Post AY0mSMNe0w3ReNs7iy by Powareverb@mastodon.nz
(DIR) More posts by Powareverb@mastodon.nz
(DIR) Post #AXscjf5yzjhIqTs7cG by billbennett@mastodon.nz
2023-07-13T20:40:44Z
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@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons The problem is that the arguments in favour of such taxes are more complicated and require listeners to think while the arguments against are simple and work on an emotional knee-jerk level. That’s impossible to fight in an election. People have been trained to reject additional taxes, even if they are unlikely to pay them.
(DIR) Post #AXscjl8gWbQLabBMf2 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-20T08:30:27Z
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@billbennett> People have been trained to reject additional taxes, even if they are unlikely to pay themWhere do you get this cynical mythology from? A number of scientific surveys reported by MediaWatch have consistently found that the majority of kiwis oppose tax cuts and support higher taxes. Even some of my most rabidly pro-business friends support increasing taxes on the wealthy and using the funds to pay for universal basic services.@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AXsgD4UByLMzqwuWzQ by Powareverb@mastodon.nz
2023-07-20T09:09:23Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons if anything, people are being *trained* by media to hate taxes. I'm super keen to pay more taxes. I'm sure I'm not the only one.
(DIR) Post #AXsmEisHtRTZ8ALsnI by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-20T10:16:56Z
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So if the NatLabs aren't ruling out taxing the wealthy because that's what citizens want, then why? Because it's what their biggest *donors* want. In other words, the NatLabs are auctioning off chunks of policy to the highest bidder, to fund their election campaigns.This points to a major weakness in our current electoral "democracies", identified by Lawrence Lessig in his talk about "Tweedism"; the "money primary" decides:https://yewtu.be/watch?v=PJy8vTu66tE@billbennett@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AXsmxf1953xCCPvIOW by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-20T10:25:03Z
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If we want elections to produce governments that actually represent the interests of citizens, and respond to their needs and desires on an equal basis between elections, then we need to stop those policy auctions;* only allow people - human individuals not companies or trusts - to make campaign donations* limit how much each person can contribute per election, based on what the average person can realistically afford@billbennett@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb#PolicyNZ
(DIR) Post #AXsnU2EKJQ1PSUWf56 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-20T10:30:54Z
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This is good for democracy and for everyone involved in the electoral process. Citizens get responsive representation. Parties get to escape from the financial arms race, where they waste more money on every campaign, and spend more time pimping themselves for it. Even the wealthy, who don't get to buy policy anymore, but do get to avoid living in a society that resembles a Mad Max movie more and more, with every passing year. Everyone wins.@billbennett@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb
(DIR) Post #AXsna52wkmjlvn5MuG by Powareverb@mastodon.nz
2023-07-20T10:31:58Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons be better if there were no donations at all imho, but thats probably too drastic by half.
(DIR) Post #AXsom77axrklnOYtP6 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-20T10:45:21Z
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@Powareverb > be better if there were no donations at allI have seen proposals to abolish privately-funded election campaigns, and have funding provided to all parties by the Electoral Commission. I'm not totally opposed to this, but there be dragons. I can see a few ways this could also be used to allow a minority to shape the policy agenda of all parties with a realistic shot at forming a government.@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AXsqHODZYBgxkapp6O by billbennett@mastodon.nz
2023-07-20T11:02:10Z
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@strypey @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons OK. So explain this. Labour drops wealth tax plans promises no CGT and recovers in the polls almost back to parity with the right. I don’t like it any more than you do, but National’s focus on tax policy was working. Hear me out…. 1/2
(DIR) Post #AXsuUyoBDdQUoah3mi by billbennett@mastodon.nz
2023-07-20T11:08:14Z
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@strypey @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons Rational arguments about taxes and economics can work when discussions are reasoned and balanced, but right-wingers often use rhetoric designed to appeal to the lower, dinosaur part of brains which respond in an unthinking way to simplistic slogans and messages. It’s much easier to see how this works if you look at, say, the Trump v Clinton election.
(DIR) Post #AXsuUzUifTSCwWb25g by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-20T11:49:30Z
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@billbennett> It’s much easier to see how this works if you look at, say, the Trump v Clinton election😂 Oh that's gold.Wait.. were you serious?@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AXsviWTDTZoAvyuSPY by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-20T12:03:10Z
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@billbennett> Labour drops wealth tax plans promises no CGT and recovers in the polls almost back to parity with the rightNo new polls have been taken since those policies were announced. I don't think any have even been published since then.Intriguing that you expect this result. I doubt you'll get it. For the simple and obvious reason that anyone who is that desperate to be taxed by corps rather than govts, bounced back to the NatACTs as soon as Ardern quit.@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AY0QYVbgHy2q2uIFXM by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T02:51:39Z
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@mark> not that an average person can realistically afford $30,000True, but having any kind of limit would be a big step forward from where we are now. The challenge is getting the NatLabs to vote for limiting the amount of money people can give them : /Maybe electoral reform needs another round of binding referenda, rather than a den of foxes voting on security measures for the henhouse... @isaacfreeman @billbennett @Powareverb @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AY0QqRov6bMjVz2WYa by lightweight@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T02:40:31Z
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@strypey yes, and ensure full disclosure of *every* donation down to a very small denomination. @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb
(DIR) Post #AY0QqScu6lLe10QRSy by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T02:54:51Z
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@lightweight> ensure full disclosure of *every* donation down to a very small denominationI don't support this. Partly because if donations were limited in frequency and quantity, it seems like overkill. Partly because in a small country, being able to find out that an employee donated to a socially liberal party might motivated a conservative employer to subtly (or not so subtly) discriminate against them.@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb
(DIR) Post #AY0UuPbFhckfbSnC88 by kaffiene@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T03:40:22Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons While it's true that the population support taxing the rich, the media will pillory such moves. Labour have shown that they are allergic to anything that might make the media frown at them and require actual argument on their part (see their capitulation on CGT)
(DIR) Post #AY0VwaE7GNUt5xZOzY by ojala@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T03:52:01Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb I would set the donation limit to whatever nobody would sell a policy for. Say 1 grand or even less.
