Post AsR8oZkv0RYQ1dtjPc by shortstories@merovingian.club
(DIR) More posts by shortstories@merovingian.club
(DIR) Post #AsQWxY40rzld7rgGUS by RoninGrey@merovingian.club
2025-03-25T22:01:10Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica Hey, I see you're Orthodox. Does that mean Eastern Orthodoxy? I have some questions you may have the answer to, either way. Are they futurist / dispensationalists? If I had a different eschatological perspective than what the church teaches, I would not really be accepted, right? I heard that they even somewhat distanced themselves from Eastern Orthodox people who use different calendars.
(DIR) Post #AsQWxYvXeyaLnsj0vQ by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:27:59.776834Z
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@RoninGrey Oh hey I love answering Faith questions. I am indeed an Orthodox Christian. I’m technically pretty bad at religion, but I have studied extensively for many years and consider myself “somewhat educated” 😁 While “futurist” may be flexible enough to include the range of Orthodox eschatology, we are most certainly not dispensationalists. There really isn’t an exact Protestant-sourced term that exactly captures our Faith, as far as I’m aware. We believe (from the Creed) Lord Jesus “will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead; Whose Kingdom will have no end.” Also, “we look for the Resurrection of the Dead; and the life of the Age to Come.” The New Testament also contains many teachings we take at face-value. When He comes again in Glory, “every knee shall bow.” There will be no question in *anyone’s* mind what‘s happening. As lightning strikes from the East to the West, so shall the coming of the Son of Man be when He comes on the Cloud on His Great and Terrible Day. We don’t accept the teaching of a “pre-Tribulation Rapture”. Rather that the dead will rise to meet The Lord in the air (as per the oft-cited Thessalonians reference). While we accept a certain symbolic fulfillment of the various Prophecies have at times occurred, we are not Preterists. Some things have not been completely fulfilled; some things are indeed “being fulfilled” as ongoing imminent spiritual realities, constantly manifesting in present circumstances. And yet many other things were at last fulfilled with the Incarnation of Christ. Which exactly are which is a big topic of discussion, beyond the present scope of this comment. That’s a brief overview of what immediately comes to mind in response to your question. Feel free to ask if you’d like clarification on any points; keep in mind however I hold no spiritual authority over anyone outside my own house; so as usual, ymmv. Consult your Local Orthodox Bishop if you’re looking for such official authority 😁
(DIR) Post #AsQX4WEw37BtUq75UW by reallyangry@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:29:16.375304Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @RoninGrey I AM A NON DENOM CHRISTIAN
(DIR) Post #AsQXFzdJ6g9LqJz5gu by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:31:21.174344Z
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@reallyangry @RoninGrey Orthodoxy has Jurisdictions, rather than denominations - organized along ethnic national lines. That’s a big part of the appeal to me tbh.
(DIR) Post #AsQXIRr39NSTwxaDDM by reallyangry@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:31:47.593452Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @RoninGrey but that's not make sense to me.
(DIR) Post #AsQXUJqojYagbN8Q2C by reallyangry@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:33:56.294875Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @RoninGrey well i know the orthodoxes are like eahc country ahs their own.
(DIR) Post #AsQY520m1UujzLIVXc by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:40:34.197275Z
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@reallyangry @RoninGrey Right right; the name “Orthodox” itself means “correct worship”, reflecting the idea that our highest priority is The Faith we received from the Apostles, which they received from God. First and foremost we’re a Communion of Faith. We’ve got all kinds of reasons for this. At Babel, Our Lord organized Man along ethnic national lines - for Man’s survival (like when He made clothes for Adam and Eve - but on a world-scale). We uphold this - but recognizing the The Faith, the “reversal of Babel” - that is, God’s own plan for reunifying all Men.
(DIR) Post #AsQYJyQfclqHDoXGT2 by reallyangry@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:43:16.376896Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @RoninGrey in the end i don't care waht branch of the faith people are on, long as they ain't telling me i'm damned.
(DIR) Post #AsQZ2ELDpBv9JX5ewC by RoninGrey@merovingian.club
2025-03-25T22:36:20Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica So, great example you brought up, so let's use that: preterism --if I were a partial preterist, would most "jurisdictions" say I had to renounce it? Or just not teach it? How would that work? Would they go as far as to call me heretical?
