Post AYd7oUYPy5j0eiLyIS by freemo@qoto.org
(DIR) More posts by freemo@qoto.org
(DIR) Post #AYchKn9xdCIOrd5iNM by heidilifeldman@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T13:34:16Z
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U.S. #law schools should discourage students from applying for clerkships with #ClarenceThomas; faculty should refuse to recommend students for those clerkships; firms and other legal employers should refuse to hire people who have chosen to clerk for Thomas starting this year (when the large extent of his corruption became known). To do otherwise is to be complicit with Thomas’s unethical conduct. #LawFedi #LegalEthics #JudicialEthics
(DIR) Post #AYchKoUChQ5AyhZOZE by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T13:58:44Z
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@heidilifeldman I have no love for Thomas.. but no just ew no. Working for someone doesnt mean you should be an outcast for life... no lets stop with this petty nonsense. Focus on Thomas if you want to boycott someone.
(DIR) Post #AYciMuA4fZGJ74iQvA by opendna@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-08-11T14:09:52Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman Honestly? Knowing what we know now? Yeah, it should. It's like those who joined the Trump White House: literally everyone in the field knew it was a career-ender so only the stupid, corrupt, or morally bankrupt signed up. Republicans of intelligence or integrity blocked the transition team's phone number.It's not like someone can hope to learn anything about jurisprudence from the man. It's clearly nothing more than an internship in partisan corruption.
(DIR) Post #AYcj0x4xF3WPkEPuAS by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T14:17:35Z
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@opendna I hve no problem with you judging politicians by whatever standards you want.. but working people being denied jobs because of politicial associations.. absolutely not, disgusting.@heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYcoYroDqCtJ17a7xg by cowblizzard@mas.to
2023-08-11T15:19:45Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman yes it should follow you for life. You make your choice to work with a corrupt Justice, it says all we need to know about your character.
(DIR) Post #AYcowfgSZdhAMTIlma by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T15:24:02Z
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@cowblizzard Well lets hope people boycott you and refuse to ever hire you again for having such fascist views. Maybe you will learn something.@heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYcqy6s3B8vKsVXL4C by Ed_Brickell@mstdn.social
2023-08-11T15:46:43Z
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@freemo You are completely missing the point. It’s not his politics that are being boycotted here; it’s his significant and repeated failures in ethical conduct - absolutely unforgivable in a Supreme Court justice. Would you want a severely ethically compromised justice deciding your fate for years, even decades? No, I didn’t think so - end of.
(DIR) Post #AYcsaIgpmf0uUc461g by cowblizzard@mas.to
2023-08-11T16:04:49Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman ok.
(DIR) Post #AYcvSRuXupjAdaQVKS by rticks@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T16:36:57Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman Ew excusing working for a terrorist
(DIR) Post #AYcvhZoymucNVx2Isa by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T16:39:44Z
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@rticks He isnt a terrorist, he is a horrible human in many ways... but not a terrorist... and people need to feed their children. Most dont have the luxury to choose.@heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYcywQ2fjEKbOJD3zc by ThatPrilla@theatl.social
2023-08-11T17:16:00Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman They said "starting this year". Anyone who worked for him in the past is fine, but people choosing to work for him are most certainly aware of the reporting about him.Personally I think that's generous. It's unlikely that his clerks were totally unaware of how he was operating.
(DIR) Post #AYcz8QdxJoE6jONLOq by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T17:18:12Z
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@ThatPrilla @heidilifeldman Its not about awareness. People need to feed their families, or are trying to get training so they can get hired. Not to mention that forcing him to not have a staff isnt going to solve a damn thing, if anything will just make him worse not better.
(DIR) Post #AYd1DSEj1TVL1o69ke by chapulin_enojado@c.im
2023-08-11T17:41:32Z
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@freemo @opendna @heidilifeldman Thinking of Martin Bormann here. And all the other ordinary people, just working.
(DIR) Post #AYd1WqQfIdGLYuvfF2 by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T17:45:03Z
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@chapulin_enojado Even nazis dont qualify as war criminals just by being nazis. The ones who we find guilty actively gave orders rather than just following them. The reason is the same, much like people have to eat and work you'd get shot and killed if you stood up against your commander int he nazi army.@opendna @heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYd20cQ7wph2nosIgy by ThatPrilla@theatl.social
2023-08-11T17:50:24Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman Since 2020 he has had 18 law clerks.6 from Yale, 5 from Chicago, 3 from Harvard, and 1 each from NYU, Virginia, George Mason, and Alabama.Each class of 37 law clerks (4 per justice 5 for chief justice) is on a path towards being able to wield power and influence that will impact every person living in the United States.
