Post AcE6P57YTorWM96Wgq by tom_andraszek@mastodon.social
(DIR) More posts by tom_andraszek@mastodon.social
(DIR) Post #AcD9jTVHdmfuTReuzA by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-26T21:42:44.188503Z
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#Ukraine "Radio NV" interview with #Poland Piotr Kulpa, now lecturer at Kyiv university, about the situation on the Poland-Ukraine border. Summary of what he says:* The ongoing blockade is disastrous, but it has very concrete origins.* It started when Ukraine introduced two electronic queues, one for loaded (slow) and one (fast) for empty trucks. Polish trucks were directed by Ukrainian customs to the slow one and waited for 12 days on average.* That is, unless they paid a bribe. Given 100-200 EUR bribe, percentage of drivers willing to pay it and 900'000 trucks crossing per year, Kulpa estimates, profits of the customs go into millions.* This is disastrous for Polish truckers, who already lost routes to Russia and Kazakhstan, and it was the last drop that caused the blockade.* Polish government inaction has a number of factors: the new coalition government after recent elections hasn't been formed, and the existing (PiS) doesn't want to leave remembered by police pacification of the protesters as its last action.* There's also purely human aspect to the PiS inaction here: they're disappointed. In the first months of war Poland went way ahead of the rest of the coalition, risking a lot, quietly passing Ukraine heavy weapon long before anyone did and nearly emptying their ammunition stores. In response, as they feel, they got chilled reaction from Kyiv.* Kulpa several times highlights that while the blockade is a disaster for both sides, the root cause is an extreme corruption racket scheme on the Ukrainian side of the border. Any time anyone is asking in Ukraine don't Poles care about the war effort, Kulpa says, they should in the first place direct the question to the corrupt Ukrainian officials on the border, because all cost of bribes was ultimately added to the cost of goods paid by Ukrainians and their army.* Of course, Russia is an ultimate beneficent of *any* conflict between Ukraine and Poland. Russia, and the "old Europe" lobbies who want the return of the pre-war business opportunities with Russia. And it's true that pro-Russian "Konfederacja" party ultimately joined the campaign. But you didn't need even a single Russian hand in *this* conflict, it all originated in the massive corruption scheme on the Ukrainian border.* Kulpa says he talked to drivers who waited for 10 days in the Ukrainian queue only to be pulled out, and sent to the end, making his wait time over 20 days. The treatment of Polish drivers on the Ukrainian border was extremely demeaning, yet nobody on the Ukrainian cared about it while the drivers appealed and protested long before the blockade.* Kulpa says the critical and required step to open the border is the removal of the corruption schemes on the Ukrainian side, which in the first place harms Ukrainian society as the recipient of the goods.Source: https://piped.video/watch?v=Rm8PEJOwpK8 (in Russian)
(DIR) Post #AcDAFoaamRG18WYy7k by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-26T21:48:37.792793Z
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People in comments (99% in Ukrainian) say that "Radio NV" should now to ensure balance of opinions take an interview with Ukrainian high-rank customs 😆
(DIR) Post #AcDDxbVZ4nYPAcmclc by tom_andraszek@mastodon.social
2023-11-26T22:10:53Z
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@kravietz - and as far as I know there is also the problem of Ukrainian drivers transporting goods inside the EU (cabotage), which they are not allowed to do.
(DIR) Post #AcDE8SOPJ8iI5JbuXw by silo_bear@mindly.social
2023-11-26T22:24:06Z
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@kravietz trusting a russian source, or the russian version of any political event, is fucking hilarious.
(DIR) Post #AcDE8TLFmLmj1p8uGm by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-26T22:31:36.470865Z
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@silo_bearAgreed, that's why I didn't post any Russian source. Radio NV is Ukrainian. Kulpa is Polish, working in Kyiv.
(DIR) Post #AcDELygoXXMW14fRa4 by robryk@qoto.org
2023-11-26T22:11:39Z
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@kravietz Balance of opinions or to allow them to respond in the same medium? (I don't read Ukrainian worth a damn, so would find it hard to tell myself.)