(DIR) Post #AsQZ2Fgso8qFV0ETL6 by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T22:51:14.051585Z
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@RoninGrey Of course, I’m not your Father Confessor, so my answers cannot hold any authority over you - so it exists in the hypothetical. From what I can tell, it would depend upon the specifics of what you believe regarding End Times. Some parts of our eschatology could very well be called “partial-preterism” iirc. Others, not so much. We could consider whether or not you believe the quotes from the Creed. If you struggle with those, I’m guessing you’ll have a struggle with your Father Confessor. Apologies that I’m less well-versed with partial-Preterism than I used to be; I considered myself that during most of my “Protestant Interlude”. I liked Hank Hanegraaf’s take quite a bit.
(DIR) Post #AsQZw00uHWLz5uBGMa by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T23:01:21.376469Z
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@RoninGrey I’ll go from that; from abt 2010-2013, I saw no reason to doubt the idea that the Destruction of the Temple in AD 70, was prophesied in Revelation, and constituted St. John’s primary intended audience. Why not ? Upon becoming Orthodox, I came to find that’s not really current in the Church; Holy Tradition holds a generally later date - perhaps AD 95. So, I changed my mind. Personally, I cannot say for sure whether your priest would excommunicate you over believing the earlier date; some may, some may not. It is in the realm of possibility. As such, the general Orthodox approach is to obey your Father Confessor and Bishop.
(DIR) Post #AsQad0p59Ga03Y9yhk by RoninGrey@merovingian.club
2025-03-25T23:02:19Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica I believe Christ literally did return (at least one more visit is coming), as He told his disciples, in many of their lifetimes. Just like the Jews expected the Messiah would come and physically deliver them at his one-and-only visit, they were mistaken about the timeline of events. I believe we, too, will find ourselves mistaken about quite a bit in how we understood prophecy.
(DIR) Post #AsQad1YSQYsMKHODQm by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T23:09:06.598330Z
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@RoninGrey Right right; I’d say some of that might raise some eyebrows. I’m not typically interested in online religious arguments so I’m going to refrain from busting anyone’s chops over “wrongthink” without a green-light from the Holy Spirit 😁 That said, the expectation I experience in Orthodoxy is to replace one’s own personal opinions, with teachings arrived at upon perusing the Lives of the Saints. Often, the Orthodox position is found in great sermons delivered by St. John Chrysostom, or even more often the Prayers and Hymns sung in Church Services. On no small number of occasions I had to update on the fly while singing in the Choir. Lex Orandi, lex Credendi ☦️
(DIR) Post #AsQbOUt7BX4wuaglii by RoninGrey@merovingian.club
2025-03-25T23:13:19Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica Thanks for the help, brother. Like the heart of my pastor, I'm really trying to just be part of the solution instead of causing more trouble to people around me from what many Christians in the past have done. I wish you well.
(DIR) Post #AsQbOWF89AHd79zrfs by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T23:17:41.156952Z
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@RoninGrey Hey you’re welcome ! The Faith is a journey, from my experience; sometimes a walk through the woods, other times straggling away from a terrible shipwreck. I don’t know at all who is where, but I believe in trajectory. Lord have mercy on Thy suffering servants ☦️
(DIR) Post #AsQe5wDxcoxi3PHUxM by DoubleD@merovingian.club
2025-03-25T23:23:26Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica This was a great conversation to read after the fact. Orthodoxy has all kinds of interesting nooks to explore, so I am learning more and more. The communities I've encountered are also stronger than any Protestant group I've encountered, save for the Anabaptists like the Mennonites and the Amish.
(DIR) Post #AsQe5wmhXekdn9XF6e by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-25T23:47:57.161355Z
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@DoubleD @RoninGrey Great to hear it, DoubleD ! Few things in my life are more gratifying than sharing the Reason for the hope I have. And I think you’re wholly correct in your observation regarding Orthodox community; there‘s a cultural cohesion that’s quite uncommon in the contemporary American milieu. It brings to mind the “way things are supposed to be”. For example, in my youth, I remember communities still at times “came together to pray”; which maybe gets lip-service here or there, but that I haven’t really seen in decades.
(DIR) Post #AsQtN56FNTyFogJ1EG by UncleIroh@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T02:16:58Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @DoubleD @RoninGrey I can't tell you guys how great it is to see more men in this space becoming Orthodox enquirers.
