Post A56PLoBPbsajNuGPkO by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
(DIR) More posts by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
(DIR) Post #A5512pFeoyPH8dhltQ by vegan_dyke@spinster.xyz
2021-03-10T21:35:39.161884Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
This is important: A white woman friend tried to convince a black woman who leads a local feminism group that trans natal males are cheating all women of our privacy, spaces, awards, etc. The black woman responded by saying recently she was challenged for her position by a white man who claims to be NB, so she does understand.https://spinster.xyz/@cubedreamer/posts/A54uTRBeAKFhOiw3maAny of the dozen people who liked/reposted this want to explain why everyone in this story is referred to by race? This isn’t the first Spinster post I’ve seen like this. I’m tired of crypto-racist shit going uncommented in women’s online spaces.
(DIR) Post #A551kKFDSxZ1iHF08u by ArtistBristol@spinster.xyz
2021-03-10T21:57:23.595229Z
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@vegan_dyke If anyone fancies progressive discussion on race relations, try this:https://www.theequianoproject.com/videos
(DIR) Post #A552mNnZK5XdGkr0V6 by vegan_dyke@spinster.xyz
2021-03-10T22:03:56.271299Z
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@ArtistBristol What the hell are you trying to do? Get me to stop talking about race and racism here? This is such a random suggestion as a response to a post that is about something specific to this website. No, I'll talk about it here.
(DIR) Post #A552mOAFxjgoP7T7rc by ArtistBristol@spinster.xyz
2021-03-10T22:08:58.353615Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@vegan_dyke I'm very pleased you are talking about it. Ghettoisation is a tool of capitalist oppression and we shouldn't go along with it.
(DIR) Post #A553p1kdqmgRiKJGO8 by LostInCalifornia@spinster.xyz
2021-03-10T22:20:39.291957Z
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@vegan_dyke @ArtistBristol G’head, and talk about race and racism. Discussions need to had.An example would be a 76% white movement latching itself onto BLM, while bashing “white feminists” as “TERF’s”, and males claiming to be women because “if a black woman is a woman, a trans woman is a woman.”
(DIR) Post #A553xSk1Nzwdjr2eX2 by Babayaga@spinster.xyz
2021-03-10T22:13:11.154769Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@vegan_dyke @ArtistBristol Hi we are really weary of "discussion " of race and why it's often stated like you illustrate.Weve had many trolls trying to pit white roaches against good people as a diversive tactic and so it's delicate and weve discussed intersectionality of sexism and racism a lot. It's a bit like when every new person just needs to talk about sex being real for a bit because it's the first safe place to talk.Talk all you want about what you feel and face of course that's what we are here for. there are great discussions out there that help stop us reinventing the wheel and allowing flares that get copied out of context to tras who then come in to troll.Speak up but try not to escalate if you can X
(DIR) Post #A55ajgfy4sVdOCBX7Y by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T04:29:27.885515Z
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@vegan_dyke I think cuberdreamer was demonstrating the opposite of a TRA narrative, that black women will side with
(DIR) Post #A55cFRinJTkkEJDN4a by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T04:46:24.388727Z
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@vegan_dyke I think cuberdreamer was demonstrating the opposite of a TRA narrative. The narrative is that black women ought to side with trans women against evil white women who use their privilege to ignore their sisters. Never mind all the gender critical women of all other races, if they shout that it's a white woman thing loud enough someone it convinces idiot teenagers that the horror of race segregation is the moral equivalent of sex segregation. The implication being that trans identified males must then be considered women, after being tied so closely to the fight against racism. I'm sure you can tell why that's bullshit. It also works to guilt white women into supporting trans rights in order to fight racism because, again, racism was excluding people and sex is used to exclude people sometimes and EXCLUSION IS ALWAYS BAD! Then ironically because they are so privileged they may try and pressure other feminists to accept men as women. It weaponises white women's guilt and fear about being racist and women's socialization to try and make things fair. Except we all know there's a difference. We have experienced it, we are educated about sex differences, people only have to look at the pictures about TIMs in sports.Just genderists conflate sex and gender, this specific narrative conflates sex based boundaries with race based boundaries. It's a very emotional argument that falls apart because sex based differences are drastic and racial differences are nowhere near as much. One race can't get another pregnant, no race has a specifically different biological burden the women do compared to men. Anyways, I'm pretty neutral towards the story. Should race be unimportant? Yes, ideally. Can someone look for reassurance to counter a racist narrative by explaining their own experience, including race, yes because if no one fights the narrative, then it's the same as all the other censorship. A lot of TRAs compared black women being excluded from womenhood to trans women being excluded from womenhood. Again, I'm sure you can tell why it's bullshit. Insulting even. That doesn't stop them from repeating it because repetition is a good propaganda tool.Don't even get me started on the gender special nonbinaries being hypocritical assholes, who a racism. I hope that clarifies things, I can't speak for everyone but that's my interpretation. Sometimes even if you know a narrative is bullshit you still want to share the experience countering it with others to feel less alone.
