Post AcfvtmpDmuhA7V5QJM by cstross@wandering.shop
(DIR) More posts by cstross@wandering.shop
(DIR) Post #AcfvtiYPfSsCsDBwYa by shiri@foggyminds.com
2023-12-10T17:45:11Z
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Just recently had to break it down in a group because it's been flaring up, figured a post would be nice.This may seem like a Jewish specific topic, but it is important for non-Jews to know as well.Zionism vs Anti-Zionism.First of all, if you're a non-Jew it's best to identify with neither as for non-Jews is almost always antisemitic. (And yes I mean both).This is a one of the biggest bones of contention in the Jewish community and is absolutely a loud argument right now due to current events. Worse yet, it's generally so because of a mix of misunderstandings and extremism.ZionismOriginally this was the belief that the only way Jews could find some stability and safety would be to form a Jewish state. Once the state was formed, this turned into rabid support for Israel. For the milder of them, it basically boils down to patriotism... for the extremes it's nationalismThe loudest and most well represented of Zionists, however, believe basically that any criticism of Israel is inherently antisemitic, even by fellow Jews.(How can this be antisemitic for non-jews? Short answer without derailing: Nazis are often Zionist)Anti-ZionismOriginally this was opposition to the creation of modern Israel, though each person had their own wildly varying reasons.After the creation, many Anti-Zionists became Zionists. For the rest it mostly transformed into minimizing and addressing the damages caused by the creation of the state (ie. the occupation of Palestine). Many do dream of the potential of dismantling the state, but don't see it as feasible because creating a new humanitarian crisis to solve another isn't an acceptable solution.They're generally painted by Zionists as if they want to abruptly end the state without addressing the crisis it would cause. (As such even mild Zionists often believe Anti-Zionism to be inherently antisemitic)(Non-Jews can criticize Israel, but being/identifying-as Anti-Zionist is pretty much reserved for Jews; the exception being victims of Israel)#IsraelHamasWar #Israel #Zionism #AntiZionism #AntiZionismIsNotAntisemitism #Hamas #Judaism
(DIR) Post #AcfvtjUu9zf3ncYejA by witewulf@mastodonapp.uk
2023-12-10T18:05:20Z
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@shiri @cstross I’m even more confused than before I read that 😮
(DIR) Post #AcfvtkOYp4BGaEb6Tg by cstross@wandering.shop
2023-12-10T18:07:13Z
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@witewulf @shiri Okay, TLDR: anti-zionism has been co-opted by fucking Nazis. But among Jews it's specifically about opposition to an imperialist, colonialist ideology that is popular among right-wing Jews (notably the current government of Israel).
(DIR) Post #AcfvtlCtnuRl6M9IwK by shiri@foggyminds.com
2023-12-10T18:10:12Z
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@cstross @witewulf Thank you, definitely showing why you're the writer and I'm the shitposter lol
(DIR) Post #Acfvtm2ehTqZgsMdc0 by cstross@wandering.shop
2023-12-10T18:17:31Z
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@shiri @witewulf You pretty much nailed it, though! All I'd add is that zionism started out in the late 19th century as yet another component of the general European wave of ethno-nationalism that birthed Italy and Germany as well as the Balkan states, and broke up the Austro-Hungarian Empire: everyone else got a homeland, so why not the Jews? But then WW1 and the Balfour Declaration happened, and it turned from aspirational into a tool of oil imperialism.
(DIR) Post #AcfvtmpDmuhA7V5QJM by cstross@wandering.shop
2023-12-10T18:18:23Z
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@shiri @witewulf (I am entitled to an Israeli passport under the Law of Return ... but I don't want one.)
(DIR) Post #AcfvtnWTC7I2HdJxiq by admin@detroitriotcity.com
2023-12-10T18:54:14.269991Z
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@cstross @shiri @witewulf That’s because a parasite cannot live without a host, kike. :merchant_shoot: