Post B4FHTmLygGUCDomPq4 by futurebird@sauropods.win
(DIR) More posts by futurebird@sauropods.win
(DIR) Post #B4FDNLbonsvbilrouW by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T09:51:56Z
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I know 8 trans people well and many more as acquaintances. The 8 people I know well range from being an old childhood friend, to coworkers, to students, to neighbors. I'm mostly aware that they are trans at all due to the increase in anti-trans laws and blatant transphobia in the US. Were it not for that I might not know or even care. But I worry about them. In each case the fact that they are trans is one of the less interesting things I know about them.
(DIR) Post #B4FDgvAUoqPVVaQ8rw by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T09:55:28Z
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I sometimes want to just explain to the bigots, this could all be very normal if you'd stop huffing bigoted media and get to know someone who was trans. It's just like ... a hormone imbalance that can be treated. It's like being mad at people for having red hair. If only you knew how boring this could be, how normal. How easy to forget that they are trans. And I could just forget, if it weren't for the bigotry and the threats to their safety.
(DIR) Post #B4FECcsOMc5k2l4RbE by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:01:12Z
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In decades of knowing trans people in being in places that are more accepting of trans and LGBTQ people I've never once had someone say "how dare you misgender me" though if someone had I don't know if that would matter, it's just nothing like what people expect and fear.No one is pole dancing. I do not live in a gay pride parade. I'm a Christian, I go to church now and then. I'm inwardly kind of prudish and I don't even like being around people swearing much.
(DIR) Post #B4FEZLpFvJmnp3RKpU by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:05:16Z
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All these nerds are so normal. And we are all robbed of feeling normal by the bigotry. I'm glad that I'm not exceptional among the cis people I know in these communities, who are like me frustrated and angry that people we care about are being used as political props. But how do you explain that everything is normal? How do you make a big sensation about how there is nothing sensational about the fact that people may change their name, or their gender?
(DIR) Post #B4FF8mGpaufVyVEMgy by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:11:43Z
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And if you don't like slightly sheltered nerds who wince when we hear swear words there are people who are more outgoing and bodacious: some of them are trans. It's very normal and boring. No one cares.Whatever cultural daily norms you find ... normal could include trans people. It wouldn't matter. It has no impact on your life.Why has your fear reached across the country and made one of my students nervous that he can't get his medicine? How fucking dare you.
(DIR) Post #B4FFXQAGv7Kgeduhbk by albertcardona@mathstodon.xyz
2026-03-14T10:16:07Z
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@futurebird I mean, fishes change gender as part of their natural life cycle; frogs can as well; many animals are hermaphrodites; some are gynandromorphs; homosexuallity is very common (double-digit percent) in a number of mammals and birds, inclusive of the rearing of chicks. Beyond vertebrates, there’s even more variation. As a biologist, these debates are bizarre, because all that matters is that the population persists over time, and individuals contribute what they want or can to that success. And being nice to each other sure smooths everyday life, increasing chances of success. We are all in it together, here on spaceship Earth.
(DIR) Post #B4FGeZKnKG0h4io8h6 by plsik@mastodon.social
2026-03-14T10:28:37Z
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@futurebird That’s right. I have a friend—we don’t see each other often, but we get along well. At one point, I realized he’s trans, but it doesn’t really matter; it’s just a personal curiosity. But then he started talking about the safety of the community queer center. Because of the neo-Nazis, it could be an easy target. I wish we didn’t have to deal with this crap at all.
(DIR) Post #B4FGgVZqGZLg08lqoC by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:29:00Z
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I can understand the fears that people have for their children. "be yourself" is good advice but being yourself can be dangerous. And that's often not fair. You might tell your teen daughter "you're not leaving the house dressed like that" you know she could be hurt. It's "better parenting" to make it clear why you are making such demands, but there is this practical impulse to keep young people safe. I've spoken to parents of trans kids filled with fear.
(DIR) Post #B4FGoRKFxNDf8HGLp2 by Taco_lad@aus.social
2026-03-14T10:30:23Z
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@futurebird while I am not a Christian any more, I do wonder why it is so difficult to accept that God might put a soul in the wrong shaped body as a test of compassion for other people.Do they attempt to help and alleviate the discomfort? Or do they vilify the person in the wrong body and in doing so condemn themselves?
(DIR) Post #B4FH01nqfvVtRyd7dA by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:32:32Z
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But, having seen decades of trans lives as an outsider I think it's better to still be yourself in the end. It's healthier. It's safer. That it is less safe to be a trans kid than a cis kid isn't the fault of trans kids. Like, we all knew that, right? But it's worth saying anyway I think. Even if we enter a more repressive world I will still know the same number of trans people. This is nothing new, and maybe we are painfully turning a corner.
(DIR) Post #B4FHBTwaO8N7ugB7p2 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:34:36Z
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It already exists in little pockets, it works better than the alternatives. It's spreading. Maybe things are going to get worse before they get better but I believe in and want the future where being trans is boring.
(DIR) Post #B4FHRiMaXqv3Ge561I by wmd@chaos.social
2026-03-14T10:37:28Z
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@futurebird I think there is an element of a fear of having to give some of their culture/identity, which gets tough. Patriarchy is deeply embedded in certain cultures and identities, often people want their kids to follow their 'lineage' or worse even be them or better thems. Being trans messes with that, it -can- destroy these notions and expectations of the patriarchal culture, I feel people are worries about giving up that bit of their identity/culture.
(DIR) Post #B4FHTl11eg8G4XyAXg by lionelb@expressional.social
2026-03-14T10:37:24Z
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@albertcardona @futurebird Diversity in all respects is a strength. It is also a joy. A population of Hegseth clones would be so mind-numbingly tedious that we would welcome its (inevitable) rapid demise.Imagine a world without railway map nerds. Hideous.
(DIR) Post #B4FHTmLygGUCDomPq4 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:37:55Z
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@lionelb @albertcardona "Hegseth clones"One is too many of that one.