(DIR) Post #AY0jmTl5zYe8Skk7rU by Powareverb@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T06:27:04Z
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@strypey @lightweight @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons yep, agree on both points but I still wish this could be. Second one is interesting, how do you provide a mechanism giving accountability for donations without allowing for discrimination? Feels like a separate solvable problem.
(DIR) Post #AY0mSMNe0w3ReNs7iy by Powareverb@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T06:57:03Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons Lessig is great eh. And this is a fantastic vid. Love especially how he sets up each point, then drops the truth.As well as donations, our setup for local elections is another great example, right?
(DIR) Post #AY0n0kNLJ6btuq7zFY by radiotime@ravenation.club
2023-07-24T07:03:11Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb "* only allow people - human individuals not companies or trusts - to make campaign donations" failing this, you might as well let corporations vote
(DIR) Post #AY14MDqwbWmedlneFs by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T10:17:40Z
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@kaffiene> While it's true that the population support taxing the rich, the media will pillory such movesSo it seems. Who pays corporate news media bills? Predominantly the biggest spenders on advertising. Who owns those? The same people who make the biggest campaign donations to political parties. So like the parties, news media are auctioning off their platforms to the highest bidder : /(1/2)@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AY14XYUaCxbhpzkDVA by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T10:19:42Z
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@kaffieneThis is why;a) I roll my eyes when the news media romanticise themselves as arbiters of objective truth, and servants of democracy, and pillory social media as the sole source of mis/disinfob) I favour direct democracy over representation in politics, and decentralisation over representation in media.(2/2)@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AY15bTNTGZLH5SqkKm by kaffiene@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T03:50:57Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb Great video!
(DIR) Post #AY15bU8GSalxQak7Gq by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T10:31:37Z
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@kaffiene> Great video!Ae. Not only is Lessig is an accomplished presenter, he never presents on a subject until he has thoroughly explored and mastered it. An explosive combo.Lessig's contributions to the world include legal support for the early FSF, and founding CreativeCommons. His exploration of Tweedism came out of the brick walls both organisations came up against when lobbying govt in the public interest.@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb
(DIR) Post #AY15hzJXRKFJsG7JIG by kaffiene@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T03:58:59Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb Or perhaps no donations at all for established parties?
(DIR) Post #AY15i0BmBfdCaTUcpk by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T10:32:47Z
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@kaffiene> Or perhaps no donations at all for established parties?That seems overly restrictive. Also, what would your legal test be for "established"?@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb
(DIR) Post #AY16M35EqQkz9EWxs0 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T10:40:04Z
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@Powareverb> As well as donations, our setup for local elections is another great example, right?I'm not sure what you mean. Care to expand on this?@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AY16QfBr6fzCUZpHtI by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-24T10:40:53Z
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@radiotime> failing this, you might as well let corporations voteYou might as well *only* let corporations vote.@billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb
(DIR) Post #AY17Alpijy32PqSTom by Powareverb@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T10:49:12Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoonsPerhaps I'm mistaken, but "wherever you pay rates, you can vote" seems a little like getting extra votes if you have plenty of money.https://www.votelocal.co.nz/information-for-voters/ratepayer-roll-registration/
(DIR) Post #AY1qx2wwtsuJL6EWlE by kaffiene@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T19:22:07Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb i don't think that' needs to be complicated. Size of party vote would do - any party thats received > 5% is no longer eligible for private donations. That way people can fund new ideas but once parties are established money can't sway the political system
(DIR) Post #AY1s7xc1BZSnvOD9JA by kaffiene@mastodon.nz
2023-07-24T19:35:15Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons strongly agree with your first point
(DIR) Post #AY2J8oDIJTBxpKHA12 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-25T00:37:59Z
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@Powareverb > "wherever you pay rates, you can vote" seems a little like getting extra votes if you have plenty of money.Oh I see. This is complicated. There's a fair argument that a person has a meaningful interest in the Council of a place where they own a property. But unfair that property ownership is so heavily skewed towards one slice of the population. Arguably if we could solve that problem, it would solve this local election problem too. @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AY2O7kimJLLcTeJlKa by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-25T01:33:53Z
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@kaffiene> any party thats received > 5% In the last election? Ever?> That way people can fund new ideas but once parties are established money can't sway the political systemI agree with the motivation. But if parties already in Parliament can't use public money for campaigning (which is they can't and that's good), and they can't accept donations, how do they cover printing manifestos and other basic campaign costs? billbennett@mastodon.nz @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb
(DIR) Post #AY3vmajXqBzr1GiXkO by kaffiene@mastodon.nz
2023-07-25T19:25:40Z
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@strypey @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb I'm in favour of public funding of political parties.
(DIR) Post #AY4EYewPIbcn8xntmS by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-07-25T22:56:07Z
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@kaffiene> I'm in favour of public funding of political parties@Powareverb pointed in this direction in an earlier post:https://mastodon.nz/@Powareverb/110745951848591527See my reply.@isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons
(DIR) Post #AY4Imea3preNteHQBM by radiotime@ravenation.club
2023-07-25T23:43:25Z
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@strypey @billbennett @isaacfreeman @SlaneCartoons @Powareverb once you let an 800 lb elephant get a foot in the door...