(DIR) Post #A55dnsa03sKrKS5GxU by vegan_dyke@spinster.xyz
2021-03-10T22:42:58.025092Z
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@Babayaga I don't see the relevance of half of what you posted, and I don't know who is this "we" you are referring to. but unless you are a moderator, I don't need your permission to post what I want, and I'll escalate whatever I damn well please. The post I quoted got a bunch of likes and reposts, so evidently plenty of people didn't think she was trolling, so I don't know why you have even brought up trolling.
(DIR) Post #A55dntlNf32702PsKu by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T05:03:49.330559Z
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@vegan_dyke @Babayaga I think when she says "we" she's thinking about a specific troll that a large group of users on spinster encountered back in December and repeatedly. OH I GOT SO EXCITED I GET TO TELL YOU ABOUT HOOFING IN THE FRONT BUTT!Basically there was a repeat troll who'd always start off by posting a few discussions about racism. It was always about blacks vs whites and American centered. Things that came off as sincere discussion. At first. Once he had people discussing the inequality of racism he'd try and maneuver that guilt and uncertainty or any arguments against what he'd say towards accepting trans women or being seen as bigots. That whole white nationalists are terfs thing. When women wouldn't budge, he'd get angry and like many trolls before him it would devolve into insulting women for daring to demand sex based rights. Only his insults were so left field they were funny. Eventually if I remember correctly he called everyone snow roaches (or white roaches?) and claimed we all hoofed each other in the front butt. It was funny because he was upset that women wouldn't just accept the transference of racial problems as equivalent to ignoring the differences between the sexes or serving trans identified male above actual women. Also because Hoofing it in the front butt, what even does it means????????? He called himself @MelaninRevolution but at some point some guy went by grandma something who was a very similar troll and possibly the same person. I can't speak for babayaga but I don't think she's trying to stop you form talking, I think she's just trying to explain the common troll tactic that happened here a few times.I also think when she says "don't escalate" she means "don't feed the trolls" or possibly even if you care and are deeply impacted by racism if you become very irate at other users here they may mistake you for a troll because pretending to be very upset about racism has been used as a troll tactic before and she would be sad if a sincere women looking for communication and understanding were to be mistaken as such. Ok, I basically I can't find a ton about hoofin in front butt guy but I did find this link:https://spinster.xyz/@Kay/posts/A2BA2tHrtieeB40uoa I hope you can feel comfortable here and continue discussion. Also please be aware that your profile is public and people from other instances may jump on trolling you. You aren't posting to just spinster, you're posting to all of the fediverse. If you take anything from this comment, please let it be hoofing in the front butt. Thank you.
(DIR) Post #A55gNBcfS4D4QwIMt6 by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T05:32:37.907850Z
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@vegan_dyke @Babayaga To quote melanin revolution, "Black women here to fight the White patriarchy"https://pl.anon-kenkai.com/users/A2FWqRM0yegYEbH1hA"Intellectually, that’s not a great argument against the validity of trans people. A lot of straight people “try out” homosexuality and decide it’s not for them.Trans women aren’t women because they possess a functional Y chromosome. If you don’t have a functional Y chromosome, you’re a woman. Done. If you can’t justify trans exclusion based on that simple biological ideal, you can’t justify trans exclusion."I'm trying so hard to find where he said hoof in the front butt.