(DIR) Post #AcDELzU5aKmGTtinNw by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-26T22:34:03.949177Z
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@robrykI have an impression the comment was ironic. I don't think corruption on the border is a huge secret in Ukraine 😉
(DIR) Post #AcDFPzuU2nHkujXedc by milan_zimmermann@mastodon.social
2023-11-26T22:34:19Z
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@kravietz Thanks for the summary, as I am not sure how to auto-translate on piped.video.Other sources (2 links below) put the blame squarely on the pro-Russian Polish party Konfederacia and it's leader Rafal Mekler. That sounds quite plausible. This boycot needs to stop, either way."Polish truckers started blocking three border crossing points on Nov. 6, in protest of the liberalization of EU transport rules for Ukrainian trucks, "https://news.yahoo.com/polish-border-protest-organizer-plans-234513131.htmlhttps://youtu.be/OpbEgytRfmY?t=538
(DIR) Post #AcDFQ0x0AutU8pjBCa by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-26T22:46:28.909431Z
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@milan_zimmermannThe blockade was of course direct result of the actions of the Polish truckers. More interesting is why they started it.That "Konfederacja" made them do it is easy explanation, but really too easy. It's like saying "Euromaidan was just paid by CIA". In Poland "Konfederacja" enjoys marginal support and all their past anti-Ukrainian actions were met with popular hostility by Poles.But not this one.And it didn't really start now in November. Earliest posts by Mekler I found were from May 2023 (!) so almost half year ago. He was saying the same thing as he's saying now — that Ukrainian customs screw Poles on bribes and Ukrainian drivers in EU screw them on dumping prices. Many other people in the community confirmed that.To me it looks the other way around — the protest started long ago, but nothing happened. In October they warned about the blockade. Nobody cared. In early November they once again delayed the blockade for two weeks. Nobody was giving a shit. Now suddenly everyone is interested...
(DIR) Post #AcDFzEnGhOnpD5yFFI by silo_bear@mindly.social
2023-11-26T22:42:42Z
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@kravietz Thomas Fiala is Czech, technically. And his network of media outlets is linked to Goldman Sachs. He seems exactly like a european Rupert Murdoch, so I would take that news with a grain of salt.If such a thing were true, Ukraine authorities would have came down hard, like they did against literally every other instance of bribery since the war started.
(DIR) Post #AcDFzFbxevLtkJgjGC by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-26T22:52:50.249937Z
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@silo_bearWell. I read Ukrainian media. A lot. Mobilization in Ukraine goes for over a year now. Arrests of corrupt recruitment officers started when, like this autumn only, when all media were writing about their luxury cars and apartments in Dubai long before? Arrest of head of secret communications service (!) a week ago? Great news, but I will never believe they only found out now. So yes, they do come down hard, just not always on time, because networks of corrupt officials are very powerful and interconnected.
(DIR) Post #AcE4rdOcRI8irJZafA by wolvverine@mastodon.social
2023-11-27T02:21:50Z
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@kravietz "and the existing (PiS) doesn't want to leave remembered by police pacification of the protesters as its last action."What shines through here is dislike of pis rather than reliable information.Forcible solution was not and is not considered in any case-all the more so that in Poland the majority supports a just protest.Not to mention that these are voters including PiS in the next elections.
(DIR) Post #AcE4reFnFafrWES3Xs by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-27T08:22:53.778227Z
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@wolvverineI don't see any dislike of PiS here. And PiS did use riot police without much hesitation in the past, as long as it was against people protesting against the abortion ban.
(DIR) Post #AcE62nLFtwf2qQsxAu by polezaivsani@chaos.social
2023-11-27T01:29:14Z
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@kravietz The time it'd take for sensible Ukrainian state officials to receive the signal and start unpicking the mess can be a proxy for how bad corruption is in these pathways. By how the signal did not make it through thus far, I surmise that the customs/road police seem to be ripe for an exhaustive revision.@silo_bear
(DIR) Post #AcE62oD8fblLXY5zA8 by silo_bear@mindly.social
2023-11-27T01:41:07Z
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@polezaivsani @kravietz I guess it's reasonable but that is no reason still to disrupt critical aid and disrupt the military operation of a country you wish to trade with.And if they were trucking to and fro russia, fuck them.
