Post AXl50R4sfydPe6pXay by freemo@qoto.org
(DIR) More posts by freemo@qoto.org
(DIR) Post #AXl50QKnRJltLBGjlQ by marcelias@mas.to
2023-07-16T14:12:42Z
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More evidence that No Labels is a joke. Its newly released platform includes voting as an "idea." If you don't know what it means to have a "counted vote" verified, neither do I, neither do they. It's gibberish, pure and simple.
(DIR) Post #AXl50R4sfydPe6pXay by freemo@qoto.org
2023-07-16T17:09:34Z
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@marcelias Actually I think they have been quite clear on what they meant by this as they have been very consistent in what they ask for.. you may not agree, and thats fine, but we know the ask...They want all votes to be verified with a proper government issued photo ID in person. So no mail-in votes, and all states must require photo ID verified at the booths.I personally dont like it because it breaks state sovereignty.. so I am against it. But I wont pretend I dont understand what they mean...
(DIR) Post #AXl7Mlta9lcAUSK88G by SteveBellovin@mastodon.lawprofs.org
2023-07-16T15:41:43Z
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@marcelias @20002ist It’s actually not gibberish. There are cryptographic mechanisms that can be used to let an individual verify, in a privacy-preserving way, that their vote was included in the published count. Whether this is a good idea is a separate question, since it requires far too much software in vote-casting.
(DIR) Post #AXl7Mmyw7LUXrLpv7I by geofft@mastodon.social
2023-07-16T16:43:51Z
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@SteveBellovin @marcelias @20002ist Is casting a non-provisional ballot and having it not counted actually a thing that happens? I feel like way more cases are people being told they can't vote or being pressured out of voting.
(DIR) Post #AXl7Mnq6ve1gWGiO00 by SteveBellovin@mastodon.lawprofs.org
2023-07-16T16:57:04Z
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@geofft @marcelias @20002ist Yup!That said, see https://people.csail.mit.edu/rivest/pubs/CCCCx10.pdf on verification of votes being counted. ALSO see https://people.csail.mit.edu/rivest/pubs/RW06.pdf on "software independence", which most experts (including, of course, @mattblaze) regard as crucial.
(DIR) Post #AXl7MoVwQ7UEc0HnCS by mattblaze@federate.social
2023-07-16T17:21:57Z
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@SteveBellovin @geofft @marcelias @20002ist Right. Also worth noting that end-to-end-verifiable voting and software independence are orthogonal. The former is still basically a research subject; existing systems are extremely complex and not yet practical.Software independence, on the other hand, is currently achievable and crucial, since software-based tabulation systems are inherently unreliable.
(DIR) Post #AXl7MpN7EQ1NGvAG5A by mattblaze@federate.social
2023-07-16T17:24:37Z
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@SteveBellovin @geofft @marcelias @20002ist So advocating for software-independent elections is sensible and basically uncontroversial among experts.But advocating end-to-end-verifiable elections today is like basing health policy on the assumption that cancer will be cured next year. It would be NICE, but don't bet on it.
(DIR) Post #AXl7Mq0oqnmRG3jxy4 by tomjennings@tldr.nettime.org
2023-07-16T17:36:00Z
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@mattblaze @SteveBellovin @geofft @marcelias @20002ist Apropos to nothing, someone on the old FidoNet came up with a solid scheme for voting on an open system. Of course doesn't require a computer. You put your vote (yes, no etc) adjacent to a magic word and send it to the compiler of votes. Those individual ballots form a list. The list is a public file. Everyone can download the list, find their magic word and vote, tally their own results etc. Requires a sort of vigilance and competence maybe not scaleable but systems abound.
(DIR) Post #AXl7wp5DmXvGnlxU4O by mattblaze@federate.social
2023-07-16T17:42:30Z
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@tomjennings @SteveBellovin @geofft @marcelias @20002ist Secure voting with all the requirements of civil elections is complicated. And This doesn't meet them.For example, it allows you to reveal (and sell) your vote by agreeing in advance on your magic word with the buyer.Useful voting schemes involve more than some dude's idea that they tweeted, I'm afraid.
(DIR) Post #AXl8426lknlDE17X2e by mattblaze@federate.social
2023-07-16T17:42:57Z
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@tomjennings @SteveBellovin @geofft @marcelias @20002ist Secure voting with all the requirements of civil elections is complicated. And this, sadly, doesn't meet them.For example, it allows you to reveal (and sell) your vote by agreeing in advance on your magic word with the buyer.Useful voting schemes involve more than some dude's idea that they tweeted, I'm afraid.
(DIR) Post #AXlBNUtnEbfhsm1Xvs by jpgoldberg@ioc.exchange
2023-07-16T18:20:56Z
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@tomjennings @mattblaze @SteveBellovin @geofft @marcelias @20002ist additionally, such verification schemes may be transparent to a few mathematicians, but are not so to most voters.(I used to be an advocate of these. I’ve since come to better understand how fragile public confidence in the systems may be.)
(DIR) Post #AXlCBbrlbXAxyDyIdM by jpgoldberg@ioc.exchange
2023-07-16T18:28:43Z
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@tomjennings @mattblaze @SteveBellovin @geofft @marcelias @20002ist that is typical of proposals by those (including my past self) who tried to solve a couple of salient problems without recognizing other problems that existing systems solve.The voting booth solved the problem of voter coercion/buying so well that we have forgotten that it was once an enormous problem.