(DIR) Post #AYd2NgFxqrFFMP7NNw by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T17:54:34Z
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@ThatPrilla Yes they are, and who they worked for should not change that. Now if they actively did anything on their own then by all means hold it against them. Thomas's decisions arent their own, nor do they necessarily have the luxury to quit.@heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYd2y2VUbOxAnHibWS by chapulin_enojado@c.im
2023-08-11T18:01:09Z
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@freemo @opendna @heidilifeldman 1. They're not just clerks, doing a job in a vacuum. Working so closely with Thomas, his clerks must have been aware of behavior like that described in the ProPublica articles. And likely more.2. Nobody is forcing Thomas' clerks to work for Thomas. They chose this. They're not at risk of being shot for leaving. They remain for personal gain. They could leave and not starve on a meager $500,000 law firm salary.3. Clerks don't just blindly follow orders. They do the research and write drafts for the justices.4. Given 1, 2, & 3 they are likely accomplices to Thomas' corrupt activities.
(DIR) Post #AYd3I2qd2oe9dv8zce by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T18:04:48Z
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@chapulin_enojado 1) They may be aware, they may not.. If you can show they were aware and didnt make any illegal actions public then youve got my support.2) Starving because you cant afford to eat is a gun against your head. You are assuming they have offers for working 500K at some other law firm, they may not.3) Again then demonstrate specific things the clerk did wrong and you have my support... If they created a draft that was their own opinion and not at the direction of Thomas, and it has damning stuff in it, then by all means share it and Ill be happy to support any resistance against such a person.@opendna @heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYd40XVQQ62FT7RW7M by ThatPrilla@theatl.social
2023-08-11T18:12:48Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman None of these folks would have trouble getting a job with likely better pay. With very few exceptions, they have a previous clerkship with a federal judge.By helping Thomas justify his opinions, they literally further his potentially corrupt influence.
(DIR) Post #AYd4KBncpkJ9wHKFaS by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T18:16:21Z
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@ThatPrilla Regardless, even if they could find a job, no this is wrong without actively reviewing their specific actions. They may very well be offering dissenting opinions to Thomas and very much trying to push him the opposite direction.These sort of idiotic blanket boycots on people simply by association, particularly employment, is not the way to go on any level.@heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYd4qh2AEwDQ4scoV6 by ThatPrilla@theatl.social
2023-08-11T18:22:08Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman That might be a compelling argument in the case of a justice who wasn't tainted by the appearance of corruption.Corruption isn't something you sway with a slick legal argument. Corruption dictates the outcome and finds justification after the fact.
(DIR) Post #AYd66UfG64EIIn0dXM by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T18:36:09Z
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@freemo @chapulin_enojado @opendna @heidilifeldman Any law student being offered a Supreme Court clerkship has plenty of other lucrative and prestigious alternatives, they're not about to "starve".
(DIR) Post #AYd6QE6rMBzckYKRqy by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T18:39:51Z
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@ThatPrilla For the corruption component I see two sides... Before the corruption was exposed they may not have known, so i wont hold that against them unless specific evidence surfaces they knew... After the corruption was exposed its not their responsibility to judge or investigate if the corruption is legitimate. There are mechanisms in place for that already and that is where that should be decided.@heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYd6jjRv3qCnRyTq1w by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T18:43:23Z
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@freemo Plenty of Nazis were found guilty for following orders. In 2015 Oscar Groning was convicted for facilitating mass murder at Auschwitz. he was a bookkeeper who never personally killed anyone. The "I was just following orders" defense was rejected at Nuremberg.
(DIR) Post #AYd6unq5538qFZ3ovo by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T18:45:24Z
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@freemo @rticks @heidilifeldman Law students who are offered Supreme Court clerkships do have that luxury
(DIR) Post #AYd6zU7pnpeiYbb5rk by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T18:46:13Z
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@cuibonobaby Thats not what im saying.. what im saying is even nazi's werent found guilty simply for having hitler as a "boss"
(DIR) Post #AYd73vpcjX5De3CRnc by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T18:47:02Z
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@freemo Keep moving those goalposts.
(DIR) Post #AYd7GCeG2FAFHAjcEi by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T18:49:14Z
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@freemo In fact, during the denazification process in Germany people were denied jobs just for being members of the party.
(DIR) Post #AYd7oUYPy5j0eiLyIS by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T18:55:26Z
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@cuibonobaby LOL as if adapting ones position when new information is learned is a bad thing.
(DIR) Post #AYd8RwtwVYJTrnEhRA by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T19:02:34Z
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@freemo what new information did you lthat caused you to change your position? In fact it appears like you couldn't defend your first position so you just adopted another one.
(DIR) Post #AYd8xhu1o9KKcFQ4R6 by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T19:08:19Z
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@cuibonobaby How has my original position changed? huhThe new information I responded to was the assertion that they could probably find new jobs easily enough. My original position never asserted that them being unable to find new work is the only reason that would justify them being a clerk, so how did I move the goalposts?
(DIR) Post #AYd9buRAckXZ4g5j4S by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T19:15:36Z
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@freemo I stand corrected. You didn't change your original position.
