Post AUy91qBZPipkGeT1gu by pinhman@mstdn.ca
(DIR) More posts by pinhman@mstdn.ca
(DIR) Post #AUx4y0w0ug5jTL9P60 by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-23T15:39:03Z
2 likes, 4 repeats
Our grocery bills, and all bills, are high because of more greed than ever in history? Oh, that explains it. 🛒🍋🍞🥛https://fortune.com/2023/04/05/end-of-capitalism-inflation-greedflation-societe-generale-corporate-profits/ #inflation #greedflation #economy #economics h/t @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUy8hReYunNqOFIokq by herbiekerby@mindly.social
2023-04-23T17:32:14Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo I’ve been writing the Federal Reserve Board about this for close to a year. And I’ve been writing my elected officials about the price gouging and rent skyrocketing because of corporate greed and buying up the housing market and the staff member didn’t understand where I was coming from. They are so out of touch about how the everyday guy is trying to literally survive.
(DIR) Post #AUy8icClAbWHP9r93Q by dfraser@mastodon.sdf.org
2023-04-23T17:50:58Z
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@davidaugust “markup growth” is a nice euphemism for greed
(DIR) Post #AUy8oomVK8HI9DX756 by GhostOnTheHalfShell@masto.ai
2023-04-23T19:31:00Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo The essence of the situation is that economic consolidation leads to pure rent seeking and this has got to be the worst form of it in a long time. Even feudal lords ran down their economic order because they ran up debt engaging in war and spending lavishly on luxury goods.
(DIR) Post #AUy8oqQxBEEBGxSvlg by GhostOnTheHalfShell@masto.ai
2023-04-23T19:32:20Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo The concentration itself has destroyed competition (thru reduction in businesses) and competitors (through cross ownership).A high GINI is a signal that markets are dying and are doing so at an accelerating rate. Both democracy and whatever pillars of capitalism are said to exist are effectively dead. Whatever the Koch Network and it’s affiliates wail about the threat to American values, it is them who have destroyed it.
(DIR) Post #AUy8pjOipE7fjxqQQS by VHasch@universeodon.com
2023-04-23T19:47:28Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo Sooner or later, the greed will destroy their business. You can't get blood from a stone, and we're all pretty skint right now.
(DIR) Post #AUy8pjzwaptfbPG9RY by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-23T19:47:58Z
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@VHasch @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo yes. Such imbalance will adjust, either gently or not gently.
(DIR) Post #AUy8wVckQytn35dYbA by yoshimitsu@mstdn.social
2023-04-23T18:31:18Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo This is why the solution isn't to "make more money," it's to spend less. What happens when we "pay people more"? Prices go up, often outpacing any wage gains.Start taking steps to reduce your reliance and contribution to the system, then eventually we can reverse the trajectory of the disparity in wealth.It won't happen until it's cool and sexy to spend less instead of making more.
(DIR) Post #AUy8wWObZ3BDRW1mC0 by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-23T18:35:57Z
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@yoshimitsu @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo many hundreds of millions of people are already spending as little as they can. Shrinking expenses alone does not translate to financial stability. Most humans cannot become subsistence farmers totally independent of the rest of the world.
(DIR) Post #AUy8wWwdWWOz93wxEm by yoshimitsu@mstdn.social
2023-04-23T19:13:25Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo Most of the people spending "as little as they can" are not in the US and certainly not in major cities.Please keep in mind the difference between "needs" and "wants" before you try arguing to the contrary.
(DIR) Post #AUy8wXV1SfuKri2Ppo by antimagaglitterbomb@universeodon.com
2023-04-23T23:34:08Z
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@yoshimitsu @davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo Kind of hard for people to spend less when their income is not enough to even cover their "needs."That is the reality for many people in the US and worldwide.
(DIR) Post #AUy8wYRVxChBn7P80O by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-24T02:43:19Z
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@antimagaglitterbomb @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo Perhaps @yoshimitsu, you are unfamiliar with the economic realities of the American people. Shelter is a need, not a want. https://www.bentley.edu/news/why-its-hard-house-homeless
(DIR) Post #AUy91m5kdPnnZRiK48 by pinhman@mstdn.ca
2023-04-23T17:39:24Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo T hese 28 Rochdale men scraped together a meagre capital and opened a shop in Toad Lane, where they sold wholesome food at reasonable prices https://www.ccw.coop/history/
(DIR) Post #AUy91mmI5FpVhNcIN6 by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-23T17:45:17Z
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@pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo inspiring, not sure if such a plan can scale quickly and impact grocery prices. And it is unlikely such a plan would have any impact on other prices.
