[HN Gopher] Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency ...
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Google Pixel 6 still freezes when calling Emergency Services
Author : curiousgal
Score : 403 points
Date : 2022-09-04 14:24 UTC (8 hours ago)
(HTM) web link (old.reddit.com)
(TXT) w3m dump (old.reddit.com)
| croes wrote:
| Why are there no recalls for smartphones like there are for cars?
| r12343a_19 wrote:
| The Pixel 6 is an overhyped disappointment. I replaced my old
| super-cheap Android One phone with a Pixel 6 and it's full of
| hardware / software bugs: GPS has problems, I see graphics
| artefacts (GPU problems?) and Google doesn't care.
|
| I'm not surprised at all it has such a problem.
|
| I should have bought an iPhone SE.
| shadycuz wrote:
| Oh, so that's why my Pixel 6 always thinks I'm 50 feet to the
| right of my current location.
| radiorental wrote:
| I've been a happy pixel user for years after getting burned
| with some cheap Android phones, most notably One Plus.
|
| The Pixel 6 is an unmitigated clusterfuck. GPS/Maps locking up
| is the worst. Either wont load or will lock up during a trip
| and you will miss a turn. Try rebooting a phone while you're
| alone on a motorway, then having to type in your route again -
| super dangerous.
|
| I've had the camera (video) lock up mid scene. Focus locks up.
| Fingerprint recognition is a fail 25-50% of the time.
|
| These have been known issues since release, I made the now
| incorrect assumption these were natural bugs that would be
| fixed over time.
|
| Pixel 6 is the last phone from Google I will own. Not sure I
| want to jump to iOS yet but things are looking increasingly
| bleak in the Android garden
| cageface wrote:
| Around the time of the Pixel 3 Android seemed to have all the
| momentum and Apple seemed to be flailing around trying to
| find ways to sell even more expensive and gimmicky hardware
| to their existing users. Since then Android seems to have
| really stagnated and Apple has fixed most of the shortcomings
| of their OS and introduced some good models at lower price
| points. There are still some things I prefer about Android's
| UX and I strongly dislike how locked down iOS is but most
| people are probably better off buying an iPhone now.
| Rastonbury wrote:
| Same got scammed by all the reviews saying best Pixel yet and
| a good price for flagship. Terrible software issues, I was
| unable to make calls without 10s of a high pitch beep
| interrupting within the first 5s, I'm glad I don't rely on my
| phone for work calls but some people do. I had to enroll in
| to the Beta early release to resolve it. Bluetooth dropping
| for seconds in the car. Random extreme battery drain even
| now. Fingerprint works about 50% of the time which is a pain
| because I have an 8 digit pin enforced by MS Teams for work.
|
| Never again
| r12343a_19 wrote:
| Oh, so there isn't a problem with my dirty fingers or
| something. The fingerprint reader indeed works like half the
| time.
| throwaway675309 wrote:
| Anecdotal but ever since I started using the pixel line (a
| pixel 2 and now in pixel 4a) from the previous Nexus 5x it has
| just been a Smorgasburg of quality control issues. The pixel 4a
| GPS constantly has conflict issues with Bluetooth and loses
| signal, and recently the SIM card reader disconnects
| intermittently.
|
| The only reason I haven't switched to iPhone is because the
| speech recognition on android is light years ahead of Siri. So
| frustrating....
| dopeboy wrote:
| Get the SE. Aside from battery life, it's great in every way.
| Picked up the 2020 version used for $150. This is after 11
| years on Android.
| howinteresting wrote:
| You still, in 2022, can't use uBlock Origin on iOS. It is the
| _only_ major platform which makes it impossible to use uBlock
| Origin.
|
| edit: iOS only has static block lists a la Chrome Manifest
| v3, not dynamic ones like uBlock Origin uses.
| happyopossum wrote:
| There are TONS of ad-blockers, and a very sophisticated and
| comprehensive ad blocking API available on iOS. What's
| stopping one single ad blocker from running on it?
| WesolyKubeczek wrote:
| These tons of ad blockers do a very poor job actually
| blocking ads in Safari, unfortunately. I run AdGuard and
| any time I'm out of my PiHole's range it's all a crapfest
| of ads.
| wombat-man wrote:
| nextdns works real well for me.
| happyopossum wrote:
| I use 1blocker and virtually never see an ad..
| kitsunesoba wrote:
| Similar here. Have 1Blocker, Better, Purify, and the
| Firefox Focus Safari extension and between those I rarely
| see ads. Compared to Firefox with uBlock Origin on my
| Windows machines I'd say the experience is about 98-99%
| as good.
| charrondev wrote:
| I've used 1Blocker without issue for a years. I use
| uBlock Origin on my desktop, but I can't say I remember
| seeing ads on my mobile with 1Blocker.
| abdusco wrote:
| any recommendation for an adblocker on ios that can block
| youtube ads?
| WesolyKubeczek wrote:
| I'm using Musi (which is designed to stream songs off
| youtube). Behind the scenes, it likely uses mechanisms
| akin to popular youtube downloaders, and is finicky where
| age-restricted videos are concerned.
|
| But with it, I've yet to see a single ad and it can play
| audio from youtube in the background.
|
| It can find and play playlists but has a poor story of
| following channels. You cannot navigate to a channel with
| it and binge on videos from it.
| lotsofpulp wrote:
| Wipr works most of the time for me.
| happyopossum wrote:
| 1Blocker or magic lasso seem to do the trick for me
| LaputanMachine wrote:
| "Vinegar - Tube Cleaner" blocks all YouTube ads in
| Safari.
|
| It also replaces YouTube's video player with the native
| HTML5 player, so you can play videos in the background or
| watch them in picture-in-picture mode.
|
| Vinegar can also be used together with Sponsorblock for a
| completely ad-free experience. It's a difference as night
| and day.
| nzentzis wrote:
| Thank you for this recommendation - I'm planning to
| switch platforms in a few weeks, and blocking YT ads was
| one of the big open questions I still had.
| DangitBobby wrote:
| I am so disappointed to hear that. The Pixel 3 was the best
| phone ever made as far as I'm concerned, and the 5 is not too
| shabby. Now I'm worried I'll have to look for another non-
| Samsung phone line when this phone needs to be replaced.
| jhot wrote:
| There is a lot of complaints against the 6 in this post so
| maybe it sucks but I've been super pleased with mine after
| upgrading from the 3a. I am running GrapheneOS but that
| shouldn't shield me from hardware issues which I haven't
| noticed any. My wife just got a 6a and so far so good with it
| as well.
| whywhywhywhy wrote:
| Just from watching Google the past few years I'm starting to
| wonder if the company has completely de-prioritized hardware.
| [deleted]
| Steltek wrote:
| Whoa. My spouse was unable to dial 911 in the US once (probably
| the only time it was tried on that phone). Thankfully it wasn't a
| life-or-death, get-me-to-the-ER emergency and we just used my
| phone (Pixel 3). We thought it was an isolated bug on just that
| phone but this sounds super dangerous now.
|
| How can this still exist?
| klabb3 wrote:
| > How can this still exist?
|
| Engagement numbers for this feature is very low. No promotion
| opportunities.
| vhold wrote:
| Reminds me of how my Windows Mobile phone over 20 years ago would
| sometimes bring up the dialpad without the "9" available, which
| was the last straw for me and got me to switch.
| [deleted]
| qwertox wrote:
| There's another thing to keep in mind: Bluetooth.
|
| I was biking and noticed a fire so I called the emergency number.
| I didn't notice that I had my Bluetooth headset connected to the
| phone, since I was listening to a podcast maybe half an hour
| earlier during the ride but never use it for talking on the
| phone.
|
| So I didn't even hear the ringing an nothing, I was wondering if
| something was broken, until I realized that it was using the
| headset for the call.
|
| In the end this was no problem because I noticed fast enough, but
| what became a problem was notifying my location.
|
| I started passing him the Plus Code which was the first thing
| shown on the emergency screen: the call center person got annoyed
| asking me what I was reading to him. So I opted to read him the
| full GPS coordinates, where he then told me that this appears to
| be a completely different location from what I described him
| before resorting to the Plus Code.
|
| Then there is a map on the screen which you have to tap on in
| order to get a full map view with street names, which finally
| helped passing the location.
|
| It was a horrible experience in the sense that this technology
| seemed to make it more complicated while under stress.
|
| Why show Plus Codes if they are not an agreed upon standard? Why
| not show me the nearest street names, which in my case was a bit
| problematic because I was on a field, but highlight and name some
| well known POI's, after all, Google has a huge database of ranked
| POIs. Something like "One third between POI 1 and POI 2".
| cush wrote:
| A phone without basic emergency service access should be
| recalled. Google has no intention on fixing it, they might as
| well save themselves further liability
| hda111 wrote:
| Is this because of the 000 number? 112 is standard in GSM and
| should work always.
| oefrha wrote:
| Remember when Microsoft Teams on Android, a userland application,
| would block emergency calls? [1] Guess the asinine emergency call
| system still isn't properly fixed after that incident.
|
| [1] https://support.google.com/pixelphone/answer/11496917?hl=en
| (Pretty sure there was a big thread here, but somehow can't find
| it now.)
| JadoJodo wrote:
| > Pretty sure there was a big thread here, but somehow can't
| find it now.
