Post AcnrapVQkeAMNdDKro by SnoopJ@hachyderm.io
(DIR) More posts by SnoopJ@hachyderm.io
(DIR) Post #AcnLtj8nRZF3blauVk by daniel@gultsch.social
2023-12-14T08:48:49Z
1 likes, 2 repeats
Do I have to give another talk on how push notifications work? With @Mer__edith of @signalapp spreading lies and news outlets like @heiseonline amplifying their nonsense I feel like their is a lot of confusion out there on how push works. Google’s push notifications aren’t delivered by fairy dust and don’t consume any battery.TLDR: You can de-google your phone. Install Conversations. It is the only app running in background. It will use #UnifiedPush to wake up other apps like Tusky and Ltt.rs.
(DIR) Post #AcnSJsbLUYTQCfnleC by ikonoklast@chaos.social
2023-12-14T10:00:45Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @heiseonline So what exactly is the lie?
(DIR) Post #AcnSWQIS2VdMBMwfD6 by daniel@gultsch.social
2023-12-14T10:03:01Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@ikonoklast See my responses to @Mer__edith· https://gultsch.social/@daniel/111565910462764838· https://gultsch.social/@daniel/111565871666665989
(DIR) Post #AcnSZpZmVVrvSDfz16 by ikonoklast@chaos.social
2023-12-14T10:03:38Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel will do, thanks =)
(DIR) Post #AcnoRXdxUicsVo5B9E by Mer__edith@mastodon.world
2023-12-14T14:08:39Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @signalapp @heiseonline The number of rude, misinformed comments I get--here especially--from people who clearly have no experience developing & maintaining a high availability comms service that people actually use is astounding. I can't tell if it's rigid ideology--unwillingness to acknowledge the sorry state of the tech ecosystem due to their personal investment in a fading FOSS libertarian dream, or misogyny, or genuine/willful misunderstanding, or some combo. But it's exhausting.
(DIR) Post #AcnppOzHQfVyZNzrto by daniel@gultsch.social
2023-12-14T14:24:11Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Mer__edith ideology maybe. Lack of understanding probably not. I’ve been working in the instant messaging industry for 10 years now.
(DIR) Post #AcnrCcq6C5pa94L9Bw by rick@tinnies.club
2023-12-14T14:39:33Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @Mer__edith My man, you are coming across as a world-class asshole. Maybe take a hint. (and/or) Enjoy your new home in the deep valley of blocklists, now that you've fluffed the pillows for your comfort.
(DIR) Post #AcnrapVQkeAMNdDKro by SnoopJ@hachyderm.io
2023-12-14T14:43:57Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel one of these responses is an accusation that Signal isn't unique, and one of them is a snide remark about TCP.It is not clear from the responses what you are accusing her of lying about, but it does give an overwhemling impression of argument in bad faith to promote your own application. I *hope* that was not your intent and that I have missed something obvious.
(DIR) Post #AcntXaEzFaeo4k6QC0 by thinkerer@social.linux.pizza
2023-12-14T14:16:30Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Mer__edith @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline Mostly IMHO it is lack of knowledge or partial/superficial understanding in addition to a lack of realism.
(DIR) Post #AcntXbFjUIqdDLSWzg by dalias@hachyderm.io
2023-12-14T14:20:38Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@thinkerer @Mer__edith @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline I think it's more a lack of social skills combined with misogyny. There are good technical points behind what some of these ppl are saying, but they have some tradeoffs (like possibly requiring a background activity with persistent notification to do right) and call for good faith discussions acknowledging that and explaining why they want those options rather than personal attacks. The latter torpedo the technical goals.
(DIR) Post #AcntXbzSkHQZVAr3Gy by Mer__edith@mastodon.world
2023-12-14T14:26:14Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@dalias @thinkerer @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline The assumption that we haven't poured over all of these options before we made the choices we did is really galling. Along with the frequent comparisons between Signal--which offers messaging and voice and video calling globally, serving billions of messages/calls--and some or another small-scale alt messaging app, as if these were apples/apples. Wrap all of that in the kind of behavior that quickly gets you kicked out of any cool party.
