Post A93foFSNuCLAjFAd5k by Clariana@spinster.xyz
(DIR) More posts by Clariana@spinster.xyz
(DIR) Post #A93eJWgngYutF8hSts by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:27:31.634022Z
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First of all, Americans are in school for 13 years, not 12. Second of all, the American education system is already so shitty and getting worse, so why would anyone want to support the government funding it even more?https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9766185/Biden-calls-increase-education-12-14-years.html
(DIR) Post #A93eS5IissASuEWEam by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:29:04.793244Z
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@fpcgggc Well dumbing down is not good for any nation and private education won't be the answer so what would you do?
(DIR) Post #A93feIGKcT5YXBmn8y by Gelatinousrube@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:36:51.456592Z
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@Clariana @fpcgggc Counterpointish: my state does a "community college in high school" program that's been very successful by some measures. A lot of kids need more challenge or to get out of a yuck high school environment in a way that's not just dropping out. I think this is WAY better than extending high school to 19/20. https://www.seattletimes.com/education-lab/at-25-running-start-a-success-but-how-to-bring-in-more-minority-and-low-income-minority-students/
(DIR) Post #A93foFSNuCLAjFAd5k by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:43:34.588474Z
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@Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc America won't be world leader for long if most of its population is undereducated, that stands to reason.
(DIR) Post #A93gPqaSooqIbJsUoC by the_trunchbull@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:34:10.192434Z
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@fpcgggc I can’t imagine he means 14 years required, since you can’t force people over 18 to stay in school (and many drop out before then). Just from reading the article it sounds like he means 14 years of free education instead of 12. Kindergarten programs generally aren’t full-day programs, so yes, we get 12 years (1st through 12th grade) publicly funded. 14 years of free education would mean anyone who wants an associate’s degree (community college/technical school) can get one for free. I’ve written plenty on here about problems in our education system and how “liberal” ideologies are making it worse, but if Biden’s suggesting we make associate’s degrees free or publicly fund the first two years of college, I’m for it. Student debt sucks, especially since GEDs/high school diplomas don’t cut it for decent employment in this day and age. People in my generation are screwed already, and college prices keep going up.
(DIR) Post #A93gPr0hFHpHug9RhI by Ismat@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:37:10.784271Z
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@the_trunchbull @fpcgggc I got all my college education for free in India. If poor countries can do it so should the wealthy ones like USA.
(DIR) Post #A93gPrShZAEBJXFoLg by the_trunchbull@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:39:10.609406Z
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@Ismat @fpcgggc I’m almost 30 and still have student debt I can’t see myself paying off til I’m at least 40, despite having been continuously employed and being careful with money. The US really should be able to do better than this.
(DIR) Post #A93gjQjIfLFSCHLh7w by SheChanges@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:54:37.758276Z
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Of course, the USA can do better than putting the next generation into debt peonage. What is lacking is the will to do it. Our American elite can afford their kid's college, so they don't care.@the_trunchbull @Ismat @fpcgggc
(DIR) Post #A93hIPhWTxbn8sCOzQ by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:00:56.880580Z
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@the_trunchbull Since when is kindergarten not a full day?
(DIR) Post #A93haygb9BlyrJcPqa by Ismat@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T21:48:08.005897Z
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@the_trunchbull @fpcgggc I have no debts, my nigel won a scholarship (because he is naturally good at math) so he doesn’t have any debt either. We have been able to travel, deal with my illness etc. can’t imagine what we would have done with college debt.
(DIR) Post #A93hazEz5LHKZxhsRc by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:04:18.231978Z
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@Ismat @the_trunchbull I have school debt but I’m just going to let it ride. It is criminal that college is so expensive, but Democrats don’t discuss lowering the cost.
(DIR) Post #A93i0oYVR1BEy89ZeC by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:08:57.827153Z
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@Gelatinousrube @Clariana The schools near me did this, too. Students took college classes, community college classes, or just went to campus during their off periods.I think private school and homeschool *is* the future of education. If I have children I’m sending them to catholic school, which is what I did in high school. the cost of catholic school is not ungodly, and many catholic/Christian schools do income based tuition.
(DIR) Post #A93iFd1eaJxHYMqoWu by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:11:38.928573Z
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@fpcgggc @Gelatinousrube Whoa, Catholic school, patriarchy central!And yes, I went to Catholic school a few years. Private school foists elites and inequality. As for home-schooling...
(DIR) Post #A93kdL9ms7z6zb5cem by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:38:16.082559Z
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@hanafiyyah @fpcgggc And thus empires fall...
(DIR) Post #A93kgFaG366yZorIuG by hanafiyyah@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:35:01.318371Z
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@fpcgggc Americans are too comfortable...too many kids don't feel a reason to succeed and don't try hard in school. They want top paid jobs and a comfy lifestyle without the process and hard study it takes to get there. American public schools are not competitive. How many students graduated high school while they didn't touch even past algebra classes? Why they are studying Spanish for 10,12,13 years while they graduate and can't even read children's literature while even in my third world country we learned 2 languages to relative reading fluency?! Or even not knowing conventions of punctuation in one's own native language???I feel it's like this in many Western countries, that people got too comfortable. I was helping my husband in reading CVs for a French company and all best applicants were from his home regions , Maghreb, or China... the French native applicants looked like they just want to find a cushy job on day 1 and not work to get there and put things on CV like "using Microsoft word" in a highly technical field...With this of course even large number of postgraduate students in STEM fields in best universities are not from that country!This results even in the best talents leaving their home countries, and harm the countries in the long run... many will stay in their host country for employment if given the opportunity. I don't know the solution, but it's a very bad situation in American public education and it extends even to universities when so many children arrive with no study habits, doing minimum, slacking work. I was a TA for undergrad in an American public university and saw this firsthand.. I know this and I don't even have kids.
(DIR) Post #A93lGbmazVGfqnxz4S by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:45:26.862287Z
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@Clariana Id say more than half of my classmates in catholic school came from families on welfare, and probably 10% were from the reservation, so idk. @Gelatinousrube
(DIR) Post #A93lXdBZ1r6R7klJxY by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:48:31.199693Z
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@fpcgggc @Gelatinousrube I'll say this about my schooling. Good on the basics. Bad on encouraging proper thinking. Some of the sisters were kind. Some were even kind and clever. Some were neither. For a Catholic school my school was pretty open, but we learnt nothing about sex. We learnt nothing about standing up for women or for each other.
(DIR) Post #A93rYX4XqIzIB9IAsa by Ismat@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:05:19.122965Z
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@fpcgggc @the_trunchbull They talk about free education before elections only. Biden had made promises to cancel student debt. Its all forgotten now.
(DIR) Post #A93u3Y0GdBFnx4Cy3M by Chronic-Yonic@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T23:53:55.157354Z
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@Ismat @fpcgggc @the_trunchbull Well saying things like that before an election is very good bait to get votes. They've all been doing this forever and each election, in every country, we all fall for their lies
(DIR) Post #A93x8vdAVnLYXcf4Sm by Gelatinousrube@spinster.xyz
2021-07-07T22:52:26.122858Z
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@Clariana @fpcgggc I'll be interested to see what happens in the next generation. Will people still be eager to send their children here to attend college if it's all insurrectionist critical theory nonsense? They said Gen X were slackers, but they were willing to learn and work under Boomers, who didn't think much of them. Some millennials were supposedly "snowflakes" who prioritized feelings and delivery over content, which sometimes made them miss the memo. Zoomers are being told that the way is to tear it all down, pick everything apart, and that joy is problematic. What are employers supposed to do with this lot? My kid spent the year learning about the ways that America is bad, but not really learning that much about it, or what any good parts were, so she could make an informed decision. She tried to write a paper on the history of the suffragists and her peers tore apart her language (e.g. "feminism" instead of "gender equality.") No feedback or thought about the actual content. This is the kind of ignorance and lack of critical thinking skills I worry about.
