Post AL7AlPluurooz4d4CW by mohab@fosstodon.org
(DIR) More posts by mohab@fosstodon.org
(DIR) Post #AL3Ak8iq2m6jBRk23U by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T14:21:21Z
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What's the point?#Privacy https://kevq.uk/whats-the-point/
(DIR) Post #AL3BGOHLjwU4hMGJsW by tulpa@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T14:27:12Z
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@kev I just got a new job. The interview was done over Google Meet. Imagine if I were a Google-hater. How would I have gotten that job?It's just not worth it to be strict about much of anything, let alone privacy on today's Internet.
(DIR) Post #AL3CYoIpp2GYZpIuQK by brandont@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T14:41:44Z
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@kev Reminds me of the "Yet you participate in society? Curious!" meme. Privacy is important and a battle that needs to continue to happen, but there is a level of pragmatism that should also exist. I can advocate for more ethical technology on the web, and also engage in the mainstream internet. I see so many people consider these mutually exclusive, and they're just perpetually angry and cynical. I don't want to be that way.
(DIR) Post #AL3CmZTzif1wfS5MkC by Mundon@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T14:44:10Z
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@kev That's pretty much the point I've hit. As much as I try to keep myself private online, I just don't have the energy to keep at it.I still have a Facebook account, but rarely log into it. I literally only still have it because my wife (who doesn't care at all about online privacy) does most of her business on FB and I want to support her by sharing her posts.By this point big tech has a complete profile of almost all of us. You can minimize adding to it, but that's about it.
(DIR) Post #AL3DFcbjBGL4kyYTL6 by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T14:49:24Z
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Responses so far are refreshing. Thanks, folks!
(DIR) Post #AL3DOhgpebwl7qGzxY by birnim@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T14:51:07Z
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@kev hopefully you aren't going to infosuicide by banning everybody on fosstodon, close it and go to twitter? 😂
(DIR) Post #AL3DlByligaJR9O0S8 by twizzay@thisis.mylegendary.quest
2022-07-01T14:55:12.122749Z
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@kev @brandont I needed to read this today. Thanks. :blobcatbigfan:
(DIR) Post #AL3FCs8FCjopwca58y by glc@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T15:11:22Z
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@kev Privacy is still worth fighting for, even with modern-society compromises. For me, privacy is about choosing who stores and accesses different types of my data. All Facebook need to know is what you choose to post in the group you've joined. Use your privacy knowledge to ensure they see nothing else.I have to admit though I'd personally draw a line at WhatsApp!
(DIR) Post #AL3FRA6RBaorjaY9Kq by vandys@mst.vsta.org
2022-07-01T15:14:00Z
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@kev Really, it's not a new thing to feel like you're swimming against the current when dealing with the rotten. Eugenics, racism, Japanese internment, first Iraq war, .... The dynamic to wear you down and make you conform is a constant in human civilization.I fight harder than most, and accept more inconvenience than most. I wish more people would _think_ about what they're enabling.
(DIR) Post #AL3GUet3Hu5U24WImO by TomLarrow@mastodon.social
2022-07-01T15:25:48Z
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@kev the only way to ensure total online privacy is to never go online, or interact with any online servicesEverything else is a compromise, and everyone has different needs that adjust where that compromise line lives.I wish I could be more secure than a typical Android phone, but I need one to run the software that allows me to view the data that comes from my son's continuous glucose monitor, and soon his insulin pumpDo the best you can, where you can, and accept you can't be perfect
(DIR) Post #AL3GYGLSTYJR4kWdW4 by gortbrown@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T15:26:27Z
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@kev agreed! Sometimes you need (or maybe even want) to use some software that isn't very privacy conscious, but that doesn't mean you don't care about privacy. At the end of the day, people should just use what they need to use, or what they're comfortable using.
(DIR) Post #AL3Ggo3j0n2nxEIxSS by wholesomedonut@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T15:27:58Z
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@kev I’m paid to use tools.You don’t see mechanics starting foundations and screaming at you on socials because they’re told to use Black and Decker tools instead of Cornwell because it’s cheap or available or whatever else.And when I go home?Due to where I live and the industries I’ve worked in, whatever needs to be known about me (and likely a lot that doesn’t) has already been compiled.Life is for family, sunsets, good food, and sharing light in a dark world.I don’t care who knows.
