Post AR8fXa1eLTk3TywpsG by maxganz@data-folks.masto.host
(DIR) More posts by maxganz@data-folks.masto.host
(DIR) Post #AR8b1zDIlJuOWC4rpo by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T16:21:18Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
50 years ago, the harbor of New York City was a sewer, filled with human trash and pollutants But congress passed the Clean Water Act and it helped enormously, so …… today wildlife has staged a remarkable comeback, and the water quality is high. They’ve seen humpback whales in the Hudson River one mile from Times Square, and there’s a thousand breeding pairs of heronSmart ecological legislation works “Friend” link to NYT story: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/12/30/opinion/new-york-harbor-clean-water-act.html?unlocked_article_code=AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACEIPuonUktbfqYhlSlUYAybSRdkhrxqAwv7C3_ktgWX9aSicUzxF1aEeB4WJ_QLSbLZufZ461CjdRMNENPVnYs1O-dJlHh4nTRi08NzDkY4ZIi4xpMW5VD1s1JuUA_Vk-2awKzTlduo6zbfg7lfYaDG9WaKJ03N1cAl1sNAyIwHRrH8Mx6zBFOdz3cAvnqtyQ8AnGkpTIXWCrPLqCB5hON6ZbBi66gY-WOhRWzq7jsfLovtbM10UUQSaOSs5tWUs69pcOscVPLL8LXMjf8n-gLYQCA94PcyvKmMBXv9Vu1OojbRc8kM&referringSource=articleShare
(DIR) Post #AR8cZEpPpO2mSOKBYu by mimsical@mastodon.social
2022-12-30T16:38:29Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive I love this! much slower progress here in Baltimore / on the Chesapeake but progress is happening nonetheless. Check out Mr. Trash Wheel if you're not familiar...https://www.mrtrashwheel.com/
(DIR) Post #AR8d9USRCBNzM6rZqa by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T16:45:08Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@mimsical It's great, eh?I'll check out the Chesapeake stuff ... it'd be great to see more ecological revival there
(DIR) Post #AR8e289RpbHo6K2FcW by stevenweaver@mastodon.social
2022-12-30T16:54:31Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Thanks for the link - definitely a great success story, but there's still work to do. While there have been improvements we are fighting algal blooms here in the #FingerLakes because of excess farm runoffs. Let's make sure progress continues. A good primer from the Finger Lakes Land Trust: https://www.fllt.org/toxic-algae-facts
(DIR) Post #AR8fXa1eLTk3TywpsG by maxganz@data-folks.masto.host
2022-12-30T17:11:51Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive I recall reading though poor legislation was central to the 1930s dust bowl in USA/Canada. I may be wrong, but I suspect as with it all things it's much easier to get it wrong, than right.
(DIR) Post #AR8gbuQIY8jjrC6aBM by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T17:23:28Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@maxganz Yeah, good question -- what's the ratio of "getting it wrong" to "getting it right" with legislation?Part of the problem is that in any society, there'll be disagreements -- some who think the legislation personally screwed them, others who are like no dude it helped many othersI doubt the companies who were saving a ton of money by dumping untreated waste into the river *liked* the Clean Water Act
(DIR) Post #AR8gpqBz4of0n03LpA by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T17:26:04Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@maxganz It's good to reflect on the true crapshows of legislation that had terrible second-order effects -- like that dust bowl exampleUS legislation to mandate an ethanol percentage in gasoline has, as I've read, been pretty much a messHasn't really reduced emissions significantly, and it incentivized farms to monocrop corn, corn, corn, corn
(DIR) Post #AR8gw7KyFFzBhWFWL2 by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T17:26:55Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@stevenweaver yep yep, I've read a little bit about the finger lakes
(DIR) Post #AR8hCzPOyb2s2AMpSy by maxganz@data-folks.masto.host
2022-12-30T17:30:35Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Neighbourhood costs are I think always wrong, from an ethical point of view.The question is whether legislature can deal with this, or the wide range of other ecological issues? and can it, upon recognizing an issue, produce legislation which actually has the intended effect?Overall, are we better off with legislation, or worse off? more to the point, how can we even tell, given how complex the world is?We need a mechanism which works overall and can be *proved* to be working.
(DIR) Post #AR8iC4x0z96Mt4De7s by debcha@mastodon.social
2022-12-30T17:41:34Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive I’ve just been writing about this, using Boston as an example. I remember when I first moved here, I saw a night heron in the Charles. I’d never seen one and didn’t even know what it was but I could tell from its beak that it ate fish, which suggested that the river had to be in not-terrible shape.
(DIR) Post #AR8iONF6noLH5qXr7Y by debcha@mastodon.social
2022-12-30T17:43:48Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive We get the odd news story about seals in the harbor making their way through the locks and into the river, and they always seem to presented as though the seals are invaders and not, like, it’s *their* habitat and if they think it’s worth heading upriver for fish that’s an *excellent* sign.
(DIR) Post #AR8kSdz8hE6M5NEtsm by JohnLoader6@masto.ai
2022-12-30T18:06:57Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive used to have massive oyster beds a lot earlier
(DIR) Post #AR8nsFeC6d1PzkLQkS by matthewhirtes@federated.press
2022-12-30T18:45:15Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive, not that long ago the thought of anyone using the La Cicer end of Las Canteras beach in Las Palmas de Gran Canaria was laughable. This was due to it being the most polluted part of the playa. Now, it is one of the key surfing spots in the Canary Islands.
(DIR) Post #AR8qgrwGDI5p8o3ivw by walle@geekdom.social
2022-12-30T19:16:47Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive This is a good example of how we can influence the regeneration of nature. I am sure that humans can help nature to cleanse itself. After all, man is a part of nature, which means that nature is capable of self-regulation through people.
(DIR) Post #AR8sEY9qMfeHak2Kfo by doug@towns.gay
2022-12-30T19:33:38Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive I've heard that NY harbor is legit one of the best saltwater fishing areas on the east coast
(DIR) Post #AR8sLhEn0LpNmMl2O0 by doug@towns.gay
2022-12-30T19:34:17Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive like I could pretty easily imagine having an apartment in DUMBO with a kyak strapped to the ceiling and a rooftop smoker and just catching and smoking bluefish for ppl to eat
(DIR) Post #AR8sRlOiRzBGQ2IH3o by NotsoproudBrit@toot.wales
2022-12-30T19:35:45Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive 👏👏👏
(DIR) Post #AR8tHXqM5ccDRJufnk by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T19:45:51Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@doug The bluefish are pretty amazing and *incredibly* inexpensive! I’ve had stuff at a restaurant that was caught on the line literally four hours before dinner
(DIR) Post #AR8tOiZObiScjaOueG by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T19:47:09Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@JohnLoader6 Yep
(DIR) Post #AR8tVZLxH1EkAyNgCe by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T19:48:16Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@matthewhirtes Very cool!
(DIR) Post #AR8tb6ri6TRVYmsNou by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T19:48:42Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@debcha Absolutely!!
(DIR) Post #AR8tgbej3IfkVGQKQK by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T19:47:26Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@walle Totally
(DIR) Post #AR8tn8VrnrEK94OTLM by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T19:47:58Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@magnus Ugh
(DIR) Post #AR8wK46RQ8HtvrKYZk by remguru@cyberplace.social
2022-12-30T20:19:55Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive never thought I’d see anything in the rivers around NYC… except dead bodies
(DIR) Post #AR8xCoVd6D5jUpDb2e by alonely_tree@techhub.social
2022-12-30T20:29:35Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive The UK could learn something!
(DIR) Post #AR905BFMyc9JYtfGZU by doug@towns.gay
2022-12-30T21:02:01Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive ooh is it good? I always think of bluefish as something you have to smoke for it to be good but I could be wrong here.
