Post ASH24e1noFWhUmULAm by john@sauropods.win
(DIR) More posts by john@sauropods.win
(DIR) Post #ASGw99L8jdXw2bIYSm by PeterFalkingham@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T14:47:17Z
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Aaaand that's it - either an assignment needs to be _very_ well designed and rely on specific materials (lab specimens, for instance), or it needs to be in person and hand written: https://www.windowscentral.com/software-apps/chatgpt-comes-to-microsoft-word-through-ghostwriter-add-in
(DIR) Post #ASGwJb2maTtOrJh2oa by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T14:50:05Z
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@PeterFalkingham This has escalated so quickly, it's kinda scary how unprepared we are for it.
(DIR) Post #ASGwLsDdhZMAhorCoS by PeterFalkingham@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T14:50:42Z
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@john Yeah, exactly that sentiment. We've been on the verge for so long, we forgot that eventually we'll tip over.
(DIR) Post #ASH10jRhcmovBaAocq by mike@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:26:02Z
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@PeterFalkingham @john Zero to sixty in about twelve months has to be a record, though.
(DIR) Post #ASH10jqs7CxARdwurA by Artemis201@mstdn.social
2023-02-02T15:30:24Z
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@mike @PeterFalkingham @john have you all actually tried using it? I tried to generate some info to design the structure of a presentation i was giving and the results were not great. I'd say upper grade school level writing and an inability to reliably get facts right. It's a good idea to prepare how to use it and deal with it, but as of today it's abilities are vastly oversold.
(DIR) Post #ASH10kJaORvDshNqc4 by Artemis201@mstdn.social
2023-02-02T15:33:08Z
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@mike @PeterFalkingham @john I've already seen one instructor assigning people to generate responses, and then going through and correcting its work, which i think is a fairly good response. It'll definitely be much harder to handle once it is capable of doing more than introduction paragraphs.
(DIR) Post #ASH10kmeeNArKqz3vE by PeterFalkingham@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:38:11Z
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@Artemis201 @mike @john I saw a good argument (I think on here) that critiquing is not the same skillset as generating a coherent answer: it's much easier to criticise than create - (see certain bitching about a fat apatosaur yesterday as an example!), so not an ideal replacement assessment
(DIR) Post #ASH10lRmBU4FOODu1A by mike@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:39:14Z
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@PeterFalkingham @Artemis201 @john Apfatosaur, more like.
(DIR) Post #ASH10lwcKojmw2eX5c by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:42:45Z
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@mike @PeterFalkingham @Artemis201 Stable Diffusion, "A fat Apatosaurus". I quite like the last one actually.
(DIR) Post #ASH1xMpTM8gg7wFcq8 by mike@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:53:27Z
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@john @PeterFalkingham @Artemis201 Yes, the fourth one has some character. The third is like an advert for AI's inability to do feet.But no fat apatosaur will ever surpass the one in the How And Why Wonder Book Of Dinosaurs. See https://svpow.com/2012/07/16/how-fat-was-brontosaurus-well-not-this-fat-anyway/
(DIR) Post #ASH24e1noFWhUmULAm by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:54:44Z
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@mike @PeterFalkingham @Artemis201 that’s got to be in the training set.
(DIR) Post #ASH2FcOgDJs1ceQDEu by mike@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:56:44Z
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@john @PeterFalkingham @Artemis201 LOL.I found myself re-reading "How fat is an elephant?" which has things to say about your recent piece.https://svpow.com/2013/05/29/how-fat-is-an-elephant/
(DIR) Post #ASH2Py6SMkl5q2piy0 by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T15:58:36Z
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@mike @PeterFalkingham @Artemis201 Ribs are weird, and I don't think we've got to grips with them yet.
(DIR) Post #ASH2lsNQKxEMRvDRx2 by mike@sauropods.win
2023-02-02T16:02:34Z
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@john @PeterFalkingham @Artemis201 I strongly agree. I am often haunted by the fear that maybe we have no idea what shape sauropod ribs were before they got flattened out during taphonomy/fossilisation.One of the best things to do with a really spectacularly preserved sauropod specimen, like the Carnegie's baby Cam, would be to look at this, and at the rib-vert articulations.
(DIR) Post #ASRQ5HhkdLQT1yXy0u by dpnash@mastodon.online
2023-02-07T16:05:45Z
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@Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham @john I've asked #ChatGPT a few questions that would be appropriate for an in-class assignment in an intro college history class. Every time, it gave me precise form (5-paragraph essay, gotta love it) and shallow content. A significant fraction of the time, it fell into blatant anachronism. I believe that requiring students to give good supporting details (both factually correct *and* actually supportive) more than once per paragraph would go a long way.
(DIR) Post #ASRQ5IPM1EIvDCwmye by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-07T16:10:56Z
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@dpnash @Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham Do you think it wouldn't be good enough to get a passing grade at a high school level?
