Post AQdddICJJp9rl3LdWy by kookie@octodon.social
(DIR) More posts by kookie@octodon.social
(DIR) Post #AQbaYn2mW7zZnd8Gxc by davidrevoy@framapiaf.org
2022-12-14T18:10:18Z
43 likes, 33 repeats
😔 Tired
(DIR) Post #AQbbtrrBuwM4lKKFX6 by junho8@indulgent.art
2022-12-14T18:11:16.707Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy@framapiaf.org This is either complimentary or insulting and i am unsure which.... checks if hands are visibleInsulting.
(DIR) Post #AQbbw6Kj47yeEtCmjA by kino@fedi.intkos.link
2022-12-14T18:26:44.251Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy@framapiaf.org lol
(DIR) Post #AQbc2LW7We2Z4IVqiW by Hollahollara@spinster.xyz
2022-12-14T18:27:55.211648Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@bot @davidrevoy
(DIR) Post #AQbcTLc1HPQ9BM9CK0 by Wrest@shitposter.club
2022-12-14T18:32:48.699515Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy technology and it's consequences 😔
(DIR) Post #AQbcjKlsAt8ZCtNYlU by wilmhit@social.handholding.io
2022-12-14T18:35:40.910058Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy cool. What frontend is this?
(DIR) Post #AQbt2W3c2HPWykqSsy by konni@toot.kartonrad.de
2022-12-14T21:38:25Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy your worst hater
(DIR) Post #AQbtsscbO47E1GBF56 by enigmatico@mk.absturztau.be
2022-12-14T21:47:52.701Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy@framapiaf.org People got so attached to the machines that they forgot humans also have skills.
(DIR) Post #AQcAWpdXVEFvbzgupc by sepia@mastodon.online
2022-12-14T23:31:21Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy I really wonder how we, as human beings, will handle this AI augmented future. I expect it will often make us think about how we evaluate certain things. For example: Do we like a painting because its pretty? because it tells a story? because it inspires our imagination? or maybe because of its history? how it was created or by whom? Humans have always built tools to extend their abilities and to overcome their limitations but how long will it take to get used to these new tools?
(DIR) Post #AQcAWqHx4ya9dKbBp2 by davidrevoy@framapiaf.org
2022-12-14T23:50:26Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sepia These questions are in loop in the history of modern art and contemporary art, and it is a fascinating philosophical adventure to read about it and forge a philosophy. More than 100 years of artists tried to answer that.About getting used to AI, I embraced it in September ( read https://framapiaf.org/@davidrevoy/108969346357981937 ) but that was before all artists − thanks to website like https://haveibeentrained.com/ − saw their artworks being used without their consent.*That* changed everything.
(DIR) Post #AQcAWqpd3lWLJmM5JY by lonelyowl@lor.sh
2022-12-15T00:54:23Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy @sepia I used to draw with stroke-based rendering that i saw from some dude somewhat like 5 or 6 years ago (even can't remember his nickname now), and i never asked his consent. Should i now kill myself for the sake of justice?