(DIR) Post #AR91cKsgHJg2x4QSKe by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T21:19:12Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@doug It’s a very strong-tasting and oily fish — needs to be prepared with that in mind A good chef can work magic with it though Cheaper fresh fish in NYC cannot be gotten
(DIR) Post #AR91qnzmpNLJIreIRU by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T21:19:35Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@remguru Heh
(DIR) Post #AR9203kNdK50lIr67U by doug@towns.gay
2022-12-30T21:22:46Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive ya that's why smoking is so good for it. Now if we can get rockfish/striped bass stocks back up to where being able to sell line-caught stripers in NYC restaurants...
(DIR) Post #AR92EecXKqXbB3972W by Chopinsheart@toad.social
2022-12-30T21:26:07Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Oh wow, did not know this. I grew up there. Come to think of it, I DO remember seeing what looked like real human garbage in the river. How about the East River? How is that now?
(DIR) Post #AR92k1OygWNcoElFRI by toxtethogrady@universeodon.com
2022-12-30T21:31:50Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive That holds out hope for the renewal of The Houston Ship Channel and Buffalo Bayou...
(DIR) Post #AR948WhW4EoGmlgHPE by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T21:47:32Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toxtethogrady Yes!
(DIR) Post #AR94G2Xi4vr3ZIg1om by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-30T21:48:09Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Chopinsheart I don't know specifically about the east river but I would imagine it's got to be somewhat better at least? That's all one connected body of water
(DIR) Post #AR9HaHbV5e4dTXQtJg by Litejedi@mas.to
2022-12-31T00:18:08Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive some credit to DEC and DEP, which continually work to pull down pollution even when the feds lag.
(DIR) Post #AR9MFsp80oWObGtnpw by dbc3@mastodon.world
2022-12-31T01:10:30Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive so naturally Republicans want to repeal that law.
(DIR) Post #AR9PXnakVEGjRsPLDE by FLGLchicago@mas.to
2022-12-31T01:47:18Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Not to mention you couldn't breathe the air without coughing up a lung
(DIR) Post #AR9PeoSzeFXCBn7n16 by CinciMike@mstdn.social
2022-12-31T01:48:03Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Here in Cincinnati the water quality of the Ohio River is up, but likely due to invasive zebra muscles filtering out the pollutants and choking out native species.
(DIR) Post #AR9Q9mhwEoJri8spsG by CharJTF@a11y.info
2022-12-31T01:54:12Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Thank you 🙂
(DIR) Post #AR9R8wSoZzMVdKyIlM by MollyNYC@mstdn.social
2022-12-31T02:05:15Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Thank you! Great article!Couple related things:• There’ve been increasing sightings of dolphins around Staten Island too! • The article didn’t go into it but the Million Oyster Project isn’t developing oyster beds purely for the love of oysters. It’s also because oysters filter all kinds of god-awful stuff out of the water.• There’s a well-developed open-water swimming community in #NYC (CIBBOWS.org, NYOW, Coney Island Polar Bear Club, many others)
(DIR) Post #AR9ScpRjKoYIVjHNVw by johnew@knowledgeknot.enmesh.nohost.me
2022-12-31T01:58:03.174822Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive How did you get a "Friend" link? Are you a paid subscriber? Thank you!
(DIR) Post #AR9ScqJc6TebCqUPVA by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T02:21:23Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@johnew Yep, I subscribe -- subscribers can share 12 friend links a month, so I find ones I think are particularly cool and put 'em up here!
(DIR) Post #AR9ScvphabICJoXbiC by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T02:20:46Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@MollyNYC Dolphins!! That's cool -- had not heard thatYep, I'd heard about the Million Oyster Project ... it's super cool. And yeah they are remarkable little beasts
(DIR) Post #AR9SiZ2XFJvZMgEHfU by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T02:21:44Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@CharJTF 🤘 🤖
(DIR) Post #AR9StLQ2EFdgJ0MU2S by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T02:22:44Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@CinciMike Up in my hometown of Toronto, they've been dealing with zebra mussels for a long time -- yep they clean the water but clog everything else, and muck with the ecology of other lifeforms
(DIR) Post #AR9SxwAdWrfDRmLi6a by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T02:22:54Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@FLGLchicago That too!