(DIR) Post #AUy91nM5w8TBUQMtBA by pinhman@mstdn.ca
2023-04-23T18:01:06Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo There are many small local food coops, often organic & health oriented to serve unmet needs in communities. These have had years of success. With coop membership comes involvement and commitment beyond what’s the most convenient. The big grocery chains won’t be able to challenge the potential loyalty and local focus a coop can do.
(DIR) Post #AUy91o5TDQlXl9b7uC by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-23T18:02:39Z
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@pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo and a local coop that requires additional time and energy to get food from (the total cost in time and energy for shoppers/eaters) will never be a plausible solution for feeding those who have no spare time nor energy to put into securing their food.Plus: groceries are not nearly the only thing that has risen with greedflation. Wages are almost the only thing that hasn’t.
(DIR) Post #AUy91oafLRifJuC2Wu by pinhman@mstdn.ca
2023-04-23T18:30:38Z
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@davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo I’ll entertain that I’m wrong, but the idea that a locally focused coop org can compete with big national, multinational by focusing on what makes sense locally needs a chance. I grew up in Saskatchewan amongst the socialists :))
(DIR) Post #AUy91p5rTSfmsemx9c by amaditalks@wandering.shop
2023-04-24T01:11:35Z
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@pinhman @davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo I belonged to our local co-op prior to COVID. The prices were 20-25% higher than purchasing similar goods elsewhere, plus I had to volunteer my time. Families struggling with affording food are not going to benefit from co-ops as they exist now. They’re little more than a eco-lefty status symbol for people willing to be ripped off to have the optics of caring.
(DIR) Post #AUy91pahcnLKQJDaE4 by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-24T01:31:37Z
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@amaditalks @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo yes, they are not a large scale solution to things.
(DIR) Post #AUy91qBZPipkGeT1gu by pinhman@mstdn.ca
2023-04-24T04:17:10Z
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@davidaugust @amaditalks @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo Western Canada’s federated cooperatives are largely successful but I think they have become too commercial https://www.fcl.crs/
(DIR) Post #AUzj8bQAUu9S0kmLqq by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T01:08:53Z
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@davidaugust> [cooperatives] are not a large scale solution to thingsSmall grocery stores don't have the economics of scale to compete on prices with giant corporate chains. This has nothing to do with whether they are cooperatively owned or not. There's nothing about the cooperative model that prevents co-ops from scaling up to a size where they can compete. Like building trade unions, it just takes organising:https://www.theguardian.com/social-enterprise-network/2012/jan/04/social-enterprise-blog-co-operatives-and-mutuals@amaditalks @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUzlXXkfTdELmLO6nw by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-25T01:35:43Z
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@strypey @amaditalks @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo “There's nothing about the cooperative model that prevents co-ops from scaling up to a size where they can compete.”Incorrect. Perhaps you are blissfully unaware of the impacts of poverty, and how close so many are (ex: that 59% of Americans are one paycheck away from homelessness). As mentioned earlier in this thread: Not everyone can afford extra time nor money in securing food. Earlier in this thread: https://mastodon.online/@davidaugust/110249440647413880
(DIR) Post #AUzpqR3wyDamLsfeeu by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T02:24:03Z
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Me:> There's nothing about the cooperative model that prevents co-ops from scaling up to a size where they can compete@davidaugust > IncorrectSee the evidence at the link provided. Here's a specific counter-example:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coop_ambaShall I find you more?Clinging to your assumptions in the disconfirming evidence is not an effective way to change anything, including fighting poverty-generating exploitation systems like capitalism.@amaditalks @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUzq1vD7Dnyv2UR1nM by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T02:26:08Z
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Me:> There's nothing about the cooperative model that prevents co-ops from scaling up to a size where they can compete@davidaugust > IncorrectSee the evidence at the link provided. Here's a specific example that supports my claim:"Coop Danmark is the second-biggest retailer of consumer goods in Denmark, with a market share of 40%"https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coop_amba@amaditalks @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUzqpoAZfqktgI2Aka by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-25T02:35:06Z
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@strypey @amaditalks @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo I wonder if 40% of a market of 5.8 million is a template that translates to a population of hundreds of millions spread over 4 time zones.