(DIR) Post #A93x8w1z1XCDmaGt8q by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T00:58:30.864701Z
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@Gelatinousrube I don’t want to send my kids to college because it is so expensive. I can teach them to think for themselves and to ignore the ideological bullshit. @Clariana
(DIR) Post #A93xFBq1AOASXpeoMK by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T00:59:39.022675Z
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@Clariana at my catholic school our health teacher taught us about sex, and he did say he wished he waited until married to do it. At public school we were taught abstinence, too. I went to both types of schools. I prefer catholic schooling. @Gelatinousrube
(DIR) Post #A942qeIYoWsXIYgmcy by Lilitu@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T01:09:20.491798Z
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@fpcgggc @Gelatinousrube @Clariana Honestly unless they want some sort of highly specialized job, like a lawyer or engineer or something, there’s probably no reason to.Most people don’t need a university degree. A lot of the most stable, decent-paying jobs have never required one. Even some white collar professions are starting to give them less credence now, because so many kids come out of degree mills and still have no skills whatsoever.In the majority of cases, a degree is a status marker more than a necessity. We look down on people who do trades, do apprenticeships, or self-teach, because in a system where money is king, what says “I’m very important” more loudly than spending $50,000 for no discernible reason?High schools get better rankings the more of their students go to a 4-year university. So they terrorize parents until they’re afraid not to force their kid into college, even if that kid wants to be a nail tech, because the school cares more about their ranking than your kid’s happiness. They push this idea that only “dumb people” do professions that aren’t gatekept by a university degree, and the debt industry gets their fresh blood, and the whole cycle carries on.And from there, you have lots of tender young minds to twist with pernicious ideological bullshit like that sex isn’t real, which now they’re even teaching to medical students.One of the best things I ever did — intellectually and financially — was drop out of college.
(DIR) Post #A942qehjIx0mYcSsrI by fpcgggc@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T02:02:26.561305Z
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@Lilitu Most of the Directors/VPs at my Fortune 500 company are without a college degree. I’ll hopefully be able to teach my kids to think really hard before they choose their life path. My husband went to a two year college before university and that’s probably what I will prefer my kids do if they want to attend college. I don’t regret my degree, even though I’ll be paying off loans for a while. @Clariana @Gelatinousrube
(DIR) Post #A94T40fvWgWpGueMi0 by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T06:56:11.490302Z
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@Lilitu @fpcgggc @Gelatinousrube Allow me to go all Libfem on you... I find this lack of respect for education pretty astounding... But hey, it's your life. I've never looked down on people who do trades, but frankly, there aren't that many around so perhaps we do need more artisans or plumbers, but humanities, science, art? I can't help thinking that you think like this because it's really convenient for the people at the top for you to think like this...As I said.
(DIR) Post #A94TCt6t1StUPnUf5c by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T06:57:47.728824Z
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@fpcgggc @Gelatinousrube Part of learning to think for yourself is to have different viewpoints so allow me to question this.
(DIR) Post #A94TV5t6FphLFyj5qS by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T07:01:05.164585Z
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@Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc From the views expressed here American education does seem to have some problems but I seriously doubt "a Catholic education" "let's not send them to uni" or "I can homeschool them and it'll be cheaper" are the solutions... But then I'm European so what do I know?
(DIR) Post #A94UEl1UA3XJrnQGSO by Lilitu@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T06:57:48.457859Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Forgive me if I don’t consider medical schools teaching that women don’t exist and don’t require sex-specific consideration to be real “education.”I’ll have more respect for education when education starts having some respect for its students.
(DIR) Post #A94UElUCRIVNIqrCDI by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T07:01:02.195550Z
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@Lilitu @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Education is completely useless when it teaches lies and bullshit.
(DIR) Post #A94UElzOZJSUrbS6q0 by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T07:09:19.613709Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Lilitu @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Sometimes you have to wade through the lies and the bullshit to get somewhere worthwhile... Let's not forget medieval education was mostly lies and bullshit, but at one point something began to happen and the people who'd received that l&b started to think differently and the renaissance began.My father back in the 40s in Spain received a very Catholic nationalist education (look it up, education in Spain then was the type of education you would expect from the Taliban but with a Catholic bent), which was full of lies and bullshit but he was in a good company, the type of company that looked at their philosophy text book and wondered why the refutation of Kant was longer than what they had been taught about Kant...What I am saying is you have to be familiar with the BS to address the BS and learning how the people promoting the BS think is never lost experience.