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29492884
| IAmLiterallyAB wrote:
| This is the first phone running a Google chipset, and Google CPU.
| And a Google modem I believe. Their previous phones were Qualcomm
| based. I imagine a lot of the issues people are seeing are
| related to that, a mix of hardware flaws and driver bugs.
| [deleted]
| jasec57322 wrote:
| I'm currently using a 6 year old phone. Now that I don't take
| many photos and use it lightly - it actually performs far better
| than the previous 3 new phones I had - 2 of which were flagships.
| The S22 I sent back had worse battery-life than my current phone
| - it was doing heavy background-work, despite having all the
| battery-optimal settings enabled.
|
| To the point: New phones are way too big, too power-hungry, the
| newer they get the more 'features' they have that I didn't ask
| for and don't want - not least is the data mining by everybody
| under the sun at the firmware level.
|
| I've given up buying new phones. When this one cunks-out I'll buy
| an old-used one. That is unless there comes a real alternative to
| increasingly crappy android & the above issues are resolved.
| LegitShady wrote:
| I prefer phones that are still getting security updates.
|
| You talked up your phone a lot but omitted what model it is,
| for some reason.
| keewee7 wrote:
| High-end Samsung phones are the only reason I'm still on Android.
|
| Google (Pixel), One Plus, Huawei, and most other Android phone
| designers/manufacturers have not been able to reach Samsung/Apple
| quality for the past five or more years.
| ratg13 wrote:
| Same, but I'm so done with the uninstallable facebook apps.
|
| When I got my galaxy 10 I went in and disabled all the facebook
| apps since you can't uninstall them. I went an checked the
| status a year later, and the original ones were still disabled,
| but they had pushed additional facebook apps to me behind the
| scenes without me knowing.
|
| I don't get why samsung needs facebook money this badly to
| invade their customer's privacy.
|
| Now it's time to upgrade and I'm reluctant to buy Samsung,
| Pixel seems to be garbage .. not sure where to turn next.
| dilyevsky wrote:
| It's hilarious that internally googlers always used to poo poo
| vendors in private conversations but imo you're absolutely
| right - samsung essentially holds the whole brand afloat.
| Although not by choice - they tried replacing android and
| failed miserably
| aaaaaaaaata wrote:
| Which is embarrassing, because they're one of the most
| insecure vendors...
| dagmx wrote:
| They sort of succeeded though with replacing Android Wear
| rabbidruster wrote:
| I have the pixel 6 Pro. By far the worse phone I've ever had.
| It's unable to hold a consistent phone conversation and I'll
| often cut out so the person on the other end can't hear me. Did a
| RMA and the new phone has the same problem. Support is also
| difficult to deal with. Ive been a loyal pixel owner until now,
| but can no longer recommend anyone buy a pixel phone.
| jquast wrote:
| The only reason I carry a cellphone with me in many situations is
| just in case of an emergency. I wouldn't take it for walks, to
| the store, out to eat, and definitely not while driving, but only
| for the safety of myself and others around me, it could save
| someone's life. It's the only feature of a cellphone that I need,
| everything else is secondary.
|
| That they can't care enough to address this issue is reason
| enough to swear off google completely. They must be so very cold-
| hearted, fish stinks from the head and all that.
| croes wrote:
| Let's face it nowadays smartphones are more like cameras with an
| internet connection
| dessant wrote:
| The repeated negligence around the handling of Android bugs
| related to emergency calls should result in criminal prosecution.
| It's unlikely that actual people weren't hurt because of these
| bugs. They have known about these issues for years, and they
| continue to give them the importance of an unresponsive button in
| Gmail settings.
|
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29492884
|
| https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/rfld6m/pixel_p...
| dekerta wrote:
| I got a Pixel6 in July. Aside from the camera, it is by far the
| worst phone I've ever owned. I probably experience at least 4
| or 5 major crashes every day where the phone becomes
| unresponsive for a few seconds.
|
| Up until now, I've been able to live with the bugs as a
| moderate inconvenience, but now that I know I could potentially
| die because of Google's complete lack of QA, I'm going to ditch
| the phone right away. I'll never buy a Google device again.
| What a waste of money
| tetromino_ wrote:
| Counter-anecdote: I got a Pixel 6 pro at launch. With the
| very notable exception of multi week delays in some security
| updates, it has been the best phone I have ever owned. Great
| camera, great screen, great battery life, no stability
| problems, and most importantly, no overheating after which
| plagued older Pixels under heavy usage.
|
| But YMMV - based on a perusal of forum posts, it seems that
| one's experience, among other things, depends on one's
| geographic region (which may be a proxy for the exact
| firmware model of your device). Mine is a US model, intended
| for Google Fi. A disproportionate number of complaints seem
| to be from users in certain EU countries.
| dzikimarian wrote:
| I've one from EU distribution for over half a year now.
| There were some very minor issues with the interface at the
| beginning(removed with updates later). Apart from that all
| is great. If there are multiple crashes per day I would get
| it replaced, because it's clearly faulty unit.
| londons_explore wrote:
| It's a high value connected device with error reporting.
|
| If it were crashing multiple times per day, you'd hope
| that Google would proactively contact the user and offer
| a replacement.
| delusional wrote:
| That's a cool idea. Using the telemetry to find
| (unusually) faulty hardware and reaching out to the
| customers to proactively offer a replacement could be
| some next level customer service.
| amelius wrote:
| One can dream ...
| npc12345 wrote:
| What processor does yours have?
| bb88 wrote:
| Yes and no. The big issue with me is the fingerprint reader
| behind the screen doesn't always work, and am resorting to
| punching in my pin about half the time.
|
| The Pixel 2 fingerprint reader on the back was the fastest.
| The Pixel 4 face recognition was often faster than the
| Pixel 6.
|
| Also I use google assistant for driving to get navigation,
| and when it screws up the destination instead of one step
| to fix it, it's usually two more steps or more. (e.g. "1201
| Eighth St" vs "1201 State St" and others)
| mschild wrote:
| I would recommend trying GrapheneOS. Easy to install on
| Pixels and have heard great things. The OS focus is on
| Privacy and Security which can come with some cutbacks but
| still might be worth it to you
| soulofmischief wrote:
| Welcome to the club. The 3a was the best phone I ever owned.
| Then it broke (my fault) and after going through 3 bunk
| replacements in a row, I realized that Google literally does
| zero QA and stopped trying.
| rob74 wrote:
| Maybe the Pixel 3 was better, but I still have a Pixel 2 XL
| which came with a USB-C-to-headphone adapter which simply
| _does not work_ , and also it's very picky about which USB
| ports it will connect to - it seems to prefer USB-C. Once
| you get over these issues though, it's an Ok phone...
| soulofmischief wrote:
| A defining feature of the 3a (despite being perfect for
| my baby hands) was a built-in headphone jack, which is
| now considered a "budget" feature :-)
| ssizn wrote:
| I don't understand how could you pay such a vast amount of
| money for a phone that is not even subpar... it is unusable
| by your own testimony. Not trying to be snarky or anything,
| but why didn't you return it?
| corndoge wrote:
| All phones have these problems. Every phone has glaring
| problems you have to live with or work around.
| mnd999 wrote:
| Maybe in the Android world they do (but I kinda doubt
| it), but certainly not in the Apple ecosystem.
| IntelMiner wrote:
| It depends on your definition of problems. For Android
| users Apple's ... _design intentions_ are unpalatable
| beached_whale wrote:
| For quite a few Android/iphone users it was the free
| phone their employer could get at the time with their
| corporate plan
| doubled112 wrote:
| As a fairly long time Android user (Android 2.2 -> 12
| from various manufacturers), the iPhone 13 Mini in my
| pocket works really well.
|
| I honestly can't even say one is better than the other,
| just different, and they've mostly stolen the good ideas
| from each other over the years anyway.
| realusername wrote:
| I had my fair share of iOS bugs as well, the worst ones
| are clearly the broken account syncs
| sieabahlpark wrote:
| Don't know what you're talking about. My pixel 6 pro or
| whatever works great and the pixel 5 I have works fine.
|
| "All phones have these problems" is just false.
| agileAlligator wrote:
| > All phones have these problems. Every phone has glaring
| problems you have to live with or work around.
|
| No?
| dsr_ wrote:
| Danger Sidekick II
|
| Palm Treo 700
|
| Motorola Droid
|
| Samsung Galaxy Nexus
|
| LG G2
|
| Google Nexus 6P
|
| Google Pixel XL
|
| OnePlus 7Pro
|
| None of them had glaring problems I had to live with or
| work around.
|
| The battery life up until the LG G2 was a problem -- I
| usually needed to recharge mid-day if I was doing
| anything active. The G2 had the best form factor ever --
| honestly, they should have kept the external dimensions
| the same and just improved the internals each year. 5.2"
| screen, 460 ppi. 138.5 x 70.9 x 8.9 mm. 143g. Eventually
| it developed a touchscreen fault that slowly spread.
|
| The Nexus 6P was a great phone, but big. It developed
| battery problems after about a year. Up until then, fine.
|
| The Pixel XL was a little disappointing because it didn't
| really feel like much of an advance, but it didn't have
| the battery problem.
|
| I'm still using the 7 Pro, which, for a bigphone, is not
| bad. It has the excellent motorized pop-up selfie cam,
| which I like because I hardly ever use it. When I do use
| it, it deploys quickly. Battery life is starting to
| degrade (2.5 years in) and I'm thinking about either a
| Pixel 7 or an Asus Zenphone 9 this fall.
|
| So, no. Not every phone has glaring problems.
| michaelmrose wrote:
| Phone quality is uneven with some OEMs consistently
| producing crap and others sometimes laying eggs. Your
| sample size is likely small. Many people don't buy a new
| phone until the old one doesn't work anymore. So you
| could trivially have only experienced 2-3 phones total.
| It would be trivial then to conclude all phones have
| these problems even though its not so.
|
| Try a Motorola or a well reviewed model from another
| manufacture paying attention especially to people's
| complaints and whether or not they represent legit flaws.
| Spend at least 30 minutes reading reviews before you buy.
| buffet_overflow wrote:
| Across several android and iOS phones (including some of
| the first android phones in the US market), I have not
| personally experienced issues anything close to what I've
| read about from the Pixel line.
|
| We need to push manufacturers to be better, especially
| about providing timely and stable OS updates.
| LinAGKar wrote:
| I have, on OnePlus
| to11mtm wrote:
| I more or less agree.
|
| I have two exceptions that come to mind... My Galaxy J7
| (Original version) was a lovely little device that still
| works, aside from lack of updates from the mfg. It wasn't
| fancy or fast, but it was cheap and has been able to do
| what I needed it to.
|
| I bring that one up specifically because it wasn't a
| 'flagship' phone which tend to be as polished as possible
| (although often wind up with quirks on/related to new
| features), but a cheapish low to midrange (which often
| see problems around hardware choices and/or bugs around
| software for said hardware choices [^0])
|
| I'm also going to give the 'WTF' shout-out to the
| Original Nexus 7 with HSPA+, you had to jump through some
| hilarious hoops to make it a device usable as a 'phone',
| and talking on it was something that became a meme among
| my colleagues... yet sadly was more 'reliable' than most
| of the HTC/LG shitshows of the day.