(DIR) Post #AUzsSl6P6zPLPrDiiW by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T02:53:23Z
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@davidaugustGood questions. The Coop Denmark example does prove that co-ops can scale up much larger than eco-lefty boutiques, which you and @amaditalks were quite rightly pointing out the limitations of.> coops cannot solve inflation in groceries If price-gouging and excessive profits is the main driver of inflation ("greedflation"), as you suggest here and I agree...https://mastodon.online/@davidaugust/110248876009436601.. there's every reason to think that they can solve it. @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUzsuawqSTJw221SRk by amaditalks@wandering.shop
2023-04-25T02:51:43Z
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@davidaugust @strypey @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo it also assumes linked co-ops, which is not something that meaningfully exists in the US and does not appear to be on the horizon. Because of the personal investment demanded, members want local control. Our little co-op here in Pittsburgh is not going to join forces with the legendary co-op in Park Slope Brooklyn anytime soon.
(DIR) Post #AUzsubZU8oEFxs6Jfs by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T02:58:25Z
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@amaditalks> it also assumes linked co-ops, which is not something that meaningfully exists in the US and does not appear to be on the horizonThis could explain why co-ops have much less economic impact in the US than elsewhere. Perhaps this is the problem to be solved? (1/2)@davidaugust @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUztUopOKZtNVJoDeS by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T03:04:57Z
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@amaditalks> members want local controlSure, that's important. But imagine a structure where the local co-ops are owner-members of a supply co-op, which gives them some of the benefits of working at scale. Things like getting bulk discounts from large suppliers and transporters. Co-ops working on grocery supply or logistics could join too, making it easier to compete with the vertical integration of large chains.(2/2)@davidaugust @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUzvEj8ru2YL92NEoa by amaditalks@wandering.shop
2023-04-25T03:24:25Z
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@strypey @davidaugust @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo you’ve just described a co-op with a hell of a lot more paid employees — additional cost — than member volunteers running the show, because that kind of enterprise requires full time, designated work. Given that the prices are already too high, the savings from that supply co-op would need to be incredibly, incredibly substantial for it to be worthwhile.
(DIR) Post #AUzz4WMQy4R8QR6kIi by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T04:07:26Z
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@amaditalks> that kind of enterprise requires full time, designated workTrue. But local co-ops are already paying for that work in the prices you pay to corporate suppliers.> the savings from that supply co-op would need to be incredibly, incredibly substantialIf it works at all, the model counterbalances the monopoly power that allows corporate suppliers to add excessive markup (driving greedflation). So the savings could be substantial.@davidaugust @pinhman @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo
(DIR) Post #AUzzzNSgj8vtKc90wS by pinhman@mstdn.ca
2023-04-25T03:29:25Z
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@amaditalks @strypey @davidaugust @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo True, but if the inflationary costs are excessive profit, a coop not taking excessive profits would be feasible? Is it the degree of “vertical integration” that limits cooperatives from competing?
(DIR) Post #AUzzzODTvAMZfk2NsW by davidaugust@mastodon.online
2023-04-25T03:38:13Z
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@pinhman @amaditalks @strypey @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo vertical and horizontal. Consolidation has been a major factor in many industries being configured to allow greedflation. Grocery stores merged and prices went up significantly: https://www.newsweek.com/grocery-prices-could-increase-millions-under-proposed-kroger-albertsons-merger-1763326?amp=1
(DIR) Post #AUzzzOplcozJaTwxYO by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-04-25T04:17:42Z
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@davidaugust> Grocery stores merged and prices went up significantlyThe same happened here in Aotearoa (pop: 5 million as of the recent census). Two companies own the vast majority of supermarkets, so they can effectively set grocery prices to maximize profit, regardless of the effect on food affordability. I would love to be in Denmark's situation, with 40% of the retail market served by an onshore-owned co-op.@pinhman @amaditalks @yaneerbaryam @Peternimmo