(DIR) Post #B4FI3ynXtBspF8w7M0 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-14T10:44:27Z
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@wmd Patriarchy lets predators run wild. At this point I think it's basically designed to do that. You hear right wingers making so much noise about protecting children, but let that child be "imperfect" in any way ?So upset about the exploitation of the innocent, yet no one is innocent enough to be a victim worth listening to. "she's a disturbed woman with a long criminal history"Said the press secretory about one of the Epstein file accusers.
(DIR) Post #B4FIQKDIwoQm26dkI4 by wmd@chaos.social
2026-03-14T10:48:28Z
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@futurebird It's such a toxic culture :(It's very ingrained into the right and their identities I think, but also still elsewhere. I've seen enough 'lefties' who feel a lot about their kid following their parents footsteps, but also fear of straying from 'their path' will lead to unhappiness and being afraid for their children. Patriarchy is all they know, and the unknown scares them (helped along by misinformation).
(DIR) Post #B4FIZWCzigrnqCsXwW by PalmAndNeedle@norden.social
2026-03-14T10:50:07Z
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@futurebird yeah... I would love so much to be boring and normal
(DIR) Post #B4FKpHorBckDksEdSi by Tooden@aus.social
2026-03-14T11:15:21Z
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@futurebird Dawg, yes! If we ate going to clone any cis white, let it be Stephen King, or someone else who is a useful nice guy. @lionelb @albertcardona
(DIR) Post #B4FT3ozbRe00KNhfFY by aSweetGentleman@mstdn.social
2026-03-14T12:47:38Z
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@futurebird Thanks for being an ally. :trans_heart:
(DIR) Post #B4FVtOGeFkJIPMOTXE by slothrop@chaos.social
2026-03-14T13:19:22Z
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@futurebird Thanks for writing this ❤️I might add: I'm raising four children. There certainly are things that I worry about on their behalf: Will they have food to eat and air to breathe? Will they get to enjoy living in a functioning society? Will they be able to sustain themselves? And so on. Trans people (and LGBTQ folks more broadly) don't appear on my list of concerns. At all.
(DIR) Post #B4FhUoMDJVg7XC2jnU by RobotDiver@starlite.rodeo
2026-03-14T15:29:23Z
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@futurebird I sometimes wonder how my neighbours see us. My partner and I are a trans couple. We definitely got some looks when we first moved in, but a few people have gone out of their way to introduce themselves now. I think our garden has disarmed them a bit and now they seem more interested in the fact that I used to be a landscape designer than our genders. It feels really weird to know you are constantly being observed as an "other" though, when we are literally just ourselves. Trying to hide as someone you aren't is an exhausting way to live and I don't want any young person to have to go through decades of that like we did. My parents made being trans really difficult. I didn't come out until well after my mom died and my dad made it so difficult that I really don't feel like I got to finally be myself until he passed as well. I see so many parents making it hard for their kids every day without even realizing it. My former hairdresser told me her child had told her they were non-binary three times, but she said they would have to wait to figure it out until he was older. I'm not prepared to have a hard discussion with someone holding a pair of scissors, but every time you ignore or dismiss what your kids tell you is a hammer that will pound their hopes and lives into the ground and leave them feeling hopeless and confused. It's not the loud and dangerous transphobia that is the most violent. It's the quiet, nearly unspoken sanding away of another person's existence because they don't meet a parent's expectations and I don't think enough people realize that.
(DIR) Post #B4G0BQyvth9ifCcyCu by IngaLovinde@embracing.space
2026-03-14T18:58:45Z
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@futurebird > I've never once had someone say "how dare you misgender me"Because usually it goes like that: X: insistently on purpose misgenders Y, adding a bunch of transphobic shit.Y: "could you please not misgender me?"X: doubles down on misgendering, adds even more transphobic shit. Y: "COULD YOU PLEASE NOT"X: triples down. Y: "you're asshole", and leaves (if possible) X, later: "ah, these trans people, they always say "how dare you misgender me""
(DIR) Post #B4GPjbkQsCZGkoElJw by jeridansky@sfba.social
2026-03-14T23:45:05Z
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@futurebird This makes me think of the trans guy I had no idea was trans until his wife wrote a book entitled When My Boyfriend Was a Girl. I just knew him as a nice Cat Dad.
(DIR) Post #B4GRtk6GsHG5SiPcuW by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T00:09:17Z
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@futurebirdIn my experience, LGBTQ people and their allies want it to be illegal to express yourself in a way that offends them, including misgendering.Maybe it's different on your side of the pond.
(DIR) Post #B4HOplFgXpExAiBYy8 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-15T11:09:45Z
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@light With an online conversation it's hard to know if someone who disagrees with you is being sincere or not. "LGBTQ people and their allies want it to be illegal to express yourself"There are always limits to expression. If I decide I don't want to call you by your name, but I feel that "Sealion" is a better name for you, I could get in trouble at work or at school for doing that after you object... because it's rude.
(DIR) Post #B4HaXlUa6yUy9dL2Q4 by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T13:20:48Z
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@futurebirdI have to admit, I don't currently work and I haven't been in school for ages. I'm still rebuilding my life. So I can't really comment on that last point. But I reckon it's probably different in those circumstances than in society as a whole. But still, https://qoto.org/@light/116217402058880799
(DIR) Post #B4HaXrWvf9wQseTzua by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T13:20:48Z
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Yes, I sincerely believe in freedom of speech. Is there a problem with that? Does that make me a "sea lion"? What even is a "sea lion"? Someone who asks questions? What's wrong with asking questions? Curiosity and debate are good things.Do you also have this attitude with your students?@futurebird
(DIR) Post #B4HbEeOUNWYYajwDaK by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-15T13:28:42Z
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@light If you have a job and you boss is named "Jane" but you decide you'd rather call her "Debbie" since you think she looks more like a Debbie than a "Jane" and you also decide you'd rather only speak to her by singing... well is it "against free speech" if she fires you for being annoying and not treating her with respect?
(DIR) Post #B4HcM0oNWqFa6F7bvc by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T13:25:06Z
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@futurebirdAlso, it's not rude to state a fact so long as you're not rubbing it in.
