Post AFOMEAkLobQ7NK6xH6 by jaranta@scholar.social
(DIR) More posts by jaranta@scholar.social
(DIR) Post #AFNNd5SUWDrB0hF2tk by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T21:07:23Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
Is an admin's choice to defederate from a sizable (1000+ users) #instance worth many registered users' losses of personal connections?
(DIR) Post #AFNNyxk5t5eHRxuFay by mike@social.chinwag.org
2022-01-12T21:11:21Z
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@cosullivan I don't think this has a clear yes/no answer. As an instance admin it's not something I'd do lightly but I can certainly imagine some circumstances where I'd do it.
(DIR) Post #AFNO4xsoHHelciqSpM by cat@hackers.town
2022-01-12T21:12:25Z
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@cosullivan i really strongly believe the fediverse as a network should be feelings/ethics agnostic, users should be the ones with the tools and making the choice to mute/block other users and instances, not admins.
(DIR) Post #AFNOgbw2KP3kYcIztg by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T21:19:14Z
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@cat As a moderator, I agree. Defederating because 0.25% of another instance's userbase doesn't know how to behave, or behaves according to its instance but not the others is akin to shunning RL contacts because they live and work where the crime rate is above 0.25%
(DIR) Post #AFNOgx2pqJyY1meDuS by vfrmedia@social.tchncs.de
2022-01-12T21:19:15Z
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@cosullivan maybe there should be an "it depends" option - admins are usually personally liable for any legal issues incurred operating the instance and compliance with domestic laws, and personally identifiable through the payments to their hosting providers/ISPs.If too many folk on one instance are tooting content that it is legally problematic in the country another instance is hosted in, defederation is perfectly understandable..
(DIR) Post #AFNOqGLvQT5aW517Gy by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T21:20:58Z
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@vfrmedia Why would someone with power to defederate an instance not check that instance's terms of use, and report a user if the offending user violates its host's terms of use?
(DIR) Post #AFNOvGEXIRNJavwanI by cat@hackers.town
2022-01-12T21:21:51Z
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@cosullivan i like that analogy a lot, because i live, have friends in or even drive through a "bad" neighborhood, i'm not somehow infected by it. if i live next door to a trap house i'm not a drug dealer.
(DIR) Post #AFNP2v6Tk0AONUpMgK by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T21:23:16Z
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@mike If I were an admin, I would defederate if the other instance had been purchased, or had a change in admin, and bots registered en masse.
(DIR) Post #AFNP9WHyOpNjRaLosi by vfrmedia@social.tchncs.de
2022-01-12T21:24:27Z
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@cosullivan in some cases the reports (to the distant instance) are simply ignored; or the instance claims to have terms of use but doesn't enforce them. Some admins will even say "if you don't like what is on this instance, then defederate". TBH the Fediverse is large enough now that this doesn't cause a big problem. I have partly lost contact with some mutuals due to a defederation but I can still contact them via alts on other instances if I wish..
(DIR) Post #AFNPoGr4geMfRwCWI4 by cat@hackers.town
2022-01-12T21:23:21Z
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@cosullivan and if i am, where is the line drawn? we defederate with the "bad" instance, do we also defederate with anyone that chooses to not defederate with them? do we track the instances alts down and defederate with those instances too? it really gets me worked up.
(DIR) Post #AFNPoHLCscT2xOIaG0 by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T21:31:48Z
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@cat Yeah I get the sense that some admins think "less than 99.50% of users in this instance obey my instance's 249-word Code of Conduct, so I'll put them on a blocklist and circulate the message that I did so so other admins can follow my lead"
(DIR) Post #AFNQ4XCteskwnWABFY by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T21:34:45Z
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@cat Yeah it's hard to remove supposition that ego is the driver when an instance's defederation happens without reason or notice to its registered userbase
(DIR) Post #AFNVAF1gfOJlv3ScKW by junkman@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T22:31:49Z
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@cosullivan Fedi gives the users the power to mute/block users & domains themselves. Thats what makes it better then centralized corporate platforms. Power to the user!I don't think its right for someone else to tell me who I can or can''t talk to just because of the 'hood they happen to live in.
(DIR) Post #AFNVRiqr1vkLLMjGwS by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-12T22:34:59Z
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@junkman Agreed
(DIR) Post #AFNdxwaaHyD0qkziQC by kadin@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-13T00:10:27Z
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@cosullivan I think if I was on an instance that suddenly de-federated and cost me a lot of valued connections, and I didn't feel like that decision was consistent with my values/needs, I'd be looking for a new instance to migrate to.FWIW, this feels like a rehash of the old BBS days, when sysops would sometimes get in spats with each other and refuse to exchange traffic. I always felt like that was each BBS's prerogative, but it's not very attractive if it's not done for good reason.
(DIR) Post #AFNexHnA4UwgH37xVw by cosullivan@mastodon.sdf.org
2022-01-13T00:21:31Z
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@kadin the defederation in your example would be the intention of the administration, and not an unanticipated side effect of a server upgrade, correct?
(DIR) Post #AFOMEAkLobQ7NK6xH6 by jaranta@scholar.social
2022-01-13T08:26:21Z
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@cosullivan I don't think this question is framed in a manner that makes it possible to answer it in a constructive manner.