Post B0jp88AFZ0cKu4iDaq by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
(DIR) More posts by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
(DIR) Post #B0fKJBpgOJIqFq2tmq by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-11-27T06:22:26Z
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The Autumn Budget raised the overall tax take to a record level in terms of proportion of GDP (although as noted yesterday still mid-range in relation to OECD countries)... but what this emphasises is something that has become clear across the UK: we pay too much for what we get.In the public sector we have a growing level of taxation but have still major crises (driven by austerity); and for years the UK's private sector (e.g energy) has also been over-priced...#economics #politics
(DIR) Post #B0fKJDIQwttYnIVNEu by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-27T08:43:44Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 Too much? Do my eyes deceive me? ;) Jokes aside, given the current level of public services in the UK, how high would a fair tax be today? And do you have a theoretical maximum for the tax level if things worked exactly the way you wanted?
(DIR) Post #B0fOPO4qB9kBmgLXRw by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-11-27T09:29:39Z
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@h4890 That's an excellent Q. but one that is really difficult to answer; certainly the current tax levels are not an outlier in EU terms & the problem likes not so much in the money raised by how it is spent (although of course here the national debt is a key factor).... but broadly speaking with VG public services I would have no real problem with a 50% tax take, provided it was progressive & redistributive without being punitive at medium to high levels...
(DIR) Post #B0fUelnwqHJ5RVABea by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-27T10:39:42Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 When you say 50% are you thinking only income tax then, or are you thinking a kind of "total" income tax, where the tax is levied at someones total income, regardless of source (capital, rent, work)? Or would you think that that would be too draconian and would lead to everyone above a certain nr just fleeing the country?
(DIR) Post #B0fdLYBKAQ4tHF0WjA by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-11-27T12:17:01Z
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@h4890 I was thinking of overall tax take, which would also inlace things like VAT, duties etc. in a complex arrangement.... certainly 50% income tax rates have been acceptable before (indeed much higher in the past), provided they are only over a certain level of income.The key issue is getting the rich to understand that their wealth is not completely their own doing, and that their fortune is linked to social context (and of course, luck)... justifying their 'contribution'
(DIR) Post #B0flweBTc17UF1HLjU by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-27T13:53:25Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 Well, that key issue, I think is a tough one to solve, since you would have a very hard time arguing that I am not the sole reason for my wealth. ;) Money is also a very liquid asset, so tax levels aside, as long as we don't have a one world government, there will always be places to go to for the rich and wealthy. Another strategy is to just hide in plain sight, since the tax law is so complex, there will always be holes in it. And finally... you can do like the Wallenbergs
(DIR) Post #B0fm3UclYOskcRJ88O by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-27T13:54:39Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 of sweden, and move your wealth to a tax free non-profit. The way to take out wealth is naturally to buy things for the non-profit, and to hire "money mgmt services" from companies belonging to the same family. The core wealth, remains untaxed, but very much under control of the family, the the non-profit shell. This has worked beautifully for 5-6 generations.
(DIR) Post #B0fmL7dFmDiIWSwS8m by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-11-27T13:57:49Z
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@h4890 yes such arrangements are also made in a similar fashion in the UK... I agree the issue is complex & in the end an issue for tax law, which would bring us back to our agreement on tax simplification (accepting a slight difference on exactly *how* simple the tax system should be)
(DIR) Post #B0hJjRWUxtu2oDwlfM by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-28T07:46:41Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 I think that makes perfect sense.
(DIR) Post #B0jdnUkpHSuNO6mIPA by stuartb@social.teamb.space
2025-11-29T10:19:26Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 Mostly, the problem is that these latest tax measures are being aimed at the wrong people.People at the bottom of the range, those who are most likely working part time and needing top-ups from the government to barely get by, are going to be dragged into paying taxes because of the threshold freeze, which will severely impact them, while those at the top will barely notice, it will be little more than a rounding error to them.Proportionally, those at the bottom are being asked to payn more, again, than those at the top.maybe if thoe at the top were being asked to pay more, they might ask for better value for money.But not like they do at the moment, where they are demanding cuts to the benefits system, which largely wouldn't be neccesary if they were to pay their workers a decent wage.