(DIR) Post #B4HcM22axTDTucmTj6 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-15T13:41:13Z
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@light This isn't about "free speech" at all. You should treat all people with basic human respect. If you don't wish to do that you may find that people don't want to be around you or work with you.
(DIR) Post #B4HcMuVsQoj0r4tcrg by ehproque@neopaquita.es
2026-03-15T13:41:13Z
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@futurebird but they don't want it to be normal, they want to be bullying somebody
(DIR) Post #B4Hco4Nbr6iPH5ynmC by adriano@lile.cl
2026-03-15T13:37:39Z
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@light Just as a semi-disinterested observer: if I held *any* generosity or respect for your position, this disingenuous "well what does sealion actually mean? isn't it something incredibly harmless and positive?" made me lose it. No, a sealion is not somebody who just asks questions, and you know it.@futurebird
(DIR) Post #B4Hco5zDskOeG2aM2i by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-15T13:46:15Z
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@adriano @light It never feels good to be wrong. I should know. I want to think "This will sink in if they think about it. And it's easier for me to talk about it than someone more directly invested"But then I think about a friend who was with their girl scout troop on a trip and some jerk thought one of the girls "didn't look like a girl" and thought it was his duty to bring this up (and the child heard this!) because that's where this is going.
(DIR) Post #B4Hd0cR341jwN3ZX9M by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-15T13:48:35Z
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@adriano @light If you are wondering "well was it a trans kid?" Why. That is irrelevant. That is the wrong thing to be worried about here. Not all girls "look like girls" according to the whims of random men. Their opinions on "what is objectively a woman" are unimportant. But, in this case it was a cis girl. Just not the most conforming kind of little girl. She wanted to see the dinosaurs at the Natural History museum. Will she even remember the dinosaurs or will she remember the asshole?
(DIR) Post #B4Hd9l3aNWsDiTxInY by adriano@lile.cl
2026-03-15T13:50:12Z
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@futurebird @light In this moment where the USA government and several states are actually taking ID and rights away from trans and queer people it's a bit rich to have the gall to utter "In my experience, LGBTQ people and their allies want it to be illegal to express yourself in a way that offends them, including misgendering." Like, kudos, what a massive set of brass gonads.
(DIR) Post #B4HdQUjcJhf618b0me by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T13:53:03Z
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@futurebird That's fine. But police action backed up by violence is something entirely different and you know it.
(DIR) Post #B4HfLMmGfquJnaWC80 by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T14:14:41Z
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@futurebird I will ignore the dogpiling and consider your point.Is it rude to say that a girl doesn't look like a girl?Well, I assume it depends on the girl.I am a man, and I have been repeatedly referred to as a woman online.One (a transwoman) seemed to think I was actually a woman (specifically one who uses spinster.xyz). I was not offended. It seemed more funny than hateful.1/2
(DIR) Post #B4HfjXitd7tEhDTAUC by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-15T14:19:04Z
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@light "Is it rude to say that a girl doesn't look like a girl? Well, I assume it depends on the girl."Listen to yourself. What are you going to do? Make a femininity chart for children with allowed haircuts and clothing choices? "If you have less than six points on The Light Noc Social femininity scale then it is find to insult the child."Come on. Cut it out. Bruh. I'm done.
(DIR) Post #B4Hg17eJJLsf2dhtfU by independentpen@mas.to
2026-03-15T14:22:13Z
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@futurebird @light@noc.social what are you sub tooting here?
(DIR) Post #B4Hg1eQzPtpiisjDzE by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T14:22:05Z
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@futurebirdThat's disingenuous. I am NOT saying that femininity or masculinity should be regulated or officialised or anything that. I am saying it depends on the person being "misgendered" whether it is offensive to them or not.But you knew that. You don't actually care about dialogue. You just want to browbeat an unbeliever on the internet. Fuck you.
(DIR) Post #B4IEWQgrxlVnW20Imu by jrdepriest@infosec.exchange
2026-03-15T20:48:52Z
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@futurebird The best reaction my wife and I had to telling someone I was transgender was a heartfelt "is that all?"
(DIR) Post #B4IEqu82DqG8blTPoO by paninid@mastodon.world
2026-03-15T20:52:32Z
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@futurebird @wmd @jrdepriest It’s all projection.
(DIR) Post #B4IQFbxk00j30Ddsx6 by JoscelynTransient@chaosfem.tw
2026-03-15T23:00:16Z
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@futurebird I’ve definitely been there with parents that are wrestling with this fear too, more than any bigotry or biases (plenty of parents of trans kids that do have transphobia to work through too, but this is a thing I’ve seen too among some).With the way you framed it…it somehow brought to mind the way Ta-Nehisi Coates describes why his family resorted to physical punishment: fear of what the outside world would do to him. I remember that hitting like a pile of bricks when I read “Between the World and Me,” the lesson his family was teaching him before the world taught him that his body didn’t belong to himself under a system of racism.Makes me think about this parallel, how the current political powers are making it very clear that they do not think trans people’s, especially trans kids’, bodies belong to themselves. How it’s a lesson so many of us have to internalize and navigate to survive. And I can so easily see parents of trans kids wrestling with how to try to instill in them that their lives and bodies should belong to themselves but that there are violence shitheads who don’t.
(DIR) Post #B4IQx2VrA5YPnaJ8s4 by light@noc.social
2026-03-15T13:50:53Z
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@futurebird That's a silly example. A person's name is their prerogative. Calling someone by a name they don't want to be called by is just plain rude. This goes for both cis and trans people.That being said, people in power shouldn't punish those "underneath" them for personal reasons. But not all nouns are names. It's tyrannical to force someone to refer to a man as a "woman" or "she", or vice versa.
(DIR) Post #B4IQx3wppGjEFXwCYq by johnzajac@dice.camp
2026-03-15T14:12:11Z
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@light @futurebird You think this is a good take because a lot of people who cleared the way for fascists to take over told you that free speech was freedom from accountability and consequences.You can misgender and dead name anyone you want! You won't be arrested or even fined, nor should you be.But, someone might get sick of you being a little piece of shit and pick you up and throw you out. And that's their right! They should do that!And this is what we call "society". Welcome.