(DIR) Post #AcntXclfr1zZuhPYQ4 by thinkerer@social.linux.pizza
2023-12-14T14:17:45Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Mer__edith @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline And this is more evident in security and privacy issues.
(DIR) Post #AcntXd9QQizV6MWWRM by stereo@freiburg.social
2023-12-14T15:05:39Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Mer__edith "some or another small-scale alt messaging app" thats decribes signal too. #wouldBeNice to stay together signal+matrix+xmpp ❤️@matrix @dalias @thinkerer @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline
(DIR) Post #AcntfkBc9mcFEoPsBc by noodlejetski@masto.ai
2023-12-14T15:07:15Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @Mer__edith shame that over those 10 years no one has ever told you that the tone is as important as the message itself
(DIR) Post #Acnu2NSonx11QSFvHs by thinkerer@social.linux.pizza
2023-12-14T15:11:16Z
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@stereo @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline There is no comparison between these three messengers. Signal is on a different level. Also Meredith never named other messengers.
(DIR) Post #AcnuLXzrrpLBayr5jk by daniel@gultsch.social
2023-12-14T15:14:49Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@noodlejetski @Mer__edith my earlier criticism (see https://gultsch.social/@daniel/111565910462764838 ) went entirely unnoticed. So yes tone is important 😉
(DIR) Post #AcnuhoMFiZDai1wSDg by cherti@chaos.social
2023-12-14T15:18:49Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @noodlejetski So the solution to not get a response is to become rude? Sounds like a recipe to have your point ignored entirely... And understandably so.
(DIR) Post #AcnvkJJhgUJbGAVNwm by jcbrand@mastodon.xyz
2023-12-14T15:30:28Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Mer__edith @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline Immediately playing the misogyny card. 😐And then your white knights jump in to defend your honor 😂
(DIR) Post #Aco6e1Y5vmVZubRQiu by COMPU73E@mstdn.games
2023-12-14T17:32:32Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jcbrand whereas you using the term "white knights" just demonstrates to everyone that you're an utter dickhead, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
(DIR) Post #Acp80x6IvhZRt9tpjM by fifilamoura@eldritch.cafe
2023-12-14T14:29:25Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Mer__edith @daniel@gultsch.social @signalapp @heiseonline The highly blockable men do like to make themselves obvious. Sorry that this guy is tagging you as a means to get attention for himself. And thanks for doing the work you do, it's appreciated by many of us, as is your presence here.
(DIR) Post #AcpUUuL5xWcn0GVU5A by thinkerer@social.linux.pizza
2023-12-14T15:21:12Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@stereo @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline I have done the self hosting exercise with Matrix (synapse) and XMPP (both ejabberd and prosody) and know what I am talking about. Obviously in the case of XMPP one should be using OMEMO (and how much tested is OMEMO compared to Signal ??, no offense Daniel). Technically Signal is far far superior and way way more tested.
(DIR) Post #AcpUUvJiK9782GrtZI by debacle@framapiaf.org
2023-12-15T09:22:43Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@thinkerer @stereo @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline You did never try to self-host Signal, did you? Otherwise the comparison is not really fair.Well, it might not be fair anyway to compare an application financed by shady Silicon Valley tech billionaires like #BrianActon or #JackDorsey with e.g. #Jabber or other "grassroots" approaches.
(DIR) Post #AcpbZPgPB9LWXZt20W by haeckse@fosstodon.org
2023-12-15T10:53:50Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@debacle @thinkerer @stereo @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline @jcbrand @debacle @Monal In a digital world, messages we send,Jabber, Signal, Matrix - what a nice blend.No need to argue, let's unite with glee,In this holiday season, we're all in harmony.Snowflakes falling, messages enthralling,Tech debates, put them all on stalling.No need to fight, in this festive light,Different apps, but the joy's in sight.
(DIR) Post #AcqPacxCJqDdhHVu8u by thinkerer@social.linux.pizza
2023-12-15T10:56:45Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@debacle @stereo @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline Whatever... You know this is not possible because the server is closed-source. But whatever... Do your thing, I'll do mine.
