Post 9tfdEfMRaMHReeNPyC by solderpunk@tilde.zone
(DIR) More posts by solderpunk@tilde.zone
(DIR) Post #9tfSQTfBntntM1ZfKC by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T13:19:43Z
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I don't understand how even a rough approximation of vi's notion of "marking" a location in a file so you can jump right back to it hasn't been adopted by every other editor in the world. Heck, even in non-editing contexts, it would be amazing. I would kill to be able to mark and jump between browser tabs, and between points in webpages. Why is this not a thing?
(DIR) Post #9tfWCua7KFBmbNzLsm by es0mhi@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T14:02:03Z
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@solderpunk As I'm an emacs guy, I'm not familiar with the function in vi. (But in emacs you can send a marked position to the mark ring - ctrl+space ctrl+space - and than jump to or cycle through marked positions.) According to "why this is not a thing" elsewhere, my first guess would be the ubiquity of the search function (e.g. ctrl+f in the browser.) It took the world by storm since allmighty google taught us, that's how to use a computer: by typing search terms into a slot. I hate it!
(DIR) Post #9tfWsdc0o8r48PltVA by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T14:09:38Z
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@es0mhi That sounds like a very similar functionality, but instead of using a ring buffer in vi you give positions single character labels (e.g. a, b, c) and can then jump to those positions by label. Maybe there's a way to cycle through them, too, but I've never needed to. I'm not at all surprised that emacs has something similar and didn't mean to imply vi was unique - just that I feel like this basic idea should be much more widely implemented in all kinds of textual interfaces.
(DIR) Post #9tfXCBji9vA9TGh9lo by aev@mastodon.sdf.org
2020-04-03T14:13:03Z
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@solderpunk Bookmarks are a thing in web browsers, does that count? And the Notepad++ editor and many programming IDEs have bookmarks or other kinds of marks, that allow jumping back and forth. Does that count?
(DIR) Post #9tfZXe6u3m3HSeu0vo by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T14:39:27Z
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@aev Web bookmarks aren't really the same thing as what I have in mind. I'm talking about a means to quickly navigate between points in a text document within a single viewing session, not loading a previous document again in a new session. And it was actually my inability to find this kind of feature in an IDE (Rstudio) that triggered this complain in the first place. I'm glad to hear some others have it.
(DIR) Post #9tfa8TcO24kpdQBtSq by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T14:46:06Z
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@solderpunk @es0mhi My EdimCoder editor has this, with the labels.
(DIR) Post #9tfaDtS3Pc8PCfwO0W by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T14:47:05Z
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@solderpunk @es0mhi My EdimCoder editor has this, with the labels. You can also do operations on the labels/bookmarks, instead of just jumping to them. But EdimCoder is a line-editor, so it works a bit differently.
(DIR) Post #9tfaGARvBYoAV5xlsO by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T14:47:30Z
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@solderpunk @es0mhi My EdimCoder editor has this, with the labels. You can also do operations on the labels/bookmarks, instead of just jumping to them, and bookmarks can be just one line or a range of lines. But EdimCoder is a line-editor, so it works a bit differently.
(DIR) Post #9tfalG70BLet2X0HwW by djmoch@mastodon.danielmoch.com
2020-04-03T14:53:05Z
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@solderpunk Hey @ed1conf, should we tell them this didn’t start with vi? 😉
(DIR) Post #9tfb1CKzyxuHy39Pvc by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T14:56:00Z
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@djmoch @solderpunk @ed1conf I don't think solderpunk ever suggested it started with vi. Why does this matter exactly?
(DIR) Post #9tfbT8J6YrW3ZjaMRE by ed1conf@bsd.network
2020-04-03T15:01:00Z
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@solderpunk If you haven't encountered it yet, the $PAGER less supports bookmarks very similar to ed/ex/vi/vim. Likewise, if you use file-managers, vifm similarly supports marks.
(DIR) Post #9tfbWNysk7Mf3Vg3xg by es0mhi@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:01:39Z
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@krixano @solderpunk yes, but let's forget about editors for a moment. The original question is the more interesting: Why doesn't this feature exist elsewhere? Jumping between tabs in the browser would be fantastic indeed: I constantly find myself rearranging the tabs, so that I have certain tabs side by side and do not have to circle through them all. The vi idea of attaching a label to something could be applied to almost anything!
(DIR) Post #9tfbegN6Fc98PSxf4S by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:03:08Z
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@es0mhi @solderpunk I agree, that question is very interesting. Browsers already have the potential to do this, because anything with an id can be pointed to directly with a hash after the address.
(DIR) Post #9tfby35vzV1qO1APYW by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:06:39Z
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@djmoch @solderpunk @ed1conf Oh, btw, TECO had marks before Emacs.
(DIR) Post #9tfcRpFg1TgO8nvG1w by aev@mastodon.sdf.org
2020-04-03T15:11:54Z
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@solderpunk Understood. Sad to hear RStudio doesn't have this. In web pages the bookmarks can be set in-page by the author, using named anchors. Then we can focus such an in-page bookmark by using #name as the address suffix.
