Post AbxhShbKGHbNBaIfeS by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
(DIR) More posts by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
(DIR) Post #AbxhShbKGHbNBaIfeS by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
2023-11-19T10:45:11Z
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Does anyone have a qualified estimate of how many truckloads of logistics a brigade needs on a daily basis. I keep seeing people saying that #Ukraine will need a bridge over the Dnipro to sustain a fight, and that is also conventional doctrine for river crossings. But a single mini-ferry capable of carrying three trucks and conducting one passage per hour will transfer 72 trucks every day. How many such ferries would it take to replace a bridge?
(DIR) Post #Abxhy4plvpqIDd1Ahc by t_mkdf@ruhr.social
2023-11-19T10:50:47Z
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@anderspuck I suppose it also matters what kind of a brigade.Light infantry needs less than armoured or (god forbid) artillery.
(DIR) Post #AbxiJOseavemTOX8jY by Peternimmo@mastodon.scot
2023-11-19T10:54:42Z
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@anderspuck I believe there is a road bridge and a rail bridge across the river in that area, both damaged. No doubt the Ukrainians have looked into repairing them
(DIR) Post #AbxiZbbN45zAYpB1pA by elpolacodesplegado@hessen.social
2023-11-19T10:57:34Z
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@anderspuck Eventually you need more than a brigade on that other side. The basic measurement for each unit would be days of supply (DoS). 3 DoS would equal x amount of ammo, fuel, food, spare parts. Technically you can supply them via helicopter and/or air drop too. The latter would be under extreme risk though. Let me see if I can find a document on DoS rates for different types of units.
(DIR) Post #AbxjhupxX4hEUMWjFA by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
2023-11-19T11:10:16Z
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@Peternimmo Yes, and there is also the remnants of the Nova Kakhovha dam. Maybe that could be made passable too.
(DIR) Post #AbxjklnxZRGdLPx8CW by picard@mas.to
2023-11-19T11:10:58Z
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@anderspuck In How to Fight a War, Mike Martin estimated 18.5kg per person per day for light infantry. Including ammunition, food, water, plus miscellaneous items like clothing, batteries, etc. Based on an estimate of 300 rounds per day. He goes into more detail calculating it in the book, but that's the estimate.A battalion of 500 men, that's 9.25 tonnes per day. Excluding vehicles.Can't comment on the accuracy of his estimates, but maybe a reasonable starting point?
(DIR) Post #AbxkA4r3sd1LfOTGMq by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
2023-11-19T11:15:16Z
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@picard Sounds reasonable to me. But that is also just a single truck or two for a battalion. Even if we multiply that number by 10 it still sounds possible to do without a bridge.
(DIR) Post #AbxoZ796tlmNpR6hhA by virtualradiator@mas.to
2023-11-19T12:04:45Z
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@anderspuck @picard so that is 3 7.5t trucks per day per brigade. That's not that much, less vehicles if you go for heavier ones
(DIR) Post #AbxocxXSYmfjBsKVgu by notsoloud@expressional.social
2023-11-19T12:05:25Z
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@anderspuckWouldn't a reconstructed bridge be terribly vulnerable to glide bombs? The Russians use them a lot in the area already.@Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AbxovnOIVtLfDh1gZM by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
2023-11-19T12:08:53Z
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@notsoloud @Peternimmo Yes, a bridge would be very vulnerable.
(DIR) Post #AbxrRS9nCDCWXTSsM4 by VikingChieftain@krigskunst.social
2023-11-19T12:36:58Z
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@anderspuck @Peternimmo I don't think the Kakhovka dam can be easily repaired. There's no roadway or support anymore and rebuilding it would probably take too long.
(DIR) Post #Aby4VQ4qAZteePN0ds by elpolacodesplegado@hessen.social
2023-11-19T14:38:40Z
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@anderspuck Tried to find a quick answer. A lot of papers talking about formulas for the calculation of DoS expenditure, but they are highly dependent on troop type etc. With things ranging from water to food, ammo and fuel I guess it is properly somewhere upwards of 200 tons per day. But I'm not a logistician.
(DIR) Post #Aby4dZguJDPOmi42aW by bluGill@kbin.social
2023-11-19T13:51:18+00:00
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@anderspuck a bridge makes it easier and safer. A ferry across the water needs to be loaded and unloaded on either end which is time and place for the enemy to strike.@picard
(DIR) Post #Aby4daYR6CE7Sj6n1U by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
2023-11-19T15:04:44Z
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@bluGill @picard I think both are vulnerable, but a pontoon bridge will be easy to strike.
(DIR) Post #Aby7IVb8dCu7s60pJw by Jeffrey_Smith@mastodon.social
2023-11-19T15:34:38Z
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@anderspuck @bluGill @picard The Ukrainians really made life miserable for the Russians trying to cross on ferries and via pontoon bridges during the Kherson offensive. At the same time, the lack of an adequate Russian reinforcement and counterattack at the Dnipro bridgehead must be very encouraging. I suspect the Ukrainians will be very pleased if this advance pushes the russian artillery out of range of Kherson's civilian population this winter. #SlavaUkraini
(DIR) Post #Aby7Sdlp6Mb875qEAC by anderspuck@krigskunst.social
2023-11-19T15:36:33Z
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@Jeffrey_Smith @bluGill @picard I think so too. But I will also say that I think the Russians managed to do surprisingly well with ferries and barges during that time. It was a very big force they had on the right bank of the river.
(DIR) Post #AbyTRUov5eiJ3c9Jc8 by picard@mas.to
2023-11-19T19:42:44Z
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@anderspuck @Jeffrey_Smith @bluGill I remember when they hit the bridge last year. The assumption seemed to be that was it for the russians, supply was basically impossible. But they clung on for much longer. Until the Ukrainians forced them to leave.So it doesn't seem unreasonable to expect Ukraine may feel optimistic about supplying this operation. At the very least, as you discussed in your recent (excellent!) video, they may be putting the russians in a real dilemma in how to deal with it.