(DIR) Post #AcqPadrYwHJ0W5suzw by thinkerer@social.linux.pizza
2023-12-15T11:04:49Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@debacle @stereo @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline And to be frank I have no problem with the Signal server being closed source, I have some good guesses for why it is like that, but I will keep these to myself.
(DIR) Post #AcqPaedm31s0vcRQ92 by mstdnscl@mastodon.social
2023-12-15T19:55:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@thinkerer @debacle @stereo @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline I believe, that the Signal server is #freeSoftware under #AGPL: https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Server
(DIR) Post #AcqPafNrHgjXEY0Dya by stereo@freiburg.social
2023-12-15T20:14:11Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@mstdnscl @thinkerer @debacle @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline good luck setting it up and connect to it.
(DIR) Post #AcqQ8YqY613onwaIt6 by debacle@framapiaf.org
2023-12-15T20:20:17Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@stereo @mstdnscl @thinkerer @Mer__edith @matrix @dalias @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline But only after trying that, the comparison with #Jabber and others would be kind of fair.
(DIR) Post #Acqwxyuq7zwoxV9dyK by ekis@mastodon.social
2023-12-16T02:28:12Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @Mer__edith @signalapp @heiseonline Signal app requiring a phone number is a huge red flag. Because it inherently means the metadata of which phone number talks to which phone number is known, not to mention contact lists.The networks it reveals are probably more important than what is being said.Example: DNS record lookups based on a lot of factors like frequency, uniqueness, etc can identify most people from any network they are on.XMPP with OTR is the only secure way to chat.
(DIR) Post #AcrdbFkff7DyXjo5Hk by jobangles@mastodon.world
2023-12-16T10:08:55Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Mer__edith @daniel @signalapp @heiseonline I hope you're both not still angry with eachother. I would like to understand the technical details here. If I'm not mistaken, what Daniel is saying is that conversation's persistent client-server connection is more battery efficient than signal's (when not using GCM). It does not seem to me like the connection method itself is affected by the difference in scale between both apps. I.e., could signal not use a similar approach to improve batterylife?
(DIR) Post #AcrdbGRv4Joqhs2chE by daniel@gultsch.social
2023-12-16T10:26:00Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jobangles to be clear I’m not saying that Conversations’ method is more efficient. It's just that @signalapp speaks of their own method as 'destroying the user’s battery' while I know for a fact the implementation in Conversations is not.My assumption is rather that they vastly exaggerate the battery impact of their own implementation to make GCM seem like something they absolutely have to use.Signals battery impact might be completely acceptable and Conversations’ only very marginally better
(DIR) Post #AcreB5BkPhYwCsYZLE by jobangles@mastodon.world
2023-12-16T10:32:28Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @signalapp I see, thank you for explaining. To offer some context, I have experienced firsthand that Signal will use a ton of battery when not using GCM, so I can confirm that. See here as well: https://github.com/signalapp/Signal-Android/issues/9729. By comparison, in my experience Conversations has been a lot easier on my battery. So I'm genuinely trying to understand why Signal couldn't implement this as well. It would be great if it would use less battery, a lot of people seem to encounter the issue.
(DIR) Post #AcretCZ2LuHTp7UHr6 by daniel@gultsch.social
2023-12-16T10:40:28Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jobangles @signalapp I have never measured or even experienced the battery impact of Signal w/o GCM so I don’t want to make any public claims about Conversations being more efficient. If however what you just said is true my assumption would be that working without vendor push (APNS/GCM) is absolutely not a priority for them. On iOS (which has vastly more market share in the US) it's a non starter anyway. They are not stupid they just don’t care and never tried to optimize it in the first place
(DIR) Post #AcrguWJmaosRHs6opE by jobangles@mastodon.world
2023-12-16T11:03:06Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@daniel @signalapp I see. Yes that does seem reasonable. People using degoogled Android are already a minority, and if Android in general is as well then I can understand the reasoning behind that prioritisation. So basically then the explanation for Signal not tackling the battery drain issue yet is one of pragmatism, broadly speaking. I would be very interested in hearing the perspective of @Mer__edith on this. Would you agree? Or is the above completely wrong?