(DIR) Post #9tfd75GrMwY1hE9K0u by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:19:27Z
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@es0mhi @krixano I do the very same thing with rearranging tabs! I can see some people arguing that the need for this is a symptom of bad tab management practices, but what would they know? :p
(DIR) Post #9tfdBDcKHPpUjwA50y by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:20:12Z
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@solderpunk @es0mhi I'm bad at managing tabs also, lol
(DIR) Post #9tfdDROc1OrC3Mo4nY by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:20:38Z
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@solderpunk @es0mhi I'm bad at managing tabs also, lolI typically have at least 50 tabs open at once.
(DIR) Post #9tfdEdnJPUaGnOvqZU by ed1conf@bsd.network
2020-04-03T15:07:11Z
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@solderpunk A quick test shows that more(1) on OpenBSD (the default $PAGER for the man command) also supports marks.
(DIR) Post #9tfdEfMRaMHReeNPyC by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:20:50Z
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@ed1conf Ah, that's so great to know about less and more! Should be especially handy for reading man pages. Thanks a lot, my complaining was worthwhile. :)
(DIR) Post #9tfda5tK8pei1ByQam by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:24:43Z
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@krixano @es0mhi Oh, how cute that you think that's bad! I'm probably closer to 500. :p
(DIR) Post #9tfdhrDqZ2sEq8H6rQ by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:26:07Z
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@solderpunk @es0mhi I mean... I sometimes get up into the hundreds, until my computer crashes, lol (this just happened to me like yesturday I think).I don't think I've reached anything above around 200 though :)
(DIR) Post #9tfdpohJpoNfKIr6kC by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:27:34Z
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@krixano @es0mhi But after it crashes, you restore your session and just keep on adding more tabs to the pile, right? Some of my tabs have probably been resurrected dozens of times in this way and I've never even actually focussed on them so that the pages load. There are genuine archaeological strata in my tab list. I'm a monster.
(DIR) Post #9tfdx7tMrwBQsqycuu by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T15:28:52Z
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@solderpunk @es0mhi I don't always restore my session. Sometimes I just start fresh again.
(DIR) Post #9tfmTF6GP8og8fplNw by djmoch@mastodon.danielmoch.com
2020-04-03T17:04:19Z
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@krixano @solderpunk @ed1conf The wink emoji indicates to you that I think this is important? I do not.
(DIR) Post #9tfmZxSeNru5SZVW2C by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T17:05:33Z
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@djmoch @solderpunk @ed1conf It doesn't how much you thought it was important, because it was clearly important enough for you to mention it, now wasn't it?
(DIR) Post #9tfmlNQgAv0ZBU1wG0 by krixano@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T17:07:37Z
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@djmoch @solderpunk @ed1conf It doesn't matter how much you thought it was important, because it was clearly important enough for you to mention it, now wasn't it?
(DIR) Post #9tfqrfy8YdeWEowHHE by es0mhi@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T17:53:33Z
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@solderpunk May I borrow the term "tab archeology"? Has a lot of potential ;-)
(DIR) Post #9tftVptRHLU4Vd1F0y by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T18:23:13Z
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@es0mhi Feel very free!
(DIR) Post #9tfuViCtxIKucpcwvA by jirka@mastodon.sdf.org
2020-04-03T18:26:26Z
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@ed1conf @solderpunk And how about the sc spreadsheet? It supports the vi-like bokmarks, too.
(DIR) Post #9tfuVm4XaK1cc3kKRc by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T18:34:22Z
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@jirka @ed1conf I am very intrigued by the fact that multiple people have referred to these marks as "bookmarks". To my mind "bookmark" is strictly web-browser lingo for saving URLs. Did browsers co-opt this term as it was being earlier used by editors, or have people later generalised the meaning of "bookmark" to also refer to the presumably much older concept in editors?
(DIR) Post #9tfvXz8m4Hqtg1LQFE by ed1conf@bsd.network
2020-04-03T18:45:59Z
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@solderpunk That's a fascinating question.I've picked up on the linguistic differences, and occasionally vacillate to choose a "right" term in one context or another, but I've never applied serious thought to the historical background. My digging doesn't show "bookmarks" in any of my pre-browser (I lump lynx & other gopher/WAIS browsers in that category) document searches. Not saying it didn't exist, but "marks" has a much stronger presence.
(DIR) Post #9tfwAJjnw7FaYuwXpo by solderpunk@tilde.zone
2020-04-03T18:52:57Z
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@ed1conf That's what I'd have expected to find if I hadn't been too lazy to dig! :p I suspect "bookmark" is the more recent term and its meaning has slowly expanded to conquer the territory previously held by "mark". These things happen, but to my mind/ear it sounds a bit off to speak of bookmarks in things like ed, vi, less/more or sc.
(DIR) Post #9tfwbysd4uKfyvGJBw by ed1conf@bsd.network
2020-04-03T18:57:46Z
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@solderpunk I got to the point where my mind had convinced me that the Turbo Pascal v5.5 or v6 IDE (late 80s) had referred to them as "bookmarks" but I pulled up the manual and sure enough, they were only "marks" there too. The quest continues. :flan_wink: