Post AcLLf7TmL06nitKA5I by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
(DIR) More posts by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
(DIR) Post #AcJJa27UFTNfQcQNIu by andymoose@mastodon.social
2023-11-29T20:46:33Z
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What’s so depressing is that as a species if we wanted to we could wipe out SARS2 like we did with that strain of flu a couple of years ago. Imagine lifting everyone’s lives up with this one action. But no, better to pretend it’s all fine and keep getting sick while millions are denied any form of a life.
(DIR) Post #AcJJa2uPJaVpsLJRYW by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-29T21:01:29Z
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@andymoose COVID research scientist here.We cant and we didnt.The flu strain from a couple years ago H1N1 is still alive and kicking just like SARS-COV- isNeither was ever an option to eliminate entirely with current technology, we knew this very early on in our studies,
(DIR) Post #AcJLs5ub5Wd6JI8S4O by andymoose@mastodon.social
2023-11-29T21:27:10Z
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@freemo can’t win don’t try. Got it.
(DIR) Post #AcJM1MpVYbDJO1B0T2 by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-29T21:28:49Z
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@andymoose No one said that,.. You can "win"... winning doesnt mean eradication. Winning means having good treatments and plans to handle the disease well, just as we have for H1N1.Don't try or expect what is literally not possible though, so in that sense, yea, dont "try" (as in waste your time) on a goal that isnt physically possible.
(DIR) Post #AcJM6tvNwGifTZZ2kS by andymoose@mastodon.social
2023-11-29T21:29:48Z
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@freemo so treatments but no mitigation. Let ‘er rip - that’s your professional view?
(DIR) Post #AcJMP1jXdz6guKfSL2 by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-29T21:33:05Z
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@andymoose What, where are you coming up with this nonsense. Please show me where I said no mitigation was ok? Your just saying random nonsense things that have nothign to do with anything I even said, what is even going on here
(DIR) Post #AcJQMzgegK55nWbU4O by andymoose@mastodon.social
2023-11-29T22:17:33Z
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@freemo you only talk of treatments. I see no mention of prevention in what you said.
(DIR) Post #AcJQnzNNwfKQeWSjRY by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-29T22:22:26Z
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@andymoose Fair, yes prevention is important to. Vaccines, access to them, and even some general things like better ventilation are all good steps to take. Even just better hygene practices like not working if you feel sick and washing yoru hands more are all good things for a society to do even if COVID werent a concern.
(DIR) Post #AcKvgUsWEEQbm7tOF6 by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T15:43:08Z
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@freemo @andymoose I suspect the reference was to the Yamagata strain.
(DIR) Post #AcL5uPx4LEDs5jIUSW by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T17:37:43Z
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@DavidM_yeg Ahh ok, yea in that case the yamagata strain was just replaced with two new active strains. Nothing unusual about strains being replaced with new strains, that happens no matter what we do and seen several strains of covid be eliminated by that metric.@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcL9eiIeksuIBGA5bc by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T18:19:39Z
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@freemo @andymoose Of course that doesn’t invalidate the basic sentiment in the OP: the high level of illness, disability, and death we are experiencing from Covid is absolutely a choice. We have tools that could significantly reduce this burden, both at an individual and a population level, and largely we simply refuse to use them.Imagine a world where we continued to care enough…
(DIR) Post #AcLA4C9kt2ay1C9I5g by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T18:24:19Z
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@andymoose @freemo It wasn’t just that a somewhat obscure strain was eliminated… here in Alberta, we skipped an entire ‘flu season, with 0 lab recorded cases in 20-21. We weren’t “shut down”, we weren’t being locked away in isolation, we weren’t living pathetic lives that were only a shadow of their former selves: we were instead taking very simple common-sense precautions against airborne diseases.
(DIR) Post #AcLA7w1GpDet83xn4i by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T18:24:59Z
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@DavidM_yeg I am not sure how you think the mutation of strains forming more varied genoms less able to respond to a single vaccine is an example of the OP.Obviously the OP's later comments about engaging more with preventative care is certainly valid, the idea that we can eliminate viruses that way is simply not factual and an example of a flu recombinating into new forms (strains) is hardly a good example.If you want a good example of preventative care eliminating a virus you can look at small pox, which we did eliminate and not just rearrange the strains.The problem is neither the flu nor small pox is representative of COVID so sadly while we knew small pox could be eliminated once the science understoof the problem we likewise know COVID (like most viruses) cant be with current tech.@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLAHdCNegeJeYmeKe by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T18:26:43Z
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@DavidM_yeg If alberta wasnt in lockdown at a time that most of the world was, sadly thats not a great example either. You were more than likely benefiting off the rest of the worlds lock down and your own commons-sense methods likely helped to keep you further isolated but only protected you to the extreme you did due to worldwide lock downs.@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLBGtI2RVsdDwdnRg by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T18:37:48Z
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@freemo @andymoose At this point Covid is with us for the long haul. I think this is where the message around a ‘new normal’ was mishandled. It appears people have decided a ‘new normal’ actually just means the old normal but with a lot more disease, suffering, and disruption.I imagine a ‘new normal’ in which we adjust our society to reality and stop mindlessly sharing respiratory viruses. We have the tools to bring Rt below 1 for most of them most of the time.
(DIR) Post #AcLCHb4Jm55QxI7jqi by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T18:49:07Z
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@freemo @andymoose Sorry the world was *not* in ‘lockdown’ during the ‘20-‘21 ‘flu season, especially our largest neighbour to the south …unless by ‘lockdown’ you mean ‘required masks in schools and public places’ in which case we shouldn’t continue this conversation.
(DIR) Post #AcLGrY40p8QPsSNa3k by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T19:40:27Z
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@DavidM_yegIn the USA the lockdown was maintained until August 2020. So the lockdown basically existed right up to the flu season. Were you expecting the flu to instantly spike back to baseline levels once lock down ends? It takes time for viruses to start spreading again, it isnt an instant process you know, and with the lockdowns literally ending right as flu season begins means you are going to have a much reduced incident.Also you are flat out wrong about the 0 flu cases. It wasn’t just that a somewhat obscure strain was eliminated… here in Alberta, we skipped an entire ‘flu season, with 0 lab recorded cases in 20-21.Alberta’s 2021 flu season had 2,906 confirmed flu cases resuling in 523 hospitalizations. Anf thats just confirmed cases.https://www.alberta.ca/influenza-the-flu@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLHip6MCxsy4Dsamm by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T19:50:02Z
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@DavidM_yeg unless by ‘lockdown’ you mean ‘required masks in schools and public places’ in which case we shouldn’t continue this conversation.Just to be clear, no this isnt what I mean. I am talking about where movement itself is restricted (such as cancelling public events or shutting down non essential workplaces)@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLJhyQYFXcebp31lY by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T20:12:16Z
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@freemo @andymoose From that the website you just linked to… 0 lab confirmed cases from Aug 2020 to Aug 2021
(DIR) Post #AcLK1Acl7sSrwHua0W by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T20:15:48Z
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@freemo @andymoose As the chairman at the time of a church congregation, I am very aware of the various measures in place as navigating them was very much my responsibility. There were no movement restrictions (though there were reduced occupation capacities for buildings) during that ‘flu season.
(DIR) Post #AcLKBONQqeurULcI8e by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:17:39Z
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@DavidM_yeg How does you being the chairman of a chrch congregation give you knowledge about **world-wide** movement restrictions? We are talking about how the world still being in lock down up to the start of the season (including in the USA) being a factor. Not to mention we havent even addressed when alberta lockdowns might have ended, as I dont have that info.@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLKWGFiFZc6N7xOl6 by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:21:25Z
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@DavidM_yeg This seems valid, my mistake. I was reading from the wrong column.However now looking at the correct data it seems, and unspuprisingly, that 2022-023 has been the deadliest flu season on record for alberta. This goes to show the fundemental point, lockdowns will result in decline in numbers but **not** elimination. Once lock downs are removed the rates will come back up and even slyrocket and over time result in no real gains.To put it in some perspective the 2023 flu https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-flu-season-deaths-1.6797449@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLKc9TUMYVf5YD3PE by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T20:22:30Z
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@freemo @andymoose It doesn’t 🙄I wait for you to address the “flat out wrong” statement first though.
(DIR) Post #AcLKj7KCknloRrBjua by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:23:43Z
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@DavidM_yeg What do you mean, that was already addressed in my other response here:https://qoto.org/@freemo/111501356942640679@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLLf7TmL06nitKA5I by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T20:34:14Z
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@freemo @andymoose I think we’re done. My point is that when people adapt their movement patterns and take precautions against airborne spread, rates plummet. Maintaining the measures that work for long periods will mean long term reductions.Continuing to use an inflammatory term like lockdown as a broad and blanket term for responsible measures is misleading.