|
| For a number of years, I was on a 'tiered' setup where my
| phones were WinPho, and I had either the aforementioned
| Nexus, or later a Samsung Galaxy Tab for my android
| 'needs'. The WinPhos sucked from an app standpoint but
| were otherwise the best 'smart phones' IMO between
| 2012-2016 [^1][^2]
|
| [^0] I often wonder how many problems are related to
| firmware bugs versus a problem with the underlying
| hardware. As an example from another semi-related sector,
| consider the Intel Puma 6. You can try to mask some/most
| of the problems in firmware, but at the end of the day
| the design has a problem. Sometimes I wonder whether the
| extremely aggressive release cycle of phones is/was a way
| to 'mask' the problem.
|
| [^1] Here! was far superior to Google navigation IMO,
| even had offline map downloading before it was cool. Call
| quality was always good, none of the weird drops/bugs I'd
| see on android, SMS was good except dual sim support on
| the late models.
|
| [^2] I'll admit I don't really use iPhone. I buy them for
| my dad (he loved his WinPho for the simplicity and tile
| interface, but 'I like this too!' so that is what he
| sticks with now).
| duxup wrote:
| > Every phone has glaring problems you have to live with
| or work around.
|
| I can only think of one phone i have used that has what I
| would characterize as "glaring problems".
| RowanH wrote:
| I've now got quite a few phones on my desk (6 right now)
| plus all the other historical ones. It's surprising to
| see the differences, quirks, and little gems. My main
| phone has now become an 13 Pro Max, it's solid, reliable
| and smooth (but my main reason was the camera/video
| quality). While features might be hidden via gestures I
| don't think I've ever seen a problem or bug with anything
| - certainly nothing that is repeated or sticks out in my
| mind.
|
| But that said the functionality of Android is much wider
| in scope, which is a blessing and a curse.
|
| For my startup one of the core features is uploading
| photos/videos, and lots of them.. getting to know how
| each platform deals with background processes has been
| very eye opening. Apple : there's a couple of ways, it's
| on our terms, maybe, if we feel up to the task - but you
| know what you're getting. Android : here's the kazillion
| different changing API's on how to do it... you'll get
| there with better performance of what you want (maybe)
| but good luck navigating the landscape !
|
| I suspect Androids eco system problems is just keeping up
| with ever changing APIs, or learning what worked fine on
| your Sony xperia 1 ii, fails miserably on your first
| customers Samsung S20.... then realising you're doing it
| wrong on the apis, then re-writing it, then the api's
| change....
|
| So the chance of app bugs is far, far higher in Android.
| victornomad wrote:
| As a person that has been dealing with Android
| programming since version 1.6 I have to say that things
| got very stable since version 4.4 Kitkat. That's 9 years
| ago...
|
| The ecosystem has improved, and added a bunch of new
| optional stuff, a new language, a new way of making UIs,
| etc. Retrocompatibility is still very good.
| victornomad wrote:
| I totally agree with that. Got the pixel 6 after a Pixel 2
| and Pixel 4a. The first thing I didnt like was the size. I
| find it VERY uncomfortable to handle, and also very heavy!
|
| I also had many problems with it. Heating, unresponsiveness,
| and after getting the latest upgrade to Android 13 it got
| even worse.
|
| That was my last Pixel phone and probably my last Android.
| RichardCA wrote:
| I went through a similar process. I ended up getting a
| Pixel 5, they are still being sold new-in-box on Amazon. I
| really liked the size and weight of the 4a but wanted
| something that had 5G support. The 5 is actually smaller
| and lighter than both the 4a 5G and 5a 5G. Very thankful to
| the folks who run gsmarena.com, it's extremely helpful for
| this sort of thing.
| agildehaus wrote:
| I own a Pixel 6 and can't recall the last time I experienced
| a crash of any sort.
| desmosxxx wrote:
| Mine doesn't crash (anymore, it did when v12 came out), but
| it my cell/data goes offline randomly and I get worse
| service than my peers in many places. It also overheats
| when exposed to almost any sunlight at all no matter the
| ambient temperature (it's overheated in my car with the ac
| on and no case) or when charging and doing a video call at
| the same time.
|
| I can remember my Nexus 4 and note 5 being solid phones,
| but every android phone I've had after that has been awful
| in one way or another.
|
| The final straw for me has been android auto on this phone.
| Completely unusable and unsafe. So many crashes and
| lockups. At this point I'm looking at an iPhone for my next
| phone. Something like android would be nice, but I also
| want a premium phone that works.
|
| My note 5 is still going strong and is smooth and
| responsive (except for lack of updates) and the battery
| hasn't swelled or anything.
| gpm wrote:
| Same
| The_Colonel wrote:
| My P6P is also the worst phone I can remember, but unlike
| you, I also really dislike (main) camera. It oversharpens
| people's faces to absurd degree in anything but optimal
| light. Faces are discolored (often gray), wrinkles come up,
| hair often looks kind of greasy. (for landscapes the camera
| is pretty good though)
| nextos wrote:
| I don't dislike Pixel hardware because it's the only phone
| supported by GrapheneOS, which makes Android tolerable.
|
| But the software is ridiculous in some regards. I bought an
| Pixel sometime ago, new in a box from Google, and it took
| two battery charges to go through a gazillion of OTA
| updates to get it to the latest Android. I know I could
| have plugged it in and flashed the latest ROM directly, but
| is a normal user supposed to do that? It seems that nobody
| cares at Google.
|
| Aside from this, if you look into the network dump of a
| brand new Pixel it is scary / amazing how many connections
| it is doing every day. And nobody knows why it's
| connecting...
|
| I wish SailfishOS became a bit more polished to be a viable
| alternative to iOS and Android. It's almost there. It
| passes the above test with flying colors, it's completely
| silent. Just an NTP connection every 12 h. The UI is a joy
| to use, reminiscent of the N9, and a few great indie
| developers.
| dylan604 wrote:
| >And nobody knows why it's connecting...
|
| I highly doubt that. I'm sure the people that wrote the
| code know exactly what it is doing. Does the number of
| knowledgable coders vs the poplulation of the planet
| approach nobody when rounding?
| nextos wrote:
| I meant users.
| neilv wrote:
| I was happy with GrapheneOS on Pixel 3, and would still
| use it except it's EOL for some firmware security
| updates.
|
| The Pixel 4a hardware I then got (didn't want a 4) is
| fine with GrapheneOS, though an "a", and I prefer the 3.
|
| The Pixel 5 seems OK so far, though the display colors on
| this particular unit (don't know about the model) are
| noticeably less vibrant than the 3.
|
| I hope GrapheneOS keeps going on a good path, and that
| there's an appealing option for hardware after the Pixel
| 5. (I can't yet justify the cost of a non-backordered
| Librem 5, for how little I use a smartphone, and I have
| mixed feelings about the PinePhones.)
| scarface74 wrote:
| Why would Google "care" about a phone that sells only an
| inconsequential 2 million a quarter? If they make 4
| billion a year in revenue on selling Pixel phones, that
| is around a quarter of how much Google reportedly pays
| Apple to be the default search engine on iOS devices.
|
| In other words, Apple makes more from Google in mobile
| than Google makes from selling Pixels.
| to11mtm wrote:
| > It seems that nobody cares at Google.
|
| My dystopian response is that they know if you're going
| 'all in' on their branded phone you are either geeky
| enough to deal with it, or drank too much kool-aid to
| care.
| dagmx wrote:
| It certainly has contributed to harm
|
| https://reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/wpirx8/had_an_emer...
|
| The Australian government really needs to get involved and
| force Google to fix their shit
| to11mtm wrote:
| Oh they know. I've had call issues (that included ability to
| make emergency calls) since the G1 days. Oftentimes it is a
| diceroll between the firmware of the MFG and the version of
| android.
|
| One of the things I miss most about WinPho is the reliability
| of their phone/sms stack (well, except for near the end of
| WP10, things got weird)
| bjt2n3904 wrote:
| > criminal prosecution
|
| Steady now. I don't think you want that.
| bdcravens wrote:
| As a developer, I worry about this. However, I also don't
| work on systems that could cause anyone a level of harm
| resulting in criminal damage. If I did, I'd like to think I'd
| increase the care I put into my craft 1000x. I realize that's
| not doable in many companies, and that's the problem. Too
| many companies taking the "move fast and break things"
| attitude towards people's lives and safety. This is how you
| invite the big foot of government regulation.
| 41b696ef1113 wrote:
| I am reminded of this article [0] on how NASA develops
| software. For things that absolutely must work, standard
| development practices do not apply. Real Engineers do not
| get to leave off testing for the big red emergency shut off
| button.
|
| [0] https://www.fastcompany.com/28121/they-write-right-
| stuff
| michaelmrose wrote:
| It highly probable that you are incapable of increasing the
| care you put into your craft by 1000x as you no matter your
| intentions because there isn't 1000x more of you to give.
|
| In anything better processes and consistency beats try
| harder 7 days a week and twice on Sunday.
| bdcravens wrote:
| By care I'm thinking more disciplined approaches and
| moving very slowly with a significant increase in QA and
| verification. Most of us, regardless of the framework,
| time in the industry, or what letter we put in our xDD
| methodology of choice, are flying by the seat of our
| pants compared to most disciplines.
| dessant wrote:
| I think it's important to hold people responsible for
| negligence that causes harm to others, even in the tech
| industry.
| bjt2n3904 wrote:
| > It's unlikely that actual people weren't hurt because of
| these bugs.
|
| Do you want criminal prosecution for actual harm, or for
| potential harm?
|
| America has this habit of reaching for the biggest gun it
| has to solve problems, or make a statement.
|
| It always backfires.
| dagmx wrote:
| Criminal reports for negligence that can cause death are
| a thing around the world.
|
| Pray tell, how would it backfire to make sure emergency
| services are always available ?
| freeone3000 wrote:
| They are scared that such standards would then be applied
| to their work.
| dagmx wrote:
| After reading their other comments I think they're more
| of the mindset of "regulations mean higher cost and I
| don't want to pay more to meet standards I don't
| immediately care about"
| chc wrote:
| You're speaking in generalities that can hardly even be
| mapped to the situation at hand. What, specifically, are
| you saying is the correct recourse here? What are you
| saying would go wrong if Google were prosecuted for
| intentionally shipping a nonfunctional emergency feature?
