Post B5z4eab4btEex0wYZk by lain@fediffusion.art
(DIR) More posts by lain@fediffusion.art
(DIR) Post #B5ofht5bs4fMjq6TGy by lain@fediffusion.art
1 likes, 1 repeats
> Bun operates its own fork of Zig, and recently achieved a 4x performance improvement on Bun compile after adding "parallel semantic analysis and multiple codegen units to the llvm backend". Here's that code. But @bunjavascript says:> We do not currently plan to upstream this, as Zig has a strict ban on LLM-authored contributions.https://simonwillison.net/2026/Apr/30/zig-anti-ai/
(DIR) Post #B5ofhtKqxOrLV7Ee24 by lain@fediffusion.art
1 likes, 1 repeats
simon is very kind to the zig project. the rationale is rather nonsensical.
(DIR) Post #B5ogT1tcwgsPf7yfuS by lain@fediffusion.art
1 likes, 1 repeats
@s8n the problem is in the last line:> We don’t do this just because it’s the “right” thing to do, but also because it’s the smart thing to do.what's smart about not merging 4x improvements, because you hope that you get more contributors that way? a very shaky assumption, too.
(DIR) Post #B5ogYSI2F42uy7yubQ by mischievoustomato@tsundere.love
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @s8n hypothetical currently, but what happens to a project if a pro-ai/ok-with-ai fork ends up being more successful than itself?
(DIR) Post #B5ogqkUfIdx4dgc0jA by lain@fediffusion.art
0 likes, 0 repeats
@s8n i think that's what they mean by 'smart', though. if not "this is better for the project long-term", what do they mean?
(DIR) Post #B5oh75KlaEwNuKluRE by HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @s8n a lot of these people are basically artniggers for software. they care less about objective stuff like "does it compile" and "does it run" and "what are the performance / efficiency characteristics" and more about the guy who wrote this or that line of code. they think a public project is like a digital CHAZ where we just need to get along and have fun, man.
(DIR) Post #B5ohPLH13kYUYVitkm by HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social
0 likes, 0 repeats
@s8n @lain also i have yet to see your foreskin, jew.
(DIR) Post #B5oiI0lgzzmIt38ka0 by Deplorable_Degenerate@eveningzoo.club
0 likes, 0 repeats
Sounds like you have a Fever.
(DIR) Post #B5oiI0yoDEGnXjHE1Y by HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Deplorable_Degenerate @lain @s8n several weeks ago, this satan nigger said he wished trump had been shot dead that one time (back in, where was it, Butler?) on live television and that this and the ensuing harrs presidency would be better than the current trump one. when i simply restated his argument to clarify he really did mean it would be strictly better to have an openly, genocidally anti-white and pro-israel government rather than one merely covertly so, he accused me of pilpul and called me "rabbi," and when i simply called him "rabbi" back, he got angry and unfollowed me. i knew i'd struck a nerve so i badgered him to post his foreskin so i could jack off to it i mean confirm he isn't jewish, and he's *still* not done it, all this time later.
(DIR) Post #B5ojwQ1UcZsikcMWAa by WandererUber@poa.st
0 likes, 0 repeats
I think it does make sense. If you want competent people in your maintainer pool and your time is limited, there is no point in allowing LLM commits. They seem to believe that progress on the language is fast enough as is.
(DIR) Post #B5ojwQFJnAwNRUpYie by lain@fediffusion.art
0 likes, 0 repeats
@WandererUber i understand what they are going for, but i still think they are making lot of assumptions that are unlikely to hold
(DIR) Post #B5ojwQT8xm028NIbGi by WandererUber@poa.st
1 likes, 0 repeats
Which are those?A software does not attract maintainers just because it is fast/well-written, so even if the majority of LLM commits' quality was to their standards, it's not a bad assumption to bet on community instead.And I think we are also making assumptions such as "they will never have this perf benefit", which is not necessarily true. If one of their maintainers studies the architecture of that patch and writes one that does it, they will get the improvement, it's just that they don't offload direct work onto LLMs right now.