(DIR) Post #AL3IZ9TJiQLzxMkkGO by AstralPegasus98@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T15:49:01Z
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@kev It really is a pick-your-battles situation, some just aren't worth it. I'll use Android and YouTube for example, there's really no viable escaping them.But I absolutely refuse to touch anything that the cancerous stain on society that is Facebook has its wretched tendrils in.
(DIR) Post #AL3IijdSd5Pciq4EXg by AppleOnTech@mastodon.technology
2022-07-01T15:50:44Z
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@kev Hey Kevin, I feel your pain. These days I practice security more than privacy. I to am forced into using whatsapp and I choose to use facebook for family and friends from the past. I just minimize the best I can. As of late I self-host as much as I can. But the toes will always be in the water a little. Just minimize, you won't remove your footprint, but you also don't have to give it all away.
(DIR) Post #AL3JZxRs0GwWuW1ZdA by Ged@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T16:00:21Z
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@kev For me, it's not about changing anyone but more about personal integrity. I admire your post, but it's like telling a smoking addict that they're going to be passive smokers whether they quit or not...On one hand, you're right. On the other hand, a lot of people don't care enough that 'smoking is bad'. I take it a personal responsibility to keep reminding (without pissing them off) - myself too - disregarding if I succeed in changing anything or not... just my two cents.
(DIR) Post #AL3JfJbF4bhz3ixkKe by ttiurani@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T16:01:18Z
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@kev Personally I've stopped thinking in terms of winning or losing.The struggle for an ethical internet, against whatever immoral garbage is being pushed at any given time, isn't going to end.The same goes for environmentism: no matter how bad (or good) things get, the fight for future generations and non-human life will never be over.For this reason, the main issues you must not fail are long-term physical and mental sustainability and choosing battles strategically.
(DIR) Post #AL3JlyloumZEU85Weu by ttiurani@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T16:02:32Z
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@kev Personally I've stopped thinking in terms of winning or losing.The struggle for an ethical internet, against whatever immoral garbage is being pushed at any given time, isn't going to end.The same goes for environmentalism: no matter how bad (or good) things get, the fight for future generations and non-human life will never be over.For this reason, the main issues you must not fail at are long-term physical and mental sustainability and choosing battles strategically.
(DIR) Post #AL3K3w4PgzlVK6LafA by zeab@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T16:05:47Z
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@kev I've still kept fighting. But only for personal. Example, I avoid Google like the plague. But for work? I'm literally at a job that is in 100% Google with Google cloud and everything.It's immensely difficult to keep fighting. Sometimes you miss a lot of what social groups have available. But I still think it's worth not being used as a product. That punishing frustration of being put in a corner, as you stated with Facebook, that keeps my blood boiling.
(DIR) Post #AL3Kr41ut3eECQbbf6 by adamsdesk@mastodon.technology
2022-07-01T16:14:40Z
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@kev For me its not about winning or loosing. Its my own personal values and principles I live by. Its a challenge if life that will never be perfect. I have no issue flat out saying no if whatever I'm choosing to do breaks my values and principles. Is it a struggle, yes it is. Unfortunately society has lost the value of allowing freedom of choice and has made privacy along with security a social isolation. Meaning if you choose privacy/security you isolate yourself from society.
(DIR) Post #AL3PZAN14hAeQDlAqe by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T17:07:25Z
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@ttiurani love this!
(DIR) Post #AL3QUE0gDNWODUWIEK by alex0233@mastodon.social
2022-07-01T17:17:45Z
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@kev the point is if people quit fighting and standing their ground... the people that want to destroy privacy win.
(DIR) Post #AL3TzFl04KIaTUflx2 by SimplyBrandon@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T17:56:57Z
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@kev I get your frustration, I’ve been there many times before. It sucks to feel like your losing the battle. I made myself feel better about my choices by realizing that Im winning every time I avoid the privacy traps. Everyday I don’t use Facebook or Google is a win. Sure, some days I may lose, but I’ll win more than I’ll lose and that’s the best that I can do.