(DIR) Post #A94UJaqXQP2Bkibl2m by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T07:10:12.823223Z
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@Lilitu @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Forgive me for saying that I'm sure that's not all they teach in medical school, even in the States...
(DIR) Post #A94XcshPZYUMUEEBuK by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T07:47:18.593043Z
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@Clariana @Lilitu @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc I was raised to have education as one of my highest values. I don't want to hang with people who think people who went to college are snobs, or idiots. I like to hang with people who have interests other than beer and football.
(DIR) Post #A94ZPK2PKaeR87i8jg by Raunchel@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T07:47:27.129830Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Absolutely. Investing in education has one of the highest returns a state can have. Of course, there are issues with public schools, but stopping with them, or cutting the funding even more, definitely aren't solutions. Now, I am a European as well who went to a state-funded school and now sends her own girls to private schools, but those can't ever be the general solution because of cost. What's needed is well-educated teachers who encourage children to learn with the resources that are needed for that. And that means quite a bit of money.
(DIR) Post #A94ZZkUPq4tg43md4y by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:09:09.622327Z
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@BeachBleach @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc Me too, this is what makes me a bit sad about some of these comments. But on reflection the people making them seem pretty well educated and informed themselves so perhaps they might have a point, it's just not one I can share where I am.
(DIR) Post #A94ZjwYroLysOsj6lE by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:11:00.043936Z
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@Raunchel @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Yes, yes, and yes.And there will always be problems with education but in generally some education is better than none.
(DIR) Post #A94cXEET6DYpItoWbg by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:42:19.190196Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Lilitu @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc And you have arguments over what is the truth and what is lies, and who says so??
(DIR) Post #A94dHAi2WvRlhLYM6K by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:50:37.239053Z
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@Lilitu @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc I know three women (online, but have met them in person) in the medical profession who have all gotten pissed at me for pointing out that people can't change sex. One is a doctor, M.D. and lesbian. One is an R.N. (B.S.R.N.) One is a medical librarian (M.L.S.) in the largest medical center in the world. They got pissed at me for posting the paragraph in a currently used college genetics textbook that says "male and female are mutually exclusive characteristics". It's scary the way the medical folks have been captured by the gender woo woo, when anyone who has studied biology should certainly know the difference between sex and gender, as sex is biology and gender is sociological bullshit. I have a BA in biology myself. I just DO NOT GET IT. These are well educated grown women. And they say "Why do you care?". Because I think doctors should first, do no harm. The doctor said that my obsession with it was "pathology". Sure, lady. She's the one, not me, who thinks it's just fine to cut off healthy breasts and genitals of minors. She's the one, not me, who thinks people can change their sex. She must have flunked not only genetics, but histology, which is the study of tissues in the body. WE LEARNED ALL ABOUT SEX YEARS AGO IN SCHOOL. Absolutely no scientific debate there at all. Gender Woo Woo is about as scientifically valid as astrology and phrenology(reading the bumps on your head for clues to character). I'm the one that has to tell HER about lesbian erasure. I'm not the lesbian in this scenario. SMDH.
(DIR) Post #A94daQfVQ0sEhFYBv6 by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:46:41.181269Z
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@BeachBleach @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc If my anatomy professor told me that a penis and a vagina were exactly the same, then I would say that is a lie. You wouldn' t?
(DIR) Post #A94daRC7SkxgKOoEkq by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:54:05.532816Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @BeachBleach @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc That's clear cut, so its not a very good example, but suppose the question were whose proof of the existence of god is better and why, that of Maimonides or Thomas Aquinas?And you can say, "well this is all BS, god doesn't exist..." But to actually answer the question about the BS in the terms it is posed involves a good deal of skill, reasoning and knowledge, and that's why I would argue even education about BS can be productive...
(DIR) Post #A94dqiLDTmli8npFWC by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:51:39.826169Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc You are just proving Lilitu right, though: the people you are talking about didn' t show any kind of respect for the education they received. You need to stop respecting what is being taught to you to rebel and start thinking that it' s crap, if you don' t, you will just keep holding what is being taught as worthy.Cultural revolutions happen DESPITE what is being taught in school, not because of that. You just happen to have free thinkers who start really analyzing what is being told, dissect it, and say something else. Maybe if those free thinkers didn' t have to worry about dismantling bullshit, they would have more time and resources to spend on human development.