(DIR) Post #AsQtN5y8994YVnW3DU by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T02:39:05.868153Z
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@UncleIroh @DoubleD @RoninGrey Wholly completely agree. In my case it was more like Orthodoxy found me, and above all I was surprised by it; a few times, tbh. The first time I went and looked it up (on Wikipedia), I was surprised to discover it’s actually as Trinitarian as I am; I guess I’d just assumed it was something weird. But I found myself mildly shocked I was agreeing point by point with everything I read. I was already attached to a congregation though, and filed it away into the “interesting trivia” brain-box.
(DIR) Post #AsQuW3DppORYYNhCvg by Based_Accelerationist@merovingian.club
2025-03-25T23:28:45Z
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@reallyangry They're all Judeo doomsday cults. They all want to believe Israel is their holy land, they all want a messiah to appear to rule the nations (every knee shall bow). They all want to be the true Jews. They all oppose white European faith systems (which they call paganism). They are all very obvious controlled opposition.The patriarch of the Russian Orthodox Church threatened to expel brother Nathanael for making anti-Jewish videos and thinks the West is Satan.
(DIR) Post #AsQyHBupch9OzMydfM by RegalBeagle@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T03:11:00Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @DoubleD @RoninGrey @UncleIroh Late to the thread; there's good stuff here, but I'm not familiar with any of this history or sermons. Raised Presbyterian, but haven't found a church that resonates with me. Is there an Orthodox primer you'd recommend for reading?
(DIR) Post #AsQyHDJKR6L9JdRiUK by N_Y_SparkyOxCable@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T03:23:25Z
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@RegalBeagle @KingOfWhiteAmerica @DoubleD @RoninGrey @UncleIroh I second this request.
(DIR) Post #AsQyHE6bTtktmSV4IC by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T03:34:02.309590Z
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@N_Y_SparkyOxCable @RegalBeagle @DoubleD @RoninGrey @UncleIroh I’m assuming you already have a decent grounding in The Bible. Given that:I’d first recommend “An Exact Exposition of the Orthodox Faith” by St. John of Damascus. https://www.ccel.org/ccel/schaff/npnf209.iii.iv.i.i.htmlI recommed praying first; then just devouring it, and highlighting anything you think is “weird” or “off”. Then, I recommend reading a more modern / contemporary book like Clark Carlton’s *The Faith* and see if any of your highlights come up in that book. It often does a good job with clarifying what may amount to a cultural misunderstanding or whatnot. A popular old “industry standard” is *The Orthodox Church* by Bp. Timothy Kallistos Ware; but only if you can find a first or second edition because it went downhill each time they released it. If you’ve been out of The Word for a while, just start with Clark Carlton’s *The Faith*. It’s mostly harmless 😁
(DIR) Post #AsR80yNXBWjnueJ8Xw by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:23:12Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica https://web.archive.org/web/20160303175944/http://nestorian.org/Clicking on a link sayingUnofficial Home Page of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic ChurchUsed to lead to this chart as will as a description of each of the branchesI could no longer find it in the more recent website version and it is very difficult to find in the archived version
(DIR) Post #AsR8681Glf4BGGLsGm by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:24:08Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica https://web.archive.org/web/20160303175944/http://nestorian.org/Clicking on a link sayingUnofficial Home Page of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic ChurchUsed to lead to this chart as will as a description of each of the branchesI could no longer find it in the more recent website version and it is very difficult to find in the archived version because it is accessed through a series of menus but the link does not change to be different than the homepage in the end
(DIR) Post #AsR8ChkMqZyNnza8ZM by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:25:18Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica https://web.archive.org/web/20160303175944/http://nestorian.org/Clicking on a series of things leading to finally click onUnofficial Home Page of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic ChurchUsed to lead to this chart as will as a description of each of the branchesI could no longer find it in the more recent website version & it is very difficult to find in the archived version because it is accessed through a series of menus but the link does not change to be different than the homepage in the end
(DIR) Post #AsR8JKjApYE8RJBUGm by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:26:27Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica https://web.archive.org/web/20160303175944/http://nestorian.org/Clicking on a series of things leading to finally click onUnofficial Home Page of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic ChurchUsed to lead to this chart plus a written description of each denominationI could no longer find it in the more recent website version & it is very difficult to find in the archived version because it is accessed through a series of menus but the link does not change to be different than the homepage in the end
(DIR) Post #AsR8Ym4XRiwvahXYw4 by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:29:17Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica So basically there were what were called Ecumenical councils in which assigned people voted on what is trueWhen one group disagreed with how another group voted sometimes there was a Church SplitEach group has a list of councils and if you do not agree with the councils historic decisions you might be considered not a part of the ChurchBut many people simply do not know all the council decisions to be able to say they disagree & still call themself a member
(DIR) Post #AsR8oZkv0RYQ1dtjPc by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:32:10Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica The Denomination under Pope Francis did not exist until 1870 or later approximatelyBefore then people were free to believe the Pope was not infallibleAfter Vatican 1 there was a new decision that the Pope is infallibleNew Catholics believe the Pope is not an antipope and the pope is infallibleOld Catholics believe the Pope is not infallible and or the Pope is an antipope
(DIR) Post #AsR9703rwPGkp7XzV2 by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:35:30Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica Church of the East, Eastern Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox and Old Catholics never claimed the Pope was infallibleMany or all of them claimed the ecumenical council process of group voting was infallible but the Pope as a sole individual was not infallibleIf you want to know what a specific group believes you have to examine their council votes they list as binding and read the texts in regards to the groups I mentioned
(DIR) Post #AsR97QBYoQs1qVLV68 by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T05:35:34.914122Z
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@shortstories @RoninGrey Yeah I disagree with the chart of course; from my perspective, we’re the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, with the Latins aka “Roman Catholic Church” breaking away in the 11th Century. This is of course an Ecclesiological consideration; just what constitutes “The Church”, and why.
