Post 9la1SShvmLcXpyA6ZU by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
(DIR) More posts by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
(DIR) Post #9lZvmTX3p554SgEmKu by nico@mastodon.social
2019-08-05T13:23:28Z
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keep seeing "SHARE IF YOU THINK WE SHOULD LOOK AFTER VETERANS NOT REFUGEES" as if they're not all victims of the same thing
(DIR) Post #9lZvmTrGbxFBTLgupc by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-05T14:23:33Z
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@nico While i dont fully support this idea, the veterans did give their all for America, but the government let them down. Comparing that to refugees, I can see their point.
(DIR) Post #9lZzNLvdM79PSM0W3c by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-05T15:03:41Z
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@jordan31 @nico “giving their all for America” can be construed negatively with regard to the aggressive foreign policies since the end of the Second World War. You need to be extremely chauvinist or ignorant (willfully or not) to make “give [your]all for America” as a virtuous thing.
(DIR) Post #9la04Q6xgEgAsfqGP2 by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-05T15:11:36Z
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@hypolite @nico Wouldn't care if others saw it as negative. I'm stating they did something for the country that many others would not.
(DIR) Post #9la0J7dOeuvNv51WwC by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-05T15:14:17Z
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@hypolite @nico Such as Vietnam vets, they were spit on and left to be forgotten.
(DIR) Post #9la1SShvmLcXpyA6ZU by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-05T15:21:06Z
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@jordan31 @nico Yes, but you can say the same for white supremacist terrorists who mass-murder people in the US. So the context of the commitment is important to judge its moral/ethical merits.
(DIR) Post #9la1pbHI53xl4tjam8 by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-05T15:31:04Z
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@hypolite @nico I'm talking about military, people who fight to protect the citizens. Not mass shooters.
(DIR) Post #9la85cB36WDcE2pnUm by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-05T16:41:23Z
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@jordan31 @nico US soldiers don't fight to protect US citizens because they aren't under any foreign state threat in their home country. More practically, the US military has been historically enforcing political ideologies and securing strategic economical assets abroad by force, which is arguably less noble.On the other hand, the US nuclear arsenal actually ensures large-scale invasion deterrence from all but a handful of other nations, but even then it would be a zero-sum game.
(DIR) Post #9laD2EVv7wK5jkntHE by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-05T17:36:53Z
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@hypolite @nico True to an extent, but some of that force is protecting us from countries that seek to do us harm or threaten our way of life because of different ideologies. Also, there is the thing of, better on their soil than ours. We try to keep it off our soil and bring the fight to them.
(DIR) Post #9laDeyVcZBJHOP8ZI8 by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-05T17:43:46Z
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@jordan31 @nico You realize you are blindly repeating state propaganda? Most of the harm foreigners want to do to Americans has been because of the aggressive US foreign policies, nobody is threatening anyone's "way of life", it isn't even something you can actually do!It isn't on US soil because nobody wants to bring the fight there. On the contrary, the US has been demonstrably lying to invade multiple foreign countries, how is it protecting anyone's "way of life" by bringing a fight abroad that wasn't existing in the first place?
(DIR) Post #9laGUkglOXcjUqALgG by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-05T18:15:39Z
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@hypolite @nico I take it you are anti America or just hate the way things are? I'm not here to debate, or to change your mind. I spoke my thoughts, it is what it is.
(DIR) Post #9laGk9nsIjkxjRq0qu by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-05T18:18:20Z
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@jordan31 @nico I'm anti-US-foreign-policy, yes, and I also live in the US because I like it here. Sorry I don't fit neither of your archetypes.
(DIR) Post #9laJles4ZrUCEsD0qm by nico@mastodon.social
2019-08-05T18:52:20Z
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@jordan31 im not american
(DIR) Post #9lbfuikhTA80xuYt4S by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-06T10:35:11Z
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@hypolite @nico Nah, to each their own. You were not born to fit my views, as I was not to yours.
(DIR) Post #9lblwQDVxAn7mdEY9A by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-06T11:42:37Z
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@jordan31 @nico And yet you're the one parroting right-wing/government talking points even though they don't mean anything practically. I'm sorry to break it to you that US soldiers don't actually "fight to protect US citizens" living in their country nor that any country in the world is actually "threatening [US persons'] way of life". They both are chauvinistic fictions that have no bearing on reality, and are used to justify extremely aggressive foreign policies and freedom restrictions in the US itself.This patriotism-inspiring and fear-mongering language (including almost any mention of "terrorism" about Muslims) has been used to cover up unjust wars abroad and domestic mass surveillance at home even though it most certainly violates the 4th amendment of the Constitution.
(DIR) Post #9lc0Dbixp0HHkn263k by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-06T14:22:41Z
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@hypolite @nico you're still going on about this? Well, after 9/11 we had a responsibility to finish what was started. Personally I think we are done, though I get the reason to stay. Either we are committed, little late for turning back.
(DIR) Post #9lc0RHnugI6U1hs1VQ by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-06T14:25:06Z
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@jordan31 @nico What was started exactly? And what has been done exactly?
(DIR) Post #9lc0X1q0xJJUFJajCq by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-06T14:26:11Z
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@hypolite @nico 9/11/2001.
(DIR) Post #9lc0ibLhGbgXZCvedM by hypolite@friendica.mrpetovan.com
2019-08-06T14:28:13Z
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@jordan31 @nico If this is your stopgap answer, I'm afraid we won't be able to discuss further.
(DIR) Post #9lc23OSwSeQ3e6nQ48 by jordan31@fosstodon.org
2019-08-06T14:43:15Z
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@hypolite @nico cool.