| hmfrh wrote:
| > Do you want criminal prosecution for actual harm, or
| for potential harm?
|
| Do you only want DUI to be illegal if it results in an
| accident?
| desindol wrote:
| You mean it's better to cover your devs ass instead of people
| in an emergency?
| Vervious wrote:
| I want that. I think that refusing to fix a life-or-death bug
| for 8 months is criminally negligent. Especially when
| millions of Pixel 6s are out in the wild, as an essential
| utility for millions of people.
| IncandescentGas wrote:
| Why should software companies, developers, product managers
| and executives remain immune from consequences of willful
| negligence, when that negligence results in real harm?
|
| In college I took an Engineering Ethics class, where we
| studied engineering mistakes resulting in deaths, and learned
| about the investigation and prosecution of the engineers
| involved when there was negligence.
|
| The Hyatt Regency walkway collapse in particular will always
| stay with me.
| https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyatt_Regency_walkway_collapse.
| ok_dad wrote:
| I especially like the Therac-25 [0] as a good example for
| software engineers. A literal concurrency bug between the
| UI and radiation emitter caused at least 6 people to get
| massive overdoses of radiation. Think about that next time
| you're using a multi-thread/multi-process library!
|
| [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therac-25
| libria wrote:
| I don't know the specific law, but FCC does expect a phone to
| be able to reach 911 (e.g., 911 Act). There must already be a
| penalizing process or fines in place for manufacturers who
| fail to meet basic standards.
|
| I'm not sure what criminal liability would look like, though.
| Who do we put in jail? The dev? QA? People who CR'd the bug?
| The TPM who proposed the feature? The manager who allocated
| time? The skip who initiated the whole project? Should they
| share blame and multithread a 7 month sentence together and
| do 1 month together?
|
| I agree w/ you though. My company needs to alert me if any
| LOC I'm working on could land me in prison and I'll gladly
| switch projects. I definitely don't want that burden.
| hengheng wrote:
| Does anybody know at what point the FCC can revoke the
| radio license of these devices? Reaching emergency services
| seems a prerequisite for transmitting on the telephony part
| of the spectrum, so it might be surprisingly clear.
| BrianOnHN wrote:
| Why else are Googlers paid so much? (rhetorical)
|
| They need to do their damn job.
|
| As a pixel 6 owner, I'm disgusted.
| sieabahlpark wrote:
| ChuckNorris89 wrote:
| I know it was rhetorical but Googlers aren't pad so much
| because the quality of the SW coming out of Google
| matches the pay, but because they work for the number one
| data scraping and advertising company in the world.
|
| Yo can have the best leetcoders in the world, but if QA
| is not part of the company culture, then ...
| bjt2n3904 wrote:
| It's abundantly clear from the replies in this thread that
| people are thinking emotionally, not rationally.
|
| They're pissed off at their phone, and reaching for the
| biggest stick they can find -- not to fix the problem, but
| to punish whoever caused it. Likely, they wouldn't even
| punish the right person, it would just be a scapegoat
| sacrificed to appease their wrath.
|
| Your comment is right on the nose when it comes to thinking
| rationally, and not emotionally.
|
| A smart phone is not like the flight computers on a 747. If
| you want guaranteed 911 access with the threat of criminal
| prosecution if it fails, I'll happily design you a device.
| It will cost $50k, and will have a monthly service fee of
| $1000 per user. It won't have any other features besides
| 911. But it will work!
|
| People just don't know what they're demanding.
| omginternets wrote:
| You seem to be (intentionally?) missing the point, which
| is that a known-dangerous bug was not promptly fixed.
|
| The mental gymnastics required to turn this into
| something other than criminal negligence are ... olympic.
| dagmx wrote:
| I would argue that you're the one who's having the
| emotional reaction , not the rational one, when it comes
| to involving authorities and legally mandated access to
| emergency services.
|
| You are clearly unaware of the legal requirements here.
| libria wrote:
| > You are clearly unaware of the legal requirements here.
|
| _I_ am definitely unaware. If you do know the specific
| law /infraction, please link to it as that would help the
| discussion.
|
| It doesn't help to vaguely hand-wave (emotionally I would
| argue) "Someone should go to jail!!". As I asked above,
| which people? How much jail? And what are the clearly
| defined laws?
|
| There are engineers that deal directly with code critical
| to public safety and the amount of verification,
| compliance, testing, authorization, permits, processes,
| legal reviews, etc involved in that pipeline increase
| costs and delays 10-fold, but they are extremely safe and
| reliable.
|
| Not saying we shouldn't do this for an emergency device,
| but it most certainly will not be cost-free, few
| engineers would want to be involved and consumers will
| not want to buy it.
| dagmx wrote:
| First of all...did you change to an alt account? I don't
| see libria anywhere in my reply chain above but you're
| responding as if you're bjt2n3904
|
| Secondly nobody mentioned jail. Criminal investigation
| doesn't mean jail time especially for corporations.
| Criminal negligence can just mean fines and a requirement
| to resolve the issue
|
| You're also acting as if people are saying the whole
| device and all software should be infallible. That's not
| the requirement. Legally any cellular device needs to be
| able to contact emergency services as long as there are
| no extenuating circumstances (dead battery, no
| connectivity).
|
| This is federally mandated in many countries. That Google
| has repeated failures to do so, across multiple countries
| and across a long period of time means that they are in
| violation of government rules.
|
| You're being intentionally obtuse on these points.
| michaelmrose wrote:
| All phones likely have bugs which could lead to crashes
| which means it could in theory just happen to experience
| an issue concurrently with the users attempting to call
| 911 resulting in a failure. However your base image
| should have few to zero such bugs and such failures just
| happening to coincide with an emergency call are or ought
| to be statistically very unlikely.
|
| The issue is not that a crash could happen its that a
| specific crash happens specifically when the user tries
| to place an emergency call triggered by the code that is
| supposed to run when the user makes such a call making
| failure statistically much more likely. Worse this has
| been a known issue since 2021.
|
| People aren't asking for space shuttle quality
| engineering they are asking for the same statistical
| probability of failure as any other good quality phone.
| It is deeply ironic that while you insist others don't
| know what they are demanding you clearly have no idea
| what they are demanding.
| dylan604 wrote:
| >A smart phone is not like the flight computers on a 747.
|
| You're right. They're about as reliable as the flight
| computers on a 737 Max instead
| verisimilitudes wrote:
| It's really disgusting to see someone argue that people
| don't want to pay for quality, when old phones worked.
| Now, the pilpul here will be to claim that those old
| phones totally didn't _actually_ work, they just appeared
| to basically always work, so it 's _totally_ the same
| thing; it 's not.
|
| The fact of the matter is that old phones may not have
| been formally-proven to work, but basically worked. The
| new phones aren't formally-proven to work, and basically
| don't.
|
| > People just don't know what they're demanding.
|
| As a programmer, I want the cretins claiming to be
| programmers to face justice for their disgusting work,
| about which they're so smug and condescending.
| [deleted]
| dessant wrote:
| There is a difference between initial product design
| (also needs to follow regulations, but not the main topic
| of discussion), and failure to act on repeated bug
| reports spanning years that clearly describe software
| bugs which disrupt emergency calls on Android phones.
| There is not much to defend in their conduct.
| djbusby wrote:
| Fine the company $1 per unit sold per day until the 911
| feature is fixed.
| dylan604 wrote:
| $1 per day per user maybe might get someone's attention
| bongoman37 wrote:
| sophacles wrote:
| Why not? I like the laws that have been passed to ensure that
| people are able to contact emergency services. I think
| enforcing those laws is logical, given that they exist and
| imho they exist for good reason.
| geodel wrote:
| Yesterday I was reading it is because Google pay such a low
| salary. If they increase it to like 3x-4x of current, all bugs
| will disappear on their own.
| kieselguhr_kid wrote:
| I know this is some kind of sarcasm but I'm not sure what
| kind of sarcasm it is.
| geodel wrote:
| Well, I am reminded on this forum very often that any poor
| software product is most likely because developers are not
| compensated fairly for their work.
| ipaddr wrote:
| Make sense no one wants to qa this section
| jacooper wrote:
| I'm basically locked into Pixels because of GrapheneOS/CalyxOS,
| the best experience you can get for a privacy friendly phone.
|
| The software is great, the camera is amazing, and the battery is
| good too, the only problem is the display on my Pixel 4XL.
|
| IOS is a hot garbage prison, to the point its users dream of
| something like newpipe, and the FOSS scene is basically
| nonexistent, also Apple doesn't care about your privacy, I will
| never switch.
|
| All other phones are either filled with gimicky things, have
| crappy designs(one ui isn't great compared to stock android) and
| nothing is private like CalyxOS/GrapheneOS.
|
| And yes payment apps/SafetyNet works on Calyx!
|
| Since Pixel 6 doesn't seem to be great, I will probably upgrade
| to PXL7/8, though there are some enticing deals on the normal
| Pixel 6.
| fyloraspit wrote:
| Same here but I have the Pixel 5. It's been a great experience
| for me.
| bubblethink wrote:
| How do we know that it's Google's fault ? There are so many
| variables here. We should ask for automated testing numbers. At
| least in the US, there isn't one. It requires special manual work
| to make a test call to 911.
| croes wrote:
| If something can interfere with making a emergency call on a
| Google phone it's definitely Google's fault.
|
| It's their job to make sure it works in all circumstances
| martin_a wrote:
| Calling emergency services is of course a premium feature (Pixel
| 6 PRO), I don't get the fuss everybody's making around here.
|
| Seriously: I'm shocked that such basic functionality does not
| work due to some "oh, let's make a gimmick here" thing.
| newhotelowner wrote:
| My pixel 6 misses to dial regular numbers a lot of times. The app
| just stays on dialing and then quits. There is no error, nothing.
| It should at least throw an error.
| mrkramer wrote:
| On the side note I thought Android has very few bugs probably
| because I don't use my Android phone a lot but I encountered one
| pretty annoying bug last week and I was unpleasantly surprised.
| zahllos wrote:
| I own a pixel 6 (not the pro model), and I also regret it. I've
| never needed to call the emergency services but I do find
| relatively frequent network drops: one moment it has a 5G or LTE
| connection, the next it is unable to find access to the network.
|
| This is in Switzerland on the 'flagship' carrier Swisscom.