(DIR) Post #B4IQxCZlkOcr0cDPMG by johnzajac@dice.camp
2026-03-15T14:14:54Z
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@light @futurebird Btw if you want to change society so that you get to be a piece of shit but trans people don't get to exist in peace you aren't a "free speech advocate", you're just someone who prefers speech that is abusive and harmful and dramatically restricts and suppresses the expression and speech of others in service to abuse.The vast majority of people who face consequences for their abusive speech literally sought out victims and abused them at work or at home or in the street.
(DIR) Post #B4IRjbWgHoIUI4qogi by JessTheUnstill@infosec.exchange
2026-03-15T23:16:55Z
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@futurebird Being gay is a far bigger part of my life than being trans. Because I walk around holding my partner's hand. Or giving her a hug. Or we smile at one another and pay for food together. It's easy for people to tell we're a pair of women who are together.Trans? I'm in no way ashamed of it, and sometimes I have a trans pride something or another around. But most of the time? It's about as interesting of a part of me as where I went to college. Sure I still deal with the remaining body dysphoria, but so do cis people.Just leave us alone and we'll be your slightly quirky neighbors who are a bit more empathetic to the plights of both genders than average.
(DIR) Post #B4ISayLQB8RMPO232e by thomasjwebb@mastodon.social
2026-03-15T23:26:35Z
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@futurebird I like to say if me being trans/non-binary isn't the least interesting thing about me, either I'm doing something wrong or society is doing something very wrong. It's only a big deal because people make it so.
(DIR) Post #B4ISlXoTA7rjJ9ezku by dagda@netzsphaere.xyz
2026-03-15T23:28:34.227340Z
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@johnzajac @light @futurebird @taylan Freedom of speech literally means freedom from accountability and consequences tho. That's why it's federal law in many countries. Exactly for the state not to decide to impose "accountability and consequences" for you.Your ideology is an exact copy of Idi Amins views on thisIdi Amin (former Ugandan dictat…
(DIR) Post #B4ISuILA3i3xvV7kxc by dagda@netzsphaere.xyz
2026-03-15T23:30:09.227571Z
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@meso @johnzajac @taylan @light @futurebird the quote goes immensely hard I must admit
(DIR) Post #B4ITAFt2wroYwzaHaK by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-15T23:32:58Z
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@dagda Get some new material. No one believes y'all care about "free speech" anymore.
(DIR) Post #B4ITEi9vm5JZnHbfDk by JessTheUnstill@infosec.exchange
2026-03-15T23:33:46Z
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@futurebird Yeah, wanting to try being another gender out is a risky thing for your personal and social safety. But I guarantee you that trans kids havent come to that decision on a whim. This isn't dating a sketchy significant other. Or even choosing a "bad" major in college. This is about a kid choosing Who They Are.Countless kids movies are full of "be who you are" narratives. But somehow the cishets want to say "be who you are, but not That".
(DIR) Post #B4ITLwuBLcVNYSgvVg by dagda@netzsphaere.xyz
2026-03-15T23:35:08.869277Z
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@futurebird who's y'all?
(DIR) Post #B4IVz5V5WZaXPlkDD6 by dagda@netzsphaere.xyz
2026-03-16T00:04:38.059752Z
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@futurebird @johnzajac @light @taylan you can't even elaborate because your Trump derangement syndrome automatically associates statement A to also support policy B, C, D, E and F.So yeah, everyone is MAGA, your neighbor is MAGA because he said something vaguely resembling something Trump said, just as your janitor, your student, your taxi driver, your doctor.I didn't even make a political statement or laid out how to solve addressing trans people in interactions in general (I personally just use the names and suggested pronouns), I mainly came here to observe Taylans curious autism on this topic and pointed out an intellectual flaw I saw presented by John.Neither I, Taylan or light even live in the United states, and as for Taylan I know he voted a social democratic party in Europe while I voted socialist.And for the record I think barely anyone on the American Right believes in free speech, they only do when convenient, just as you guys. I just assume you are not happy with this situation, but don't ever consider that persecuting perception (which pronouns ultimately are) or dissident thought could backfire.
(DIR) Post #B4IZuXykc9uG6ji21A by tlariv@mastodon.cloud
2026-03-16T00:48:33Z
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@futurebirdThe thing that I wish transphobes could understand is how much trans folks have to go through – especially in this society – just to get their outward selves to match who they are. The counseling, the HRT, the voice training, the persecution and danger of violence. Nobody's doing all that to win the 50m girls' freestyle at the state swim meet.
(DIR) Post #B4Ibo7G9F9opPSuLbM by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T00:56:59Z
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@taylan From the snippet you included and your comments, it looks like you misinterpreted that decision. As for the details of a variety of hate speech accusations and convictions- I am not gonna dig in to each. Any law can be misapplied in a particular case - but that doesn’t invalidate the rule. I don’t know if these are examples or not. That is beside the point. In this discussion, common courtesy avoids any risk of falling afoul of hate speech laws.
(DIR) Post #B4IdT0JE5bZTgGPNWi by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T01:25:29Z
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@taylan Stating an opinion is not harassment. Keep up. We’ve been over this already.
(DIR) Post #B4Ifq10FsJMyOydQw4 by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T01:33:31Z
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@taylan It would depend on the circumstances. If just expressing your opinion, then it is not harassment. There are situations where it could tip into harassment. That would be for a court or HR department to determine based on the circumstances. As an aside, I believe “gender critical” is not a gender I have heard before. Is that like when your gender is so fragile it can explode with the slightest provocation?
(DIR) Post #B4Ii91NsskICzhsUfw by futurebird@sauropods.win
2026-03-16T02:20:49Z
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@celesteh @Taco_lad Now that I think about it more it's odd.
(DIR) Post #B4Ijav1cDcS9KmKPpY by johnzajac@dice.camp
2026-03-16T02:07:57Z
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@taylan @light @futurebird You're relying on me being a gormless liberal who is bamboozled by edge cases, lies, and extremist propaganda, and that's a bad assumption. I understand the difference between your ideology of aggressive eliminationism and what you call a "gender ideology" which is just people trying to live their lives how they choose to live them.To that point, trans people's right to live free of defamatory abuse and your right to defame and abuse them are not equivalent.
