Post AhNpJ4F6Zdiftqs1Ca by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
(DIR) More posts by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
(DIR) Post #AhNmNDWdhdKzzBMJfc by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T12:49:40Z
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@tomcapuder Well, Mr. Know-it-all, let you try to demonstate the truth that no god exists. C'mon, we're waiting.
(DIR) Post #AhNmNDv6Egu5D2nqnQ by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:03:28Z
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@VoxClamans @tomcapuder Stop trying to shift the burden of proof. It's not up to atheists to prove that no god exists, it's up to theists to prove their claim that their god does exist.
(DIR) Post #AhNmXP81PzAYrqha2i by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T14:05:19Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @tomcapuder Sorry, but no: both claims are to be made, and both are unprovable.
(DIR) Post #AhNnGB94FnSMWyXc4u by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:13:25Z
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@VoxClamans @tomcapuder I can't speak for all atheists. Some atheists may claim that god does not exist, and in such situations, they'd have a burden of proof. But I don't claim that god doesn't exist. My position on the existence of god is that theists haven't provided sufficient evidence to prove that their god exists, and until they do I'll reserve belief in that god, but I'm not asserting that god doesn't exist because I don't have enough information to properly do so.
(DIR) Post #AhNnSYXj5Tv2ZYydV2 by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T14:15:38Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @tomcapuder that's agnoticism, which is a rational thought.
(DIR) Post #AhNnVNfZyFBNiazsXI by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T14:07:37Z
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@tomcapuder @Radical_EgoCom Oh yes you do (you meaning atheists in general). Agnostics are (scientifically) right, atheists and theists or deists are both non scientific.
(DIR) Post #AhNnVOGRlAfnYwFK08 by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:16:08Z
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@VoxClamans @tomcapuder Atheism itself is a lack of belief in a god, not the assertion that god doesn't exist. Within atheism, there are two subsets, gnostic atheism, which asserts that god doesn't exist, and agnostic atheism, which does not assert that a god does not exist.
(DIR) Post #AhNnkqTh90UtPRoQee by madies@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:18:58Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Sorry, then the Loch Ness monster, Sasquatch, and Russell's Teapot also exist. Until we prove a negative.
(DIR) Post #AhNnnU2l0mOahOTER6 by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:19:27Z
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@VoxClamans @tomcapuder Agnosticism is not some middle ground between theism and atheism. Agnosticism and Gnosticism are knowledge positions, while Atheism and Theism are positions of belief. A person can be an agnostic theist a gnostic atheist or vice-versa.
(DIR) Post #AhNnvjCKYGgG13sano by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:20:56Z
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@madies @VoxClamans @tomcapuder We don't have to say that they exist until proven otherwise, we can just not believe in them.
(DIR) Post #AhNo5XPpDGjoMyrxFQ by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
2024-04-29T14:22:37Z
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@Radical_EgoCom That's a common point of view, but your philosophy is called "Agnosticism". It's a reasonable point of view and shares many positions with atheism. Still it isn't the same. Atheism really means to reject the existance of god, while agnosticism doesn't care.@VoxClamans @tomcapuder
(DIR) Post #AhNoSSWLZtHvqhqjCK by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:26:51Z
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@taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Atheism doesn't mean to reject the existence of god, it means to not believe in a god. I'm both an agnostic and an atheist, in that I don't know for certain if a god does or doesn't exist (agnosticism), but due to there being no evidence to support the existence of god, I withhold belief in god's existence until evidence has been provided (atheism).
(DIR) Post #AhNoZoot4L492G1yPA by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T14:24:00Z
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@taschenorakel @Radical_EgoCom @tomcapuder (exactly what I was trying to expose, but better written than by me …)
(DIR) Post #AhNoZpU0bRxX5nGoV6 by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:28:07Z
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@VoxClamans @taschenorakel @tomcapuder No, it isn't better overall, because it still contains the same incorrect definition of atheism.