(DIR) Post #A55glKUc7mG6tT2Zfc by WaxJustice@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T05:35:04.052555Z
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@BCLADY @vegan_dyke @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution As a veteran of HITFB, I second everything the hamster just said. There's a bit of initial weariness because we want this to stay a safe place for all women to discuss and voice their concerns about race. This particular troll worked that angle pretty hard. Hoofin in the front butt is a hell of a legacy though. :blob_cat_giggle: :blacker_heart: ♀️
(DIR) Post #A55glZIP5SP8nwRXDk by WaxJustice@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T05:36:27.957178Z
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@BCLADY @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution @vegan_dyke *Wariness, not weariness.
(DIR) Post #A55hfJrJfTpH91MDS4 by Gelatinousrube@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T05:45:37.507394Z
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@WaxJustice @BCLADY @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution @vegan_dyke I just want you to know that I'm starting to hear "hoofin in the front butt" to the tune of "workin on my night moves."
(DIR) Post #A55hpMGfZBghVm0FKC by WaxJustice@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T05:48:23.871402Z
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@Gelatinousrube @BCLADY @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution @vegan_dyke Great me too now!
(DIR) Post #A55i1MmzSDc4bSqYzo by polarisera@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T05:51:05.505854Z
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@Gelatinousrube @WaxJustice @BCLADY @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution @vegan_dyke No luck
(DIR) Post #A55j3cxMPp8DHKL6HI by Hollahollara@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T06:02:42.652175Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@BCLADY @vegan_dyke @Babayaga This whole conflation of race and political bent seems a bit American, if that makes sense. In the two party system, the stereotype is many white people vote Republican, and POC mostly vote Democrat. Further, toxic activists see transgender activism as the (noble) left versus the (hateful) right, and so “accusations” of holding white supremacy as an ideal, or “betraying” one’s race abound, depending upon which stereotype the person connecting race to transphobia is using at that moment.The idea of race or ethnicity being an absolute binary in the U.S. is stupid as well, but here we are, being free. 🤷♀️(This sort of exposed bias also happens when liberal white atheists find out many POC are socially conservative or religious in the U.S.)I don’t know if race and politics divide so neatly (in stereotype or fact) in other countries.
(DIR) Post #A55jenYZxztorxTMAK by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T06:09:25.687880Z
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@Hollahollara @Babayaga @vegan_dyke I agree with this. I hate the two party system. Even in Canada it's going to get to a point where we'll either: be able to have words and spaces to talk about women while having an idiot conservation try to fuck with abortion and birth control.ORHave abortion, birth control but continue to lose our rights and spaces which will create more pain and discomfort.Either way women are second class citizens. I want a five party system, at least. White woke people being challenged about their hypocritical and conflicting views is funny. I want a youtube channel that just interviews them and shows people contradicting their assumptions so I can laugh.
(DIR) Post #A55zVqXZ6QuwmckevY by waltercool@pl.slash.cl
2021-03-11T09:07:05.026900Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Hollahollara @BCLADY @Babayaga @vegan_dyke Not at my native country for sure, but politics divide us a lot.Under “Hispanic culture” we aren’t “shamed” to use some words like Anglo-Saxon countries, Spanish alike countries didn’t used slavery on-demand like England/France/Holland, instead they used religious conversions. So, we don’t have “historical problems” problems between black and white people like US.We call any “dark skin guy” as “the black”, any “blonde white skin guy” as German, any “Asiatic guy” as “Chinese”… and we have a whole list about it and no one really gives a fck.Usually, the good thing on Spanish I guess, is how gendered is our language, and most people are proud about it. This US/UK about “respect my pronoun” thing is VERY unpopular.
