Post AljceXUmTU7iOFlMZs by theothersimo@mastodon.social
(DIR) More posts by theothersimo@mastodon.social
(DIR) Post #AljMn5frgTJ1Ra0FXc by tinker@infosec.exchange
2024-09-06T00:36:44Z
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This is an amazing concept....Open Sourced "3D Printed" PharmaceuticalsBuild your own pill printing machine. Feed it an open sourced "recipe" / medical chemical compound instruction. Add some base ingredients. And make your own medicine.This is an exceedingly solarpunk idea and could be a core aspect of a post-scarcity world as it relates to healthcare. They have information about abortion medication (Misoprostol), ADHD medication (Vyvance), and more.There are obvious issues - especially around quality control, safety, effectiveness, and application. And the makers address this - but wow. Just wow.I very specifically have not verified any of this. But I'm incredibly interested in diving in and learning about it and its feasibility. The anarchist collective behind this venture, Four Thieves Vinegar Collective (@4thievesvinegar), spoke at this last DefCon 32. See @mixael's talk here (via Peertube): https://kolektiva.media/w/uvD1wWTRoh7HEto8zeSswrHere is a @404mediaco article by @jasonkoebler : https://www.404media.co/right-to-repair-for-your-body-the-rise-of-diy-pirated-medicine/Here is their main website: https://fourthievesvinegar.orgHere is are the open sourced instructions (along with parts list - both purchased and off the shelf along with 3D printed parts): https://github.com/FourThievesVinegar/solderless-microlabDefinitely something to follow and learn more about. I'm excited and hope this is effective and grows.(HT @aeischeid for highlighting the article and HT my dear friend for telling me about it after going to their DefCon talk!) #solarPunk #postScarcity #healthcare #abortion #abortionAccess #ADHD
(DIR) Post #AljMn6WgW5Ya5OiQs4 by coreysnipes@fosstodon.org
2024-09-06T00:57:28Z
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@tinker I was blown away when I read about this. Also, how has he not been sued to oblivion?
(DIR) Post #AljMn7DDxvaIDKcPB2 by tinker@infosec.exchange
2024-09-06T01:00:21Z
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@coreysnipes - Who would sue and on what grounds? (I'm not a lawyer, but I think threat modeling that out is important - so... sincere question that should be explored more!)Big thing is as this is open sourced, ideally, others would fork the build and tweak it and improve it, right? Even the instruction set is open sourced... so once those get out, even if the original creator no longer maintains it, the idea, concept, build, and implementation are still there.In that way, it's resilient to attack.
(DIR) Post #AljMn8CCJEMDGR96DQ by Npars01@mstdn.social
2024-09-06T10:17:46Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@tinker @coreysnipes The "make your own medicine" movement means no quality standards, no regulations to thwart fraud, and no way to control overdosing on homemade opioids.Imagine cancer drugs with a miniscule percentage of an efficacious dosage. But sold as the real deal to the poor or desperate.Imagine drugs containing deadly contaminants.Imagine counterfeit abortion drugs killing women or causing birth defects.https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counterfeit_medicationshttps://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn00dkw9479ohttps://www.politico.eu/article/zombie-drug-kills-11-pot-vapes-knockoff-pills-uk-xylazine/
(DIR) Post #AljNkNQ1M0qZYwrVCa by susie@blob.cat
2024-09-06T15:39:37.234416Z
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@Npars01 @tinker @coreysnipes These are real issues that are affecting even big name medicine brands (mostly due to offloading manufacturing to poor countries where they decide to straighten some steps and pocket the savings). Opening this can of worms to everyone would cause tons of health issues in the populace and overcrowd the healthcare systems in place to treat these individuals.In theory a magic machine creating things out of basic ingredients sounds like a miracle, but everyone should understand medicine isn't just putting few ingredients together and swallowing it. Reading stuff like this just makes me say no out loud. Home chemistry is a thing, but medicines are way more precise work than for example making your own wine. I will continue to trust my life to certificated professional work made in clean laboratory conditions with constant tests to assure quality control.The real cost in medicine comes from patents and research. Running a pirate lab filled with actual professionals in professional grade equipment and ingredients IS an option to cut down the costs to a bare minimum, BUT that is very illegal even if you don't sell the end product. The word pirate isn't there to give it a cool name.So to get affordable medicine to everyone the solution is not this, but the abolishing of the current worldwide patent system. Generic drugs (non-patented and widely produced) are cheap as fuck. The cost of manufacturing is very very low in mass produced medicine. Running a "home lab" like this would be many times more expensive than just buying those at the local pharmacy and many many many times more dangerous and potentially deadly.
(DIR) Post #AljTgpO61WoQsDeWkC by urdle@pouet.chapril.org
2024-09-06T16:45:11Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@tinker @404mediaco @jasonkoebler @aeischeid @4thievesvinegar @mixael Not so long ago, your local pharmacist did prepare/mix your medication. So I really think we could, for some medication, go back to that.
(DIR) Post #AljcV0zrvypSzWlLU0 by Archivist@social.linux.pizza
2024-09-06T18:24:54Z
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@Npars01 @tinker @coreysnipes "make your own" is not "sell in the streets" if you have no access to these medications, making them for yourself may save your life. It is a hard difference between making your own medication and buying it from a rando on ebay
(DIR) Post #AljceXUmTU7iOFlMZs by theothersimo@mastodon.social
2024-09-06T16:55:54Z
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@martinvermeer @mybarkingdogs @Npars01 @tinker Meth labs being an interesting point of comparison. Methamphetimine isn’t a particularly complicated molecule yet black market labs aren’t able to produce it without fairly specialized feedstock. Making more complex medicines from base materials seems impractical.
(DIR) Post #AljceYPr3HmFFGSwXQ by Archivist@social.linux.pizza
2024-09-06T18:26:36Z
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@theothersimo @martinvermeer @mybarkingdogs @Npars01 @tinker the point is that expensive is not the same as complicated to produce, the article does actually present a good example of a simple to manufacture medication that is expensive due to patents