(DIR) Post #AhNoePq9N0Pz0hoVRQ by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T14:28:59Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @taschenorakel @tomcapuder https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism ?
(DIR) Post #AhNosyE6JrWriBxN0C by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:31:37Z
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@VoxClamans @taschenorakel @tomcapuder I already know what agnosticism means. I'm an atheist and an agnostic.
(DIR) Post #AhNpJ4F6Zdiftqs1Ca by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
2024-04-29T14:36:14Z
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@Radical_EgoCom Sorry, that's plain wrong. The word "Atheismus" is of greek origin and it really literally means: "without god". It was and is a philosophically deduced concept: The first atheists literally said: "I can proof without any doubt, that there is no god". It's really simply not atheism if you leave room for any kind of god. God is not needed, god makes no sense, the concept god is a contradiction in itself. That's the who hearth of atheism.@VoxClamans @tomcapuder
(DIR) Post #AhNpa4yx4sf37GQVzk by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:39:26Z
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@taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder You're referencing ancient definitions of atheism and its original origins. I'm talking about the modern contemporary usage of the word. Today, the word "atheist" refers to someone who doesn't believe in a god.
(DIR) Post #AhNpsE0GHBAEJ6gwj2 by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
2024-04-29T14:37:48Z
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@Radical_EgoComClaiming there would be room for any kind of a godness in atheism is like proclamating a Christianity that doesn't know Jesus. You are denying the central, the essential idea.@VoxClamans @tomcapuder
(DIR) Post #AhNpsEsV1WY71K4GGW by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:42:27Z
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@taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder I never claimed there would be room for god within atheism. I'm a skeptic and as such I don't believe that things exist unless there is evidence to support their existence. Being an atheist, I don't believe in a god due to the lack of sufficient evidence, but if someone were to provide evidence that proves that god exists then I would no longer be an atheist.
(DIR) Post #AhNqHzcQNbbHDvpTQe by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
2024-04-29T14:47:21Z
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@Radical_EgoComNope. Give it a new name. All fine, but don't claim what's not in the word."θεος" - god"ἄθεος" - without godIt's really in the name. It's the tiny letter "ἄ" that really makes the difference.Actually I really don't understand why you (and a few others) want to redefine perfectly fine terminology.Agnosticism isn't worth less, if you don't call it atheism. Actually the uncertainty in agnosticism that separates it from atheism is a great finding.@VoxClamans @tomcapuder
(DIR) Post #AhNqrl6XovzodLyKfo by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T14:53:49Z
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@taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder I don't know what you don't understand. I'll say this as simply as I can: I don't know if a god does or does not exist. Also, due to the lack of sufficient evidence for the existence of a god I don't believe in a god. That makes me an agnostic atheist.
(DIR) Post #AhNrFhHVgcXBj6W2nQ by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
2024-04-29T14:58:07Z
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@Radical_EgoCom Atheists are convinced they can prove there is no god. They are convinced there is sufficient evidence.This is fundamentally different from "nobody can prove", "I need more evidence", as you take the stance. This is a contradicting position.Did you spot the word "convinced"? What stark contradiction towards "prove", if you take strict position. Agnosticism takes this strict position. That's its unique contribution to the debate, and its great.@VoxClamans @tomcapuder
(DIR) Post #AhNrNkiimhnWi05JzM by taschenorakel@mastodon.green
2024-04-29T14:59:36Z
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@Radical_EgoComNo, this makes you an agnostics, and it's great. No need to hide behind atheism. Agnostism can truely stand, and to deserves to stand for its own. It's a huge contribution.@VoxClamans @tomcapuder
(DIR) Post #AhNrXGUc1b4zr61NuS by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T15:01:00Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Is there a middle ground label for that?