(DIR) Post #A56PLoBPbsajNuGPkO by BeachBleach@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T08:35:25.653002Z
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@BCLADY @Hollahollara @Babayaga @vegan_dyke The officials in the Nevada Democratic Party all resigned after socialist BernieBros got elected to all the positions. They also took a bunch of money with them and shifted it to somebody else. So this is what happens when Bernie gets millions of people motivated to change things, they join the DSA, and establishment Democrats refuse to accept progressives. And Bernie was stopped from getting the nomination TWICE by the establishment Democrats. So fuck them. A lot of people in the U.S. have no political party.
(DIR) Post #A56PiP7cx70uJsGfr6 by Hollahollara@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T14:00:41.759208Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@waltercool @BCLADY @Babayaga @vegan_dyke That is interesting, how your country sees the issues differently, regarding inherited shame, bc there was conversion instead of chattel slavery.I am sure the pronoun thing will run it’s course too, and be rightly mockable.
(DIR) Post #A56PjcOZ5Y7rm7llAW by hanafiyyah@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T08:56:24.720243Z
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@BeachBleach @BCLADY @Babayaga @Hollahollara @vegan_dyke I always found the claims of "stealing"/"being stopped" dubious, but I got involved as an observer in last election in dem primary level in one of the first voting states and omg...the cheating was literally so blatant. I could tell a lot of stories about that. It was really insane thing to witness and I kept needing to check with others to confirm if I didn't imagine it.That, and just the level of harassment I received from dems...literally had one woman following me around calling me a "sand n***er" (for liking the wrong democrat...) in the primary location while a bunch of other people looked on and ignored it. When someone asked me to speak to local newspaper on my experience, they said "this is normal when tensions run high in election year" as their reason to not publish it.Politics, and probably especially intra-party politics, seems to attract the lowest common denominator.
(DIR) Post #A57R0rktWkX7Rtxhmy by Melkora@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T11:17:48.732424Z
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@BCLADY I remnber this one. But I am afraid, you can't call his action a sincere discussion about race. He was simply canting phrases, probably coppied from social media, didn't even bother to look logical and screamed racist and white feminist randomly at everybody. On the other hand, from my own experience, there are lot of women here, presumably white, who are not very fond of discussing racial and ethnical oppression here and call y, who try a troll. @vegan_dyke @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution
(DIR) Post #A57R0sIvUDkt9Rsspk by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T01:49:56.734662Z
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@Melkora @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution @vegan_dyke I am sorry if you've had that experience on here with people immediately jumping to calling someone a troll. Do you have any links to that happening? I wish I could figure out a way to make it saner to talk about this sort of thing. The biggest thing I can start off with is confirming the instance the user is from.I think race is a lot less uniting to people than physical sex is because it's a lot more cultural. Cultures vary a lot and race ties culture together with physical looks. Countries have completely different histories. I'm not sure what the solution is but I know for me a big part of it has been to focus more on my own country and community. I don't really feel like I can do much for other countries. I am not rich or well connected. I read stuff. Sometimes there's a lot people can do in actions that would never translate onto social media because posting about doing the things would undo the whole intent of the good action. I disagree about the troll, though. His first posts did actually appear to be a sincere discussion. Things like talking about reducing racism and discussion about reparations. Predictably they didn’t get a lot of attention. They weren't too long. Nothing gets attention like front butt hoofing. It was probably less fun to him than just being a nonsensical jerk.
(DIR) Post #A57evhvC3p9srODIwq by vegan_dyke@spinster.xyz
2021-03-11T08:21:43.248869Z
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@BCLADY If people mistake me for a troll just because I become irate, they are the problem, not me nor any trolls from the past. My words speak for themselves and I've not posted anything trollish. There are no trollish posts in this whole conversation, so "don't feed the trolls" would be a pointless suggestion. "Don't jump to conclusions just because somebody said something about race" is the relevant suggestion here.