(DIR) Post #B0jdnWKJR0t8GSO9M8 by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T10:40:55Z
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@stuartb @ChrisMayLA6 This is the cruel irony of modern socialism. It's the worker who gets punished, while believing that he will be rewarded. Excellent manipulation by the socialist leaders! The rich will just move away, which means that it is impossible to tax them. Sweden lost hundred of billions by chasing away billionaires in the 70s, and is a much porer country today for it.
(DIR) Post #B0jdnqQMiDc6b1NGZE by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T10:41:03Z
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@stuartb @ChrisMayLA6 A populist socialist can only punish the middle classes. But that was lies ruin. Business activity will decline, people will slowly move away, work less, and tax revenues will decrease. For a beautiful example of this damage, look no further than sweden. After ww2, the richest country in europe. Fast forward to today, and socialism has pushed sweden down to the EU average. The "blessing" is that this happens at a
(DIR) Post #B0jdr0HcVt4u2en39E by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T10:41:36Z
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@stuartb @ChrisMayLA6 glacial scale, so every generation think they win, but when you zoom out, you see more pro capitalist countries overtaking sweden. I highly recommend Johan Norbergs book, the capitalist manifesto, if you would like to follow this argument and history, with a wealth of data and facts, supporting it.
(DIR) Post #B0jjhDT7EcpVlTspNY by stuartb@social.teamb.space
2025-11-29T11:46:44Z
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@h4890 @ChrisMayLA6 If the ultra wealthy aren't paying their fair way, then we lose nothing by making them move away.It should be noted, however, that most of the places they would be liable to go have higher tax rates than the UK, which are also more stringently enforced.Meaning that they likely won't gain much, if anything, if they move.
(DIR) Post #B0jk5WCvDSJEpetfrU by stuartb@social.teamb.space
2025-11-29T11:51:25Z
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@h4890 @ChrisMayLA6 re: Sweden being the richest country in Europe post WWII - just remind me again how much money they had to invest to rebuild after being destroyed by the best part of a decade of warfare.it's like the US became the richest country in the world, because their entire home country was untouched by the war, but they also simutaneously charged their "Allies" extortionate amounts for military supplies, something Sweden wasn't able to do.
(DIR) Post #B0jp88AFZ0cKu4iDaq by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-11-29T12:47:56Z
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@h4890 @stuartb Similarly, the shift in the UK's economic standard has been glacial; so glacial that our political class still think we are a major power & have an arrogant entitlement that merely antagonises voters....
(DIR) Post #B0kXAswP13nUXbMJDE by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T21:01:28Z
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@stuartb @ChrisMayLA6 Oh Stuart, let me ensure you that there are plenty of places for them to go, with much lower of zero taxes. Why do you think there are no places for the to go? This is a genuine question from someone who is not new to the game of tax evation/tax planning. As for taking their stuff, you must keep in mind that they can take their companies as well and job opportunities. The swedish bank Nordea moved HQ to finland, resulting in 1000 lost jobs or so.
(DIR) Post #B0kXFBmitfhY8tsqh6 by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T21:02:15Z
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@stuartb @ChrisMayLA6 So you see, that by chasing away the rich, the country loses a lot. But there is one escape for the argument, and that is if you would rather prefer a land without rich people, but a lower standard of living. If that is what you prefer, then you do have an iron clad argument.
(DIR) Post #B0kXOkLxk3e5xcvLoO by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T21:03:59Z
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@stuartb @ChrisMayLA6 Stuart... this is line of reasoning is actually just supporting my argument. Yes, sweden was not razed to the ground, and was the richest country in europe. _Despite that fact_, sweden is now an average country, which means that plenty of countries, who did not adopt the socialist route, grew and surpassed sweden. So this only serves to show again, how socialism has destryoed swedn, and how countries that were bombed to pieces managed to overtake it.
