Post AW3KvuASH3v2jcvm1A by pep@post.lurk.org
(DIR) More posts by pep@post.lurk.org
(DIR) Post #AVwVcf4JvVH9nGMuHI by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-23T09:45:17Z
0 likes, 3 repeats
Hey @xmpp folks, if I was to encourage the devs of a messaging server/client written in Rust to implement XMPP, with MUC and OMEMO, what would be the best links to send them for guidance?#XMPP #Rust
(DIR) Post #AVwYkjNU5ZoDKxs6bo by EndlessMason@hachyderm.io
2023-05-23T10:20:26Z
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@strypey @xmpp .
(DIR) Post #AVwdWjUnLy5tQ4R4ts by pep@post.lurk.org
2023-05-23T11:13:55Z
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@strypey @xmpp We've released https://xmpp.rs 0.4. There's still a long way to go but we'd like to get feedback.That's a client library, even though it may be possible to use parsers for the server side as well. And there's a patch pending for OMEMO too.
(DIR) Post #AVwi4bqggrXVMj5KIi by sysrq@freespeechextremist.com
2023-05-23T12:05:01.371173Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@strypey @xmpp >rust>xmpp:fire::shitassdickfuckfluoride::fire:
(DIR) Post #AVxVGSmp6a0mUKYkBk by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-23T21:16:06Z
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@pep> We've released https://xmpp.rs 0.4Thanks for that. It was among the good suggestions I got from the ModernXMPP MUC.TBH the nature of the project means they're more likely to implement matrix, using Conduit as a guide on the server side and the Rust SDK for clients.@xmpp
(DIR) Post #AVxVVuRgYGKWcC2OFE by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-23T21:18:55Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Corfiothttps://www.zombo.com/
(DIR) Post #AVxXjh7B6z1lEV98qW by pep@post.lurk.org
2023-05-23T21:43:46Z
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@strypey @xmpp Yeah everyone has got expectations and no one comes to help. And then they say something about how it's not mature and they go make their own. So there's that. #FreeSoftwareI hope they're happy with whatever they choose (or don't choose).
(DIR) Post #AVxdlxp6YnZjME9rpw by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-23T22:51:28Z
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@pepIt's not even a definite that they will federate. My main goal with the info I shared was to encourage them to do so, and to make the case that either XMPP or matrix would be a better choice for a chat app than ActivityPub ; ) @xmpp
(DIR) Post #AVxigJiqj6nNJGMJto by pernia@cum.salon
2023-05-23T23:46:29.377263Z
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@strypey @xmpp goatse.cx
(DIR) Post #AVycsM27YVZZNugods by pep@post.lurk.org
2023-05-24T10:16:01Z
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@strypey @xmpp Ok sorry I'm re-reading your post and I must have been hallucinating when writing that reply. That's a comment I get often (what I replied to) so I didn't even think it through.
(DIR) Post #AVzo5ioRT0wqS5pOcq by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-24T23:56:28Z
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@pepWhat sort of help would be useful to the team developing xmpp-rs? More Rust devs with an interest in federation protocols? More federation protocol devs keen to learn Rust? Something else?
(DIR) Post #AW0rKsdTil9KHZZzIu by pep@post.lurk.org
2023-05-25T12:07:28Z
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@strypey For xmpp-rs, anybody with time and motivation would be a good addition.There are people with technical skills gravitating around but I feel like I'm the one "having to" drive the project and that's just not me. I'll try to help whoever comes by and asks, and I'll take on tasks if necessary for the person to be able to do whatever they want if it looks somewhat achievable.Also I've been conceptually stuck on a few things in this library for some time (API design?), so I started projects around to attempt to look at it in other ways.https://code.bouah.net/pep/muchrooms, and recently https://code.bouah.net/pep/cusku. I guess that's me trying to show the lib is already usable (even though I know of glaringly missing features).The lower libs (jid, minidom, parsers) should already be pretty complete too, or at least more straightforward to add up to.Other examples of the lower libs in use: https://github.com/avstack/gst-meetThe parsers lib is mostly written by @linkmauve, who also contributed there.#XMPP #Rust
(DIR) Post #AW1oKj7ez9Z44btM8W by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-25T23:08:38Z
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@pep> For xmpp-rs, anybody with time and motivation would be a good additionCan I suggest writing up a blog piece or a simple homepage about the state of XMPP work in Rust? It could also introduce xmpp-rs, summarizing its goals and areas that need work. But something that gives an overview of projects underway and how they relate to each other, an entry point for Rust people interested in XMPP. I found a bunch of things in a web search, but it was hard to tell what to focus on. @linkmauve
(DIR) Post #AW2TWvpPfTIt4iINDE by dekkzz76@emacs.ch
2023-05-26T06:50:13Z
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@strypey @xmpp xmpp.org ?