(DIR) Post #A57eviPKFnGGMqJMum by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T04:25:53.415800Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@vegan_dyke I disagree that don't feed the trolls is a pointless suggestion. I interpreted your outraged reply as possibly trollish,"What the hell are you trying to do? Get me to stop talking about race and racism here?" because it was really quickly assuming the worst of another user. Who was admittedly ignoring your question but also wasn't trying to stop you from talking and I viewed it as trying to contribute in a way she could. I even hesitated to write this because I don't know what your response will be about my honest interpretation. It's hard to tell mock anger that's built up for a troll and it's not fair that it's a tactic used to dismiss actual anger from negative experiences. I don't know how to counter act this except by pointing out the narrative while also continuing to talk. What you kept posting demonstrated that it wasn't trolling. It's pain. I'm sorry feeling like you might be picked out for your race. It isn't fair when women who are fighting to equality of the sexes should also fight other forms of discriminations. It's been historically demonstrated that women have let others down when it comes to the achievements of women's rights one the dominants race got what they wanted. However, race is really a lot more complicated and varies a lot more than sex. So I would expect more conversation. Considering people can be of different races, mixed races, that different races have different histories with different countries that there's different percentages of the population.My way of coping with racism online is to try and make sure I know when I'm dealing with a specific geographic location (local newspaper comment section) and having different expectations when it's from all over the world (I pretty low expectations of fediverse lol).I think it's good that you asked questions and I don't care to judge your emotions, only to try and inform you how an outsider might see things. I only want you to know how I see this community seems to be forming. Considering I spend way too much time on here anyways.
(DIR) Post #A57f9rXp4y9klA22Pw by vegan_dyke@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T04:27:10.458097Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@BCLADY I haven't had that experience. I brought up people assuming that I'm a troll because you said that you thought babayaga was warning me about being mistaken for a troll. Honestly, race should not be a uniting force at all because it's a social construct that's useful only for perpetrating racism. Anti-racism should be the uniting force, and talking about racism is a part of anti-racism. Anybody who feels divided from other women because of that discussion is the problem; neither the discussion itself nor its superficial similarities to trolling is not the problem.
(DIR) Post #A57hpGQHgcT3hSNJuy by vegan_dyke@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T04:32:01.800512Z
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@BCLADY Stop assuming that you know what I felt. I was not in pain. I asked a question about something someone else posted on Spinster, and someone responded with a random suggestion that I go to a completely different website for discussion about racism, a website that you can't actually discuss anything on because it's for videos. I didn't ask for a discussion about racism; I asked about the interpretation of someone's post. I was suspicious because the suggestion made no sense.
(DIR) Post #A57hpGsdzB9X7Pdy7c by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T04:58:20.574262Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@vegan_dyke Uh, ok? You admitted you were irate so should I have said irate as a specific word instead? Also what else is someone supposed to assume when there's swearing involved? Please write detailed instructions for how to communicate on spinster since you seem to be able to see everything wrong. You're saying you didn't ask for a discussion of racism but I disagreed with your interpretations and the reason happens to be because of trolls using racism specifically. So what, I shouldn't bother trying to talk to you? Because you'll just tell me I'm doing this and that wrong? so I'm supposed to both have a conversation about racism because you originally wanted to know why race was mentioned in an original topic but also I'm not supposed to try and understand how that impacts you? I need to mind read when your done talking about something online? What do you want then because it seems like engaging with you will only be met with commands and disregard. Like anything I type aside from agreement will be met with some issue or other being told that it's not right. It makes me expect that the point is for you to feel in control by telling me what to do instead of actually communicating to me. Not exactly solving problems.Maybe realize that people are going to assume things and talk about them because that's how communication works. There have to be more assumptions online because there's less to go off of. Also if you're going to mention your own emotional state then commanding someone to not acknowledge it, that a shitty thing to do. It makes me realize that there's little point in talking with you. Whatever, I'm done. You'll just be irritated at anything I say anyways.