(DIR) Post #AL3UOthmgCTbbxOega by AppleOnTech@mastodon.technology
2022-07-01T16:40:02Z
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@kev looking at this reply again, it would of been so much more poetic if I ended with you don't have to give them the whole foot....🤣 😂 🤣
(DIR) Post #AL3UOxhZougg0TKXuy by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T18:01:35Z
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@AppleOnTech you missed a trick there! 😂
(DIR) Post #AL3Ul8irWfiUYdVUJs by RyuKurisu@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T18:05:38Z
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@kev last year on May 4th (Remembrance of the Dead in my country; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remembrance_of_the_Dead) I deleted my Facebook account, and I haven't missed it one day. The biggest updates of family and friends still reach my wife, so I only "use" it in proxy.I really dislike the use of WhatsApp by my company and family/friends, but technically I'm free of Facebook (but not from Meta 😔), but I see that as a necessary evil until there is a great decentralised/P2P alternative. Google is another story.
(DIR) Post #AL3r5gK8VNkhYM8qdU by gruerproof@fosstodon.org
2022-07-01T22:15:52Z
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@kev Dude, you’re not alone.
(DIR) Post #AL3rdPlOaAzc2Pydvc by mayech@mastodon.social
2022-07-01T22:21:58Z
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@kev I feel like this won't ever be solved by tech.For example, when fairphone, pinephone etc. as well as the firmwares become stable enough to put them in the hands of an average non-techie, with all those annoying but popular services sandboxed, and doing the same on desktop, they will strike back. If the political climate/power dynamics don't change, and they are notably affected in their data collection for whatever reason, they'll use their power to find new ways to get the details.
(DIR) Post #AL4HbDYFc4e4ONRSGO by dallin@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T03:12:54Z
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@kev I went far enough down the digital privacy rabbit hole to experience the feelings of isolation and paranoia that come with it.I still advocate for FOSS and privacy, and hope for a day when most popular software respects those ideals. But in the meantime few people can (or want to) live like Richard Stallman.
(DIR) Post #AL4JF2uAiQFouVFbOa by thisisfilber7@mastodon.online
2022-07-02T03:31:16Z
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@kev Well, I have to use WhatsApp again eventually, but I'd like to recommend you to use 2 phones; 1 for your private life with de-googling versions and 1 with Zuck's products. In case you need to have a Zuckbook account, don't use your real name (maybe name initial might help), no profile picture. Also don't put your personal images in your camera rolls on that phone.Trivia: WhatsApp only knows my phone number, Android version and IP address. The maximum thing I can do.
(DIR) Post #AL4XcZd0cGxmPzKtEm by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:12:25Z
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@birnim haha definitely not.
(DIR) Post #AL4XzNgRBzsc25oatU by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:16:32Z
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@glc That’s what I intend to do - the FB account is purely for that group. Not using our real names and no other info included.WhatsApp is similar. I’m using it purely for the TT group, but I hate that it’s on my phone. I really hate that. I have an app that blocks in-app trackers, so I hope it’s doing it’s job…
(DIR) Post #AL4YJaPPabltI8UBoe by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:20:11Z
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@AstralPegasus98 that’s why I’m so conflicted, because FB really is the worst or the worst.
(DIR) Post #AL4YljWVIPIDfSDzdY by adamsdesk@mastodon.technology
2022-07-01T16:17:26Z
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@kev Hopefully this will change in society. I say delete Facebook and WhatsApp. Its not worth it. Its going to break who you are. At least how I understand what you stand for.
(DIR) Post #AL4Ylk0HVh719o9m3E by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:25:16Z
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@adamsdesk this isn’t about me though. Well, the WA group is, but I enjoy TT and it keeps me relatively fit. So my mental and physical well-being has gotta be more important than worrying about Meta tracking me.FB is different though. It’s the village here EVERYTHING is arranged, so my kids would miss out and we wouldn’t be as integrated into the local community. Again, I think that’s more important than Meta’s tentacles.
(DIR) Post #AL4YohFAECkhSxWk9g by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:25:50Z
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@adamsdesk this isn’t about me though. Well, the WA group is, but I enjoy TT and it keeps me relatively fit. So my mental and physical well-being has gotta be more important than worrying about Meta tracking me.FB is different though. It’s the village group where EVERYTHING is arranged, so my kids would miss out and we wouldn’t be as integrated into the local community. Again, I think that’s more important than Meta’s tentacles.
(DIR) Post #AL4YvJTsyW8vnLZI1Y by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:27:02Z
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@alex0233 I get that. But at some point, real life and practicality wins. Especially when it impacts your family, or physical/mental well-being.
(DIR) Post #AL4Z0D8Rznd1YtsSoq by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:27:53Z
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@SimplyBrandon I really like this perception. Thanks, Brandon.
