Post AdKWphEhUcvIqZlsWm by defanor@emacs.ch
(DIR) More posts by defanor@emacs.ch
(DIR) Post #AdJfLhcCDyY5lRZdpI by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-29T22:57:32Z
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Have you convinced a full normie to #XMPP? How has it gone? Were there any problems or need of being help desk? Why is "ok" Monal the best client for iOS?
(DIR) Post #AdJhZBwoxXrHVomTOy by dekkzz76@emacs.ch
2023-12-29T23:21:48Z
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@mms nope, can't get any traction with linux ppl either, bound to their whatsapp on phones
(DIR) Post #AdJhZCcITL2FaSBb3A by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-29T23:22:21Z
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@dekkzz76 oh no.
(DIR) Post #AdKWphEhUcvIqZlsWm by defanor@emacs.ch
2023-12-30T08:56:48Z
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@mms Not sure whom to count as a "full normie", but for people who do not even install software or register accounts themselves, there is not much difference between, say, WhatsApp and Conversations: they use what others have set for them. I have set Conversations that way, it works well; regularly using it for voice calls, text messages, file transfer.Slightly more tech-savvy people seem to be reluctant to set additional clients or to try new protocols in general, probably occasional issues with software reliability (and message loss, into which I ran many times myself) not helping to build the confidence, while larger centralized IMs are somewhat more predictable.Some also mention the lack of attachment to phone numbers as an issue, or the lack of "sticker packs". Both are available now (IIRC there is at least one XMPP server with phone number attachments, and XEP-0449 for "stickers"), but apparently some people want for them to be available and the same for everyone, not just to set them for themselves: to be able to communicate to anybody knowing their phone number, or to send those stickers and know that they will be presented as they are supposed to. Though I struggle to see the appeal of those "features" in particular, apparently it adds to the overall impression people have of a messenger.I think it is similar with other technologies, including programming languages and operating systems: at first people use whatever they are given, then they care about seemingly unimportant aspects (like syntax, visual design, other appearances, or what they are used to), and then possibly start paying attention to more important ones, clustering around a few of the more advanced options.
(DIR) Post #AdKfeOAkviaG7lbpgW by debacle@framapiaf.org
2023-12-30T10:35:31Z
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@mms Sure, family, friends... The easiest onboarding was #Quicksy.im (Android only).A typical "full normie" forgets their password and at some point (new device or whatever) they need it. Quicksy solves this by using the phone number as id and SMS password reset.A #Monal fork with the same functionality would be awesome.#Jabber @Monal
(DIR) Post #AdKmbqJAZ5hCCDHGd6 by raphael@mastodon.communick.com
2023-12-30T11:53:32Z
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@mms gave up on #XMPP because of how poor the iOS apps were and started using #Matrix instead.
(DIR) Post #AdL6lfkkf5MnRH8xI8 by fuesstest@social.tchncs.de
2023-12-30T15:39:28Z
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@mms #iOS and #XMPP simply don't go well together
(DIR) Post #AdL9WltNqzMLzwldVQ by Monal@fosstodon.org
2023-12-30T16:01:34Z
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@fuesstest @mms Out of curiosity, what exactly bothers you about #Monal? We support chatting, voice calls and have proper push messages.
(DIR) Post #AdL9Wmt49ehR5FcteK by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-30T16:10:24Z
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@Monal @fuesstest nothing - for me it’s very good. But when I used it (a year ago), there were multiple little problems I ii, like app hanging, account breaking (needed app restart), upload problems, encryption problems that my 70 year old mother would mutmrder me if I said that is how to contact me from now on. This is why I said “ok” - it does what it needs to do, but it’s not fool proof like iMessage or signal.
