Post AZG0VnwpDp1bvbSv0C by tante@tldr.nettime.org
(DIR) More posts by tante@tldr.nettime.org
(DIR) Post #AZFxvas6A6EH2VrO5Y by tante@tldr.nettime.org
2023-08-30T12:38:16Z
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Giving Fairphone shit because while trying to build a long-term viable, sustainable and socially and economically fairer device they also think about the people in the real fucking world who are supposed to use them and offer them the software most of them rely on (like Google Apps) is more toxic purism than I can stand.People who are willing to suffer in their life by using something different, something slightly incompatible to what the rest of the world uses already do install roms and run whatever on their machines.Getting real actual people to buy a phone that's not built to be thrown away in a year of two, that highlights the values of sustainability is a huge win. And making the medicine ("your phone might not be as fancy as your peers' phones") taste sweeter ("for 8 years you have access to all the applications you need for your life to function within a digital society") is just a smart move.
(DIR) Post #AZFy3iO46RfofJgWFU by wangxiaoxiao2048@masto.nu
2023-08-30T12:39:45Z
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@tante
(DIR) Post #AZFy7klnBbCNDIhzwO by tante@tldr.nettime.org
2023-08-30T12:40:11Z
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(And the term #surveillance #capitalism is as short-sighted as the book that it comes from. Criticizing "surveillance capitalism" implies that there are better forms but every issue that Zuboff's book points out directly stems from capitalism itself. It's just about the big C, the "surveillance" prefix is just a veil to make things less clear.)
(DIR) Post #AZFytbg2IQX8udpnOK by cwillmes@mastodon.social
2023-08-30T12:49:10Z
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@tante You do see, that you do defend toxic tech silos with this kind of rethoric? May I add, proprietory silos like Apple iOS and lesser so Google Android are indeed capitalist/conservertaive/neo-liberal/politically right-wing tech models. I get that people are layzy and do not want to take up this fight and problems that come with it. But that you give someone, like fairphone, who does take up this fight (for you also) "shit" is just plain bad.
(DIR) Post #AZFz5gGP4M4Yc2bOvQ by eichkat3r@hessen.social
2023-08-30T12:51:21Z
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@tante i don't know where this is coming fromsince fairphone actually sells their devices with pre installed eOS for a slightly higher price which i find is pretty nicehttps://www.golem.de/news/alternatives-android-fairphone-4-mit-e-os-ab-werk-erhaeltlich-2201-162496.html
(DIR) Post #AZFz9kxLZ29oKCdFqa by tante@tldr.nettime.org
2023-08-30T12:51:56Z
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If your job is working on open source and you don't need all the stuff that Google etc provide, awesome. I get it, running only free stuff is really cool, I do it myself. For me.But that's based on my skills, the things. I care about. It's kind of my hobby so to speak and it oftentimes means that I have to dick around with wonky solutions. Which *I* am okay with.But demanding that of real people in the world? People who just need a simple thing to do a shared spreadsheet for some gift for a nursery school teacher leaving should have the whole "Let's use Glorp!" - "No Glorp is run by a transphobe. Maybe Snoot?" - "Snoot is to hard to run, because it demands an old version of Zonk" - "Could we set up a mailing list?" dance? Get fucking real.
(DIR) Post #AZG0HVyHGHk07XKZG4 by fasterandworse@hci.social
2023-08-30T13:04:37Z
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@tante this is kind of the essence of why I’m so critical of UX posturing
(DIR) Post #AZG0NVb5Z6EChLLIlE by cwillmes@mastodon.social
2023-08-30T13:04:43Z
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@tante Who demands that? This brings the wrong spin into it... of course its not easy... someone who do not want to fight (work on their tech skills to be sovereign enough to be able to use this complicated shit) should maybe not use this complicated shit then... but we can help people get educated so they maybe can do it and make the open/good/"communist"/progressive left tech more accessible....