(DIR) Post #AcE62p6nKgHYKA8Que by polezaivsani@chaos.social
2023-11-27T01:53:45Z
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@silo_bear There are different motives in people's lives and you can't expect everybody to be guided by one big idea *alone*. Empathy, compassion and discretion are great tool in fighting warring Putin too. In addition to arms and other means that is.Also if I understand correctly, they are letting critical goods pass through alright.@kravietz
(DIR) Post #AcE62p9dA8YCSxShKi by polezaivsani@chaos.social
2023-11-27T02:23:13Z
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The hot head silo blocked me by the time I had written most of this, and I thought I'd leave it here for other caring souls still.How effective is such a stance (black & white, either you're fighting against Putin or you're helping him) is in unpicking this issue? That's a rhetorical question because it appears to me that there would be little understanding and thus cooperation when you don't want to understand the other party's motives and insist on everything be subject to one good aim....
(DIR) Post #AcE62q9JSntHYGJxTc by silo_bear@mindly.social
2023-11-27T01:59:54Z
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@polezaivsani @kravietz Don't expect fucking sympathy for any entrepreneur when genocide is happening in their line of business. Fuck off with thatLet me spell it out for you.LIVES > MONEY.
(DIR) Post #AcE62r2y7sPUKsMPE8 by polezaivsani@chaos.social
2023-11-27T02:05:20Z
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@silo_bear Are you typing in from the trenches? If not I'd say the black and white thinking would soon become a limiting factor. @kravietz
(DIR) Post #AcE62rbi2iCQ4cc9NQ by polezaivsani@chaos.social
2023-11-27T02:25:36Z
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Imagine what effect would 'fuck it, let's go fight Putin' have on a hypothetical trucker who has problem making his ends meet. He's likely supporting this cause as well, but dismissing his woes is only exacerbating the problem, not helping solve it and get on track.Show the people some love and you'd solve the problems together!
(DIR) Post #AcE64W01LqFjdYm0Qq by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-27T08:36:01.570461Z
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@silo_bearThere's another very detailed account of what's going on on the border from volunteer Paweł Jasiński, who had been himself transporting exclusively goods for ZSU, at his own cost, since March 2022:https://nitter.net/pjasinski/status/1727704...I've heard this "let's not talk business while war is going" argument a lot. It sounds noble, it has just one problem.Corrupt DPSU & customs #Ukraine officers, who are the root cause of the blockade, aren't on the front line.They are not suffering from Russian bombs. Quite they opposite, they are sitting at the safe EU border, filling up their pockets with millions. And they earn on nothing else but the very strategic goods that you're concerned about. It's not Poles that are hitting you a knife in the back, it's the corrupt bastards from DPSU & customs. And they were screwing Polish drivers so much, that the latter finally responded in the same way.As I've explained to someone before, Poles are in this aspect very similar to Ukrainians. When faces with glaring injustice, they don't sit and wait like Russians, they just go out to the streets and don't give a shit. This is precisely what is happening now, and the longer Ukraine is in denial about the causes of the protest, the longer it takes.@polezaivsani
(DIR) Post #AcE6P57YTorWM96Wgq by tom_andraszek@mastodon.social
2023-11-27T00:09:41Z
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@kravietz - it gets complicated, as Polish firms also employ Ukrainian drivers living in Poland, who could compete with Ukrainian drivers living in Ukraine, provided they didn't need to wait 12 days to return, but cannot go to Ukraine, because they are not exempt from draft... Also Ukrainians are registering companies in Poland to provide services in the EU... The core of the issue is that one way or another, Polish truckers and freight companies, like Polish farmers, are losing livelihoods.
(DIR) Post #AcE6T9Iat7QUTMCtsm by kravietz@agora.echelon.pl
2023-11-27T08:38:44.378779Z
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@silo_bearAs a reminder, Russia was one of the largest Ukraine's trading partner between 2014 and 2022, with continued exchange of goods, transit of gas and oil, Russian ammonia etc. Fuck them too?@polezaivsani