(DIR) Post #A57sn8HC6TB3LmJFui by Babayaga@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T06:49:07.400418Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@BCLADY @vegan_dyke I think it's time to call it. Crazy or a tra. Avoid avoid
(DIR) Post #A57tWWqFcHFUZOLzEm by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T07:09:25.370948Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@Babayaga @vegan_dyke I'm more optimistic. I don't think she's crazy or a TRA.I think she is frustrated by racism and isn't even aware of how her communication will only be divisive. Which is self defeating for the cause of stopping racism because if you can't even talk about it then, what can you do? This is a weird thing similar like how someone gets caught up in gender. It's frustrating but I'd rather have people stand together and learn to get by this...communication tactic? Pattern? Trap? Idk what to call it. It sucks because it's a reoccurring thing but I don't even know how to describe it. Only that it ends in one person seeking control because of an "ism" or "phobia" and that if you're stuck being seen as someone to be commanded no matter what, that's not a conversation anymore and there are times when it's ok to do that but online certainly isn't the place to expect that, or with friendships, it's really frustrating. I don't know how to fully define it. I've seen this sort of thing happen before with friends on things so I don't think it's trolling. I think it's being unaware that you've stopped conversing. It's a pretty common tumblr thing actually? Like when teens fight over stuff with having little experience with it. She might be a teenager?But also lol she raised the idea that it's important to have conversations about anti racism but also that I shouldn't be the one to do it with her because I didn't specifically ask her to have a conversation about racism so I'm pretty confused about what she thinks of the idea of how there shouldn't be racism but there needs to be anti-racism which validates the concept of racism? It mostly makes me a bit sad and frustrated. It's from social media overload, I think? Also from people who aren't used to questioning things. I think her original question was a fair. It makes me a bit sad to not have the communication but what are you going to do?
(DIR) Post #A57xBI7NYzYsdlUgJU by Babayaga@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T07:32:53.810690Z
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@BCLADY @vegan_dyke I cant imagine coming to spinster which is calm and full of kind women and writing such hostile things, by all means question anything and talk about how you feel and what you face, but trying to demonise every person trying to engage with you on it is just really weird.Its mute anyway because they blocked me with the first message.
(DIR) Post #A57xBIYfvVOc0QGTrM by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T07:50:23.775228Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Babayaga @vegan_dyke I mean fair, it might just be me because it's something I've experienced elsewhere recently so maybe I'm seeing something that isn't there. I'm blocked too but whatever, if someone has to do that because I call them out on hypocrisy, maybe if they're sincere they'll think about it for a while and come back realizing that is isn't helpful. And if they are a troll then they won't play with me which is fine by me. Idk. All I know is that lately I've figured out when talking about controversial topics, if I'm in a place where I'm getting commanded again and again and the other person won't even acknowledge my written arguments they agree with (like she didn't challenge me on my view of "the narrative" I was describing so I'm assuming she agreed with me) then I'm getting to the point where I'm not going to entertain it because no matter what I will be chastised. There have been discussion about race on spin where women have been able to air their frustrations about racism which haven't ended in one side commanding the other side and taking anything said as a bad faith argument. I appreciate them. I am also willing to listen to those who say they feel racism is a thing because well, it's historically been a thing. I'd like to be mindful of that. Except I don't think you can have the same standards online, I don't live in the US, so trying to get me to agree with your views about US racism by simply referring to it as racism is not going to do much. It's like race is the equivalent to trans in that it's a really big concept that is very confusing.I mean ideally I'd like to be supportive but accepting someone who is only going to criticize you isn't supporting them. I also might make bad jokes every now and again and I hope that I don't hurt any women by that.Bah, I do hope she's a teen or young adult who's trying to learn how to make arguments and took something from this instead of stupid troll.