| Swisscom are generally regarded as having the best overall
| coverage in Switzerland, helped by the fact they used to be the
| "PTT" i.e. a national enterprise as part of the Swiss Post. They
| operate Ericsson hardware, and Switzerland has lower power
| maximums for mobile operators compared to many European
| countries, resulting in a higher density of antennae. I'm also
| not talking about challenging environments like the mountains:
| I'm saying my Pixel 6 routinely drops 5G in the centre of cities
| like Geneva, Bern or Zurich. One of which happens to host a
| reasonably large Google office, so you'd figure they'd notice
| issues like this.
|
| I've tried reflashing the OS from scratch, upgrading to beta
| versions of 'Carrier Services' etc. The issue appears to have
| improved over time and happens less frequently, but it still
| certainly happens.
|
| My original plan was to eventually move to GrapheneOS but I'm now
| unsure, as I can't tell if this is the quality of stock android
| and the pixel hardware, and I'm rethinking my options.
| Nergg wrote:
| I also live in Switzerland and using Swisscom network. I have a
| pixel 4a, so I don't use 5g but the phone is really bad with
| finding network. I also experiment weird bugs like today it was
| impossible to watch tv online (rts) on my pixel but it was
| working on my friend iPhone. I hate to be trapped in Apple
| ecosystem but Google products are so buggy... I bought a Nest
| Google assistant last week and it can't understand the most
| basic queries... I spent hours trying to configure it and
| reseting, always failed at some point.
|
| I think Google doesn't care about other language than English
| and doesn't care about Swiss market (they don't even sell their
| phone on the Swiss google shop).
|
| I thought about going Samsung but Exynos, privacy issue, and
| their stupid marketing doesn't help...
|
| GrapheneOS and other privacy focus OS seems nice on paper but a
| lot of time spent to make it work.
|
| I guess I'll wait iPhone 14 keynote and Pixel 7 before making a
| choice.
| [deleted]
| amir734jj wrote:
| I switched to pixel 6 from pixel 4 and it was buggy to the point
| that I had to give away my pixel 6. Then I bought new still in
| box pixel 3 and I'm happy again.
| DangitBobby wrote:
| Is it still getting updates?
| rozenmd wrote:
| No - I have a Pixel 3 as well and the last uptime was last
| October or so
| dpkirchner wrote:
| No, the 3 was abandoned a little over four years after its
| release.
| MereInterest wrote:
| And the more relevant date: not even 2.5 years between the
| Pixel 3 being the actively promoted flagship device and
| being declared obsolete by virtue of dropping security
| updates.
| 3434111 wrote:
| rch wrote:
| Pixel 5 is still solid. I skipped the 6 because of comments
| on HN, but I'll probably have to update to the 7 when it
| comes out.
|
| In the meantime, I'd also like to try the Librem 5 US. This
| thread is convincing me to give it a shot anyway.
| scottmcdot wrote:
| If I test dial 000 will it immediately go to an operator? Or do I
| have a few seconds to hang up?
| hx833001 wrote:
| In the US dialing 911 will connect immediately and if you hang
| up they call you back.
| edmcnulty101 wrote:
| I have zero issues with my Pixel 6. It's an awesome phone and I
| really like it.
|
| However, I just bought it a few months ago, so maybe they fixed a
| lot of stuff.
| ineedtosleep wrote:
| Same and just wanted to echo it amid the Android hate that's
| bombarded this thread. Sure it has its warts, but the amount of
| hyperbole here about it being "the worst phone ever" is
| unwarranted.
| curiousgal wrote:
| It is not the worst phone ever. It is the worst Pixel ever.
| davesque wrote:
| Yeah, me too. Zero problems. I've also successfully dialed 911
| with it. Though it was in Seattle so I got put on hold for 5
| minutes ^_^. I guess the linked thread says the issue is in
| Australia.
| LinuxBender wrote:
| Out of curiosity has anyone tried GrapheneOS [1] on the pixel 6?
| Does it fix these problems or is this strictly a
| hardware/firmware issue?
|
| [1] - https://grapheneos.org/faq#device-support
| 0goel0 wrote:
| "...in Australia"
|
| How is this not a S1 P0 that requires an emergency hot patch from
| Google? AU should ban pixel phone sales until this is fixed.
| NelsonMinar wrote:
| This problem is apparently years old and happens in many
| countries. Given the liability associated I'm surprised Google
| hasn't fixed it.
|
| https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/wpirx8/had_an_...
|
| https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/ti8o8f/diallin...
|
| https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/comments/rfld6m/pixel_p...
| jl6 wrote:
| It has all the characteristics of a bug that you can just feel
| in your bones will never get fixed:
|
| * Intermittent.
|
| * Affects only some users.
|
| * Possible link to a hardware problem
|
| * Vendor track record of only putting serious effort into
| development of new products, not maintenance of existing
| products.
|
| That's some weighty inertia to overcome, but maybe the prospect
| of legal liability will manage it.
| dagmx wrote:
| I don't know enough about the emergency service requirements
| but it sounds like the issue is in the data Google are trying
| to query before connecting the call.
|
| They likely have a blocking function somewhere that they
| should be running concurrently or falling back to a cache
| after a timeout.
|
| Given how widespread this is in the comments on Reddit , I'm
| sure they must have enough user logs to pinpoint it.
| 5d8767c68926 wrote:
| This is making me furious. I do not think I have ever called
| 911, but it is one of those safety features I thought I could
| fully expect to work when needed.
|
| I have only ever used Android, but this is going to be my
| final such device. I have accepted a lot of rough edges over
| the years, but this wilful negligence regarding safety
| features is where I am drawing the line. At least with Apple
| I will not have to hope that maintaining Emergency Services
| will get someone promoted.
| Someone wrote:
| It also is very weird that this bug even made it to production
| once because the standards explicitly require phone to call
| emergency services even if no SIM card is present.
| bspammer wrote:
| The fact that this has stuck around so long feels like a
| consequence of triaging your bugs purely by the number of
| affected users. After all, likely less than 0.1% of users ever
| run into this bug, it can't be that big of an issue right?
| anticensor wrote:
| Did you try using +44 118 999 88199 9119 725 3 instead?
| washadjeffmad wrote:
| Does anyone have details on the internals of Google's customer
| support orgs? They seem to have taken to heart compliance with
| only bare minimum legal requirements over the past four or five
| years.
|
| And given that it's now also impossible to engage support on
| Facebook to fix account issues (I was locked out of my Oculus
| Quest 2 after attempting to merge my Oculus dev account with the
| Facebook account I closed in 2006), I wonder if it's time again
| to legislate higher standards for "support".
| system2 wrote:
| Buy iPhone my friends. I spent decades defending android but
| enough was enough.
| bdcravens wrote:
| "decades"? Android 1.0 was released 14 years ago.
| [deleted]
| lizardactivist wrote:
| Happy for 3 years now with my EUR120 Nokia 4.2. I doubt I will
| ever look at the Pixel given its price and with problems like
| these.
| system2 wrote:
| Nokia 4.2 is still android.
| bdcravens wrote:
| It seems this is a Pixel 6 specific issue.
| everybodyknows wrote:
| Intensely unhappy with my Nokia 5.4 for about a month now,
| after a system update conscripted it and me into recurring DDoS
| attacks upon the public 911 system:
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32526819
| lizardactivist wrote:
| It sounds annoying, but luckily it's a configurable setting.
| whatever1 wrote:
| Interesting, this is why I switched from android to apple ~ 5
| years ago.
|
| I was expecting a very important phone call for the outcome of
| the surgery of a person very close to me.
|
| The smartphone, the Samsung galaxy S7 edge, finally rang, and I
| was trying to answer the the call, but no, android was doing
| something more important in the background, the whole UI was
| frozen and the phone call banner was not responding to touch.
| Finally, the phone rebooted by itself, and then it was back to
| normal. But my call was missed.
|
| I did not get to listen to my person, because my android
| smartphone, was more smart and less phone.
| system2 wrote:
| Did the same after my samsung galaxy was freaking out every
| week randomly. Switching to iPhone 7 was the best tech decision
| I've ever made in the last decade. Since then I never looked
| back. I feel sorry for android phone users and how much they
| suffer but still cannot accept it.
| eastbound wrote:
| I switched to iPhone when I learnt Android didn't have
| encrypted storage at the time.
|
| The whole Android stack is rife for criminal prosecution,
| between GDPR, permissions, freezing when calling 911...
| zls wrote:
| After using Android for 10 years, a similar experience made me
| switch. I'd just bought a Pixel 5, and I received a call from a
| pizza delivery driver. I say I received a call because the
| phone rang. Otherwise I'd never have known. The UI didn't show
| it at all, even though it was responsive, and the missed call
| log section never populated. Nothing except the ringer sound.
|
| The next day I switched to iPhone and have never regretted it.
| Like, if my phone can't receive calls or even capture that a
| call was missed, none of its other features matter.
| mikotodomo wrote:
| So much this. The idea of being unable to call 911 when you
| need it is absolutely horrifying. I'd argue that one of the
| main reasons for owning a phone is to protect you. I think
| Android's entire company needs to be shut down and taken over.
| alyandon wrote:
| I have similar issues sometimes with the dialer app on my Pixel
| 2. I can't have a phone that doesn't prioritize being a phone
| over everything else that might be competing for cpu resources
| so my next phone is definitely going to be an iPhone.
| [deleted]
| remram wrote:
| My wife and I recently upgraded from Pixel 4 and we found that
| both the 5 and 6 overheat during normal use. After browsing the
| internet for a half hour, either phone will be too hot to hold in
| your hand. How do phones like that get shipped?
| nickpinkston wrote:
| I got a Pixel 6 Pro a few months ago, and it's without question
| the worst phone I've ever had the displeasure to own.
|
| - It crashes constantly.
|
| - Bluetooth is even buggier than usual.
|
| - Fingerprint unlock is very finicky.
|
| - The touchscreen isn't designed/calibrated well and leads to
| constant fat finger presses.
|
| - The hotspot is buggy to connect and randomly drops once it does
| connect.
|
| - The phone is so slick (ie low friction) that it will randomly
| slide and fall off of slightly off-level surfaces.
|
| - It feels like this was released without anyone living with the
| phone for even a couple weeks and trying normal use cases...