(DIR) Post #AZG0VnwpDp1bvbSv0C by tante@tldr.nettime.org
2023-08-30T13:05:25Z
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@fasterandworse very well said
(DIR) Post #AZG0bwUeMXs4AYDITw by esther@strangeobject.space
2023-08-30T13:08:16Z
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@tante and often, especially for these low-stakes tasks like organizing a picnic or whatever, if not using corporate-controlled tools is important enough to put in some effort, a non-tech solution might have a lower barrier for most people after all. “Give this person a call or email them, they’ll take care of it” is remarkably accessible and flexible
(DIR) Post #AZG0f3h435TjMwVR7w by linushagemann@digitalcourage.social
2023-08-30T13:08:16Z
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@tante This is probably more of a tangent, but:>Getting real actual people to buy a phone that's not built to be thrown away in a year of two, that highlights the values of sustainability is a huge win. Is the phones being built that way actually the problem? I do not want to throw shade, genuinely curios.Are these lower-medium price Samsung/Huawei phones or what are the problematic devices here? iPhones seem to last quite a while and while I know that the availability of security updates is an issue for a lot of phones - I doubt that people are super concerned about that? Probably less than they should...
(DIR) Post #AZG0j5xhYbKfYwDFlg by fasterandworse@hci.social
2023-08-30T13:09:01Z
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@tante thanks. It’s from my last article which I have been riding for too long now. Need to get the follow up finished https://fasterandworse.com/the-aura-of-care/
(DIR) Post #AZG0mSVaBc1YMFfFSK by lgehr@chaos.social
2023-08-30T13:09:50Z
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@tante you are so right!
(DIR) Post #AZG3Acyx63g3hS3PZQ by hirnsushi@strangeobject.space
2023-08-30T13:36:57Z
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@tante It's this debate again, huh 🙄Every few months someone starts that same discussion on the FP forum, again and again, it's sooo fucking tiring.FOSS purists have enough options, Fairphone has been very supportive when it comes to custom ROMs. There's not only /e/OS, the FP4 can be bought with iodéOS as well. CalyxOS, DivestOS, LOS all work great, but some people need the default to be what they want, because can't have regular people use the phone as well I guess … :Blobhaj_Sad_Reach:Now giving FP shit because their QA sucks (can't use my FP4 in the sun right now, in summer) and the security releases constantly being about a month behind schedule, that I'm all for.
(DIR) Post #AZG4Kh0B6dSv16zTnM by Hawkwinter@mementomori.social
2023-08-30T13:00:30Z
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@eichkat3r @tanteI think he's commenting on others complaining that theres a version on offer with googles play store and other stuff that is bad for privacy but that many customers would expect to have available.
(DIR) Post #AZG4KhzrPIo06PqjwG by tante@tldr.nettime.org
2023-08-30T13:49:59Z
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@Hawkwinter @eichkat3r Exactly. Specifically a well-known privacy activist.
(DIR) Post #AZG8eI6XmbdhPKZKcq by B2Spirit_TT@mastodon.social
2023-08-30T14:38:24Z
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@tante Sometimes, my friend:You have to laugh sticklers🔴https://rb.gy/ec23aAs a #Twitter refugee, intolerance on #Mastodon cracks me up. #Smartphone addicts turned Thought Police lecturing #Tech minimalists on tracking😋https://bit.ly/3itE0du📌Do your good work, mind your #Health, stay productive & leave antisocial #Media to the toxic & entitled🟢https://social.vivaldi.net/@B2Spirit/110976344636484075 #SocialMedia #USA #TimeManagement #Fediverse #Psychology #News #Fairphone #Security #Europe #Politics #MentalHealth▼
(DIR) Post #AZG9I2aWtLgsrrY4S8 by flameeyes@mastodon.social
2023-08-30T14:45:34Z
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@tante I know I'm boring with having always something related to plug, but here's from 2016https://flameeyes.blog/2016/11/11/technology-and-society-the-cellphone-example/
(DIR) Post #AZGCCLBZ8N5WfgqU4m by AlexanderMars@mastodon.social
2023-08-30T15:18:12Z
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@tante I really love Fairphone’s intentions, they put it into practice, walking the walk. For the privacy minded the unfortunately named /e/ OS(seriously) is an option, idk if it’s available on the 5, but I can’t imagine it wouldn’t. Taking fairphone to task over a vanilla android install is performative outrage and a missed opportunity to educate. Ditching the headphone jack however leaves me completely nonplussed, so I still won’t be buying one.