(DIR) Post #B4Ijaw7g8YtgjsAlv6 by johnzajac@dice.camp
2026-03-16T02:10:59Z
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@taylan @light @futurebird Again - I'm not a ridiculous liberal who is confused about what free speech is, or that it comes with responsibility, just like any freedom does. You're an enemy of freedom using the vernacular of freedom to destroy it anywhere you can find it. Your particular burning cross is erasing trans people; the KKK wants to erase the free Black person; the Christofascist wants to erase women and openly queer people. You are all the same creature in different skins.
(DIR) Post #B4IjaxHHqKB2JxfxXE by johnzajac@dice.camp
2026-03-16T02:14:28Z
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@taylan @light @futurebird It is not contradictory to say that protecting freedom of speech and expression means suppressing speech and expression that only exists to destroy freedom of speech and expression, any more than it is contradictory for someone who doesn't believe in killing to protect themselves with ultimate force from someone trying to kill them.After all, to allow bullies the freedom to destroy freedom is suicide, not principle.At least to *grown* people, it is.
(DIR) Post #B4IkSQxmCisbji3CV6 by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T02:23:54Z
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@taylan I must admit that “disagreeing with gender identity” as an assertion confuses me, however. It would seem to mean that you don’t think people think of themselves as “male” or “female” - for example. It seems from your profile that you are “TERF” adjacent- but that is certainly not disagreeing with gender identity - so that doesn’t help.
(DIR) Post #B4IkabVGtqKSk7c5xY by johnzajac@dice.camp
2026-03-16T02:41:52Z
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@taylan @light @futurebird I know that's all you hear. I'm arguing with you to sharpen my ability to dismantle your arguments for third parties, not to persuade you not to be a fool and a bully. I don't have the power for that lol lmaoOnly you can decide not to dedicate your life to polishing your boot and then looking for necks of people weaker than you to stomp on.
(DIR) Post #B4IkvUQ4QsdQr08j8y by Taco_lad@aus.social
2026-03-16T02:51:57Z
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@futurebird @celesteh if there were a Christian G_d, They'd have made *everyone* to test other people. How you treat people who are in distress, showing compassion and empathy... Same for everyone in our LGBTQIA+ collective. I view it the same for myself - if I tell someone what I am and they vilify me, that's not on me, but if there was a G_d, that would be a judgement on them. Do unto others etc.
(DIR) Post #B4Il4b9clKC0Lbn4S0 by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T02:47:34Z
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@taylan FYI - I just read through the Canadian case you linked. As suspected, your summary got it wrong. It is a clearly reasoned opinion that distinguishes carefully between expressions of opinion and harassment. The passage you point to establishes a baseline for the discussion. It allows for a discussion about whether a statement is an opinion/belief or not. This sets up for a discussion of the harassing behaviors at issue in the case by à school official who used his position to create a hostile work environment for trans employees.
(DIR) Post #B4ImBGqMm6ojKvWoam by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T02:57:13Z
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@taylan “Gender identity ideology is the belief system that every human being has a 'gender identity' or 'gender' or 'true gender' that is an aspect of their personal essence. It's a deeply sexist, gender essentialist concept, as it makes 'being a woman' or 'being a man' a core component of a person's identity rather than simply acknowledging their sex as an incidental fact about their body, like being tall or short, or having various shades of skin color.” That, you may be surprised to read, doesn’t clear up your position at all. It is also a strawman with the odd feature that maps right onto the point of the original post that started all of this… that being trans is an incidental and boring part of an individual only made dramatic by the bigots who rail against people identifying how they wish and won’t let them be who they are.
(DIR) Post #B4IuIs8hJAdmfREpVI by raphaelmorgan@disabled.social
2026-03-16T04:37:01Z
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@futurebird @wmd I'm pretty sure every single trans person I've ever met, even the ones who hate children, want to protect children more than any of these fuckersI desperately wish we could protect children from being trafficked and abused, but the only people who have the power to "protect children" are """protecting""" them from me
(DIR) Post #B4J1qsSTKPG3BJeKky by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T05:37:51Z
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@taylan "I'm not sure I would call it incidental." You just railed against "gender existentialism" ( for cisgendered folks it is "an incidental fact"), but need to elevate someone's perception of their own gender to something more than incidental. Which is it? If my perception of myself as male is just like my perception of myself as short or bald, then a trans woman's perception of herself as female is just like her being tall or having red hair.Again, "not believing in gender identity" is an incoherent claim.It echoes the "I don't see race" claims that so many racists trot out on the regular. Re-read that court decision. Slowly this time. "Not believing" that trans people should perceive themselves the way they do is like not believing in climate change. Your denial of them doesn't change the reality on the ground. They exist. They have the perceptions they have. They have a right to that perception. Rather than saying to a trans woman - "my bias make me think you should not have the same right to claim to be a woman that I have [for reasons]" - you construct a fiction about a nefarious movement bent on suppression. You then point to negative reactions you get to your bigotry as proof. A perfect circle. Have a nice day.
(DIR) Post #B4J5TOfCL0SRvmf3Am by Gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz
2026-03-16T06:42:18.122726Z
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@taylan I see you run into someone who doesn't appear know the difference between a subjective perception and a reality claim.
(DIR) Post #B4JmhMah8X21aOSdfM by johnzajac@dice.camp
2026-03-16T02:32:26Z
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@dagda @taylan @light @futurebird You literally want the right to verbally abuse people into not expressing themselves.But wait! You *have* that right. That's why you're even on here writing anything at all.Freedom of speech, everyone.But that's not *all* you want. You also want *back* what you lost: the *privilege* to do that anywhere and everywhere, and have the powers-that-be back you up with guns and cash.That some small amount of that power was lost is an unforgivable offense.