(DIR) Post #AhNrjCu3CH7gCHc9IW by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T15:03:27Z
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@taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder All atheists aren't convinced that they can prove that god doesn't exist. This conversation is going in circles. Just look up "agnostic atheism" and "gnostic atheism" and the differences between the two and educate yourself.
(DIR) Post #AhNsY1CkS1kogSaYls by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T15:12:40Z
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@rob200 @VoxClamans @tomcapuder For what label?
(DIR) Post #AhNsgWtAX9oxGdUNYe by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T15:14:10Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @VoxClamans @tomcapuder For atheism and Theism.
(DIR) Post #AhNswvfABxtwjhl3QG by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T15:17:10Z
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@rob200 @VoxClamans @tomcapuder No. When it comes to belief in a god, a person either believes in it and is a theist, or they don't believe in it and is an atheist.
(DIR) Post #AhNtlCJIZVTiqWV6ae by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T15:26:14Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @rob200 @tomcapuder and if he doesn't know whether he believes?Problem with you is that you don't work with the commonly admitted definitions. So I suggest you stay (nor not) with yours, we poor mortals, common people, use the common definitions, and we don't dispute together, right? without offense.
(DIR) Post #AhNuRGwTjyRlNGtDk0 by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T15:33:49Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @VoxClamans @tomcapuder If you are an athiest but believe in some other principles does that still make an athiest an athiest?If an aithiest is open to the possibiloty of a god being proven but not particulrly believng in that.
(DIR) Post #AhNumn5TQAHV9TMEy0 by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T15:37:42Z
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@VoxClamans @rob200 @tomcapuder How could someone not know if they do or do not believe something? That's the one thing that a person can always be certain of, whether they believe in something or not. It's very simple: if someone is not a theist (believes in a god) then they are by default an atheist.
(DIR) Post #AhNv0PEAvYjRCrv6hs by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T15:40:11Z
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@rob200 @VoxClamans @tomcapuder It's very simple. If someone believes in a god then they're a theist. If they do not believe in a god then they're an atheist. Anything else that they believe in or do not believe in is irrelevant and inconsequential to the god question.
(DIR) Post #AhNvCompj2Nhx338zY by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T15:42:24Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @VoxClamans @tomcapuder I thought so but others were saying they were others in between or hinting at that.
(DIR) Post #AhNvUwyO1lU4YN6F3A by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T15:45:43Z
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@Tonkey @VoxClamans @rob200 @tomcapuder That's not the definition of atheism.
(DIR) Post #AhNw1s3xIvfIsgP0am by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T15:51:39Z
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@Tonkey @VoxClamans @rob200 @tomcapuder You claimed all atheists assert that god doesn't exist, which isn't true.
(DIR) Post #AhNwfvf1LZfXcfqAam by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T15:58:47Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Atheists just don't believe that a good exists. Does that interpretation open atheists up to proof a god exists while then still being atheists and while not believing god?
(DIR) Post #AhNwzadlD3yADlcsMq by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T16:01:33Z
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@rob200 @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Yes, atheists of this kind are open to any evidence that may prove the existence of a god, but they won't believe in that god until such evidence is provided.
(DIR) Post #AhNxGSLrHRAFR9ILgW by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T16:04:59Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder I see now. And if they then believe the evidance presented to them, are they still atheists?
(DIR) Post #AhNxO17YPJOTIbD30C by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T16:06:44Z
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@rob200 @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder No, then they'd be theist.
(DIR) Post #AhNxZaDMGp47KERJ5s by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T16:08:25Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Interesting concept.
(DIR) Post #AhNxvlHpmieA2I6nT6 by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T16:12:50Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder @VoxClamans does this help understand what @Radical_EgoCom described is still atheism?
(DIR) Post #AhNy30XzRdMFOQ7XUG by Tavian_C_Lirette@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T16:14:13Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder I always saw the term "atheist" as being comparable to "monotheist", "duotheist", "polytheist", etc. It enumerates the number of "gods" that a person does believe in. So if a person believes in 0 gods, that's atheism!But indeed, none of those terms are mutually exclusive with being agnostic. One can believe in any number of gods, yet that same person can still assert they can't prove any gods or no gods. It's called agnostic (a)theism.