(DIR) Post #B5ykEAoLrPpqMhHTF2 by phnt@fluffytail.org
2 likes, 1 repeats
@lainzig-rust-c-languages-carmack.webp
(DIR) Post #B5ykSyaFbW10mnkAiG by hj@shigusegubu.club
0 likes, 0 repeats
@phnt @lain JS and webdev:
(DIR) Post #B5ylJ406i0JUe3fuoS by icedquinn@blob.cat
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @s8n not a lot of people out there shiping zig and doing a type 1[1] gives them an audience to grand stand about.that being said if i see the coding agent shitting directly to the repo i'm giving you the side eye :comfyglare: [1]: https://iceworks.cc/blog/uctd/
(DIR) Post #B5ylUzJTxjuda9QK6y by phnt@fluffytail.org
1 likes, 0 repeats
@s8n @HatkeshiatorTND @lain >So they do not want any code in the codebase that none of them understands or is willing to maintain.This is completely the same with human contributions. You don't merge something you don't want to deal with later. Simple as.
(DIR) Post #B5ylUzeOhydud1D1iC by lain@fediffusion.art
0 likes, 0 repeats
@phnt @HatkeshiatorTND @s8n i some cases i'd be a lot more willing to merge both LLM and human code because I can get two or three LLM reviewers to look through it instead of just tired old me.
(DIR) Post #B5ylUztzlz7TPOVU1Y by icedquinn@blob.cat
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @HatkeshiatorTND @phnt @s8n i don't think they're concerned about the QC aspect. there are projects which have QC policies about ai assisted code and they're pretty transparent about the 100% inspection policy.
(DIR) Post #B5ymGCg25u7gdhUA88 by phnt@fluffytail.org
1 likes, 0 repeats
@hj @lainjs_devs.jpgjavascript-for-kids.png
(DIR) Post #B5ymTpGjvAyW5x9OWO by hj@shigusegubu.club
0 likes, 0 repeats
@phnt @lain i wish it wasn't stigmatized...
(DIR) Post #B5ymXuX8I3Pra3lYhM by HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social
0 likes, 0 repeats
@icedquinn @lain @phnt @s8n are you implying certain projects may be making decisions based on something other than practicality? such as, perhaps... ideology?unfathomable.
(DIR) Post #B5ymXukbTyBwFq4JhA by lain@fediffusion.art
0 likes, 0 repeats
@HatkeshiatorTND @icedquinn @phnt @s8n i mean, if they want to be a by-humans-for-humans community feelgood project, that's great, but i just never had the impression that zig was about that. I guess i was just wrong.
(DIR) Post #B5ymXuwel9pgrDhwTw by HatkeshiatorTND@annihilation.social
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @icedquinn @phnt @s8n project culture is a very real thing and everybody has convictions. there's always a margin where you'll refuse +0.5% productivity on principle, ditto +5000% productivity.this is why we have forks! forking a project can help it continue when the culture is no longer conducive to the project's spirit. if zig happens to be in the hands of people who care deeply about not accepting ai contributions, i don't want or need the project reft from their hold or anything. i can just operate a fork.which is what bun is doing, which is why bun/zig is going to go places zig/zig isn't.
(DIR) Post #B5ymXvATvktLY6Az20 by icedquinn@blob.cat
0 likes, 0 repeats
@HatkeshiatorTND @lain @phnt @s8n > DORA 2025 found that AI adoption led to +154% PR size, +91% review time, and +9% more bugs shipped. Reviewers are drowning in noise. (Ataraxy Labs, https://github.com/ataraxy-labs/inspect)
(DIR) Post #B5ymzao9DsdyVkvNSa by toiletpaper@shitposter.world
0 likes, 0 repeats
@icedquinn @HatkeshiatorTND @lain @phnt @s8n That makes sense. I can understand not wanting to deal with a bunch of noise, but having a hard limit on no LLM generated code seems like a losing battle, even in the short term. The real criteria should be whether the code is sound, not by whom/what it was created. Also if the amount of AI slop is becoming an issue, that's a perfect use-case for leveraging LLMs as an initial review mechanism. Fight fire with fire.
(DIR) Post #B5ymzbGVWRKRviC1fE by icedquinn@blob.cat
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toiletpaper @HatkeshiatorTND @lain @phnt @s8n there are people that are vibe maintaining but also mostly the quality control side is just shuttering PRs unless they know you and the whole thing is going to reputation networks
(DIR) Post #B5ynsvh1H4a9DCydBw by phnt@fluffytail.org
0 likes, 0 repeats
@hj @lain It's deserved. The language sucks and browsers suck even more.