(DIR) Post #ASRQ5JVlur22dOxQcS by dpnash@mastodon.online
2023-02-07T16:07:10Z
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@Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham @john In other words, I think the "OMG, ChatGPT writes essays now!" crowd is wrong; it writes essay-shaped garbage instead, and at least for now, it's not terribly difficult to distinguish the two. If it actually ends up killing adherence to specific writing forms (e.g. the classic 5-paragraph essay) as a measure of writing competence, that may actually be a good thing in the long run.
(DIR) Post #ASRRJOnFAulb1YPUEi by dpnash@mastodon.online
2023-02-07T16:24:36Z
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@john @Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham I think it could pass pop quiz-type essays for a non-AP high school history class. Beyond that, I have my doubts.Its biggest fault was having 1 or 2 historical facts per paragraph with a lot of filler -- saying something was "important", "significant", "different" ... which is fine (if a bit cliched) as an intro, but then you need to go into some detail into why "it" was important/different/etc., and ChatGPT only did that very superficially at best.
(DIR) Post #ASRRT0J34WkJyUrmuu by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-07T16:26:27Z
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@dpnash @Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham I guess I think a lot of human writers are also terrible at this stuff, but I've never had to grade a class full of essays, so I'm curious about a comparison to the mediocre.
(DIR) Post #ASRSKh1QzBgpntEE8u by dpnash@mastodon.online
2023-02-07T16:36:06Z
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@john @Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham Yeah, that'd be a good one to do, and unfortunately I don't really have a good comparison. I ... ummmm ... tended to discourage that sort of thing in my own children's school work.
(DIR) Post #ASRT2YDr42CvFmx2Ui by Artemis201@mstdn.social
2023-02-07T16:41:18Z
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@dpnash @john I'm also a pretty bad source of comparison. I mostly did AP classes so I'm comparing it to what my teachers would have accepted and then bumping it down a notch.Though at the lowest level, it does tick the "literally anything turned in" box, which may be enough for some beleaguered teachers.
(DIR) Post #ASRT2Ysyb96JJKBsae by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-07T16:44:05Z
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@Artemis201 @dpnash I turned in some absolute garbage in my first year when I decided I wasn't interested in a course. I really did get the sense I was being passed for having at least written *something* in essay form and inside the word count parameters.
(DIR) Post #ASRTRC6aQsIvtjIoIy by Artemis201@mstdn.social
2023-02-07T16:48:28Z
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@john @dpnash My read on this is that people turning in garbage often still nets them a passing grade. So at this point the question is, how much benefit do they get from writing the garbage vs generating it via AI?definitely some differences, but I'd say more on an ethical and personal effort ability, and less on a knowledge scale
(DIR) Post #ASS6UfUzV62S8qMgFc by dpnash@mastodon.online
2023-02-07T16:28:02Z
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@john @Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham I don't have my chat history at hand right now, but I remember one of the paragraphs (prompt: discuss western European social structure in 800 CE) began something like "Another social institution that was very important at the time was the Catholic Church. The Pope held a lot of political power, and bishops were significantly powerful throughout the region..." Sure, that's *correct*, but also pretty shallow. Now imagine 2 other topic paragraphs like this.
(DIR) Post #ASS6UgE0ni3EOTQdQO by dpnash@mastodon.online
2023-02-07T16:30:38Z
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@john @Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham Again, not sure about high school, but if I tried to pull this sort of thing off in an in-class writing assignment in my intro history classes in college (never mind an actual paper), there's no way this would have gotten a passing grade. I'd be lucky to have escaped actual derision at the hands of the instructor or grader.
(DIR) Post #ASS6Uh2LmYJiuaypt2 by Artemis201@mstdn.social
2023-02-07T16:38:35Z
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@dpnash @john @mike @PeterFalkingham My feelings are that it's capable of writing a single introduction paragraph. If that's all an assignment is, sure. But asking for additional paragraphs has zero flow between them, often repeats information, and has no structure. The grammar/sentence structure is advanced, but the information is super generic. I think that at the moment it's overhyped, but it will likely be a problem if they can generate longer-structure paragraphs with better specificity.
(DIR) Post #ASS6Uhc9dQxOhdjQh6 by john@sauropods.win
2023-02-08T00:05:47Z
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@Artemis201 @dpnash @mike @PeterFalkingham I wonder if this a difference of type of reasoning, or just an implementation detail. We'll find out in a few months I guess.
(DIR) Post #ASS6Ui9pcDtaO5UKBc by dpnash@mastodon.online
2023-02-07T16:32:56Z
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@john @Artemis201 @mike @PeterFalkingham It was like "We Didn't Start The Fire, Early Medieval Remix", with lots more filler words.