|
| Anyway - I've been really disappointed there haven't been updates
| to fix some of this stuff. I've heard this may be because of
| hardware issues, but I haven't looked that deeply. I've owned
| Pixel phones before and like the no BS + Google Apps-centric
| approach, but this phone really soured me on Google phones. :-(
| DrudgeCorporate wrote:
| I apparently have been living in my own bubble. Has the pixel 6
| been a bad phone in general? I haven't had a single issue with
| mine and I bought it day one.
| whatevertrevor wrote:
| Same here, have a pixel 6 pro and the only think I can relate
| with is the somewhat janky fingerprint sensor. Have not had a
| single crash, everything works smoothly.
| hocuspocus wrote:
| Lots of people have complained about the fingerprint reader,
| poor cell reception, and recently the Android 13 update that
| killed their battery life.
| koyote wrote:
| Same here, it's actually very weird seeing the endless posts
| of users in places like reddit (and here now) complaining
| about things that just never happen on my phone.
|
| I've had Android phones since 1.5 and the pixel 6 has been
| flawless for me.
| wiseowise wrote:
| Huh. I wonder where are all the Android/Pixel apologists that
| say that to taste "real" Android you have to use Pixel. (And I
| say that as an Android developer, before downvotes come my way)
| ssizn wrote:
| Because as shitty as pixel phones are, they are still better
| than the rest of android phones.
| aaaaaaaaata wrote:
| Top of the line.
|
| And this is coming from someone who had their display cable
| come unclicked after a two inch drop.
|
| Best, most rugged used hardware available right now.
|
| Pair with GrapheneOS.org for best results.
| whimsicalism wrote:
| I think they say that about the software, not the hardware.
| wiseowise wrote:
| Literally every issue listed seems like a software issue to
| me.
| whimsicalism wrote:
| Excited for the "friction" firmware update!
| wiseowise wrote:
| Okay, there's one hardware issue out of seven, I stand
| corrected.
| zamalek wrote:
| I got on the Pixel rollercoaster at 1 (a great device), and got
| off after 4. 2, 3,and (especially) 4 all either had a common
| feature missing, or did some annoying shit. Seems like I made
| the right choice.
|
| Unfortunately, it looks like OnePlus was a poor choice. Guess
| I'm turning to Nothing next.
| hocuspocus wrote:
| The 5 is okay.
|
| After owning many Google phones since the Nexus era I think
| Google should really focus on making good mid-range phones
| and simply give up on the high-end entirely. It's not like
| they're really trying to sell hardware anyway (you can't buy
| them in most of the world) so I doubt it makes any real
| money. The fact the Pixel line looks like a hobby project
| year after year is just sad at this point.
| Buttons840 wrote:
| I'm still using a Pixel 1, but it's starting to die at even
| 30% battery, and hasn't had software updates for to long.
| Wish devices weren't designed / destined to fail.
| phil21 wrote:
| I don't have any of the crashing issues others seem to, but I
| absolutely agree the Pixel 6 Pro was a large regression - the
| Pixel 3 Pro was probably the best phone I've owned.
|
| Fingerprint reader is inexcusably bad. I tried to just get used
| to it, but from a form factor _and_ implementation standpoint
| it 's a huge step back in useability.
|
| Battery life is also pretty bad for the size of battery in the
| phone. Runs hot doing anything remotely CPU intensive.
|
| I'm hopeful the Pixel 7 fixes most of these regressions. If
| not, it may be time to look at an iphone after nearly two
| decades of resistance.
| mochomocha wrote:
| I have a non-pro version, but I can definitely relate to the
| "too slick, it randomly slides" problem - especially bad
| because the back camera protrudes. It's pretty ridiculous, my
| phone ends up on the floor multiple times a day despite me
| being the careful kind when it comes to electronics.
| mda wrote:
| As an anecdote point, I didn't have any of these issues, I
| think standby battery drain was a bit high but after a few
| updates it got better, still not ideal though.
| jabart wrote:
| Pixel 6 (non-pro) user here. The fingerprint unlock is a bit
| finicky at some odd angles but none of these other issue.
| Replaced a Pixel 3a and just feels a bit faster, 5g, and bigger
| screen.
| wnevets wrote:
| Weird, I haven't noticed any of those issues and I bought my 6
| pro used. Am I just lucky?
| Tijdreiziger wrote:
| So where do we go from here?
|
| I have a Samsung Galaxy S9 at the moment, but Samsung's typo-
| filled changelogs don't exactly inspire confidence. It has also
| been bugging me to accept the new Samsung Account terms, which
| I don't want to do.
|
| Chinese brands (Huawei, Xiaomi, Motorola, etc.) don't inspire
| confidence for me either.
|
| Apple had the CSAM scanning controversy. I have an iPad, but a
| bunch of features I didn't want were turned on by default, and
| the walled garden approach is obviously a downside.
|
| I would prefer to run a privacy-focused Android distribution,
| but I have a lot of apps and I don't know how much they depend
| on Google Play Services, so I don't really want to switch over
| 'cold turkey'. Also, they're still built on the same AOSP base,
| so who's to say they don't have the same bugs?
| vorpalhex wrote:
| Nokia.
|
| Hardware runs a gen behind but it's fine enough with stock
| android.
| happyopossum wrote:
| > Apple had the CSAM scanning controversy.
|
| You mean like Google's recent CSAM controversy? At least
| Apple never proposed using ML to find new CSAM and report you
| to the police with a single violation...
| vetinari wrote:
| No, he meant Apple's CSAM controversy. Apple wanted to scan
| files on your device, while Google scans stuff you upload
| to their cloud.
| anonuser123456 wrote:
| Apple scans files on your device to compare against known
| CSAM content.
|
| Google scans your content for potential CSAM based on AI.
|
| One can imagine the false positive rate for the Google
| approach is likely higher.
| vetinari wrote:
| Apple scans files on your device, using your resources
| (storage, compute, power).
|
| Google scans files on their devices, using their
| resources (storage, compute power).
|
| It is you who decided to upload files to Google's cloud.
|
| However, it is difficult to use your own device if you
| don't have privacy there.
| anonuser123456 wrote:
| The feature Apple proposed would only apply to files you
| were uploading to iCloud. Turning off iCloud photos
| prevented scanning.
|
| The whole point of the Apple system was to enable end to
| end encryption so Apple couldn't view your data on their
| servers. The only way they could get access is when a
| threshold of CSAM likely files were met. e.g the keys are
| sharded.
|
| With the Apple approach you have considerably more
| privacy.
| vetinari wrote:
| For now. The foot would be in door to enable it system-
| wide.
| anonuser123456 wrote:
| Why would they care about getting a foot in a door that
| they have the keys to and is wide open?
|
| Modern SoCs have security domains that are invisible to
| the main CPUs. Apple can run just about anything it wants
| on the security coprocessor and users will be none the
| wiser.
|
| The American DOJ, FBI etc do not want end-to-end
| encryption and use 'think of the children' as an excuse.
| This gives Apple the plausible pushback to say 'We have
| thought of the children...'
| kevin_thibedeau wrote:
| Politicians feet not Apple's.
| robin_reala wrote:
| Apple don't scan files on your device, they backtracked
| on the plan (for now at least).
| anonuser123456 wrote:
| Apple absolutely scans your files on iCloud.
| LegitShady wrote:
| ybeh intended to but the backlash was too strong. not a
| vote of confidence in them either way.
| Spooky23 wrote:
| Not really.
|
| It was a controversy created by a poorly written Apple
| press release that unveiled two distinct features, and
| subsequently ginned up by an even worse EFF blog post.
|
| CSAM scanning was all about iCloud, just like every other
| vendor, and the benefit was a roadmap to E2E storage.
|
| The more confusing thing was the explicit content
| notifications for parents for their minor children in
| family plans.
|
| So instead, just like everyone else, you almost certainly
| have CSAM scanning happening in iCloud directly. All of
| your content is just a subpoena away. Thanks EFF.
| vetinari wrote:
| Running this kind of stuff is already leg in the door.
| Next they can decide to scan your device even, if you
| don't upload anything anywhere. For your safety, of
| course, you might be in a possession of an objectionable
| material, like photos of MAGA hats or other extremist
| paraphernalia.
|
| So this is a big red line. If you want to upload to
| iCloud, ok, scanning there is a fair game and you can
| always not upload to iCloud. But your device should be
| your device, respecting your privacy.
| endisneigh wrote:
| Apple only wanted to scan files on your device once you
| decide to upload it. In other words, if you don't ever
| actually upload anything nothing would ever be scanned.
| vorpalhex wrote:
| That upload that is the only way to load data onto your
| phone for many apps, that the phone is auto-opted into
| and that only Apple can offer? That one? The one that
| literally no competitor can replace since it uses special
| Apple entitlements?
| endisneigh wrote:
| I'm not sure what you're talking about? iOS has
| implemented interfaces to use things like Google Drive,
| One Drive, Dropbox, etc, baked into the file system.
| vorpalhex wrote:
| 1. There is no filesystem (exposed), there are per-app
| sandboxes with the ability to move files from another
| sandbox
|
| 2. It only allows single file actions, no sync/offline
| cache/etc. Most apps don't meaningfully work well with
| this - there is no "sync these ten comics to this device
| at all times"
|
| Most apps still only use their local file sandbox.
| scarface74 wrote:
| Any application that saves files using the standard file
| selector allows you to choose any installed storage
| solution.
| smoldesu wrote:
| Nobody is mad about cloud providers scanning for
| objectionable content. Everyone is mad because Apple is
| using the hardware _you_ payed for to perform an
| operation you 're paying them to provide. It's like
| paying for an API that gives you the weather, and all the
| endpoint returns is a system call for your phone's
| thermometer.
|
| It goes to show that Apple isn't afraid to undermine
| their own experience to implement adversarial software
| services. Combined with the way they "respect" the
| privacy of Chinese citizens, I don't think Apple actually
| cares about our privacy. It would seem that instead
| they're testing the waters for more radical changes[0],
| like using on-device machine learning to detect suicidal
| users or terrorists. And who's going to object when
| _that_ happens, right?
|
| [0] Source: the past century of US political discourse.
| endisneigh wrote:
| Not sure what the distinction is. Either Apple uses the
| hardware you paid for to scan [before uploading] or uses
| the service you paid for [during upload] to scan.