(DIR) Post #AQcHRA1VUaXQmV925Q by davidrevoy@framapiaf.org
2022-12-15T02:11:44Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lonelyowl First, you haven't made any commercial benefit out of it, nor have you pretended to replace the job of the said "dude". 🤣 And also, please don't compare your own process of learning and practicing with your affection for a style or an artist at a cultural time to a software feed with a long list of URL and description batch downloaded and curated by a team of worker (eg. no Mature, no Watermark, and more other choices). It's not intelligent, it's a tool.@sepia
(DIR) Post #AQcaDtSzdXE2nQO96e by lonelyowl@lor.sh
2022-12-15T05:42:17Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy @sepia > you haven't made any commercial benefit out of it Well, in general, I tried to draw for money, but the process of creating a single simple picture was incredibly long, one time i spent four days without sleep and get 15 bux for it. I assume that even african kids in cobalt mines get paid more. Now i draw only for the lulz and because of boredom. However, other people were much more lucky in this regard. We have enough of clones of popular artists like kuvshin, sakimichan and others who make a lot of money by patreon and comissions, and no one soul saw a problem within it.> And also, please don't compare your own process of learning I'm lack of technical knowledge to have a strong opinion about it, but i have an observation how a system that never saw drawings with Taylor Swift successfully adopted real life Taylor's appearance to generic art rendering style. (I merged checkpoints of novelai and Taylor model from someone from reddit)Claiming that this relatively primitive system can reason would be too naive, but it seems to be capable of more than just brainless copying.Anyway, complaining that other people's pictures were used in training without consent looks like absolutely fantastic greed, comparable to that demonstrated by Disney and other media corporations, because even DMCA leaves ways to use other people's work to create derivative works, as long as they are not completely brainless plagiarism and/or publishing without changes. If you ignore this fact, then it turns out that that dude has the right to burn part of my brain so that I forget about his drawings.The only thing that is really sad about this whole story is that it looks like another profession will die as a result of automation, and there is still nothing like UBI anywhere in the world. In this regard, I am extremely interested to know what is the point of educating economists if we going ignore them anyway.
(DIR) Post #AQcdhkjMyrGmFhyh9s by Tanath@mastodon.social
2022-12-14T22:10:27Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy I think most commenters are overreacting here. They likely never heard of Krita so didn't have the clue. AI-generated images are hot right now and it looks like many others; they likely saw it in passing and liked it enough to comment.To address some other comments, AI image generation isn't "stealing" just because it's trained on your work. It's making new works inspired by it. Would you hate people for making works inspired by your work? The AI is doing the same thing.
(DIR) Post #AQcdhlenXLCt7oqYfg by davidrevoy@framapiaf.org
2022-12-14T22:52:31Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Tanath I find it problematic that you put on the same level:1. Creators who love, hate, and interact with input within the zeitgeist and then get inspired (consciously or unconsciously) by that.AND 2. An A.I. software that received a massive list of URL of images inputs+descriptions, without the consent of their authors, and curated by a team (with their own political choices).I wouldn't call 2 inspiration but just massive stealing of data for analysis.(edited for CW)
(DIR) Post #AQcdhmhfe96CN1CMmu by Tanath@mastodon.social
2022-12-14T22:15:24Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy if you're more concerned about how much time and effort it takes you vs an AI, you could use those tools too to assist in your work. Generate some stuff based on your work and start from there. Fix up ones you like, or just use it for inspiration.
(DIR) Post #AQct6D8GXCWmbIk9eS by sepia@mastodon.online
2022-12-15T09:13:47Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lonelyowl @davidrevoy In general I have to agree. A fundamental technique of our species is to learn by copying and no copyright law can, will or should ever prevent that. Now the way these AI systems are trained is obviously not ok either, especially if companies make an effort to remove watermarks, deliberately ignore the rights of creators and sell the result.The question is where do we draw the line? Would it be ok to train a system on photos of protected art? When is the result unique?
(DIR) Post #AQd0jZKkciaCQiIWdU by lonelyowl@lor.sh
2022-12-15T10:39:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sepia @davidrevoy If you stop thinking in terms of intelligence chauvinism, implying that machine learning is fundamentally (not technically) different from human learning, you may find that countless words have already been written about the originality of art and the nature of plagiarism, and much of it is already built into our copyright laws. If the machine itself is able to separate the watermark from the drawing during the learning process, then there seems to be no reasonable way to prevent it from doing so, since I can do the same. Artists frequently participating in various holywars about who stole what from who involving humans only (i dislike them btw, but now it's not about that), applying the same logic to ai generated art will be much less inadequate than trying to prevent fair use.