(DIR) Post #AZGCFnanyQQrdwIf7w by tante@tldr.nettime.org
2023-08-30T15:18:46Z
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@flameeyes that's what happens when one has very smart peers ;)
(DIR) Post #AZGD8x3OUzoKugyGrg by krig@6510.nu
2023-08-30T15:28:47Z
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@tante Funny how nothing is as triggering as people who won’t compromise on their ideals
(DIR) Post #AZGIhywdxXAAgWKwIS by steakfrite@mastodon.social
2023-08-30T16:31:03Z
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@tante My reaction to the news was : "Oh cool, I'm gonna wait until it's supported by my custom ROM to buy it !" Not "fuck FP for giving people stock android instead of debian on arm with plasma mobile 😠" lol
(DIR) Post #AZGK6m6cvnRe3jOOQa by Hawkwinter@mementomori.social
2023-08-30T16:46:48Z
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@tante @eichkat3rOkay. Yeah I saw that thread. Didnt know if there was more people also talking about it.I don't know the economic situation of the fairphone company. But if they couldnt stay in business selling all de-googled phones, they'd accomplish less in nonexistence than selling ethical hardware with either google spyware OS or another at customer's choice.
(DIR) Post #AZGPJDX5HhuWMqWIc4 by admin@mastodon.ai8w.ddns.net
2023-08-30T17:45:02Z
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@tante Oddly, Apple itself is also guilty all the same things Google and Meta (and Micro$oft, etc) are doing.. But it's OK because the OSs' GUI is "happy"
(DIR) Post #AZGQPofeDcopF0EgvQ by akareilly@hachyderm.io
2023-08-30T17:57:24Z
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@tante I had a Jolla phone and was happy with it aside from the fact that I couldn’t use Signal. If you don’t care about the networks your friends, family, and coworkers use, you can be a purist. I can put a ROM without nasty nasty evil Googles on a phone. What I can’t do is make the damned thing smaller. That’s the thing I will give Fairphone shit about. Phones are too damned big. Make a smaller phone and more people would buy it and use it longer.
(DIR) Post #AZGTnpEa4j1BniiR0K by enmodo@mastodon.social
2023-08-30T18:35:22Z
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@tante I wish the Ubuntu project for phones (and other devices) had been successful. Quite apart from the software and apps just having a good enough sustainable (both business and environmentally speaking) hardware platform would be huge win. If you look at what % of all phone users are on the latest flagship ~ $1000 a pop phones I'll bet its < 10%. The rest of us can use something like Fairphone. And if it's a hardware spec then like "the PC" it can be cloned and mass produced.
(DIR) Post #AZGglPYPsgFGyrAlwu by alice@marrow.haus
2023-08-30T21:00:38Z
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@tante As a professional geek, having run servers (web and otherwise) for many years, if someone gets heavy-handed in recommending Linux without a more… holistic… approach to consumer usage patterns, I can quip back::Wonka.gif: "Oh, so you want me to use a UNIX-like hybrid vendor operating system… GNU/Linux, was it? I prefer something actually UNIX certified, thanks. Like my Mac."They so often forget to mention GNU.Linux is "just" the kernel.Mac?!! Watch for the eye tic.It feels good. 👹
(DIR) Post #AZHQpRGC4jwPK0VXZw by Starkimarm@social.linux.pizza
2023-08-31T05:36:50Z
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@tante "Better is not good enough. It has to be perfect at first try!!!11!1"
(DIR) Post #AZHUvzdbZa3XUoq5A0 by halla@fosstodon.org
2023-08-31T06:22:49Z
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@tante I feel kinda sorry for them because since me and my wife have an FP4, we probably won't need to buy from them until they release the FP8. Yeah, google sucks. But the fairphone supports other os'es, too, even if society doesn't.