|
| The practical difference is nil. The fact of the matter
| is, either way, if you don't upload you won't be scanned,
| if you do upload you will be. End result is the same
| regardless of whether you use OneDrive, Box, Dropbox or
| Google Drive (who all implement CSAM scanning)
| smoldesu wrote:
| The practical difference is that I pay for the
| electricity they use, now. The wear-and-tear of _their_
| service is now imparted onto my phone.
|
| If Apple wants to run that code, they're welcome to do it
| on their own servers; they pay for the hardware, they
| decide what software it runs. I shouldn't have to waste
| _my_ storage space on their NeuralHash model though. I
| shouldn 't waste _my_ CPU cycles on _their_ regulatory
| compliance. Arguing anything else is paramount to saying
| that Apple owned your phone from the start, and if _that
| 's_ the case, then antitrust legislation can't come soon
| enough.
| endisneigh wrote:
| seems like a dumb thing to argue about. everything you're
| saying is moot as you can just plug in your phone to your
| computer and upload photos without scanning, or use a
| self-hosted file upload service, etc.
|
| your compute and phone resources are already used for
| analytics and other things that you didn't explicitly
| tell the phone to do.
|
| you also greatly overestimate how much CPU it takes to
| compare a hash, lol
|
| fact of the matter is, you're only scanned when you're
| using apple services.
| smoldesu wrote:
| > your compute and phone resources are already used for
| analytics and other things that you didn't explicitly
| tell the phone to do.
|
| I didn't know LineageOS sent analytics, it never showed
| up on Netguard. Curious!
|
| If you think this is a dumb thing to argue about, then by
| all means; don't argue about it! If you're satisfied with
| your iPhone and convinced that Apple can do no wrong,
| then certainly don't let me get in your way. We're
| talking about the largest company in the world, though,
| and if you're unwilling to offer them a _little_
| criticism for objectively degrading the iPhone
| experience, then I don 't see the point in discussing
| this.
|
| > you also greatly overestimate how much CPU it takes to
| compare a hash, lol
|
| Do I? If it's not such a big hassle, then Apple can just
| run it on their own servers. They own your iCloud
| decryption keys anyways, it shouldn't be too big of a
| deal.
| endisneigh wrote:
| We're talking about Apple devices here so LineageOS is
| irrelevant. Please keep up.
|
| > Do I? If it's not such a big hassle, then Apple can
| just run it on their own servers. They own your iCloud
| decryption keys anyways, it shouldn't be too big of a
| deal.
|
| Privacy is better preserved doing it on device compared
| to on their servers.
|
| anyway, nothing more to discuss here.
| pessimizer wrote:
| You might think that it's silly to complain about having
| to directly pay for an adversarial program to run, but
| try to imagine how it could bother other people.
| astrange wrote:
| The guy who had his Google account deleted for sending
| pictures of his children to his doctor is definitely
| upset about cloud providers scanning his content!
| smoldesu wrote:
| I'm sure he is, but rules are rules. Google _cannot
| store_ that content for _any purpose_ whatsoever: there
| are very specific regulatory standards in place for
| storing medical data, and Google Drive /iCloud doesn't
| comply with those standards. They (both!) go as far as to
| tell you that in the EULA, so the context of the
| situation doesn't even matter in the first place.
|
| The more bothersome thing (to me) is client-side
| scanning. Apple is setting a precedent that allows any
| first-party manufacturer to work against the user's
| interests as long as there's a large enough common enemy.
| It should go without saying, but _that 's a horrible
| idea!_
|
| If Google were doing the same thing on their Pixel
| phones, I'd be slamming them equally as hard. It's simply
| depressing to watch a company claim they know best, while
| proceeding to use your phone to run _their_ regulatory
| compliance code.
| astrange wrote:
| Taking a picture of something on your own phone is not
| "medical data" and they weren't doing ToS compliance,
| they were scanning for novel CSAM in a way they're not
| required to, reported it to the police, and now are
| refusing to undelete his account because of their never
| give anyone customer service policy.
|
| (Even if you took a picture to send to your doctor
| through an encrypted app, it just has to end up in the
| photo library to be cloud synced, unless you remember to
| hand delete it.)
| BeetleB wrote:
| > Chinese brands (Huawei, Xiaomi, Motorola, etc.) don't
| inspire confidence for me either.
|
| Have you considered OnePlus? Their cameras aren't the best,
| but they're usually as good as the other top brands in
| everything else.
| Hamuko wrote:
| I lost my confidence in OnePlus when one of their OTA
| updates soft-bricked my OnePlus 5 on Christmas Eve. Lost
| all of the data that wasn't backed up, since I had to
| perform a complete wipe and the phone was encrypted.
|
| Also, OnePlus doesn't have a good track record when it
| comes to this particular issue:
| https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-40656034
| er888kh wrote:
| I haven't owned one of their devices, but it seems like
| Linus[1] is not satisfied with their current situation.
|
| [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GNoelvk6S4
| BeetleB wrote:
| Yikes! I have a OnePlus 5T that I'm very happy with.
|
| Amusingly I was thinking of getting a Pixel 6 until I saw
| this thread, and thought "Oh well, back to OnePlus." Now
| I don't know what to get.
| aaaaaaaaata wrote:
| Is Pixel hardware the problem?
|
| Or untested buggy Google shovel-ware?
| BeetleB wrote:
| I would argue the value add of the Pixel 6 _is_ the
| proprietary Google SW. I was considering the Pixel 6 only
| for its photo abilities, and a lot of those are via
| Google SW - not fantastic lenses /processors. If I
| replace it with a custom ROM, the OnePlus is probably a
| better device (faster processor, etc).
|
| If the Google SW is so buggy, there's no compelling
| reason to buy one just because of the HW.
| staindk wrote:
| If I had the money I'd probably get one of the more expensive
| Sony phones. They seem great, at least in theory.
| lawn wrote:
| The Fairphone 4 is great IMO.
|
| Repairability is super high, it's easily flashed to eg
| LineagOS and has been promised software updates for many
| years if you want to stay with Android.
| mFixman wrote:
| My Galaxy S21 is the best phone I've ever had. I didn't
| install any new firmware or anything that requires rooting
| and I never had a problem not accepting Samsung's terms.
|
| Everything that matters works: the phone is fast, never
| crashes, and you can install browsers with AdBlock.
| saiya-jin wrote:
| I can say, after 6+ months with samsung s22 ultra i am very
| happy with it. Camera delivers more than any apple device can
| right now (since 10x zoom is surprisingly useful for me in
| normal light), battery is fine, screen is amazing and I think
| still best on the market today.
|
| People bash androids for privacy like all are from china, but
| Korea (and Japan and US) makes some fine devices too and as
| european I prefer them to US (and obviously China).
|
| I even have european exynos crap version, which is slower but
| some claim exynos models on previous models were much more
| stable/reliable after few months compared to snapdragons.
| Can't say, what I want works, there is absolute 0
| broken/annoying things for me, no bloatware, no ads etc.
|
| That being said, when wife was looking for smaller phone few
| weeks back, I went through reviews and opinions and suggested
| iphone 13 mini. She always loved iphone photos of other folks
| and I think she will enjoy phone UI smoothness and long term
| reliability/security. It will be an interesting experiment.
| aaaaaaaaata wrote:
| > So where do we go from here?
|
| GrapheneOS.org
| Tijdreiziger wrote:
| Which is supported only on Google Pixels. So if I go that
| route, how can I be sure it won't suffer from the same bugs
| re: emergency calls?
| er888kh wrote:
| Just look for a phone on which you can easily install a
| stable custom ROM. I previously had a Samsung device and
| installed Lineage OS and was happy-ish. It was clean and free
| of bloatware, fast, and had a good battery life. The downside
| was that it wasn't stable (probably never got an uptime above
| 48h) and the major updates were too buggy and too late.
|
| I recently bought a Xiaomi device. The moment you turn it on
| you notice it's filled with spyware and bloatware. I thought
| I couldn't be more surprised after seeing the clock app ask
| for permission for "personalized experience", but they got
| me, in the calculator app. Other than that, the hardware is
| great, the themes look good, and overall it's a good
| experience. It's a pity I'd have to switch to a custom ROM
| because of this "personalized experience" MIUI nonsense.
| kelnos wrote:
| The problem is that anyone who wants to use Google Pay or
| banking apps, or anything that requires the phone to pass
| SafetyNet, will not be able to use an alternative ROM.
| Right now that's the only thing stopping me from getting a
| phone with a shitty "skinned" version of Android, as I
| can't replace the factory OS without losing a ton of
| functionality I rely on.
| Tijdreiziger wrote:
| Google Pay doesn't respect your privacy anyway, as the
| terms state that Google can use your transaction data to
| profile you.
| kelnos wrote:
| The answer to "I can't do X because I use Y and Z" is not
| "You're wrong to want to use Y and Z". Understand that
| not everyone prioritizes the same things you do.
|
| Regardless, Google already has enough information on me
| to profile me quite well; avoiding Google Pay will not
| meaningfully change that, and I get enough value out of
| it that the trade off is worth it to me, at least for
| now.
| Tijdreiziger wrote:
| Of course everyone is free to have their own priorities
| when it comes to privacy.
|
| However, for people who want to use Google Pay despite
| the privacy implications, I'm not sure running a privacy-
| preserving Android distribution is even meaningful. At
| that point, why not just run stock Google Android?
| kevin_thibedeau wrote:
| You realize that _all_ electronic payments are used to
| profile you.
| Tijdreiziger wrote:
| Even if that's true, why would you add another party
| (i.e. Google) to that chain?
| kevin_thibedeau wrote:
| While pervasive tracking is insidious, Google is the
| least problematic actor since they don't sell their data.
| nh2 wrote:
| I think that's outdated information in many regards. Most
| apps seem to have turned off the SafetyNet requirement; I
| suspect that may be due to a larger amount of Chinese
| Android phones that don't have it.
|
| I'm using a Play-Store-less microG LineageOS on a Google
| Pixel 1, and all my banking apps work (Revolut UK, German
| Post Bank authenticator), as well as a Swiss online
| health care app.
|
| I haven't found an application yet that I couldn't use on
| LineageOS due to lack of SafetyNet.
| pid-1 wrote:
| If you want a premium phone, Apple is pretty much
| unchallenged.