(DIR) Post #AQd1Rge8nQBLqrP84W by lonelyowl@lor.sh
2022-12-15T10:47:20Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sepia @davidrevoy Also, would be interesting to ask if activision blizzard legally able to take down sakimichan's (or other same kind of artist) patreon for using their protected by copyright characters to accrue money 🤔
(DIR) Post #AQd5z23QcfjdcUO7gO by davidrevoy@framapiaf.org
2022-12-15T11:37:58Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@lonelyowl It's a topic I know a bit as a free culture advocate, I wrote a full conference about the problems with fan-art years ago (for LibrePlanet https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AvtcHAMsQp4 ). Yes, commercial fan-arts are all under the fair use of companies. They could ask for removal at any moment and engage law-suit too. But it would be very unpopular with the fan base. So, it's a balance the companies learned (or not) to find. Commercial AI will face same challenge, eg. https://lexica.art/?q=star+war @sepia
(DIR) Post #AQd6SaVRbuggrtaMhE by sepia@mastodon.online
2022-12-15T11:43:30Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lonelyowl @davidrevoy Most likely they could, but are probably smart enough to realize it is free advertising for their games and that's where they earn the money. Disney probably would though 😅.This whole topic of copyright laws is incredibly tricky, but I still think a company with the intention to build a system that is technically able to create art in a specific style has to get permission to use images of the artist they want to mimic or find alternatives.
(DIR) Post #AQd6rxmWD5ziIMfiCG by lonelyowl@lor.sh
2022-12-15T11:48:06Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy @sepia Probably the best solution would be to apply copyright to final result of generation process based on how generated picture is going to be used (commercially or not) instead of moderating dataset.
(DIR) Post #AQd7ksS1jLnJgqGvUO by davidrevoy@framapiaf.org
2022-12-15T11:57:59Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lonelyowl Maybe, a bit like the 'contentID' curates Youtube or other large social media, yes, I can see that coming eventually.@sepia
(DIR) Post #AQd8kUc2Sfa1i6KrRY by lonelyowl@lor.sh
2022-12-15T12:09:10Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sepia @davidrevoy It seems to me that this is an unplowed field for all sorts of copyright law abuse. Like, an artist with widespread drawing style may try to claim that AI trying to imitate his work while AI just did something generic. But in general, I'm more worried not about companies, but first of all for myself and people like me, who do not try to make money on it, but simply make pictures for the sake of pictures, using ai as self-fix/help tool, etc. With stable diffusion it's like my wings have grown, and I don't want some elitists who has more lucky with abilities to understand drawing get this thing away from me.
(DIR) Post #AQd8xXgyK5Dh1friwy by Natanox@chaos.social
2022-12-15T00:01:43Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy @sepia "Register an account to opt-out your images from Stable Diffusion V3"This is the most fucking upside-down logic I've ever seen, and definitely 100% illegal basically anywhere on the planet. However this is the internet - it will be used anyway, and with the modern economy also using data in immoral amounts things won't change in the near future. 😔
(DIR) Post #AQdddICJJp9rl3LdWy by kookie@octodon.social
2022-12-15T08:59:53Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy oh my god that sounds exhausting. I'm so sorry.Unrelated but any chance I could buy a high ces version of that picture? Seems like a cozy wallpaper :3
(DIR) Post #AQdddIl3EewnUnbNgG by davidrevoy@framapiaf.org
2022-12-15T11:15:38Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kookie Hey, I run an open-source webcomic where all material are downloadable in free access and under an open license. You'll find the 4K wallpaper in a post I published later: https://framapiaf.org/@davidrevoy/109513537083560213 (and if you want a print, I can upload the design on my Redbubble shop). My main income is made with patronage and online donation. If you want and can support my quest to continue to make art this way , you'll find on https://www.peppercarrot.com/en/support/ all the options (Patreon/Liberapay/Bank/Paypal)🎁 .
(DIR) Post #AQk2Ruf893cRNkG4mG by straw@rdrama.cc
2022-12-18T20:01:33.959150Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@davidrevoy KritAI!