(DIR) Post #A57xExLOk4efMynaBE by You_cat_to_be_kitten_me@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T07:44:47.708193Z
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@Babayaga @BCLADY @vegan_dyke Look at his reposts on his page 😄
(DIR) Post #A57xExtmgEA15ct2mG by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-12T07:51:03.790635Z
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@You_cat_to_be_kitten_me @Babayaga @vegan_dyke Can't blocked
(DIR) Post #A5G7q8HxLcP8XE4hXs by Melkora@spinster.xyz
2021-03-14T13:20:03.137527Z
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@BCLADY Thanks for asking but it's been a long time and I let it of my mind, so I can't give you any details. But it happens a lot and I think a lot of white women here are ready to call you a troll rather than to challenge their own perejudices or racism. I think only a white woman can say, race is "divisive" or that it doesn't matter, or we should center more crucial issues that we, women have in common. Because it doesn't matter, how much race is "socially constructed". If other people, the more privileged ones see you as "racially/culturaly lower, they let you know and it's very real. Even the experiences and challenges women face differs widely based on race or ethnical background and it seems to me, a lot of white privileged women are simply to lazy, to acknowlege these differences and learn, instead of dismiss it as something " divisive". @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution @vegan_dyke
(DIR) Post #A5G7q8l1bXelzNfur2 by BCLADY@spinster.xyz
2021-03-16T06:27:45.410976Z
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@Melkora @Babayaga @MelaninRevolution @vegan_dyke I agree race matters. I disagree that it isn’t divisive. I don’t mean that in a moral way. I don’t mean to make that it’s something to dismiss. I mean in that there’s a lot to it and people have different definitions and information about it. So if you have a group goal, it can be derailing. When you add trolls who’ve used discussions of race to push people towards arguments as well it's going to make people more on edge in an online environment. Divisive doesn’t mean conversation needs to be dismissed, I mean we’re both talking here. In English. If we were to each talk in a different language that would make it more difficult. Does that mean we have to figure out how to center all languages equally? If not does that make each of us lazy? Since most people speak Chinese should we all stop to learn that? Or is it more effective to work with people you are close to in real life and try to take into account that the people you talk to online likely live in places where there are completely different percentages of cultures/races and to understand who you are talking too?If someone can't speak the same language as another person, they can still generally tell if they are women. Birth control and abortion doesn't require much change even if it's done in another country. In the case of the original question that started all this, I think it was a good question. It was posted on it’s own and by itself. It clearly explained what was meant by race.People answered.I think that defaulting to troll accusations is something people do online when they might be embarrassed or else uncertain. I believe it’s more likely to happen when they’ve been walked through what appears to be sincere conversation only to have it turn into an impossible situation where, since someone is angry about injustice and there is no right way to respond each side is left frustrated. It's easier to label or black than leave yourself open. It also might be time saving if someone is an actual troll, or really bad at communicating. I believe understanding that this is likely is anonymous online forums helps me be less emotionally irritated.I certainly felt that I couldn’t respond in any way with vegandyke in the end. At least, no way that would have let her feel heard but also wouldn’t have resulted in her seeing that any response I had going to be treated as something she didn’t want. I tried my best, it ended with me blocked. It seems like we couldn’t agree to disagree, it’s more like anything I said would be met with a command until it became impossible. I got called a troll here once when I asked for weird NSFW cartoon diaper pics to be marked as NSFW. Then someone called me a man because I used the word dude. I just expect people to be more reactive online over all. There are also huge information gaps, not just of racism but specific cultural differences that you can’t know unless the user is open with you and you each understand each others culture. It takes time and communication to understand each others behavior vs bodily states being consistent across humanity. That isn't lazy, it's realistic. UK vs US? They can be different. Canada getting bulldozed by US political stuff, also likely. Living in a city vs in a small town? Very different. So if race isn’t divisive, as you say, and that’s only a view applicable to white people, please help me understand how to be unifying. Even though that might make you assume I am white and lazy by your logic. Tell me a definition of race that everyone can agree on to be united?Tell me the order in which women should all start discussing work to understand racism issues?What if someone lives somewhere that contains no people of that race or culture?How are people who live where there's not much variety of racial differences supposed to be anti-racist but also not performative? Which race issue specifically should be discussed first? What happens when people disagree even if they are of the same race?If a group of people have a specific “enthnical” challenges, can you give at least three examples of that and then an order of their importance?Again, what if people from the groups you mention disagree with your prioritization? Does race have more of an impact than class/wealth, sex, physical ability (disability) or country/nation of residence or another part of someone’s daily experience? Can race be used to group large amounts of people together to fight their oppressors and what happens if they can't?You’re broadening the topic even in your short reply. Race, culture, ethnicity are all separate things, it would be best if we had a mutual understand of them instead of broadly sweeping them together for communications sake. There's a lot I could say but this is already really long and I'm probably not wording it the best but I'm trying to to self censor here.