(DIR) Post #B0kXaTCtJjMOG1Gs6a by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T21:06:05Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @stuartb I agree with this. The pace is so glacial that politicians tend to live in the past (see sweden as a prime example), _and_ the voters also do not realize it until it is way too late. If sweden would have stopped immigration 15 years ago, and would have built new nuclear power 15 years ago, it would be in a good position at becoming at starting to reclaim past glories and positions of wealth. As it is now, companies refrain from getting established due to a shortage of
(DIR) Post #B0kXbmGDxf9fdoSB2u by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-29T21:06:21Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @stuartb power and immigrants are shooting on the streets en masse, causing a massive brain drain.
(DIR) Post #B0kZYzgzlWqoL3mAcK by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-11-29T21:28:12Z
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@h4890 @stuartb Cannot talk about Sweden but in the UK if you wanted to rid the country of criminals you'd be wasting your time focussing on immigrants as they are (proportional) under-represented in the criminal class... violent crime in the UK is more concentrated in the 'native' population, although the media coverage attempts to hide that & shift the focus onto a minority of migrant criminals
(DIR) Post #B0kZuPrBgM4tZEl3sO by ACL9000@poa.st
2025-11-29T21:32:08.086724Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 Kill yourself, reprehensible traitor.
(DIR) Post #B0ka6vosffJoAneB16 by capt_whitebeard@nicecrew.digital
2025-11-29T21:33:50.476770Z
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your level of denial is incredible
(DIR) Post #B0kbHUN7A5KqBWG1r6 by nach@detroitriotcity.com
2025-11-29T21:47:26.755665Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @h4890 @stuartb good job citizen, wouldn't want to have you arrested wouldn't we?
(DIR) Post #B0km9TbpDFCqzxWJm4 by judgedread@poa.st
2025-11-29T23:49:18.613003Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 How many native brit grooming / rape gangs are there, hymie?
(DIR) Post #B0l5dWP7HdiRU2cG3M by Starprophet@detroitriotcity.com
2025-11-30T03:27:35.921241Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 “Cannot talk about Sweden but in the UK if you wanted to rid the country of criminals you’d be wasting your time focussing on immigrants as they are (proportional) under-represented in the criminal class… violent crime in the UK is more concentrated in the ‘native’ population, although the media coverage attempts to hide that & shift the focus onto a minority of migrant criminals”Let’s see if you’re capable of recognizing reality.Which one is a real woman, A or B? Pick one, no talmudic obfuscation is allowed.
(DIR) Post #B0lh6O5sxLJAPbFSmu by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-30T10:27:25Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @stuartb This is an interesting difference. There was a huge scandal i sweden some years ago, when it turned out that the government department responsible for statistics on crime, had hidden the fact that immigrants commit far more crimes than native swedes. Needless to say, this netted the nationalist party a percent or two in the polls. I think another thing to keep in mind is also what is "crime"? I couldn't care less if someone parked wrong or cheated on his taxes, but I do
(DIR) Post #B0lh88nYnOPpYKVrrE by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-30T10:27:45Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @stuartb very much care if someone throws grenades in the street or shoots and robs people.
(DIR) Post #B0lhQrhgZsYw2Jh4O8 by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-30T10:31:05Z
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@capt_whitebeard @stuartb @ChrisMayLA6 What is the denial here? As someone who is not from the UK, but who wants to get different perspectives, could you please elaborate?
(DIR) Post #B0lhdW5YFlUYlMtCQy by PatrickCooper@poa.st
2025-11-30T06:56:56.318361Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @h4890 @stuartb Categorically not true.No one is retarded enough to think England is safer after mass dumping of shit from the third world, and everyone knows why.People with money in the UK avoid the trash just like those in the US. 'They're just seeking a better life,' said the shitheads from their exclusive neighborhoods.
(DIR) Post #B0lhdXNfRtZqlqNBJI by h4890@liberdon.com
2025-11-30T10:33:23Z
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@PatrickCooper @ChrisMayLA6 @stuartb This is interesting. Could we have some ONS data (or which ever government departmnt that sits on the statistics) on this question?
(DIR) Post #B0liP0OpNMBUNgYAD2 by Charles_in_Charge@poa.st
2025-11-30T10:42:00.860746Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @h4890 @stuartb You can't actually believe that. Either you are criminally uniformed, dangerously retarded, or a shameless liar.