|
| I'm not a fan of expensive phones though - I'm scared I will
| break it and lose $700+ in the blink of an eye. Been using
| cheap Motorolas for the past 10 years, no complains.
| qball wrote:
| >I'm not a fan of expensive phones though - I'm scared I
| will break it and lose $700+ in the blink of an eye.
|
| Phones over 200 bucks are a serious liability, I agree.
|
| Fortunately, that also happens to be the price of the
| fourth-fastest phone on the market, that being the iPhone
| SE (Gen 2).
|
| The fastest phone on the market (that being the Gen 3) is
| twice that price, but I have an easier time accepting a
| premium for that that's closer to 100 than the 1000 you'd
| have to pay to get the most capable Android phones... and
| they're still 4 years behind the iPhone technology-wise.
| devoutsalsa wrote:
| For the iPhone, you can always buy two generations back to
| save a few bucks. I bought an iPhone 11 a couple months ago
| for $499 plus tax and it's a perfectly good phone.
| allset_ wrote:
| When you do that you're also buying into a phone that
| will stop receiving security updates sooner since iPhones
| receive updates for ~5 years after they're released.
| stu2b50 wrote:
| I wouldn't really worry about that. Apple has been very
| good at giving security patches to old devices. Just a
| few days ago they pushed a security patch for iPhones as
| old as the 5S
|
| https://9to5mac.com/2021/09/23/apple-releases-
| ios-12-5-5-for...
| Throwawayaerlei wrote:
| If you're really on a budget you can probably go back
| even more generations and get both an acceptable phone
| and one that'll get updates for some time. Which are
| probably more important for iOS because it's such a
| single big target compared to the fragmented Android
| world. I'm currently using an iPhone 6s I got in February
| 2020 for $200 from my Consumer Cellular MVNO which
| unlocks it after 6 months.
|
| One thing you'll lose with the older phones sooner than
| iOS updates is AppleCare support, but if you get a good
| bargain to begin with....
| gfd wrote:
| I didn't consider Motorola a Chinese brand but apparently
| they were sold by Google to Lenovo in 2014
| https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola_Mobility
| Spooky23 wrote:
| Just get an iPhone. They are for better or worse the
| BlackBerry of the 2020s.
|
| Samsung is the only rival in terms of hardware. Google lacks
| the attention span to execute. Everything else is even less
| baked.
|
| I'd experiment with nerdy Android distros with a tablet. I
| used to have a Linux smartphone (whose name escapes me, which
| is driving me nuts) back in like 2006/7, it was fun but not a
| "daily driver".
| michaelmrose wrote:
| Motorola makes good phones. I'm not sure why everyone is
| fixated on Samsung. Seems to me the Motorola G line is
| fantastic and even relatively cheap with the Moto G 5G
| being not but $300
| xioxox wrote:
| Motorola produce virtually no software updates. You'll
| typically only get security updates for two years after
| the phone is started to be sold.
| michaelmrose wrote:
| If its unlocked you can install what you like later on.
| At $165-$300 getting it fully unlocked is trivial.
| robin_reala wrote:
| Probably an Openmoko Neo 1973?
| LegitShady wrote:
| Because I want to use a browser with Adblock and iOS won't
| let me, so it's ruled out from the start.
|
| Why would I settle for an expensive device that makes
| browsing the internet painful? Why would I limit myself to
| only the software apple will approve?
|
| It isn't even in the running and as long as their software
| policies remain as is, won't be in the running.
| [deleted]
| AnthonyMouse wrote:
| I was an inch away from buying an iPhone, even though I
| disapprove of their curation model, because Android is
| such a garbage fire. (Not one modern Android phone has
| in-kernel-tree drivers? Not one?)
|
| And the forced curation is dumb but if they're approving
| everything I'd want to use anyway, Android can eat it
| until they sort out their problems. What do I even need?
| Signal and Firefox with uBlock, that's really it.
|
| On iOS, Signal can't do SMS and there's no uBlock. Of
| course.
| ChuckNorris89 wrote:
| _> Not one modern Android phone has in-kernel-tree
| drivers? Not one_
|
| That's up to Qualcomm, not Android. And Qualcomm needs to
| sell new chips every year, therefore planned obsolescence
| works in their favor.
| scarface74 wrote:
| Seeing that rule based content blocking has been built
| into iOS for 6 years and web extension support has been
| built in for two...
| zibby8 wrote:
| iOS supports ad-blockers in Safari.
| layer8 wrote:
| There are adblocker extensions (aka "content blockers")
| on iOS that work very well. This has been the case since
| iOS 9 IIRC, so seven years ago.
| yunohn wrote:
| What? iOS only supports content blockers as safari
| extensions since iOS 15, which is the latest iOS...
|
| Please do source your claim that this has been possible
| for 7yrs, as that's not my experience.
|
| (https://developer.apple.com/safari/extensions/)
| layer8 wrote:
| See e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9695552 and
| https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10230704.
| Tijdreiziger wrote:
| It only supports 'Chrome Manifest v3'-style 'simple'
| blocking lists, not 'true' adblockers. These mostly work
| fine but are clearly less powerful.
|
| They also don't work with non-Safari browsers (e.g.
| Firefox).
| scarface74 wrote:
| This hasn't been true for two years Safari on iOS has
| supported web extensions for that long.
| mplewis wrote:
| iOS supports adblockers since iOS 9 was released in 2015.
| LegitShady wrote:
| it does not support real adblockers like ublock origin,
| it supports 'blocking lists' which are garbage.
| scarface74 wrote:
| iOS supports web extensions and has since iOS 12/13
| butterNaN wrote:
| Consider installing /e/ os on your galaxy.
| https://e.foundation/e-os/
| whimsicalism wrote:
| If you want good stock Android phones, I believe Pixel &
| Chinese brands are only game in town.
| Tijdreiziger wrote:
| I don't really care about 'stock', tbh. It just needs to
| run the apps I want to run, and it's nice if it can also
| take decent photos. I would also strongly prefer for it to
| preserve my privacy, but I realize that's kind of a wash
| between Google and Apple.
| mikesabat wrote:
| I got a Pixel 6a a few days back and just pocket dialed someone
| for the first time in 5 years.
|
| My last phone was the 4a and the 6a seems worse in many ways. I
| haven't traded the 4a in yet because I might just move back.
|
| Are there any good alternative phones on Project Fi?
| morpheuskafka wrote:
| I was checking out the Android competition ahead of the iPhone
| 14 announcement and I was shocked that all of the flagships
| seem to have major usability complaints. I always thought that
| the UX might be a little worse, but Android would be ahead on
| hardware (battery, camera, etc). I thought the whole carriers
| doing updates and all that would have been fixed by now, but it
| seems like only Pixel has. What is keeping people still on
| Android if the flagships have so many issues?
| LegitShady wrote:
| The ability to use firefox with ublock origin. Browsing the
| internet on Apple devices is cancer.
| MontyCarloHall wrote:
| >What is keeping people still on Android if the flagships
| have so many issues?
|
| Not much, apparently. In the US at least, iPhone usage has
| been steadily eroding Android usage; indeed, as of this
| summer, the US iPhone userbase became larger than the Android
| userbase [0].
|
| [0] https://archive.ph/r6PbO
| marcolussetti wrote:
| I have both an Android (personal primary device) and an
| iPhone (work phone).
|
| For me by far the number one reason I use my Android device
| is the Internet browsing differences. Firefox Nightly with
| all the add-ons I use (first of all uBlock Origin, but so
| many more) and the sync to desktop Firefox is night and day
| compared to Safari (with an adblocker).
| tbihl wrote:
| >What is keeping people still on Android if the flagships
| have so many issues?
|
| Many things boil down to research I'd have to do to convince
| myself of feature parity for things important to me. Micro SD
| cards are mostly gone from Android and also not so important
| to me as they once we're, so that reason is effectively gone.
| In no particular order:
|
| 1. You're stuck with iMessager, which at least means I can't
| keep Signal as my default messaging app, and probably means
| other downsides.
|
| 2. Old ipods and my iPad don't seem to even allow file
| transfer with my computer via USB. I don't know if you can
| transfer files directly to/from external hard drives.
|
| 3. Lightning cables (maybe iPhones don't have these anymore?)
|
| 4. I suspect that there are missing features if you don't
| have a MacBook, but I haven't looked into it.
|
| 5. I have apps I know and like. For starters, I would have to
| find a podcast app that I liked. AFAIK you still can't use FF
| with ublock origin on iPhones, which means I would have to
| migrate all my browser activity to something else.
|
| 6. Keeping my Android phone at least lets me pretend that
| I'll migrate over to GrapheneOS like I should.
|
| 7. I like having access to FDroid. AFAIK, iPhones have no
| analogue.
|
| 8. It seems like the iPhone mini is missing a fingerprint
| reader, which means only the SE is appealing.
|
| Anyway, I thought pretty hard about it with my last phone
| because 2 of 4 Apple phones are the best 2 smaller phones,
| but it would be a lot of inconvenience just to have a smaller
| phone.
| vorpalhex wrote:
| 1. I can actually get files on my phone (usb without itunes,
| apps can bring their own sync, dropbox works as well as
| drive, etc)
|
| 2. I can sideload whatever I want. Emulators, disallowed
| apps, etc.
|
| 3. Real terminal with ssh, ability to install packages, etc
|
| 4. Not locked in to iMessage, iTunes, Apple Music, Safari
|
| 5. Some apps that use plugins can only run on Android. Those
| are right out on iOS.
| dzikimarian wrote:
| Personally I find Apple UX inferior in many areas - eg.
| notification management sucks a lot. Customization is poor -
| no sideloading, no alternative launchers, even icons cannot
| be moved freely. Device looks bad due to huge noth. That's
| just a few from the top of my head.
|
| Also giving more control over the market to company, that is
| almost definition of walled garden is bad for everyone.
| amelius wrote:
| These are issues you'd not even expect from a Pine or Librem
| Phone ...
| dmitrygr wrote:
| > It feels like this was released without anyone living with
| the phone for even a couple weeks and trying normal use
| cases...
|
| Google used to have a very robust dogfooding in program
| internally. Back in 2012 - 2015. Everybody inside the android
| org was using the latest devices before release. This is not
| nearly the case anymore.
| hocuspocus wrote:
| The Nexus at that time were full of bugs too.
| MKGoogle wrote:
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