(DIR) Post #AsR9N9VoZTOqlfJwX2 by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T05:38:25.656175Z
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@shortstories @RoninGrey I have literally no reason whatsoever to believe the current “Roman Catholic Church” actually *is* the Catholic Church; as the only thing they really have in common with the Apostolic Church, is a Bishop that lives in Rome. Everything else about them is unrecognizable.
(DIR) Post #AsR9kcOLMcxWzq11OK by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T05:42:40Z
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@KingOfWhiteAmerica @RoninGrey The Chart gives you an idea of when these denominations started to existIf a road is shaped like a Y either of the 2 split branches could arbitrarily be given the same name as the singular branch they split from or they could both be given a different nameThere was no distinction between the 2 branches before the vote in which the split occurredThus I would argue that both denominations were created by the split & neither existed before the split
(DIR) Post #AsRA35L4TfgFzGI4ky by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T05:46:00.129211Z
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@shortstories @RoninGrey Simply calling them “denominations” is a mistake from my perspective; that sort of distinction makes sense in Protestantism, but not in Orthodoxy. We are organized along ethnic national lines. A better word from our perspective is “Communions”.
(DIR) Post #AsRAOAY2IzeEDxPNvE by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T05:49:48.999523Z
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@shortstories @RoninGrey Thus, the ”Lutheran Communion,” the “Anglican Communion”, the “Roman/Latin Communion“, the “Eastern Orthodox Communion” etc works a lot better - as it affirms a real, ontological divide between these Ecclesial bodies.
(DIR) Post #AsRAvPqkR0E3Ep0vj6 by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T05:55:49.847261Z
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@shortstories @RoninGrey This may seem “nit-picky” but it really isn’t at all, to us. We actually believe these things. By receiving Communion in one of these Communions, we are affirming that we subsume our entire selves to the Faith held by that Communion. It’s no small deal.
(DIR) Post #AsRNDgvSsqeqrRhX3A by shortstories@merovingian.club
2025-03-26T08:13:35Z
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@RoninGrey @KingOfWhiteAmerica Unless the first seven ecumenical councils as listed by Eastern Orthodox say you have to believe or not believe in a specific eschatological claim then you can believe or not believe whatever you want about those eschatological claims and still be considered a member of the Eastern Orthodox Church if you meet the other membership qualifications as far as I knowhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_seven_ecumenical_councilshttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecumenical_council
(DIR) Post #AsRQfjL9ng0kJtmQQy by KingOfWhiteAmerica@poa.st
2025-03-26T08:52:16.112679Z
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@shortstories @RoninGrey As it turns out, there are really nine councils in EO whose authority are considered “Ecumenical”; the first seven, the Photian Council, and the Palamite Council. While these are indeed considered non-negotiable, the Deposit of Faith really extends even beyond them. It must be understood though; the whole Orthodox approach to the very question of “authority” is often quite distinct from Western views. The Latin Communion in Rome seem to think in terms of “will not believing this make me go to hell after I die?” By contrast, Orthodox Christians are more immediately concerned with the healing of the soul, cleansing from sin and its effects, that sort of thing. We think of Church more like a hospital, than an attorney. To me the Orthodox take makes more sense, and resonates better with the Gospel Narrative.