(DIR) Post #A94dqitFRFzTqLkQYy by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:57:02.590936Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc Let me get all lawyerly on your arse, define "respect" and define "education"...As for your second paragraph, strong disagree, a "freethinker" (care to define that as well?), has to have something against which to free think about. Dismantling the BS is actually where it is.
(DIR) Post #A94dujXCz5JR06LqHQ by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:54:12.171122Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc You say it like the USA not being world leader is a bad thing. Granted, we could have worse, but it' s not like the USA is so awesome.
(DIR) Post #A94duk2l5mY8Zx72SO by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:57:46.152576Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc There are lots worse. And I am no US lover.
(DIR) Post #A94e8O93J6GKiSZ0im by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T08:58:50.374168Z
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@Clariana @BeachBleach @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc You mean to tell me that we have a clear and cut proof that God exists or doesn' t exists and that the argument is settled in the World we are currently living in?
(DIR) Post #A94e8OWRu6yft1VhBo by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:00:14.256787Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @BeachBleach @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc No. I mean answering the question involves examining reasoning which never goes amiss. But if you take a step back for many of us arguing whether god exists at all is BS.
(DIR) Post #A94fdkP8hGG6gSbaN6 by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:03:26.195425Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc Sure, but, again, maybe if they didn' t have something to dismantle, they would redirect their energy on something else. And if not them, then someone else who benefitted from the fact that bullshit isn' t around to stunt their thoughts."Respect" is a term you used in a way that made me think that you believe that school education, regardless of what it teaches, needs to be considered worthy and "valid"."Education", in this context, is about what is being taught in school."Freethinkers" are people who don' t follow strict academical ideologies.
(DIR) Post #A94fdkrqyVEA7W2W80 by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:17:06.135934Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc But you haven't defined "respect" you have said what you believe what I believe it means (and I happen to disagree with what you say here), so what is "respect" for you?If Freethinkers don't follow strict academic ideology how can they be freethinkers without knowing what the current academic ideology is? Free thinking does not happen in a vacuum, it arises from something, bad education if you will...
(DIR) Post #A94fje7kxZpCwXHs5g by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:14:59.417350Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Yes, there' s worse around. But the USA don' t simply think that they are slightly better than the worst around, they think they are the best goddamn thing since sliced bread.Maybe they need to be taken down a peg or two for them to realize that not everything they vomit is golden.
(DIR) Post #A94fjeXHQgF2DhEFsG by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:18:10.527255Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Gelatinousrube @fpcgggc Of course they do. Every imperial power has always thought like this.
(DIR) Post #A94gWENVTI6LHboyoK by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:12:06.596952Z
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@Clariana @BeachBleach @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc But if we didn' t have to waste time wondering whether or not God exists, which is something that was taught in school for ages as the real truth, then we wouldn' t be in this situation to begin with.Nothing that is subjective and comes from emotion should be considered "truth": you can' t do experiments and reach a conclusion when it comes to philosophy, religion and ethics. Hard science can be wrong of course, but there are (or should be) more strict standards to what can be considered worthy of teaching. Nothing like that happens in humanistic sciences: teaching children that they need to think for themselves and analyze what they are being taught is one thing, but that is not what is being used nowadays in many of these classes.
(DIR) Post #A94gWEu7W2Bmul51e4 by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:26:57.428172Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc You are talking about using logic in mass communications classes to look at what we are being fed by the mass media. Cui bono? Who benefits? Who profits? Why? I'd say the first course would be a form of your college freshman level logic class, which is taught by the philosophy department but counts as a math credit.
(DIR) Post #A94gXKeBeHqf129GFc by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:20:47.037927Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc I used the word in the way I thought you were using it, so in this particular context it means that what is being taught in school needs to be considered valid and worthy.Freethinkers is just a word that I used to describe the category: I apply it to people who, currently, display those traits. In a world where there wouldn' t be strict academical idologies, they would have the same qualities but wouldn' t be freethinkers, they would just be thinkers.