(DIR) Post #B5ynsw0s5GSgCmGU8O by hj@shigusegubu.club
0 likes, 0 repeats
@phnt @lain i don't think it sucks, people just have skill issue and stdlib for it sucks, but stdlib suckage isn't exclusive to the language
(DIR) Post #B5yoALb0DlUCTIT4kq by lil5@social.last.nl
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @phnt @hjFirst image is for a react/vue/svelte devThe second is of a backend dev tasked with making a change in frontend code (they will half solve it in the most cursed way possible)AlpineJs + AlpineJs-ajax is where real websites are built.https://alpine-ajax.js.org/
(DIR) Post #B5yoALqxGSFLGlvocS by hj@shigusegubu.club
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lil5 @lain @phnt what about webapps?
(DIR) Post #B5yoihPHdPijxlMnCq by lil5@social.last.nl
1 likes, 0 repeats
@phnt @hj @lain yeah webapps is the exception to use vue/svelte/+
(DIR) Post #B5yojm1VxJWAZRlFxY by hj@shigusegubu.club
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lil5 @phnt @lain thanks, that's what i primarily do (pleroma-fe)
(DIR) Post #B5yvQm4gF0MkuF8676 by lil5@social.last.nl
0 likes, 0 repeats
@hj @phnt @lain Have you tried building with qt or gtk?While most of my nitpicks (browser) come down to the lack of elements in html. My experience with gtk and qt have been far more arduous.
(DIR) Post #B5yvQmJDMxzZdJvhlg by hj@shigusegubu.club
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lil5 @phnt @lain no, but i'm somewhat interested in qt6. I just don't really have time for it.
(DIR) Post #B5z3w90doq7WeDi3nc by protos@tsundere.love
0 likes, 0 repeats
@s8n @lain and users don't value contributors, users value code
(DIR) Post #B5z4eaMBVFKGCpyfMu by phnt@fluffytail.org
0 likes, 0 repeats
@icedquinn @HatkeshiatorTND @lain @s8n >> DORA 2025 found that AI adoption led to +154% PR size, +91% review time, and +9% more bugs shipped. Reviewers are drowning in noise.I tend to agree with this.
(DIR) Post #B5z4eab4btEex0wYZk by lain@fediffusion.art
0 likes, 0 repeats
@phnt @HatkeshiatorTND @icedquinn @s8n i do think drive-by LLM contributions of significant features can be hard for projects. In the future there probably has to be a lot more coordination between maintainers and new contributors. But this will all fizzle out. Many huge projects by now just ignore all PRs that don't from either a core member or are obviously valuable, which is fine. On the other hand, many people run their own forks of stuff with tons of added features that will never find their way back, because that's also easy now. It's more of a move to personal software instead of community software.
(DIR) Post #B5z4eb48roUIPAXlsu by lain@fediffusion.art
0 likes, 0 repeats
@phnt @HatkeshiatorTND @icedquinn @s8n i mean, look at something like this
(DIR) Post #B5z5HlySFCCvWvZ1kW by protos@tsundere.love
0 likes, 0 repeats
@s8n @lain they are, because users are in control of whether the project continues to exist, or whether a fork becomes dominant
(DIR) Post #B5z6KqEYxk1bZ47quu by protos@tsundere.love
0 likes, 0 repeats
@s8n @lain this is a programming language and a C improvement at that, it only exists for other people to use.
(DIR) Post #B5zbQnne1TVIKcrCRE by icedquinn@blob.cat
0 likes, 0 repeats
@s8n @lain @phnt i just throw PRs at people, set a dead-by date, and they have that amount of time to bike shed etc before i just walk away.once had a distro package get delayed because one decider was unhappy about how i used a case statement in bash (it was the way they used it elsewhere, with just one case, because musl wasn't supported for that package) and blocked it until i approved them changing it to an if/else, and then a second decider blocked it until it was changed yet again. 2-3 weeks over the purity of "which control flow are you allowed to use in a build script"i saw the most ridiculous shit when i still cared.