Post ATTx44UYoYMqimzPvs by Delib@mastodon.social
(DIR) More posts by Delib@mastodon.social
(DIR) Post #ATSLVo9j9bwYkS5G9w by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T00:29:26Z
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Has anyone made a DMs-only fediverse client? Like something that looks more or less like iMessage or Signal but you address people via their fediverse handles and it handles DMs as first class (and only-class) content?Has anyone made a DMs-only fediverse *server*? Like if I want to join fedi but only to direct message people and be in group chats I could join a server and it would have a nice client view like the one in the previous paragraph?
(DIR) Post #ATSLVojszAroYb08WG by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T00:37:19Z
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I'm thinking no discovery of topics or people. No hashtag support. None of that shit. Basically just email-over-activitypub. You give it addresses for people you want to talk to and then it happens. Just like with phone numbers and SMS/MMS. Make it e2e encrypted if you like, or not.The difference from email is I could have my nice iMessage like experience over here, and you can be stuck in Mastodon DM user experience hell on your end if you so choose. Choice!
(DIR) Post #ATSLVpZzrQYDADNkkC by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T00:44:57Z
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If you went the e2e route in the current ecosystem you'd have some kind of Signal-style lock-in where you'd need people running the same client on both ends, but you'd be bouncing around encrypted messages via activitypub, I guess? idk. just spitballin here people
(DIR) Post #ATSLWg5KeAVu0SRVo0 by mcc@mastodon.social
2023-03-10T00:38:34Z
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@darius At this point I feel like it would be more useful to simply make a mastodon-to-matrix bridge.
(DIR) Post #ATSLiqkAqNCGXTLm9A by zundan@mastodon.zunda.ninja
2023-03-10T00:48:57Z
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@darius Mastodon actually used to have API endpoints for E2EE messaging https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/pull/13820 which has been dropped due to the lack of clients: https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/pull/14283. It maybe worthwhile looking into the code for how it looked like. (I'm afraid I'm not an expert :P
(DIR) Post #ATSmHPotXGHXynhXEW by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T00:51:22Z
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But also, in response to all the "what about e2e encryption" -- I would like that but I would *also* like a nice dedicated user interface for my activitypub DMs as they exist today. Would a custom client be more secure than my current DMs? no. would it be LESS secure? also no!
(DIR) Post #ATSmHQMvUjVJgLciHI by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T00:55:42Z
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Further (and now I am ranting, sorry), I used email as an analogy specifically because it is insecure as shit but we use it every day
(DIR) Post #ATSmHR231qOhjsrYNE by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T00:59:59Z
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I probably should have pitched it in the original post as an idea for insecure messaging
(DIR) Post #ATSmHRaQxzu3SWx0yG by trwnh@mastodon.social
2023-03-10T03:57:58Z
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@darius i'm not sure what the point of such a *server* would be, but as a *client*, i imagine it would make some sense. i'm thinking generic activitypub server and then an activitypub client that just shows you your inbox. i mean, everything is a "direct message" on the spec level, right? just, you're dealing indirectly with resources. perhaps you could have a separate Message activity, but it is also conceivable to add certain objects to a certain collection. maybe even both of these ideas.
(DIR) Post #ATSmHSGcR9eBZMghiy by trwnh@mastodon.social
2023-03-10T04:01:08Z
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@darius if you wanted to maintain compatibility with the "Create Note" side of fedi, you could Create Note yourself, but do so within some `context` representing a room. the problem with current fedi is basically no one uses `context`, they rely on heuristics around to/cc and any structure is incidental due to inReplyTo chains
(DIR) Post #ATSmHSug2DgpZbQhA8 by ilja@ilja.space
2023-03-10T05:45:46.334806Z
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@trwnh @darius context is used by pleroma to indicate threads. It (and also Honk) also has a ChatMessage object, which could also be useful here. I'm unsure if ChatMessage uses context. I think determening what "chat" the message belongs to is done by checking 'to'. But I think 'to' can't be an array here, so it's clearer who sees what.
(DIR) Post #ATStxleRSMVTWvxDHs by didek@101010.pl
2023-03-10T07:12:39Z
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@darius Never seen one. And personally, I don't think ActivityPub is good candidate for that type of app.It is best for posts, for DMs I would put a link in the bio.
(DIR) Post #ATT0JHTMwKVw1qPsJs by Natureshadow@floss.social
2023-03-10T08:23:43Z
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@zundan @darius Building a proprietary API and otherwise relying on the wrong standards does not work out.
(DIR) Post #ATTjt412wf2SehbbOK by misty@digipres.club
2023-03-10T16:54:23Z
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@darius See, I half thought this was nerd sniping to attract replies about security
(DIR) Post #ATTkVoFzTEDd4d4SAK by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T17:01:11Z
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@misty lol no I'm just a dumbass who forgot where I was posting
(DIR) Post #ATTkmThLA2t2EaoNiC by misty@digipres.club
2023-03-10T17:03:18Z
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@darius Hahahaha. Oops
(DIR) Post #ATTx43N4ysmzFITvdI by Delib@mastodon.social
2023-03-10T01:02:45Z
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@darius XMPP has those abilities. Federation with activitypub (like mastodon) is brand new, but xmpp has always been 'fedetated' across its own servers. There are also gateways to most social networks you could imagine. The 'DM"s van also be end2end encrypted.#xmpp
(DIR) Post #ATTx43wAsOrV08txKq by darius@friend.camp
2023-03-10T01:04:17Z
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@Delib SMTP also has these abilities -- I am asking about fediverse/activitypub. It is frustrating to say "has anyone done X with Y technology?" and to get responses that are "Z technology does this"
(DIR) Post #ATTx44UYoYMqimzPvs by Delib@mastodon.social
2023-03-10T19:07:53Z
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@darius fediverse/activitypub is currently being bridged to #xmpp/jabber (which is focused on the use-case you describe), including 'real' DM's, not just the kind transmitted and stored in open text as in mastodon. These efforts are very close to being ready for the public. My hunch is that Movim.eu might be the best first-use server for users to watch for a future gateway. BTW I would not recommend using mastodon for personal messages. #libervia
(DIR) Post #ATTx44xd4TcUAwadF2 by didek@101010.pl
2023-03-10T19:22:08Z
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@Delib @darius I think he just asked if there is any interface to display ActiivtyPub post like they were DM messages.I love XMPP like you too, but we must remember everything has a use case. And appreciate that those protocols are so flexible.