Post AVkjCes5MyYSBcIILo by alcinnz@floss.social
(DIR) More posts by alcinnz@floss.social
(DIR) Post #AVUjDTpAg1ZuMfqXqq by liaizon@social.wake.st
2023-05-09T23:54:48Z
6 likes, 5 repeats
"we fund Matrix dev by selling encrypted messaging to governments, which includes police: if you don’t like that then please feel free to use a different app" May 9th, 2023 -@element source https://mastodon.matrix.org/@element/110340953550548309
(DIR) Post #AVUjDUZFugRQfbPLgO by liaizon@social.wake.st
2023-05-10T00:01:02Z
3 likes, 2 repeats
Element really just told us if we don't like their direction of selling services to cops we should use another app. This is seriously the direction they settled on.
(DIR) Post #AVUtJSluVCmqNZoSaO by liaizon@social.wake.st
2023-05-10T00:10:44Z
4 likes, 0 repeats
Well now we know why they changed their name from Riot to Element. Can't have the app be revolutionary themed if your actual audience is the fucking cops
(DIR) Post #AVUtOqx81eDWp5d8RU by foolishowl@social.coop
2023-05-10T00:55:52Z
3 likes, 3 repeats
@liaizon "It's open source, so anyone can use it", is different from, "We support local governments who use it", which is again different from, "We went to a police conference to advertise our services".
(DIR) Post #AVUv1Hg5D7YafSXwtk by APPTeOORuzvlGOetVY.verita84@poster.place
2023-05-10T02:18:07.378527Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@liaizon @ShariVegas
(DIR) Post #AVUvACTnuFJl9W3S2C by alcinnz@floss.social
2023-05-10T00:05:28Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon I just tooted about my use of XMPP & Snikket...
(DIR) Post #AVUvADEb6GkRUdwoyG by theruran@hackers.town
2023-05-10T00:10:51Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@alcinnz yeah, to answer @liaizon 's question earlier, XMPP and Conversations support OMEMO encryption. And I would say XMPP is more in line with fedi culture, as opposed to newer tech shit. :blob_raccoon_peek:
(DIR) Post #AVUvGELvr5FGhPFRgm by crashglasshouses@tsukihi.me
2023-05-10T00:13:52Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon Tox is still around. the apps seem better than they were a couple of years ago. i'd like to try it, see if it's better than XMPP, cause both Matrix and XMPP have a very similar problem that no one is working on solving.
(DIR) Post #AVUvGF2TIvGypL9Pzk by billseitz@toolsforthought.rocks
2023-05-10T00:21:14Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@crashglasshouses @liaizon Which problem is that?
(DIR) Post #AVUvGFyFq5UfiYBZ3o by ren@asbestos.cafe
2023-05-10T02:20:46.238279Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@billseitz @crashglasshouses @liaizon the lack of a viable modern (user friendly) client for either protocol, preferably not funded by selling user data
(DIR) Post #AVUve8eGiOUVxRE11U by APPTeOORuzvlGOetVY.verita84@poster.place
2023-05-10T02:25:09.691370Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@foolishowl @liaizon I love it when lefties seethe. They hate Law and Order so much. They love hating on police so niggers can destroy where they live
(DIR) Post #AVUvyDlPPGxZc78nVA by seanking@kazv.moe
2023-05-10T02:28:47.720385Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@foolishowl @liaizon Hoooo, boy. Can't wait for the possible poor handling of the backlash by the person running the account.
(DIR) Post #AVV020NlV2pX5T8qUy by PhoenixWaifu@beefyboys.win
2023-05-10T03:11:58.646624Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon @element honestly, matrix niggers deserve it for being hut dwellers.
(DIR) Post #AVV1KWAa9aRaqBMo0u by downey@floss.social
2023-05-10T01:59:28Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@foolishowl @liaizon OK, so let's have 'em all give our tax money to Microsoft. 🤦🏽♂️It's that, or they give their money to freeloaders building stuff on top of FOSS tools but not contributing back.These are the only 3 choices available.
(DIR) Post #AVV1KWq3fNcYuolvf6 by foolishowl@social.coop
2023-05-10T02:37:02Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@downey @liaizon A major reason for encrypted communications is to keep out police and state security, who have a strong interest in subverting the integrity of encryption. Anyone developing a secure communication tool would be conscious of this. To actively seek to market to police is an implicit betrayal of everyone who supported and relied on the project.And just in general, you don't collaborate with police.
(DIR) Post #AVV1xdwdBElsFRUv56 by CumskinFoidPuncher69420@beefyboys.win
2023-05-10T03:16:51.629542Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
what the fuck is a matrix nigger
(DIR) Post #AVV1xedsaRMkPZjSUa by PhoenixWaifu@beefyboys.win
2023-05-10T03:34:15.790176Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@CumskinFoidPuncher69420 @liaizon @element people stuck in their huts.
(DIR) Post #AVVLb8DETfK4Xpo1lQ by downey@floss.social
2023-05-10T02:42:05Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@foolishowl @liaizon Are you aware that government employees regularly participate in infosec events? And that >40% of the Tor Project's annual revenue comes from governments?
(DIR) Post #AVVb3a1WAWeYDhLkci by liaizon@social.wake.st
2023-05-10T00:13:41Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@theruran @alcinnz Do you have any knowledge as to where the bulk of funding is coming from for those who are supporting the XMPP ecosystem? @tigase whats your funding model look like?
(DIR) Post #AVVb3ao5FxV8eK4XK4 by rra@post.lurk.org
2023-05-10T08:00:49Z
2 likes, 2 repeats
@liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigase Sorry to pop everyone's bubble but XMPP is also widely used in police and military applications. People need to be a bit more realistic about the dual-use nature of internet and computing tools. It's a bad look to be advertising your cooperation with cops and fully mis-reading your audience here. Also, I do not condone it. However, to the audience: what did you expect? Secure communications is first and foremost a defense industry need.If use and engagement with police and defense is your standard for whether or not to use a particular set of tools, then do I have some bad news regarding all of open source for you!
(DIR) Post #AVWFK5AA9nuzb4oirg by alcinnz@floss.social
2023-05-10T17:36:56Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@rra @liaizon @theruran @tigase I find it unfair to judge devs by who are using our software, we might need to accept uses we disagree with to do the most good. (I don't disagree with private software, as long as those who use your software gets the Four Freedoms).I think it is totally fair to judge us by who we're engaging with!Personally (privileged) I can't get all that worked up about 1312, but I see the counterarguments missing the mark.
(DIR) Post #AVWkenMsbuBV4F7d3o by didek@101010.pl
2023-05-10T23:31:27Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@rra @liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigase And Element do not even sell the app itself, they sell setting up servers, a hosting and deployment service.What police is going to do with the app is at most get the source code and stick their logo in app icon.
(DIR) Post #AVWkkhmkHQLTUS2SBs by didek@101010.pl
2023-05-10T23:32:31Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@rra @liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigase And Element do not even sell the app itself, they sell setting up servers, a hosting and deployment service.What police is going to do with the app is at most get the source code and stick their logo in app icon.
(DIR) Post #AVWkx9xPMZaEL4xrzU by audricd@tkz.one
2023-05-10T11:37:29Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon @element so which is it in the end? I see contradicting retoots. Do @element sell chat logs, or chatting devices to governments / police ...? It's indeed quite not the same.
(DIR) Post #AVWkxAiuVxa4iPBo24 by didek@101010.pl
2023-05-10T23:34:45Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@audricd @liaizon @element They sell hosting (on-premise and cloud), like a hosting provider.And whitelabels, so the police can have their own version of Element with own logos for internal use.
(DIR) Post #AVWlMEQXsgFZRSY59k by r3g_5z@grapheneos.social
2023-05-10T11:10:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon @element amazing how everyone who says "what's the problem?" are also cishet white men who have never been marginalised or targeted ever in their life
(DIR) Post #AVWlMF75KWHHZOS3Si by didek@101010.pl
2023-05-10T23:39:18Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@r3g_5z @liaizon @element And right-handed.
(DIR) Post #AVWlMFgtBOuxMRCeGm by r3g_5z@grapheneos.social
2023-05-10T11:21:56Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon @element also find it so wild that a lot of people in security and privacy matrix rooms are also saying "what's the problem?"my friend in christ, the same people in the government and law enforcement are trying to take away your security and privacy
(DIR) Post #AVX6iW0vGxhdOW1yO8 by audricd@tkz.one
2023-05-11T03:38:38Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@didek @liaizon @element thank you very much for the clarification!
(DIR) Post #AVXuwWlEHuN3TOZ77g by jabberati@social.anoxinon.de
2023-05-10T23:21:07Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigase Most XMPP software is developed by individuals like @daniel without millions of VC funding. And they still manage to release modern features (Conversations and @dino released native A/V calls before #Element did) all while complying to current internet standards (instead of inventing yet another incompatible messaging protcol) and building on native UI libraries (instead of Electron bloatware). #XMPP truly was the right answer to instant messaging all along.
(DIR) Post #AVkEer5QRyh1bHV0iW by stevenroose@x0f.org
2023-05-17T11:38:48Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@rra @liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigase IMO there is a huge difference in having the police use your software and the police being part of the funding of the main software provider for a protocol. The former is obviously something you have no control over. While the latter can cause reliance on the police and give them influence/power over the direction the protocol can move towards.#xmpp #jabber #matrix
(DIR) Post #AVkjCes5MyYSBcIILo by alcinnz@floss.social
2023-05-17T17:21:03Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@stevenroose @rra @liaizon @theruran @tigase If you go out of your way it's possible to control whether the police/military use your software, but often that'd prevent a lot of good from being done too!
(DIR) Post #AVqNEPhHSeWkaUl7Qm by 0@mamot.fr
2023-05-20T10:43:06Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@stevenroose@rra @liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigaseAllow me to say, with a degree of authority, that "the police" here is being used merely as a boogeyman. In these contexts, it is such an abstract and meaningless concept that it is absurd to discuss, unless we're giving a talk in this year's tinfoil hatters convention.
(DIR) Post #AVzjpSCh3DfOUU9u7M by squeakypancakes@sunbeam.city
2023-05-10T00:01:41Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon maybe we should all listen then.
(DIR) Post #AVzjyOSoKFjhUtxb9c by foolishowl@social.coop
2023-05-10T00:52:34Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigase XMPP servers are cheap and easy to set up. The core software has been around for decades. Several proprietary chat services started as XMPP, then defederated, most famously Facebook Messenger and Google Chat. That's probably where most of the initial funding came from.
(DIR) Post #AVzjyPYAHpc4rnTO8e by alcinnz@floss.social
2023-05-10T00:57:50Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@foolishowl @liaizon @theruran @tigase As far as I can tell, the XMPP project themselves do not have much more of an internet presence than what I'm managing on the side.So I believe right now their funding is very meagre, relying on the sort of opensource contributions which have brought others so far!
(DIR) Post #AVzk0IjuZxWqK6rvBw by shibacomputer@post.lurk.org
2023-05-10T08:37:44Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@rra @liaizon @theruran @alcinnz @tigase encryption is a military technology, activism is the reason why citizens are able to use it.