Post Aw6VCzGSjV4jpZz7FQ by yogthos@social.marxist.network
(DIR) More posts by yogthos@social.marxist.network
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCrEkZyx6vx7dT6 by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-07-12T20:54:29Z
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If China is the threat that Phillip Inman argues (and few will differ from the board shape of his assessment) then what can our (or other Govt's) do given the already extensive penetration of our political economy by Chinese institutions and money?While withdrawal from the clutches of the Chinese state may well be possible, the costs of distancing will be higher (by design) that politicians may be willing (able) to countenance... if so, what next?#China #politics https://www.theguardian.com/business/2025/jul/12/world-more-wary-china-growing-economic-powe
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCsHyfT80CFdj8a by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-12T21:00:43Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 all that's going to happen is that the west will continue to isolate itself from the global majority due to sinophobia and inability to treat other nations as equals
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCtV8A3F9xKnkHI by Colman@mastodon.ie
2025-07-12T21:05:11Z
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@yogthos @ChrisMayLA6 as if the US isn’t a malign actor on the world stage. 🙄
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCuP8no2wl30Ta4 by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-07-12T21:05:51Z
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@Colman @yogthos Yes, I took that as the background implication, but unstated....
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCvC3rvB7CltXpg by Colman@mastodon.ie
2025-07-12T21:08:16Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @yogthos my question is why the state representing 1/3 of world population shouldn’t have power. Is it really worse than the US?
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCvqTRfVLE6nop6 by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-07-12T21:11:51Z
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@Colman @yogthos No I agree, I had inferred a recognition of a similar critique of the US, but as @Colman has pointed out that was likely more me than the writer... but yes, for me there are three very dangerous 'superpowers' - US, China & Russia - all dangerous in different ways but dangerous nonetheless
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCwTT6ghFB32xbU by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-12T21:29:17Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman what specifically makes China a dangerous power in your mind?Is it the fact that they haven't been at war since the 70s, or that China has had the fastest rise in the standard of living the humanity has ever seen, the fact that China is actively helping Global South develop, or perhaps that China is the only major nation actually transitioning off fossil fuels in a meaningful way?
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCxFKEkyfZTRBCK by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-07-13T06:52:37Z
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@yogthos @Colman Its an interesting point; people in Taiwan might differ on your notion of war avoidance (although as yet not happened, obviously); helping the Global South is really (like the US' prior work) hardly disinterested, but that, of course is politics, and while the green transition is notable they're still high up on the lost of emitters (by virtue of the economy's size).... but I agree, there is little specific about the danger of China that one might not also say about the USA!
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCxrFxjJpT7BTJw by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T15:47:20Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman Taiwan is a province of China last I checked as recognized by the UN, and even the US officially.You're simply creating a false equivalence between China and the US. China has been consistently a force for positive change in the world, while the US has a been a force of destruction. These are indisputable facts of the situation.
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCyeszD19x2P6g4 by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-07-13T17:28:07Z
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@yogthos @Colman well they're hardly 'indisputable facts' or we wouldn't be having this discussion - I think there are a lot of people both in China & in its neighbouring states who would disagree is been 'constantly a force for positive change'... in the same way, many might point to some (and I emphasis comes) actions of the US in the past that have also been positive - i think rather you are establishing a false absolute dichotomy...
(DIR) Post #Aw6VCzGSjV4jpZz7FQ by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T18:59:45Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman let's just look at a few facts then to make this discussion more concrete.Over the past 40 years, the number of people in China with incomes below $1.90 per day – the International Poverty Line as defined by the World Bank to track global extreme poverty– has fallen by close to 800 million. With this, China has contributed close to three-quarters of the global reduction in the number of people living in extreme poverty. https://www.worldbank.org/en/news/press-release/2022/04/01/lifting-800-million-people-out-of-poverty-new-report-looks-at-lessons-from-china-s-experience
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD03NncCuHIsBV2 by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T19:00:06Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman 90% of families in the country own their home giving China one of the highest home ownership rates in the world. What’s more is that 80% of these homes are owned outright, without mortgages or any other leans. https://www.forbes.com/sites/wadeshepard/2016/03/30/how-people-in-china-afford-their-outrageously-expensive-homesChinese household savings hit another record high in 2024 https://www.wsj.com/livecoverage/stock-market-today-dow-jones-bank-earnings-01-12-2024/card/chinese-household-savings-hit-another-record-high-xqyky00IsIe357rtJb4jPeople in China also enjoy high levels of social mobility https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/11/18/world/asia/china-social-mobility.html
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD0osx0Cked67Xc by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T19:00:54Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman Real wage (i.e. the wage adjusted for the prices you pay) has gone up 4x in the past 25 years, more than any other country. This is staggering considering it’s the most populous country on the planet. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cw8SvK0E5dIIn fact, a typical Chinese adult is now richer than the typical European adult https://www.businessinsider.com/typical-chinese-adult-now-richer-than-europeans-wealth-report-finds-2022-9From 2010 to 2019, the income of the poorest 20% in China increased even as a share of total income. https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SI.DST.FRST.20?end=2019&amp%3Blocations=CN&amp%3Bstart=2008