(DIR) Post #AL4Z7LDiKoT2fDjuO8 by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T06:29:11Z
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@mayech yeah, it’s a constant cat and mouse where the consumer most often loses.
(DIR) Post #AL4sHLXzs5nXhfi91E by mhochzwei@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T10:03:50Z
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@kev Thank you for that post. It perfectly describes the dread I have with my own privacy in this day and age. To keep my sanity, I have become what I would call a "reasonable privacy enthusiast". I am pro privacy, but I understand that:1. Privacy is not black and white2. Sometimes it is reasonable to opt for lesser privacy to gain convenience.
(DIR) Post #AL55ngVglam9OBNj8a by adamsdesk@mastodon.technology
2022-07-02T12:35:23Z
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@kev Oh dang that is a tough situation. Though that all doesn't seem fair. What if someone can't afford a mobile phone or can't use such an app. Elderly is a good example as well. Those groups are deserting those people unfortunately. Best you can do is bring those issues forward with the groups I suppose. If they are truly are community oriented they should make exceptions for those or other cases.
(DIR) Post #AL56NbJdYZNbhhs32O by joel@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T12:41:54Z
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@adamsdesk @kev can't wait for Kev to end up creating a website that mirrors the important announcements of the Facebook group.With an RSS feed of course...Btw isn't RSS-Bridge capable of generating feeds for Facebook? Maybe that could be cool
(DIR) Post #AL57dxrzZJOoF3J52u by Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com
2022-07-02T12:56:05.332783Z
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@glc >All Facebook need to know is what you choose to post in the group you've joined. >Use your privacy knowledge to ensure they see nothing else.But, as you're running their proprietary software, they are informed of far, far more and you cannot avoid their analysis of everything you take.The only solution is to simply not be a used and not use facebook.You sadly have to get people to stop taking photos with their tracking devices that are destined for facebook as well, which is quite hard, as they don't understand what they are doing to you.>I have to admit though I'd personally draw a line at WhatsApp!That is really an bad line to draw - you can easily do far better.I have none of this proprietary "social media" stuff anymore and will never again.I sadly need to steel myself more to stop compromising and completely eliminate proprietary software from my life, despite the designed difficulty of doing so.
(DIR) Post #AL5AqMd5ddWAMzwN7o by glc@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T13:21:49Z
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@Suiseiseki Oh I'd never recommend or use their proprietary apps. Website only, containers, etc. In my situation there is no completely avoiding them, I just mitigate as much as possible on the data they see directly, and the companies/services I use that have their tracking pixels.
(DIR) Post #AL5AqMyMMYX1QxtMHI by Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com
2022-07-02T13:31:57.097634Z
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@glc >Website only, containers, etc.The website is still nonfree software, just in the form of JavaScript ran silently by your browser.Also, just because you run the proprietary malware in a container, doesn't make it not proprietary malware anymore.
(DIR) Post #AL5C3oUfS2MmVXyhSy by borisv@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T13:45:33Z
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@kev Same here. Only for us, WhatsApp has become the de-facto standard. It’s omnipresent, used official communications with schools, kindergartners and some businesses. One of my previous employers used it for internal communication.
(DIR) Post #AL5NCj6hwjCFu7Dvt2 by jinxd@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T15:50:25Z
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@kev Don't look at it as a battle. but a habit. One does not have to go to extreme, but do what feels right for you.
(DIR) Post #AL5NzWiumGA1gbMeum by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T15:59:13Z
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@joel @adamsdesk you know, that isn’t actually a bad idea.
(DIR) Post #AL5PrtJt54ATMK9368 by fedops@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T16:20:16Z
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@joel I've actually been thinking about a one-way feed from Facebook groups into a Usenet newsgroup.I know it's against their ts&cs but I'd really like to get at the content of some of those groups, at least read-only.@adamsdesk @kev
(DIR) Post #AL5gaDT18KsvqwZak4 by joel@fosstodon.org
2022-07-02T19:27:29Z
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@kev now I want a blog about that
(DIR) Post #AL5pHFsOqmlfPXTlAG by alex0233@mastodon.social
2022-07-02T21:04:58Z
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@kev sorry but my existence shouldnt be allowed to be sold to the highest bidder just cuz i checked my email.