(DIR) Post #AZHXPdJ5MZpCpkVCiW by f09fa681@digitalcourage.social
2023-08-31T06:50:38Z
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@tante Can I give it shit for being yet another absolutely enormous brick, though?
(DIR) Post #AZHYr4WGOa6l0MJWb2 by RLetot@mamot.fr
2023-08-31T07:06:37Z
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@tante damn, 1st and 3rd posts are great, why did you have to sneak that strange 2nd one in there 😠
(DIR) Post #AZHb35cuIxABp1HPFI by tante@tldr.nettime.org
2023-08-31T07:31:22Z
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@f09fa681 sure
(DIR) Post #AZHhef8npDkkPKUvtQ by fakeplastictree@fosstodon.org
2023-08-31T08:45:23Z
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@tante It's okay to discuss the product. But you're blatantly manipulating when you're changing the object of the discussion from the phone to people who criticize it.
(DIR) Post #AZHlne1xiqOJO2pwmm by mray@social.tchncs.de
2023-08-31T09:31:47Z
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@tante I think the problem here was a prominent and unnecessary endorsement of google. Fairphone can do what they do without going out of their way to stress how google is the best thing since sliced bread, a thing that everybody clearly loves.
(DIR) Post #AZIVn3adnssAG9iPWi by kevinrns@mstdn.social
2023-08-31T18:07:06Z
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@tante Fuck google apps
(DIR) Post #AZIk6gEpjW4ez9lZWy by tastyraspberry@mastodon.online
2023-08-31T20:47:32Z
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@tante I think that their current approach – offering a "what most consumers expect" Android experience and referring to @e_mydata for people that care about sovereignty over their digital life – is just fine. Hoping that they'll integrate partnerships more of course, so that all Fairphone customers are made aware of the choice.One step at a time is the way to go. :)
(DIR) Post #AZMeBkYvGHneke2LEO by ben@mastodon.bentasker.co.uk
2023-09-02T17:59:58Z
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@tante Agreed, the few things that have irritated me on my Fairphone are Google things.But... it would also be a much less attractive phone without that stuff - not least because there are various paid apps that I use that only come through Play.I think I could, quite easily, convince family and the like to buy this phone - without Google apps it'd be a complete non starter.
(DIR) Post #AZMtmiS5ZKlMEXvQ0G by marshant@mastodon.scot
2023-09-02T20:54:51Z
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@tante I've got a Fairphone and my only complaint after 5-ish years is that it's still too big for my small hands and pockets. At the time I got it, I wasn't ready to leave the Google ecosystem. I'm absolutely in the target market for it, though.
(DIR) Post #AZP5HMI4Wk0PeEyeLA by myrmidon@mas.to
2023-09-03T22:13:06Z
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@tante I’m surprised by your last point as my encounters were not with one of those but people who forgot to take their pills ;)
(DIR) Post #AZS3z1rKfi7HUnbMNk by kaffeeringe@social.tchncs.de
2023-09-05T08:42:44Z
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@tante YES! An /e/ was available for the Fairphone 5 on the day of its' presentation - so I guess Fairphone cooperated on this issue.
(DIR) Post #AZS95qC2wXcP72MFf6 by ragectl@hachyderm.io
2023-09-05T09:39:56Z
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@tante I am not hating on Fairphone at all, but are they available outside the EU yet?
(DIR) Post #AZSEh6UvmlTQAKmLD6 by castarco@hachyderm.io
2023-09-05T10:42:39Z
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@tante Even if the surveillance economy was born out of capitalism, it is a distinct phenomenon on its own. It can survive the capitalist framework, and be "functional" under many other economic systems.It could also have not happened at all (its existence depends on a long list of science, tech and social "innovations" that are not directly tied to the economic system; and some of them were even created _against_ it!), while capitalism continued fucking us all in very distinct ways.