(DIR) Post #AW2xIn64KbeeZ9G8LQ by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-26T12:23:51Z
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@dekkzz76I presume these devs know how to use a search engine. I was looking for something a bit more specific ; )
(DIR) Post #AW2xNMnnWPmsSitYIK by dekkzz76@emacs.ch
2023-05-26T12:24:38Z
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@strypey never assume
(DIR) Post #AW2xYEeCBKaMM7aOu0 by dekkzz76@emacs.ch
2023-05-26T12:26:36Z
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@strypey https://xmpp.org/extensions/
(DIR) Post #AW30ctFRTFcHIVv2zA by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-26T13:01:06Z
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@dekkzz76> https://xmpp.org/extensions/That's marginally more specific, but still not much use to someone looking for guidance related to implementing XMPP in Rust.
(DIR) Post #AW30ikM3RtatS8nxBo by dekkzz76@emacs.ch
2023-05-26T13:02:07Z
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@strypey thats the core specs, the rust is up to them
(DIR) Post #AW316LImFLGGhdWUhE by dekkzz76@emacs.ch
2023-05-26T13:06:23Z
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@strypey thats the core specs, the rust is up to them dependant on skill, if they read it out of a book or are frsh out of college then they are outta luck, given how neglected xmpp is theyre likely starting from scratchsee thread belowhttps://users.rust-lang.org/t/is-there-a-working-lightweight-xmpp-client-library/43128
(DIR) Post #AW31ubT8Pb1FK6KlRw by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-26T13:15:22Z
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@dekkzz76> see thread belowI hate to be picky, but my goal was to provide the devs with something specific *and* helpful. That link ticks one one of these boxes ; )
(DIR) Post #AW32Ht27H5PGSSnZoW by dekkzz76@emacs.ch
2023-05-26T13:19:40Z
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@strypey you don't hate to be picky using hagelian dialectici've scoured google and thats the best there is, i have not looked at other langs to see if any general methodolgies would transfer or give hints applicable to rust
(DIR) Post #AW3KvuASH3v2jcvm1A by pep@post.lurk.org
2023-05-26T16:48:32Z
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@strypey @linkmauve Yeah that's a good suggestion. A friend already proposed help in this regard and we're going to setup a static website / blog articles ✊
(DIR) Post #AW3sNtUhfVGFF4M7Qe by zash@fosstodon.org
2023-05-26T22:54:44Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@pep @strypey @linkmauve What's that, an "are we xmpp yet?" page? :D
(DIR) Post #AW41vhlMgsKiI8LWWe by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-27T00:50:25Z
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@dekkzz76 > i've scoured google and thats the best there isThanks for your time. I too did some web searching and found nothing clearly helpful. Which is why I asked here, knowing that someone with inside knowledge would point me in the right direction. If you click on the OP and read the whole thread, you can see this worked out.Never teach a pig to sing. It's a waste of your time and annoys the pig ;)
(DIR) Post #AW43vKq07rRz6ASxQ8 by screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-05-27T01:12:44Z
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@strypey @dekkzz76 I think referring to the RFCs is appropriate. Presumably the programmers are either senior enough to work with that, or else they should adopt / participate in other freedom respecting projects they like.Part of why this is the case is that if you are not intending to credit a source, your implementation should not have meaningfully seen another person's implementation, to the point where you might choose a deliberately different implementation strategy out of courtesy.
(DIR) Post #AW4AQRokp9r9Rr6MsK by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-27T02:25:36Z
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@pep> we're going to setup a static website / blog articles Awesome! Let me know when it's up and I'll pass it on to the devs working on that Rust chat app. @linkmauve
(DIR) Post #AW4DmlyEsNu8BWsJqi by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-27T03:03:15Z
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@screwtape > I think referring to the RFCs is appropriateIt's not inappropriate, it's just not helpful. Giving that link to someone who knows how to use a web browser and a search engine is kind of insulting their intelligence. Whereas a link to an existing implementation in the language they're working with - even if incomplete - is more helpful.> your implementation should not have meaningfully seen another person's implementationThis kind of proprietary attitude makes no sense here.
(DIR) Post #AW4GFOuBuYPoxIlCpk by screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-05-27T03:30:48Z
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@strypey hang on, I think my toot was a presponse to this toot.Either the RFCs are good enough as a reference for what the RFCs are, or the person uses an existing library they like. For example libpurple. What I mentioned about not wanting to be derivative is even common amoung freedom respecting people sometimes, for other reasons than being "legally" distinct.
(DIR) Post #AW4LCDucpGtdlOGf44 by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-27T04:26:18Z
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@screwtape > Either the RFCs are good enough as a reference for what the RFCs are, or the person uses an existing library they likeSpecs are necessary, but not sufficient. I can't anticipate whether the devs will want to federate their chat app at all, let alone whether they will use XMPP for that. What I was trying to do is make it easier for them to quantify the amount of work involved in implementing federation, and evaluate whether XMPP or matrix would be better for their use case.
(DIR) Post #AW4VFRnCfuAhDryL4a by screwtape@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-05-27T06:18:52Z
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@strypey I remember you encouraged me to expand on my left-out bits from toots:What I've been trying to point out is that when you talk to some developers (of the indicated language), those developers will be able to tell you whether they are going to implement a new library, or whether they will use their language's C language ffi to use libpurple to do XMPP / misc chat stuff. Libpurple has had problems in the past, but if your devs aren't writing their own library, they would likely use that