewelly But did the fungus survive? Did anyone check to see if the fungus survived?!
(DIR) Post #AuWe4iyoGhcs9whYv2 by keithmann@mastodon.online
2025-05-27T17:00:01Z
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(DIR) Post #AuWwwGvSaSJ9xoolt2 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2025-05-27T20:31:28Z
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@nickgully @australopithecus @llewelly *slow clap*now get out