(DIR) Post #AL6FiIioybWerZYWGW by scientiac@fosstodon.org
2022-07-03T02:01:12Z
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@kev Exactly! I recently went back and created a Facebook account just for the sake of getting notices and contacting with teachers of my university
(DIR) Post #AL6cL92d6GzJ7nkSR6 by thisisfilber7@mastodon.online
2022-07-03T06:14:42Z
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Heyy @kev, it's really frustrating but I come up with an idea since this can actually be your best chance of being a privacy advocate.You have to "give up" temporarily but you use Zuckbook and Greenapp (with privacy measures for sure) on another phone, seperated from your de-Googling phone. You can take this moment to get closer to them. After you are close to them, you may offer your skills to help them migrating from those shit apps. Well, temporary giving in doesn't mean a loss, does it?
(DIR) Post #AL7AlPluurooz4d4CW by mohab@fosstodon.org
2022-07-03T12:40:27Z
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@kev I wonder if there are people out there who use two phones; one 'tainted' with predatory apps, and one isn't. Separate phone numbers, separate emails… etc. I wonder how practical that can be.I never thought of it as a black/white issue though. If the larger percentage of the apps/services I use are in line with my views on privacy, I'm content. No one can do anything 100% their way because, the way life works, unless it's a science experiment, no one has that much control over anything.
(DIR) Post #AL7CsvShgvPjCkLrJQ by Finner@mastodon.online
2022-07-03T13:04:12Z
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@kev Nail meet head. The best we can do is minimize our database footprint to some extent, based on how much we want to inconvenience ourselves and how much time we have to spend on the combat. I've been wanting to install grapheneOS on my phone for months now, but keep putting it off because I'm like is it really worth it. I still think probably yes is the answer. Just need to stop being lazy. Ten years ago I used to install a new ROM every month. Now I don't want to be bothered.
(DIR) Post #ALBwvcAnEiLmm22AHg by praxeology@post.lurk.org
2022-07-05T19:58:58Z
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@kev I have a lot of very similar emotions. The one thing that has been giving me a strange kind of hope lately is recognizing that lots of folks are feeling a kind of creeping sense of losing not just privacy but a wider sense of ownership and participation in how their everyday life works. It's like living in a strange mega-corp dictatorship of convenience. And almost everyone, even apple and google lovers are feeling some bad vibes lately. So maybe we need to help people to confront these uncomfortable feelings as a first step.
(DIR) Post #ALKJzaK56qUuniHRpY by pyre35@fosstodon.org
2022-07-09T20:55:06Z
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@kev this is not to personally attack you, but I am always confused when the mental health and connectivity example is brought up. Yes, it is a personal thing, and you have to do you, but from my perspective, being on those services does not equate to better mental health and/or connectivity. If it did, the world should be getting progressively better and better because we are so well connected. Instead, we seem to be going the opposite way. What gives? I'm genuinely curious.
(DIR) Post #ALKLaShmUjnHqMVvpQ by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-09T21:12:57Z
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@pyre35 if I’m not in the WhatsApp group, I can’t play in the table tennis league. It’s something I enjoy doing.If I’m not in the Facebook groups my family will miss out on all kinds of fun things going on in the community.So not being on those service is a net negative for me.
(DIR) Post #ALKMAu880U7xKFDN1U by pyre35@fosstodon.org
2022-07-09T21:19:33Z
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@kev that seems to be most peoples logic though and it doesn't appear to be panning out. That's what I'm getting at. I've always had this weird thought process about generating too high of expectations and then when people let you down it's a greater fall, but its a bit too hard to try and compress on here. I guess I'll just have to leave this one alone :)
(DIR) Post #ALKrVKxvDZ56xV60m0 by MrDers@fosstodon.org
2022-07-10T03:10:37Z
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@pyre35 @kev Are you sure you aren't conflating social media with chat apps? I didn't read Kevs article, yet, but it seems societal downturns are more appropriately linked to social media.
(DIR) Post #ALMTGWYjoxELzMdkAK by pyre35@fosstodon.org
2022-07-10T21:48:27Z
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@MrDers @kev def worth the read. I can't adequately lay out my argument in this space. Working on a blog post. It'll be out in 3-4 months probably lol
(DIR) Post #AM3ei34WDK7eEIH4dc by kev@fosstodon.org
2022-07-31T17:49:11Z
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@bjhess i just used a fake name generator online and refused to give them any details. They haven’t asked me to verify yet, but I haven’t used makrerplace either.