(DIR) Post #AR9T2MtS7GJnU7QN04 by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T02:23:09Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@dbc3 Bleah
(DIR) Post #AR9T7ApsNEWXXK2inY by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T02:23:31Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Litejedi yep yep
(DIR) Post #AR9TGNBto4pASgjMGG by JohnFisher@mstdn.social
2022-12-31T02:23:55Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Can't forget the contributions of Pete Seeger as he sailed up and down the river educating folks.
(DIR) Post #AR9UwslMuduAUu9fYe by eriknordman@mstdn.social
2022-12-31T02:47:54Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive It's truly incredible. Growing up on LI, I never expected to see this. Now my parents go seal watching at Jones Beach and my sister took a whale watching trip in NY Harbor.
(DIR) Post #AR9Y3mkVyBe1jfjrgu by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T03:22:49Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@eriknordman So damn cool
(DIR) Post #AR9Y8wR5NmF3E56rpo by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T03:22:57Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@JohnFisher Totally
(DIR) Post #AR9dITGRCG4dPzUbC4 by wndlb@mas.to
2022-12-31T04:21:29Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive Were the whales checking out properties in the Meatpacking District, like Kendall Roy’s place?
(DIR) Post #AR9ewqqN315q5Q7Pt2 by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T04:39:35Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@wndlb lol you wonder eh
(DIR) Post #AR9f3rZ2lchcLeMDlw by wndlb@mas.to
2022-12-31T04:41:15Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive I think Lewis Hamilton’s place sold, so
(DIR) Post #AR9nBhrDXYJSC16p1M by ThePsyOfLife@ohai.social
2022-12-31T06:12:20Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive And the Clean Water Act was passed by Nixon, a notorious Republican.
(DIR) Post #AR9tJUdv9dtNFazBwG by chris@abraham.su
2022-12-31T07:21:38Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@cliveNow just the streets of NYC are full of human waste now **rimshot**@JenWojcik
(DIR) Post #ARA9I0gSedrNJMUN1M by purlturtle@mastodon.social
2022-12-31T10:19:32Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive I would like to bring this to @dianeduane 's attention!
(DIR) Post #ARALI0Q4ptCjwRacee by mimsical@mastodon.social
2022-12-31T12:34:26Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive the big problem here as I understand it is ag runoff. NYState is lucky they don’t have that as much. But when you’re the watershed for the chicken producers for all of America… it’s a challenge.That said, the EPA’s consent decree forced the city of baltimore to plug enough leaks that the river down the street from me is full of fish and other wildlife and it’s a delight
(DIR) Post #ARAT9ZcLOvYm8Iol72 by twitterreject@mstdn.social
2022-12-31T14:02:33Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive approximately 50 years ago, the Cuyahoga River, (the main river in Cleveland) was so polluted that it caught on fire AGAIN! The gop actually solved the problem with their best decision in history and created the EPA. That organization has limited pollution by big businesses and the river is actually safe to use now. But Ohio republicans and the Supreme Court are fighting to limit EPA power and return to burning water. Mindboggling
(DIR) Post #ARAf4CEg6aDVcMwzfE by MarkBrigham@universeodon.com
2022-12-31T16:08:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clive @maxganz Not all legislation is good, but good legislation can do great things. Unregulated capitalism and unregulated pollution both lead to disastrous consequences. Regulate them appropriately and society can reap huge benefits, while minimizing external costs.
(DIR) Post #ARAf4CcQgHDQo23xgW by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T16:15:57Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@MarkBrigham @maxganz yep yep
(DIR) Post #ARAfAZS8hIgdMVHozA by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T16:16:56Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@mimsical Yeah, I don't think runoff is as big an issue up here any moreThat is great about the fish!
(DIR) Post #ARAfHqUBldIoDSiKIK by clive@saturation.social
2022-12-31T16:17:25Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@ThePsyOfLife Yes!