(DIR) Post #A94gXL30A1hKFzl4vg by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:27:09.288855Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc I don't believe everything taught in school is valid and worthy, but even if it isn't it can be useful. Not always, but sometimes.I trust you take my point about freethinkers having to have some knowledge of the conventional beliefs they are rejecting then.
(DIR) Post #A94gjBPNp9jNpxsJii by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:29:17.371071Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc I would tell them that was a lie. I'd go back to embryonic tissue and look up the different tissue pathways of development in the gonads.
(DIR) Post #A94h9qFyZdOE3TBe3E by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:34:06.677181Z
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@Clariana @Omina_Sentenziosa @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc Yes, the atheist/agnostic/deist ball of wax debate versus the religious is a joy for the religious and tiresome for the atheist/agnostic/deist. Although it's much easier for the non religious, using logic instead of belief. If you're a fan of logic, it's a slam dunk. Within that ball of wax there are variations. Some people don't get that. I got thrown out of an atheism sub for bringing up the God of Spinoza, which a lot of hard core scientists are attached to. That's too subtle for some people. I'd always like to know what side, if any, is using facts to support their argument? Who is not using facts, but using scare tactics and bad logic? I think that's pretty fundamental.
(DIR) Post #A94hogGubObmxb692W by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:33:23.524677Z
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@BeachBleach @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc Exactly. And why would you do that? Because it' s the truth. And how do you tell it' s the truth? Because it' s tangible and we experimented and studied it in an objective way. There is a physical and measurable difference between the two things.Which means that if you are taught that they are the same, then it' s a lie or indoctrination. Nobody should respect THAT or the organization that teaches it.
(DIR) Post #A94hognAfSPeZeBuK0 by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:41:29.367285Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc Well in the United States, especially in the South, which were the Confederate States of America at the time of the Civil War, 1861-1865, people are raising hell about critical race theory. They are raising hell b/c their version of history is that the white folks who were the slave owners were benevolent masters, treated their slaves well, and that the slaves kidnaped from Africa LIKED IT and came voluntarily, blah de blah. They refuse to acknowledge that their reason for seceding was to keep holding slaves. If you ask white Southern racists why the Confederacy seceded, they will say "state's rights", which is a cover phrase from them saying "States can do what we damn we please, we don't have to do what Washington D.C. says we do". They even call it "The War of Northern Aggression" which is another lie. South Carolina fired first on Fort Sumter in January of 1861. The South started it. Critical race theory is attempting to look at the experiences of slaves and minority populations, and the rich white men who write the history books, most of them, do not like it. Because it makes them LOOK BAD to tell the truth. We know that rich white men, in particular, must never be made to LOOK BAD. There are good alternative history books out there.
(DIR) Post #A94hrz4FB1Ha7fkQFs by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:30:22.385982Z
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@BeachBleach @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc No, I am talking about teaching CHILDREN how to analyze EVERYTHING that is being taught to them.Critical analysis should be taught when you are really young, not when you are already in university, and it should apply to everything, not just social media.
(DIR) Post #A94hrzaVF55RjiqBXM by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:42:05.583850Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc I agree on both points.
(DIR) Post #A94ieZggKNhtb6teL2 by Omina_Sentenziosa@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:38:50.430355Z
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@Clariana @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc I agree that it can be useful for the reasons you have said (basically, peaking people into rebelling against an unjust system), but that' s not really what the topic was.Lilitu was simply saying that she doesn' t respect education when it teaches bullshit, and nobody should, really. You can use that bullshit, but nobody should respect it or the people/organizations that allow that crap to be taught.I understand the point you are making, I don' t even disagree, the entire issue I have is with respecting the people and schools that teach that stuff. I am not saying that they should be banned or that they are not useful, I am just saying that they shouldn' t be respected.
(DIR) Post #A94ieaF4GXDFJkz6w4 by Clariana@spinster.xyz
2021-07-08T09:50:51.702861Z
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@Omina_Sentenziosa @Gelatinousrube @Lilitu @fpcgggc OK I think we can agree that the teaching of BS cannot and should not be respected but I think we are generalising too much about education from that. For example teaching that penis = vagina is clearly BS & not worthy of respect but I don't think we can write off the entire medical school syllabus because of that.