(DIR) Post #B4JmhO7LSck8JwkECG by dagda@netzsphaere.xyz
2026-03-16T14:46:36.379712Z
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@johnzajac @taylan @light @futurebird > You literally want the right to verbally abuse people into not expressing themselves.No I don't, I use suggested pronouns and names when talking with or about trans people> But wait! You *have* that right. That's why you're even on here writing anything at all.Freedom of speech, everyone.I didn't even write anything particular on the topic at hand, I just pointed out your flawed definition of free speech. Taylan has compiled some sources that there are in fact countries that will legally punish you for talking about transgenderism on an abstract, conceptual level (not specific social interactions with trans people) in a way that the government doesn't approve of. If these are "fringe edge cases" what's stopping the right wing and fence sitters from calling repression against liberals and anti-fascists the same way?Either way looking at your profile I noticed how you are literally an ameriKKKan theater kid so I apologize for not recognizing earlier that you are incapable of formulating reasonable or independent thoughts
(DIR) Post #B4JtacerhSGJ4O90ts by Pi_rat@freesoftwareextremist.com
2026-03-16T16:03:50.631117Z
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@dagda @johnzajac @taylan @light @futurebird Do not fault them for it, it takes exceedingly rare personality to actually stand for freedom.
(DIR) Post #B4L16TQZX8OWGbhGeO by icastico@c.im
2026-03-16T14:11:31Z
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@taylan A clearer explanation. Lots of fallacies support it, but clearer at least. The example of “short man” may be informative. I claim I am a short man. That should be an easily verifiable fact about me. Correct? You should be able to use my statement to predict my height. So how tall am I? What objective criteria are you using to decide? If you decide my height falls on one side or the other of your arbitrary line, does that make me a tall man no matter my personal experiences with height and how it impacts my life? Sex works the same way as height - except it is multidimensional. More complex. People can easily pretend that there is a natural dichotomy in sex. That sex is an easily verifiable fact about a person. That is scientifically naive. Gender, of course, is much closer to race than height. It is a social construct that is anchored in perceptions of physical features. Those perceptions by the self and others impact a person’s interactions with the world. When members of society use those perceptions to place limits on a person we call it discrimination. It is discrimination based on a false confidence that we know the underlying scientific fact of the person. That their race is a physical fact. But science cannot define race based on physical characteristics. Race is a perception that the person has of themself or others. So is gender. To eliminate discrimination based on gender requires that discrimination based on perceptions be sanctioned. Societies have done this to various extent. This includes recognition of discrimination based on gender which has given women protection to their rights (yes, thank you feminists). This progress occurs because society says “your false perceptions of this person do not give you the right to treat them differently than others. You cannot limit their access to life because of how you perceive them.” So, your denial of “gender” undercuts feminism at its core. Women are not discriminated against because of physical characteristics. They are discriminated against based on false perceptions of their potential. The position you are taking is the same one a misogynist takes to justify discrimination against women. They are just being scientists, see. Women who deny the reality of their sex are delusional. Their belief in equality is irrational. Laws sanction these misogynistic ideas when they lead to behavior. You are advocating for excluding à group of people from these protection because you have the same false confidence in your ability to know a person’s true nature that à racist or misogynist has. Your “belief” is irrelevant in the discussion. It is rooted is a misunderstanding of the issue at hand. Society doesn’t sanction your belief. They sanction your actions. No one is forcing you to believe anything. The Canadian court gets this. Bigots aren’t being oppressed for their beliefs. They are being sanctioned for their behavior.
(DIR) Post #B4LzJSazvqIqhXb91M by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T15:08:04Z
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@taylan That’s a mess. It would take awhile to show how many ways it’s a mess, so I will focus on the one issue you are using as a main pillar of bigotry - false appeals to science. Decision point fallacy: not relevant here. Natural language categories like “short man” or “man” are not based on clearly defined decision points and I never claimed they were. These kinds of categories are based on analogic reasoning - you compare the example in front of you to a stereotype and deem the example close enough or too far away to determine if it is a member of the category. This works well for the majority of cases (as you mention). Your example of. 6ft tall man not being short shows this. I am 5’7” - at the 16th percentile for US males. This makes me a marginal case of “short man” as I am 1SD below the mean. This makes me hard to “correctly” categorize as “short” or not. If I try to scientifically define things a decision point can be defined and if consistently applied everyone can say “scientifically” that I am short or not. But you won’t get general agreement. Some people will perceive me as short. Some won’t. This is a single dimension case. The word “man” works the same way. You hold a stereotype in your head and compare to the case in front of you. You will get it right most of the time. Tellingly, the features you cite for how you personally would make your decision are gender markers, not sex markers. That is appropriate and works for most cases. The issue of trans rights, however, is about rights for those on the margin. You hope to apply a scientific definition to clarify these edge cases and put them in or out of the “man” box. But science will fail you here. It turns out “man” can’t be scientifically defined in a way that gets rid of edge cases. This is true for most categories in biology. Nature doesn’t cooperate with our attempts to make it neat and tidy. Individuals who are not easily put in or out of the “man” box deserve protection from discrimination based on their “sex”. Their experience in life will see this discrimination or not, however, based on their perceived gender. That is the territory on which society parses people into “man” and “woman.” (As you did, people will use gender markers not sex to make their decisions). People use stereotype thinking to place a person in one category or another. They may try to force their perception on the individual in ways that are discriminatory. There are laws to protect people from that discrimination. Some outlaw hate speech. Appropriately.
(DIR) Post #B4LzSBfIFWBwnWliKG by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T16:13:44Z
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@taylan "make questionable analogies to race" Bigots never like to admit that their reasoning mirrors racism. The analogy between racism and gender discrimination is tight. Both are grounded in stereotyped categorization and use of "scientific" categorization to justify bias. Both try to anchor their assertions to "physical facts" about the person and use that to pretend that they are "only being rational." It is sadly consistent. "Bigot" is, like "man" or "short," a natural language category, There are no clear boundaries that place marginal cases inside or outside the bigot box. Your posts, however, easily fall into examples of bigotry because they are so closely analogous to the thinking of racism - which is the prototype of bigotry in our society. There are not laws against being a bigot. There are laws against discrimination against others based on your bigotry. These don't suppress your ability to express your opinion. They provide consequences for harassment and other discriminatory acts. No one is forcing you to change your beliefs. Society, however, has recognized that bigotry can lead to harmful actions and consequences. Those that perpetrate those can be held accountable.