(DIR) Post #AdL9eO6UBQIIXGWlSS by debacle@framapiaf.org
2023-12-30T15:34:13Z
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@raphael @mms Understandable reason!Problem is: Apple is hostile towards #freeSoftware and small scale software developers. They seem to put unreasonable burden on devs, such as "you must use a Mac for iOS development" and also pay them to be able to distribute a free-of-charge app. They do not even allow an #FDroid equivalent for iOS.For a VC funded company, that's not a big deal, but for independent (and often hobbyist) developers, it is. That drives many devs towards Android.#Monal
(DIR) Post #AdL9eP2yfx59SftTd2 by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-30T16:11:46Z
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@debacle @raphael yup. This is the reason as so my IP 13 mink breaks down (r or I can pass it down to family member) I will need to look for non-Apple device.
(DIR) Post #AdLA9mpoHepQDMhRHE by Monal@fosstodon.org
2023-12-30T16:17:26Z
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@mms @fuesstest You are welcome to help us make Monal foolproof :) This is the cool thing behind open source applications, people can contribute
(DIR) Post #AdLkuALum38QpB8BU0 by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-30T23:09:13Z
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@Monal I have no idea how to code for mobile device ;(But I'm trying again and within 10 minutes I've got one of the errors back - the "back" button and "settings" are shown at the samet time on "chats" screen and they are not clickable
(DIR) Post #AdLlKHAY3J1ZUlGT2W by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-30T23:13:56Z
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@Monal also: cool that you incoporated polish translation. I did a few of them some time ago :)
(DIR) Post #AdM7joECTWMWFyYLzM by lobi@todon.nl
2023-12-31T03:25:01Z
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@mmsMy family (including my 90yo grandma) uses Quicksy. Voice messages were difficult for my granny at first. She's used to WhatsApp's UI.
(DIR) Post #AdMjBQiDCGzvjfcmeG by Castiai@social.tchncs.de
2023-12-30T17:02:39Z
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@raphael @mms This year I've convinced about 20 "full normies" of #XMPP. I host my own #Snikket_im server and the ease of use is awesome for both users and admins. The iOS app for Snikket is based on Siskin and is doing quite well. On Android the app is based on Conversations and gives a great experience all the way.@mattj is doing a great job here!The biggest issue so far has been a very sporadic bug related to OMEMO on iOS. The rest just works as expected!
(DIR) Post #AdMjI76IViFuwG4rfU by raphael@mastodon.communick.com
2023-12-30T15:48:02Z
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@debacle @mms oh, I completely understand how bad things are for #apple developers, and I honestly don't understand how so many people suffer from Stockholm Syndrome and still defend them as "superior experience".
(DIR) Post #AdMjI7xTK0n3bAxKYC by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-31T10:25:50Z
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@raphael it was great some 5-10 years ago. Apple was ahead when it came to complete experience. Now everyone caught up (sans windows afaik), but they still have the Jobs myth.
(DIR) Post #AdMjQRmJW0SlNzhhnU by Monal@fosstodon.org
2023-12-31T10:27:21Z
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@mms We would love to fix the bug directly, but we are still unable to reproduce it. What device are you using, what ios version? Are you able to reproduce the bug? If yes, how?
(DIR) Post #AdMjneATcIE2TM4J6W by mms@emacs.ch
2023-12-31T10:31:31Z
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@Monal iOS 17.1.2, iPhone 13 mini. I can’t reproduce it now.
(DIR) Post #AdMlG9n7je66c4ItqS by moji@dresden.network
2023-12-31T10:47:52Z
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@mms +1 for #quicksy.Only sent the Google Play link of the app and they did the installation and setup themselves. Never touched their phone nor had to provide any remote support (while seeing them rarely in person).Concerning OMEMO I only once had to ask them about their changed fingerprint.Great experience so far with #dino and #conversations on my side.Parts of my family use #xmpp as their only messaging service to chat with me and between them. Though here I am managing their chat clients (Account creation, OMEMO setup/changes, etc.).
(DIR) Post #AdMnT5qBvzA2292EKm by mdosch@muenchen.social
2023-12-31T11:12:38Z
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@mmsFor me it went pretty well with prosodys 'great invitations' or #quicksy.