(DIR) Post #AcLLqpM5Y3KkzHJGtM by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:36:17Z
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@DavidM_yegI have clearly described what i mean by lockdown, and you aking up fictional things I said to win is childish to say the least.I defined lockdown clearly as: Just to be clear, no this isnt what I mean. I am talking about where movement itself is restricted (such as cancelling public events or shutting down non essential workplaces)The fact that your having a tantrum about lockdown literally meaning restricted public movement and shutting down businesses is laughable.You are right, we are done here.@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLLxIaTmE71O27vUm by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:37:33Z
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@DavidM_yegI do find it funny though that you ignore all the actual facts when talking to an actual published COVODI research scientists…. really showing your colors there.@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLM163KK3ovfYQmaO by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:38:03Z
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@DavidM_yegI do find it funny though that you ignore all the actual facts when talking to an actual published COVID research scientists…. really showing your colors there.But yea I’m the one being inflammatory, LOL@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLMGYdcKE4mfWmI9g by andymoose@mastodon.social
2023-11-30T20:41:01Z
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@freemo @DavidM_yeg just my 2 cents here but "lockdown" is all things to all people. IMO "lockdown" is what my parents faced in Athens, Greece - they had to stay in their home and if they wanted to leave to go grocery shopping or for a walk they had to send a text message to a number setup for tracking these things. People would be approached by the police when out and it was literally a "papers please" thing.
(DIR) Post #AcLMZsfq3ZgSJL1ywS by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:44:29Z
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@andymoose > People would be approached by the police when out and it was literally a "papers please" thing.We actually literally had something similar in the USA. We had special vaccine passports you would have to show to be in most public places for a bit. Thankfully that didnt last long.But yea, there is plenty of room for misinterpritation of what the term means. Thats why I went out of my way to explicitly claim what it **I** meant by the word. So regardless of what it means to anyone else, it was clearly stated what it meant in the context I am using it.I care very little for semantics beyond someone understanding me when I speak. So once that word was explained any confusion became a non-issue as far as I am concerned. I likely wouldnt care if I were to use some other determine to describe the same thing. But we all know David here cares more about using it as a weapon to derail any productive conversation rather than any actual concerns over semantics and understanding eachother.@DavidM_yeg
(DIR) Post #AcLMbJKeQYcNHOnom0 by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:44:44Z
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@andymoose People would be approached by the police when out and it was literally a “papers please” thing.We actually literally had something similar in the USA. We had special vaccine passports you would have to show to be in most public places for a bit. Thankfully that didnt last long.But yea, there is plenty of room for misinterpritation of what the term means. Thats why I went out of my way to explicitly claim what it I meant by the word. So regardless of what it means to anyone else, it was clearly stated what it meant in the context I am using it.I care very little for semantics beyond someone understanding me when I speak. So once that word was explained any confusion became a non-issue as far as I am concerned. I likely wouldnt care if I were to use some other determine to describe the same thing. But we all know David here cares more about using it as a weapon to derail any productive conversation rather than any actual concerns over semantics and understanding eachother.@DavidM_yeg
(DIR) Post #AcLMrjO3K8DUikDuPQ by andymoose@mastodon.social
2023-11-30T20:47:35Z
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@freemo @DavidM_yeg I get it - lets just end this civilly - i didn't intend for this thread to become so contentious.
(DIR) Post #AcLN5MNZf8uzPxUxTk by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T20:50:11Z
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@andymoose As far as I am concerned you and me have been perfectly civil, I dont think there is any issue there. David just came in with some toxicity, but thankfully he had the good sense to walk away before he carried on too long.@DavidM_yeg
(DIR) Post #AcLSZqNTC41kujnx7Q by DavidM_yeg@mstdn.ca
2023-11-30T21:51:36Z
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@andymoose @freemo Your medical credentials leave me speechless.
(DIR) Post #AcLSkCoybTUlPxbz7o by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T21:53:35Z
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@DavidM_yeg I never said I was a medical expert, I said I was a scientist... maybe you should look at my published papers instead, or even my resume.I just finished inventing a decide capable of detecting covid on ones breath within a few minutes at little to no cost after leading a team of medical (clinical) and chemistry teams at a large lab in Israel.Maybe you should ask, learn and research rather than accuse, it will go much further.@andymoose
(DIR) Post #AcLSv3jajE4YQ9GgfQ by freemo@qoto.org
2023-11-30T21:55:33Z
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@DavidM_yeg And for soem background the same team of medical and chemistry scientist had tried for 3 years and failed. I was called in and hired as a specialist and solved the same problem they couldnt in only 3 months.I have proven myself, and that has been well published and proven by this point.You are a waste of time, and every reply you prove that more.@andymoose