(DIR) Post #B4M0RulJC5wKKQ13WS by Gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz
2026-03-17T16:30:05.833244Z
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@taylan and you would be rightful to ask why the distinction even matters at that point Because a convincing lie doesn't become a truth.Neither does a convincing forgery become the real thing. Truth matters.
(DIR) Post #B4M64F20mTGXy3vKpk by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T16:59:50Z
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@taylan We are discussing bigotry in good faith. That is the topic.
(DIR) Post #B4M7Dvw0jkbhaeIo6K by dagda@netzsphaere.xyz
2026-03-17T17:46:02.410773Z
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@taylan @Gnomeshatecheese CAIS mentionedFun fact: I knew an individual with XY CAIS once, this person was so fucking annoyed at trans activism for constantly using Intersex as an unilateral discourse tool for their gain, said some polemic stuff about the T a biological women wouldn't have ever been able to get away with. Really shows how little political logic is behind the LGBTIQ+ acronym. Barely anyone can even properly describe the 100+ intersex conditions (of which almost all point to variance within the sex binary, not a spectrum of sex) but trans activists will spread misinformation about them in every second sentence regardless
(DIR) Post #B4M8HTBlegNHY5vGFM by Gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz
2026-03-17T17:57:53.176084Z
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@taylan I get that you're trying to make a nuanced argument that takes every detail into account. But I do think there's a general principle here that can be applied, and should be applied. Namely, that "is" and "is not" are not just a meaningful, but profoundly important distinction. If I acquire a laboriously crafted facsimile of an old, rare book, correct to the last detail, including using old paper, leather and thread, so well made that there is indeed "very little difference" between the facsimile and the real one, there will still be a difference. And the facsimile will be a facsimile, and the real one will be the real one. Some people might not care. Others might be fooled and not be able to tell the difference. But that wouldn't change the fact of one being real and one a copy. I think that alone is important, and I think leaving that principle out of discussions does a disservice in the long run. It also opens the door for obfuscation of the kind you're describing.But if we set the difference between "is" and "is not" as our compass point from the get go, we can cut through a lot of confusion.
(DIR) Post #B4M94hxpVgGTYxsjsu by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T17:47:47Z
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@taylan A transwoman claims to be a woman. You call her out on that claim and say that she doesn't belong in that box. She is not worthy of claiming that title. She does not have the right to claim womanhood. You are claiming her to be "inferior" in her womanhood. If you take this further and exclude her from activities that she wishes to participate in as a woman, you are using your bias to discriminate against her. To take away her rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. The person doing this would be doing this based on the view that her "inferior womanhood" justifies exclusion from those activities. Sports is a commonly used example. Transwomen are assumed, based on no evidence and largely flawed reasoning, to have an unfair advantage in their sport due to their former status as "male." This is justified by saying that "men" shouldn't participate in women's sports. It is obvious and reasonable says the bigoted view. This person is clearly a man. "It's unfair" or "its dangerous." The more troublesome common example is which prison the transwoman convicted of a crime should be placed in. The danger to her is ignored based on the claim that she is obviously a man. The stance you are taking is one that is used to justify discrimination. To take away the rights of another individual. It is not, no matter how hard you affirm otherwise, based in science or fact. It is a social concept that is used primarily to harm vulnerable individuals. The vulnerable population that is fighting for recognition and rights has to fight against the "reasonable" arguments you are putting forward just as those fighting racists have to fight against the flawed arguments of "racial science" like "The Bell Curve." Your speech as speech, your arguments as arguments do not constitute sanctioned behaviors. But they are the foundation upon which bigots act in discriminatory ways.
(DIR) Post #B4MBXToRP4qpymKzIG by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T18:14:10Z
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@taylan I love that you are making my point for me. True scotsman-like. So, let's say that you flip this around and use the example of a person in 1942 in the United States claiming to be an American and NOT Japanese. Importantly, their parents were born in Japan. They have physical features that conform with the more commonly cited physical features associated with people from Japan. Racists will use their heritage, their "bloodline," and their physical appearance to say that they are Japanese. What objective evidence will they have to muster to convince you that they are American and not Japanese? How will they avoid the internment camp?
(DIR) Post #B4MBXZ5zlErcMfaZqi by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T18:31:42Z
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@taylan Arguments they will make to prove they are actually American. Ever since I was young, I have considered myself American. My self-image is built upon a foundation of being American. I never felt comfortable playing out the roles that are expected of people who are Japanese. American habits and interests have always felt more natural to me. It is who I am. Being American isn't about how I look. It's not about my body or my face.
(DIR) Post #B4MEQ14SALfKfpxZVw by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T18:58:54Z
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@taylan "You're making a trivial mistake: Conflating the accurate recognition of a fact about a person, with a decision to mistreat the person on the basis of that fact.The person in your example is clearly of Japanese ethnicity. The problem is not the correct recognition of this fact; it's that the government at the time decided that anyone of Japanese ethnicity should be incarcerated."What the fuck do you base that upon? Maybe their parents are Korean, for example. Are their parents Japanese or Korean in that case? Is this person 'really' Korean and not Japanese or American? Are you going to go into the physical differences between Koreans and the Japanese to make your case? Ethnicity is certainly not a biologically determined category. Being Japanese is no more rooted in biology than being American. There is not factual basis to make the determination upon unless you subscribe to a racist framing of the question. Your trans-Japanese example only works in a racist framing.
(DIR) Post #B4MEqR3MBe3kmm2pDU by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T19:06:47Z
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@taylan "(And all of that is leaving aside the fact that there's no such thing as a "biological American" while there *is* a thing such as being biologically a man i.e. fully grown homo sapiens of the male sex.)" And yet you use "trans-Japanese" to refute my point - as if being Japanese is biological while being American is not. You use it to try and avoid the logical consequences of your train of thought. To avoid acknowledging the parallels between how you are thinking about the issue of trans rights and how racists think about racial discrimination.