(DIR) Post #AhNzVR58U0rHkckASW by Sarahw@mastodon.green
2024-04-29T16:30:28Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Exactly. That's the point. I don't believe in a god, I don't believe god exists. Same with fairies.
(DIR) Post #AhOAOTZLw4ksvylG4W by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T18:25:51Z
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@Sarahw @Radical_EgoCom @taschenorakel @tomcapuder “I don't believe god exists” is atheism, “I don't know whether there's a god or not” is agnosticism. Now if our friend comes with new definitions, any discussion is no more possible.
(DIR) Post #AhOAOTuGgJU9yqXxfk by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T18:32:37Z
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@VoxClamans @Sarahw @taschenorakel @tomcapuder You finally got the definition of "atheism" right.
(DIR) Post #AhOB0kYhDZE0d7hk0G by VoxClamans@mastodon.online
2024-04-29T18:39:30Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @Sarahw @taschenorakel @tomcapuder « Castigat ridendo mores » was the motto a French writer (and superb latinist) invented for the actor Arlequin in the XVIIth century. Means: Laughin, she (the allegory of Comedy) chastises the customs/traditions/social way of thinking and behaving.I turned it into: Don't you chastise the society while you laugh?But using Latin in English is not as easy as in French …
(DIR) Post #AhOBTbJIgKu0LRGCsi by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T18:44:45Z
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@Tonkey @VoxClamans @rob200 @tomcapuder Disbelieving in a God is not the same thing as asserting that that God does not exist.
(DIR) Post #AhOC8gl1KnSV6yooCW by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T18:52:03Z
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@Tonkey @VoxClamans @rob200 @tomcapuder You are committing an equivocation fallacy. You're equivocating between the two different statements and treating them as interchangeable when they have different meanings. "There is no god" is a positive assertion about the existence of a deity, while "I do not believe in a god" is a statement about personal belief or lack thereof. They aren't the same statement, as one asserts a fact about reality while the other expresses an individual's lack of belief
(DIR) Post #AhOCunEuXNDj7DjmnQ by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T19:00:51Z
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@Tonkey @VoxClamans @rob200 @tomcapuder This means nothing to me.
(DIR) Post #AhOD8prdZl8XJGXzwe by mycotropic@beige.party
2024-04-29T19:03:24Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @Tonkey @VoxClamans @rob200 @tomcapuder Yes, I do remember the bird site.
(DIR) Post #AhOE1nTi9EyJpxZ0ng by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T19:13:19Z
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@Tonkey @rob200 @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Just look up "gnostic atheism" and "agnostic atheism". Further discussion won't be possible until you educate yourself on this very simple topic.
(DIR) Post #AhOFO8olaXnKLUdA5Q by rob200@hear-me.social
2024-04-29T19:28:35Z
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@Radical_EgoCom @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder Is agnostic atheism what you would say you are if so might want to add that in your bio because it confused multiple people in this thread and no one really could grasp the concept being atheist. I barely was able to grasp it because I took the wording and phrasing of the meaning of Atheism literally and connected dots with what you said about being open to the possibility of a god existing.
(DIR) Post #AhOFycINT7vYC4sEe8 by Mr_GHARice@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T19:35:11Z
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@Radical_EgoComThat's not the way it works in science. If you have the hypothesis 'God exist' you must be able to show that this wrong. But how? And how should you then be able to prove its existence?It will stay just something you can believe in or just not. @taschenorakel @VoxClamans @tomcapuder
(DIR) Post #AhOGHzlIRffmTYdmxk by Radical_EgoCom@mastodon.social
2024-04-29T19:38:25Z
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@rob200 @Tonkey @VoxClamans @tomcapuder You are right, I should add that to my bio.