(DIR) Post #AYd9eoX52ADjd8EzGy by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T19:16:04Z
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@cuibonobaby appreciate the intellectual honesty on that reply, thanks.
(DIR) Post #AYd9pwBeun4UYVWcgC by MattFerrel@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-08-11T19:17:55Z
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@freemo @ThatPrilla @heidilifeldman this idea that Supreme Court clerks from elite law schools are pursuing and accepting clerkships with Thomas to “feed their families” is hilariously out of touch with reality. They have other options, all of which are lucrative.
(DIR) Post #AYdA9BhTSgNeAeaNOq by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T19:21:36Z
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@MattFerrel You: Hahaha they can get other jobs and feed their familyAlso you: We need to boycott them and make sure they cant get any jobs!@ThatPrilla @heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYdFXSuVcqEuGh4vZI by ThatPrilla@theatl.social
2023-08-11T20:22:00Z
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@freemo @MattFerrel @heidilifeldman No one called for anyone who ever worked for him in the past to be blacklisted. (I did note that it's hard to believe they weren't aware of his activities).Everyone who was working for him at the time or in the future has an ethical choice to make.
(DIR) Post #AYdLFKd4HAeV63enQ0 by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T21:25:58Z
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@freemo really? So you think KKK members should be hired at the Civil Rights division of the Department of Justice?
(DIR) Post #AYdLeTDRUJU6y2eqQ4 by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T21:30:30Z
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@cuibonobaby How in the world did you get that from what I just said? Being in the KKK is not a political association.
(DIR) Post #AYdLkAVjwerqh0vwRs by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-11T21:31:33Z
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@freemo Of course it's a political association.
(DIR) Post #AYdLzgPHdhJ3xZJMwa by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-11T21:34:20Z
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@cuibonobaby No, how is being in the KKK and an assocition with a political figure? It is an organization, not a person, it isnt a political party nor contain any politicians.
(DIR) Post #AYdcX0TXdytV1aDOJE by cuibonobaby@mastodon.social
2023-08-12T00:39:40Z
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@freemo What difference does it make whether the association is with an individual or an organization? If you think the KKK doesn't contain any politicians you don't know much about the history of the KKK.
(DIR) Post #AYdcw9Wd8MhAKceN4C by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-12T00:44:11Z
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@cuibonobaby I never said the issue was organization vs individual.. they arent a political party, they arent a political individual. They are neither. What they are is an organization whose purpose it is to harass minorities.
(DIR) Post #AYdh5cP7X2ciJwuH56 by amoshiashwili@mastodon.world
2023-08-12T01:30:44Z
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@freemo @opendna @heidilifeldman so in your mind, hyperconnected lawyers who will get a half million dollar bonus just for that line on their resume are "working people"And "don't work for obviously corrupt people" is "punish people for their political associations" in your mind. I guess you're saying that you automatically associate corruption with Thomas's political party?
(DIR) Post #AYdhQf6ofeOEn5NaEK by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-12T01:34:31Z
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@amoshiashwili They arent people who are working? The what now?also no, I addressed your second point already. If they had inside information about corruption, then yes, you should hold them accountable. Now if your expecting them to act on corruption becoming publicly known, there is a formal system in place to investigate those claims and act on them. It is not an employees responsiblity to determine their bosses innocence or guilt, or to hold him accountable for it.@opendna @heidilifeldman
(DIR) Post #AYdhcNuYRBYIvaEYYC by amoshiashwili@mastodon.world
2023-08-12T01:36:40Z
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@freemo @opendna @heidilifeldman WOW. That's just... Wow."Tell me you've never worked in a competently managed professional workplace without saying..."
(DIR) Post #AYdxlkOzmh82YTxVQ0 by opendna@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-08-12T04:37:37Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman You're telling me that it is wrong to judge a candidate's moral integrity, for positions which require exceptional trust and professional ethics, and that it is wrong for people who suffer genuine persecution to refuse to associate with the people who spend their days making that persecution possible.Thomas is both single most notorious example of public corruption in office today in America. His clerks are unfit for the profession. They can be carpenters or line cooks.
(DIR) Post #AYdyeBDgIGRbMjccqm by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-12T04:47:27Z
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@opendna @heidilifeldman No that is not what im saying.
(DIR) Post #AYdyiXvdnu2MxGGXr6 by opendna@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-08-12T04:46:12Z
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@freemo @heidilifeldman For every Thomas clerk employed in law, there are thousands of more ethical young attorneys who will not find employment in the field.What you are arguing for is rewarding corruption above integrity, nepotism above merit, and the politics of bigotry above tolerance.
(DIR) Post #AYdyiYnWZZ8feNTZqK by freemo@qoto.org
2023-08-12T04:48:15Z
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@opendna @heidilifeldman@mastodon.sociaNo thats not what im arguing for.