(DIR) Post #B4MHtFtCRx1stQKWDw by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T19:23:12Z
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@taylan Now DNA determines ethnicity?I am not trying to justify discriminatory actions. I am highlighting the cognitive gymnastics that bigots use to justify those actions. None of those put in internment camps in 1942 belong there. But the decision making process used to put people in the camps was built upon a foundation of racial science. The same kind of "obvious' facts about trans women are used to discriminate against them and put them in danger. The line of thinking you are advocating is the foundation for discriminatory actions by many. It is no more valid than the racial science used to justify the Japanese internment. And, again, making the argument is not sanctioned and is not, in itself, discrimination. But it is the conceptual foundation that is used to discriminate and harm the trans community. That is why use of these arguments CAN tip into discriminatory territory - as when a school board trustee creates a hostile work environment for school employees or children. Or when a co-worker claims "free speech" as the justification for misgendering a co-worker. And the distinction you are making, linguistically, is trivial. To die on the hill of "transwomen are a type of man" without recognizing that it is just as coherent to say "transwomen are a type of woman" has to be rooted in animus as far as I can tell. You have yet to show me otherwise.
(DIR) Post #B4MJfnuxKuxeHfrhXE by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T19:58:44Z
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@taylan "No, it wasn't. It was based on the worry that they may be loyal to Imperial Japan, due to their Japanese heritage. This entire analogy is really nonsensical." It is only nonsensical because you are stuck in a racist framing. WHY was there a worry that they may be loyal to Imperial Japan. What was it about them that raised that fear? Their ancestry? It was racism. Really. That simple. The idea that their bloodline predicted their loyalty was the justification. It is not really up for dispute. Man: dictionary definition will work - "a human being of either sex; a person."goodwill to all men" ;^).
(DIR) Post #B4MKwIHuHwbz3y1jsW by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T20:14:15Z
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@taylan "And your solution to this is not to say "their bloodline does not, in fact, determine their loyalty" but instead to deny that their bloodline is Japanese?" No. It is to deny that their bloodline determines whether or not they are Japanese. Those "Korean" parents born in Japan are just as Japanese (or American) as anyone else, unless you hold to the racist frame that bloodline determines the answer to the question. Same for their child raised in America. His bloodline doesn't determine if he is Japanese or not.
(DIR) Post #B4MKwNfUHhRdkY68pM by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T20:15:55Z
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@taylan https://youtu.be/nGy9uomagO4
(DIR) Post #B4MLvjouXRFk7LlNdw by Gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz
2026-03-17T20:30:49.575496Z
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@taylan It's possible they have to make that comparison, because otherwise calling a man a man could not be construed as dehumanisation. If they were to admit that there's nothing devaluing in saying a man pretending not to be a man is still a man, their entire case for forcing other people to go along with the pretence would fall apart. The only way disagreeing with TWAW and TMAM is bad, is if it's somehow bad to state honestly what sex a person is, and that can only be true if the statement "you are a man" is interpreted as fundamentally expressing an inferiority. In other words, it must be construed as a declaration of inferiority, in order for them to hang on to their idea that saying TWAM is bad. I suspect that as long as the person you're talking to wants to hang on to the idea that TWAW and that must not be questioned, there will be no way you can convince them that what you're saying is not the same as racism.
(DIR) Post #B4MMRzDqoByP9Zo1Y0 by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T20:25:16Z
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@taylan When did I say that person was Japanese? You made the assumption based on 'parents born in Japan' and 'physical traits coherent with those associated with Japan.' I never said the person was Japanese. I said the racists would claim it, however.
(DIR) Post #B4MQo6Gjgq3VCAxIbw by SecondUniverse@autistics.life
2026-03-17T21:25:21Z
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@futurebird You want trans to be boring? Well, I'm not entertainment, and don't want to be measured as such. Being trans can and should be a magical and wonderful journey to take in life, while at the same time it is just part of the background.
(DIR) Post #B4MUyCXLdlS5LbnW8e by nicholas@aklp.club
2026-03-17T22:11:57.810783Z
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your DNA can reveal your ancestry. I thought this is widely known.New ivy-league memo dropped. Paola Ramos has a masters in public policy from Harvard and is very confident genes are just a racist fever dream.
(DIR) Post #B4N75cF6GJbbMEE0R6 by icastico@c.im
2026-03-17T22:22:59Z
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@taylan Your reading / misunderstanding of the argument should not be confused with the substance of the argument. How you are boiling down the argument is far from the argument being made. The racist framing that was used at the time justified internment based on invalid conceptualization of the victims. It was thought justifiable to put them in an internment camp because they were "Japanese by birth" - their bloodline / ancestry determined their loyalty. Their actual loyalty, opinion, ethnic identify, national pride, whatever, did not matter. People with a racist framing decided they were a threat because of how they conceptualized the category. That is how bigotry works. "No, because the fundamental problem is still not the identification of people as members of a category." So, then, ask yourself why you care if transwomen are included in the category "women"? What is the point? What action / decision changes based on whether they are a type of man or a type of woman? Why do you want to convince others that transwomen are men? Why do you care who other people include in the category "women"? Bigotry is about caring which category people are in. If I want to treat you differently based on your membership in the out group, I need to place you in the out group. If you are in the in group, I treat you differently. If my "reasons" for making that determination are "scientific" - "obvious" or "common sense" then my decision to place you in the out group (and all that flows from that decision) are easier to justify to others who do not think as hard about the topic. I can present "facts and data" in an appropriate argument and they will not oppose my actions. It will just make sense to them like it makes sense to me.
(DIR) Post #B4NGjlQiQF9f1RsQjI by Gnomeshatecheese@spinster.xyz
2026-03-18T07:07:18.880192Z
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@nicholas @taylan Wha..??So humans are not evolved, but created as they are by some deity, because humans aren't genetically diverse, therefore there can not have been evolution through gradual genetic change... And this woman posted this clip herself on the Internet? Really??As in she actually thought this made her look good?? I'm so thrown off by this that I'm barely managing to restrain myself from using an unhinged number of punctuation marks.