Post Ak6JTmd2LbfA2qpVCq by ottobackwards@fosstodon.org
(DIR) More posts by ottobackwards@fosstodon.org
(DIR) Post #Ak5xoFYcIqJqZ97H16 by tomjennings@tldr.nettime.org
2024-07-19T17:22:59Z
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I'm still baffled by the two python worlds on linux. I can't find a top-level explainer. Anyone know of one for me to rtfm?Debian, you get python. But then there's all this code that requires pip3. All I can discern is that the distro comes with a basic and functional python, but pip is part of some more advanced system. I tried installing both, that was a disaster, especially since I don't understand the ramifications.(All I want to do is normalize some audio... lol)
(DIR) Post #Ak606YzyxVgHz0mD6u by tomjennings@tldr.nettime.org
2024-07-19T17:48:48Z
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@nelson Ahhh.. as I suspected. Improved to death!Yeah, I have one modest laptop. I don't like owning much hardware. Or anything, for that matter.I'll normalize audio by hand! I'll be done with the project while I'm still messing with software installs, lol.Thanks for the info. So I guess the pip system is for large(r) project development management,. Here, there's me and one screen one user. It's enough work for me to manage me as it is! lol
(DIR) Post #Ak609QA2H3tRRRqEr2 by rakslice@mastodon.social
2024-07-19T17:31:48Z
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@tomjennings I think you're looking for https://docs.python.org/3/installing/index.html ?
(DIR) Post #Ak609SK2Er5292XFia by rakslice@mastodon.social
2024-07-19T17:33:13Z
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@tomjennings in slightly older pythons that don't install pip by default you can get it by doing `python -m ensurepip --upgrade`
(DIR) Post #Ak60s3fak4Eoiat0hE by ParadeGrotesque@mastodon.sdf.org
2024-07-19T17:57:17Z
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@tomjennings The confusion usually comes either: A. Because Linux comes with python 2.x while pip3 is for python 3.xB. Because you try to install pip3 directly, while you should be installing pip3 through your Linux package manager (python3-pip is the package name, usually)This being said, pip is very nice and useful. Except when it breaks. Which happens. Also: remember to segment your Python environments using virtualenv.
(DIR) Post #Ak66wKVcfwwnpMdxXE by tomjennings@tldr.nettime.org
2024-07-19T19:05:22Z
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@ParadeGrotesque My debian systems comes with python3 (3.2.14). It 'came with', I didn't manually choose it.I don't know what "segment Python environment" means. That's the top level stuff I'm missing. I can't find overviews of this stuff, I guess it's just assumed knowledge. I'm hardly new to *nix.I suspect the package I wanted (ffmpeg-normalize) which wants to install via pip3 can possibly be done through distribution python, but I honestly don't know. Since my goal was audio, not python, I found another solution.(LOL the solution was to not need normalization! Only a handful of files needed more than 3dB of gain so I just did it all manually.)Just another typical day with a computer.Maybe In The Future the pip system will supplant the other one for python9000.
(DIR) Post #Ak69dqkyr4PaCbhsPY by ParadeGrotesque@mastodon.sdf.org
2024-07-19T19:35:39Z
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@tomjennings Try this:$ pip --listCommand 'pip' not found, but can be installed with:sudo apt install python3-pipSo: sudo apt install as mentioned.Then: "which pip" and then "sudo pip install ffmpeg-normalize"You may have to replace pip py pip3 depending on what Debian installs. Good luck! 🤓
(DIR) Post #Ak6GohjXRWPD589frk by tomjennings@tldr.nettime.org
2024-07-19T20:56:05Z
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@ParadeGrotesque Someone told me pip does its own package management, and interferes with apt package management? Is this false? I'll poke at python3-pip and see how it goes. Thanks!!
(DIR) Post #Ak6InSuLHMN2iekGsS by ParadeGrotesque@mastodon.sdf.org
2024-07-19T21:18:14Z
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@tomjennings Yes, pip does package management for Python. Sometimes, it will interfere with Linux packaging if, for instance, apt and pip package the same stuff. Which is something that happens.Which is also why you need Python virtual environments which helps keep your little Python packages clean and well separated. See here for an intro: https://realpython.com/python-virtual-environments-a-primer/
(DIR) Post #Ak6JTmd2LbfA2qpVCq by ottobackwards@fosstodon.org
2024-07-19T21:25:54Z
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@tomjennings Different distros repackage python differently. On RHEL you would have gotten PIP I'm pretty sure. Debian splits python up into multiple packages.If you just built python from source, you would also get pip.
(DIR) Post #Ak6LihCwz3URU7rmpU by tomjennings@tldr.nettime.org
2024-07-19T21:51:00Z
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@ParadeGrotesque OK thanks! MYSTERY SOLVED! Lol, though it really ought to be at the very top, this section:"Why Do You Need Virtual Environments?"Is what I was missing. Python has a terrible dependency structure. OK GOT IT. Sheesh!OK Now I understand (OK beginnings of understanding...) how I got screwed first time through.Thanks for that link!!