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD1SaZNxodlfpQW by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T19:01:49Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman By the end of 2020, extreme poverty, defined as living on under a threshold of around $2 per day, had been eliminated in China. According to the World Bank, the Chinese government had spent $700 billion on poverty alleviation since 2014. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/31/world/asia/china-poverty-xi-jinping.htmlAs a result, even as mainstream western media openly admits, Chinese government enjoys broad public trust and support.https://www.newsweek.com/most-china-call-their-nation-democracy-most-us-say-america-isnt-1711176https://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asia-Pacific/2021/0218/Vilified-abroad-popular-at-home-China-s-Communist-Party-at-100
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD2GZZXwj8n3kKu by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T19:02:31Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman not only that, but vast majority of people in China see their country as both being democratic, and working in the interest of the people. Something that's not observed in any western nation.https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2020-06-26/which-nations-are-democracies-some-citizens-might-disagreehttps://web.archive.org/web/20230511041927/https://6389062.fs1.hubspotusercontent-na1.net/hubfs/6389062/Canva images/Democracy Perception Index 2023.pdfhttps://www.tbsnews.net/world/china-more-democratic-america-say-people-98686https://web.archive.org/web/20201229132410/https://en.news-front.info/2020/06/27/studies-have-shown-that-china-is-more-democratic-than-the-united-states-russia-is-nearby-and-ukraine-is-at-the-bottom/
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD3AwBz25xbQlBw by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T19:03:37Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman Similarly, we can look at some facts on the clean energy transition.China's has a concrete plan for becoming carbon neutral https://www.visualcapitalist.com/chinas-energy-transition-in-5-charts/A recent study found that short term use of coal is perfectly in line with that plan https://www.carbonbrief.org/chinas-2060-climate-pledge-is-largely-consistent-with-1-5c-goal-study-findsChina already achieved its 2030 installed clean energy target in July 2024 https://climateenergyfinance.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/MONTHLY-CHINA-ENERGY-UPDATE-_-China-to-Achieve-its-2030-Energy-Target-in-July-2024.pdfWind and solar to surpass 40% of China’s power capacity by year-end https://www.scmp.com/business/commodities/article/3272181/wind-and-solar-surpass-40-chinas-power-capacity-year-end
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD3vjO0SmIjK880 by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T19:04:47Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman The amount of wind and solar power under construction in China is now nearly twice as much as the rest of the world combined https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jul/11/china-building-twice-as-much-wind-and-solar-power-as-rest-of-world-reportChina added as much new clean energy generation in the first half of this year as the UK produced from all sources in the same period last year https://www.theguardian.com/environment/article/2024/aug/16/china-generating-enough-clean-energy-match-uk-entire-electricity-outputOverall emissions in China are now in a structural decline https://www.theguardian.com/business/2023/nov/13/chinas-carbon-emissions-set-for-structural-decline-from-next-year
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD4UpHWXI3Zk9pY by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T19:12:12Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman and looking at China's neighbours it's pretty clear that their views of China are overwhelmingly positivehttps://www.statista.com/chart/32058/preference-for-us-china-as-ally-among-asean-countries/https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2024/07/09/views-of-china-and-xi-jinping/In fact, practically all the countries with negative views of China are either in the global north or those under western influence, such as Japan, South Korea, and Philippines.These are the concrete facts.
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD5H2OH6IT6Ieye by ChrisMayLA6@zirk.us
2025-07-13T21:07:26Z
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@yogthos @Colman OK, well I can appreciate you're very pro-China....but here's Amnesty International's assessment:https://www.amnesty.org.uk/issues/china?So not all nice & rosy.... but you are right the raising on living standards & the green transition are key (global significant) achievements, but that doesn't mean the Chinese state is universally benign as you suggest.... but, if you think their military operations in the South China Sea area all just defensive, then all well & good, I suppose
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD5tg4c0cOwNWCm by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T21:56:13Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman I don't know why you're making this about me when I just listed basic facts of the situation we're discussing.The whole freedom of expression thing isn't the gotcha you seem to think it is either. What matters are tangible freedom, such as freedom from poverty and the fear of illness or a lack of financial security in old age.Having jester's privilege to scream into the void is not that impressive to me.
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD6UBsrDSEBSg7M by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T21:57:22Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman also curious what you think China plans to do in the South China sea given the history that China hasn't actually been at war. Amazing that you suggest there's some nefarious purpose to China building up their military when the US has literally surrounded them with their bases and openly discusses war against China with increasingly shrill rhetoric.
(DIR) Post #Aw6VD7H6wyLcfuLkMy by yogthos@social.marxist.network
2025-07-13T21:58:59Z
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@ChrisMayLA6 @Colman meanwhile, the UK is literally arresting people protesting a literal genocide that the UK regime is actively participating in. Seems to me that somebody living under a genocidal regime doesn't get to judge China's human rights.