Post B2fIS3oW2sSib0PFPU by snappler@poa.st
(DIR) More posts by snappler@poa.st
(DIR) Post #B2fIS3XV48qpkERet6 by Goalkeeper@nicecrew.digital
0 likes, 0 repeats
>Trannylator translates "I believe you are the one who can stop justice before it turns into madness" into "There is a fine line between justice and bigotry">Bro Japanese can't be translated into English 1 to 1, trust me bro.To (loosely) quote Emeritus professor of Japanese Literature at Harvard and translator Jay Rubin:No, Japanese is not the language of the infinite. Japanese is not even vague. The people of Sony and Nissan and Toyota did not get where they are today by wafting (fucking) incense back and forth. The nonsense that surrounds Japanese would be little more than a source of mild amusement to me as a teacher of the language , except that, year after year, I find my job made more difficult by the myth of Japanese vagueness.
(DIR) Post #B2fIS3oW2sSib0PFPU by snappler@poa.st
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Goalkeeper The leap from "Japanese has some social peculiarities" to "Japan is untranslatable pretty much all the time" seems to be something morons, narcissists, and the actively malicious like to do.Thinking about it, it's a very convenient bunker to put yourself in as a D student moron to say that "Oh, this language is very vague so it's good I'm here to interpret based on my personal politics and vibes."Hilariously, when you dig into it, Japan is one of the least vague languages around. Most of what they say is very direct and very literal with a few carve outs to accommodate the modesty of their culture (don't say "iie" directly, don't say "i love you" directly, and other small bits)Pretty much everything else is stated directly, without grand metaphor or triple meaning, or even implication most of the time. The closest you'll get is "aho" having slightly different connotations to "baka" or other things in that vein. Indeed, that is how we get "People die when they're killed" and other such lines.But then, that becomes the more insulting contention of the trannylator. That their infinite reddit works of shit memes are necessary otherwise the medium would be "boring."
(DIR) Post #B2fIS40vIkO3DUD9kW by Goalkeeper@nicecrew.digital
0 likes, 0 repeats
Jay Rubin even says in his book: The reason people think it's vague is because social norms have required a verbal filter for centuries. Extreme politeness has turned into "It's just too vague to translate bro"
(DIR) Post #B2fIS4BudtB3lZLvsW by snappler@poa.st
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Goalkeeper And genuinely those social conventions are just something Westerners run into a lot, but it really only covers a very narrow set of social conventions, almost all of them with strangers.Beyond those few stranger-interactions faux pas, there really are very few situations that don't have fixed language and behavior expectations. That's why someone can be rude just be changing the second-person pronoun or sentence suffix.And yet all the shit we get translated insists on removing honorifics and cultural content as much as possible. Every time I see teenagers calling each other "Miss" and "Mister" I am flabbergasted that someone thinks that translates the nature of Japanese communication.
(DIR) Post #B2fIS4MC1fOuHSA8u0 by Goalkeeper@nicecrew.digital
1 likes, 0 repeats
The most retarded part about all of it is anyone who even has the slightest real interest in Japanese media will pick up on honorifics immediately. It's just a marker of the relationship between those two individuals. The only difference in English is instead of adding a marker we substitute a word. Sir, Ma'am, Mr./Ms. X, First name, your highness. It's all the same.
(DIR) Post #B2fIS4ULXLvGgjyebw by snappler@poa.st
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Goalkeeper Honorifics and surname/given name importance are a one-page explainer that any person has to see ONCE to understand forever.Fans all had this argument way back in the early 2000s. We fought so hard to keep the culture in the product. I hate that not only did it just get reverted outright but now the localization faggots are beyond questioning because they're all nepo hiring each other.
(DIR) Post #B2fISvnJLZaI0uG31s by heavens_feel@poa.st
0 likes, 0 repeats
@snappler @Goalkeeper yes, agreed
(DIR) Post #B2fItPy3mlpX7juoka by Witch_Hunter_Siegfried@tsundere.love
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Goalkeeper @snappler There are CASES where it works, such as the dub for Full Metal Panic, but that's due Tessa explicitly speaking formally and no other character doing such, well that and Mithril themselves being a mix of people from all over (Sosuke is from some fictional Middle Eastern Country, Kurtz is from East German (in FMP the Cold War never ends) and Mellisa is Japanese for example) and Tessa herself being IIRC English makes it a bit more believable aswell. In general I agree honorifics are something like the word Ubermensh/Untermensh or Volk for German, where they work best just being used instead of awkwardly translated.
(DIR) Post #B2fItQX9gHu2saKqS8 by Goalkeeper@nicecrew.digital
0 likes, 0 repeats
Dubs with international characters can work. The Black Lagoon dub is great. But if it takes place in Japan, use the fucking honorifics in the subs at least.
(DIR) Post #B2fLRTl8OYTmdZEsBU by snappler@poa.st
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Goalkeeper @Witch_Hunter_Siegfried My general view of when a dub "works" is when you have a very strongly western influenced franchise or setting. So Black Lagoon, Cowboy Bebop, Ghost in the Shell to some extent. Things that are trying to evoke a more serious attitude where less of the Japanese character and body language are likely to show up.It also means the typically flat delivery of the third-rate talents who often end up doing dub work don't hit quite so bad.
(DIR) Post #B2fLRTv3neQ38Lsnei by Goalkeeper@nicecrew.digital
1 likes, 0 repeats
The most insane one to me is IGPX. They somehow got Michelle Rodriguez, Mark Hamill, Haley Joel Osment, Hynden Walch, Kirk Thornton, and motherfucking Lance Henriksen. Will literally never happen again for a tv anime. https://youtu.be/9rKWWeo-eus
(DIR) Post #B2fMLnwuW4mhTJbaLo by coolboymew@shitposter.world
0 likes, 0 repeats
@snappler @Goalkeeper @Witch_Hunter_Siegfried You missed the actual one element to tie them all: It's Seinen. Source (or originals) that were meant for an older audience in the first place, which usually are more serious, and ends up avoiding most of kids characters and anime voices in general