Post Aj3FgOuRpUIRUfnDiS by wndlb@mas.to
(DIR) More posts by wndlb@mas.to
(DIR) Post #Aj3D1HHV5PUo3Pq4G0 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2024-06-18T11:37:14Z
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The “Liberal Arts” education is a suite of skills, philosophical stances, and information that has been refined over hundreds of years. It includes both technical skills and problem solving techniques— it provides a foundation for more specialized study but also for philosophical reflection. It evolves over time, but isn’t subject whims of the market or fashion. What is the role of Computer Science in the Platonic ideal of the liberal arts education?
(DIR) Post #Aj3DVw4nyVsjGXWGtU by futurebird@sauropods.win
2024-06-18T11:42:48Z
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Given that computers are ubiquitous and powerful tools part of that education should enable students to understand these tools sufficiently to embark on their redesign— and to, of course, use these tools effectively and responsibly. Tools are reflections of the aspirations and values of their creators— what values are embodied by the computer? what are its limitations and and advantages?
(DIR) Post #Aj3E3jwRbAbHTZjBrM by futurebird@sauropods.win
2024-06-18T11:48:54Z
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There’s a joke about an engineer, physicist and mathematician who wake up to discover a fire in their wastebasket. The engineer quickly estimates the water needed to put it out, doubling the quantity for good measure and puts out the fire. The physicist calculates the amount needed and uses exactly that: putting out the fire. The mathematician looks at the fire realizing it is a “solved problem,” she falls back asleep. This “mathematical laziness” is valued in Computer Science as well.
(DIR) Post #Aj3EPUMcCIUbX6L7nk by Graffotti@mastodon.social
2024-06-18T11:52:38Z
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@futurebird That is such a good question.Ideas of proof and structured arguments are perhaps more alive and practical in computing than in maths or philosophy?Ideas of the ethical use of information, of transparency and accountability?
(DIR) Post #Aj3EWfWx4uAkC1bAC8 by futurebird@sauropods.win
2024-06-18T11:54:08Z
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Once a problem is solved we aren’t required to look back, to retread those steps, unless in pursuit of efficiency. We create deterministic systems, seal them in black boxes and build ever more complex systems. And this is done with confidence that within a limited scope deterministic reasoning can work. Another built-in value in computer science is the process of debugging. (ironically often because maybe we didn’t really understand what was in one of those black boxes)
(DIR) Post #Aj3EuOtUaFFFXuSR3Q by futurebird@sauropods.win
2024-06-18T11:58:25Z
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Debugging presents students with an opportunity to actually apply all of ideas about experimental design and scientific method that are normally too unwieldy to really practice in an elementary science class. In debugging we perform one experiment after another until the problem is isolated, replicated and hopefully eliminated. Intractable problems outside of computer science can crumble under the debugging stance.
(DIR) Post #Aj3F2aKdwRDJKw3mGO by IngaLovinde@embracing.space
2024-06-18T11:59:52Z
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@futurebird another joke: a mathematician and a physicist are given empty kettles and told to make some boiled water. Both fill kettles with water, turn the fire on, wait until the water is boiling. Later, both are given kettles filled with water and told to make some boiled water. Physicist turns the fire on, waits until the water is boiling. Mathematician pours all the water out of kettle and says "now we reduced this to the previous exercise".
(DIR) Post #Aj3FEjICS5g8bPhxUu by Graffotti@mastodon.social
2024-06-18T12:01:52Z
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@futurebird If you insist on writing down your assumptions, then the problem is never "solved" because the assumptions depend on an ever changing phenomenon: people.So revisit and debug is an open opportunity.
(DIR) Post #Aj3FOU2W17c4By1TXs by futurebird@sauropods.win
2024-06-18T12:03:49Z
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@arichtman This is the origin of evil.
(DIR) Post #Aj3FgOuRpUIRUfnDiS by wndlb@mas.to
2024-06-18T12:07:03Z
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@futurebird First, to shove it self inside the liberal arts cathedral, where any whiff of STEM is usually regarded as 'for distribution requirements only.'
(DIR) Post #Aj3FjQdxq2ojjzWi7k by alec@perkins.pub
2024-06-18T12:07:17Z
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@futurebird The software engineer finds out how much water to use on Stack Overflow.The SV tech founder pitches a wifi-enabled smoke detector that automatically delivers water by drone for 19.99 per liter.The QA engineer tries throwing fire on water.
(DIR) Post #Aj3GVWOTlKHbTVDRzc by llewelly@sauropods.win
2024-06-18T12:16:17Z
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@futurebird first we need to focus on changing computer science into a discipline that researches how to build better tools for people, rather than how to turn people into tools.
(DIR) Post #Aj3K84lYiOxAwf5SpE by cammerman@mstdn.social
2024-06-18T12:56:48Z
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@futurebird This is a great little thread. Thank you for posting. I have thought about this some, but hadn't identified debugging as a generalizable skill.Two others that I think have value for anyone are what I call "algorithmic thinking" (there is probably a better name for it) and "abstraction.By algorithmic thinking I mean thinking about instructions and processes. Their steps, inputs, and outputs, as well as loops, branches, and even variables.1/2
(DIR) Post #Aj3PMGT6VDG9432Xdg by ohmu@social.seattle.wa.us
2024-06-18T13:55:07Z
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@futurebird I left code debugging behind when I left grad school. But I found something similar in civil engineering: Quality Analysis and Quality Control (QA/QC).QA/QC is one of the most valuable disciplines I learned and I learned it entirely on the job. Do you find yourself teaching any form of it?
(DIR) Post #Aj3Vzmliwa7sGDyftQ by rslomkow@mastodon.social
2024-06-18T15:09:46Z
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@futurebird I think this is a very important question.For me the key is algorithmic thinking.algorithms can solve that traditional mathematics cannot. Chaos theory, limits of certain functions.The other key is abstraction structure of CS is more specific than that of mathematics (data types, functional/imperative algorithms, state/objects), numeric representation of most everything.These are powerful tools that any modern problem solver needs to scale their reasoning to modern data.
(DIR) Post #Aj3afrVG8CKOvJayfo by dogfox@mastodon.social
2024-06-18T16:02:08Z
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@futurebird I think a crucial thing to emphasize when teach that is how rare problems you can solve and forget about are. Many, many very important kinds of work are much more like that of a gardener, requiring constant and varied attention.
(DIR) Post #Aj3sRdZkumX0qh47UG by markstos@urbanists.social
2024-06-18T19:21:22Z
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@futurebird I have a computer science degree from a Liberal Arts school, #Earlham College.The emphasis was on the /principles/ of logic, software engineering and databases rather than the minutia of the language of the day.A big advantage was an integration with the rest of the education, including critical thinking and writing. A CS degree from a liberal arts school has been a durable toolkit that enabled me not just to code but to move into technical leadership positions. No regrets!
(DIR) Post #Aj3w9Ir7bzzHBvhXvM by mhhwhitney@hachyderm.io
2024-06-18T20:02:48Z
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@futurebird There's a lot of really good overlap between the more abstract parts of Computer Science, Mathematics, and Philosophy. There's number of good tools for discussing what problems can and can't be solved at all (e.g. the halting problem) with implications to the limits of what even can be known. Complexity theory can also provide good guidance on what can and can't be solved practically.
(DIR) Post #Aj441tnfAZn75Y41ku by katzenberger@mastodon.de
2024-06-18T21:31:05Z
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@futurebird Until I arrived at the period, I was thrilled to be learning something about students that are debugging presents.I guess it shows that I'm 1) not a native speaker and 2) a German that is patient enough to wait for another verb to emerge, somewhere...
(DIR) Post #Aj5dzVLmtPEUBj8vUe by linebyline@bytetower.social
2024-06-19T15:48:48Z
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@futurebirdThe software developer agrees that it's a solved problem and downloads a framework which downloads a framework that downloads a library and will hopefully finish editing the YAML config files before the building goes up in flames.Another software developer copy-pastes a fire extinguisher from StackOverflow.