Post APmDUhOdOvvMC6eGo4 by jon@social.lot23.com
(DIR) More posts by jon@social.lot23.com
(DIR) Post #APmDUXyQR0byyDJiCm by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:03:25Z
1 likes, 5 repeats
I'm about to leave Mastodon for a few months. Not because I had a bad time, or couldn't find interesting people, or don't think the concept of a fediverse is dumb. On the contrary, I think it's great.I just have other stuff to do. But before I go, I want to share some thoughts as an ex-Twitter designer and someone who's been on Mastodon since 2018.#mastodon #twitter #ux #design #critique #hashtags #introduction đ§”
(DIR) Post #APmDUZtXI9tAvd2prU by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:05:01Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
1/ I was lucky enough to soak in Twitter's data for years. So I could see what features people actually responded to, and which we just *assumed* they'd respond to. Buckle up, I have some interesting news that you, as a Mastodon user, are going to disagree with.People don't like reverse-chron timelines. (head explodes)Let me explain myself.
(DIR) Post #APmDUaZilJdJ2SmWcC by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:07:32Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
2/ As a Mastodon user, you're waaaaaay more likely than the average user to love reverse-chron with no algorithm. It's one of the main selling points for Mastodon!But it's not rooted in what we saw in seemingly hundreds of different #designresearch findings.The reason Twitter almost died so many times at the start is that normal people aren't looking for an IRC or RSS experience. So people joined, got frustrated, and left.It took THREE YEARS to turn users into "healthy users." That's bad.
(DIR) Post #APmDUb4Cvy1GZ12s8O by amerika@noagendasocial.com
2022-11-19T23:22:35Z
5 likes, 1 repeats
@jon "normal people aren't looking for an IRC"Maybe these are the people ruining every online service and you should filter them out.
(DIR) Post #APmDUcBgldb82VYMQy by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:09:50Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
3/ Designers love talking about #empathy , but it can be hard to walk the walk. What do you do when literally 97% of your users are saying "I don't like trying to curate a good timeline, and I don't like having to scroll to keep up with everything, and I feel like I'm missing out on the good stuff, and I'm confused?"Bad designers say "Deal with it."Good designers say "Hm. This is a problem to solve."And that's where algorithmic timelines, guide, moments, editorial content, etc came from.
(DIR) Post #APmDUdye76LxadSyNk by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:12:23Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
4/ I remember when we moved from strict reverse-chron (which 97% struggle with) to "You might like" prompts (which 3% struggle with) and hearing from the VERY LOUD minority that we were destroying Twitter.But we saw as the 97% had a much better time. We saw that every step forward we took (I have a whole presentation on this) was helping people more and more.The data told us we were making a better product. And that reverse-chron kinda sucks. For most people.
(DIR) Post #APmDUfkBXpyT4MiS7U by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:14:32Z
0 likes, 2 repeats
5/ I remember when we added quote tweet, and we have the receipts. It does *not* increase abuse. (Source: I was the lead designer on the abuse team)You know what increases abuse? Reverse-chron replies without any sorting or algorithm, because someone can say "Kill yourself" as the first response. It becomes a game. It silences people.
(DIR) Post #APmDUhOdOvvMC6eGo4 by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:16:18Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
6/ My team rolled out mute keywords, which people SCREAMED at us about, saying it was killing the concept of "just show me everything" Twitter.Victims of abuse, who aren't nearly as loud, thanked us quietly.We rolled out "hide replies" which almost caused an internal riot, and was shelved for three years, but eventually it went live.Again, some people said we were killing Twitter. Again, they were wrong.
(DIR) Post #APmDUj21Jz1VGY5Eps by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:18:53Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
7/ Mastodon is exciting for a ton of reasons. I love it. I want it to succeed. But ... have you read Animal Farm?As Mastodon grows up, and tries to reach beyond the early adopters, please *listen to your users.*They'll guide you to some features that cannot be optional in a system like this. And, sorry, a lot of them will feel like traditional Twitter.#inconvenienttruth Not because people have baggage, but because humans are going to human and certain things are inevitable.
(DIR) Post #APmDUkbVTX0G8th5mq by jon@social.lot23.com
2022-11-19T20:19:38Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
8/ Good luck with everything. I hope sharing some of these opinions and experiences helps the fediverse in some small way.I'm rooting for you.Goodnight.#leavingmastodon
(DIR) Post #APmELcDPOXSPTPd8KG by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2022-11-19T23:32:05.997799Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@jon Why not creating a chronological view that shows where hidden posts are in the time line? There are some people who to want to read the entire conversation.
(DIR) Post #APmEWEatYfDTOngBHs by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2022-11-19T23:34:06.423519Z
3 likes, 3 repeats
@jon tl;dr Normalfags tend to doom scroll, because they are afraid to miss out. They are also easily deterred by trolls posting "End your life" as first reply. This is why stuff like the algorithmic timeline and hiding posts feature where made.
(DIR) Post #APmEexfBsL6ZUmqkam by ChristiJunior@detroitriotcity.com
2022-11-19T23:35:41.477544Z
10 likes, 1 repeats
@jon You sound like the kind of faggot who would approve of fucking up Mastodon's search feature because trannies and other freaks don't want to let other people easily find their most retarded posts.
(DIR) Post #APmF4v4K92FUyfz2eW by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2022-11-19T23:40:23.140091Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@jon Wrong thread. Whoops. Another feature I would have liked is something like Pleroma's group function. It let you put people you follow in In separate time lines. Sometimes you follow users who don't quiete fit together. Like for example a bunch of News oriented accounts and some meme accounts. Such a function would have allowed to make separate different things from each other.
(DIR) Post #APmGusqTkvfT5vql4y by TheMadPirate@detroitriotcity.com
2022-11-20T00:00:59.545949Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@jon You are not interested in users at all, nor you have any form of #empathy.What you seek is social engineering. To make users addicted to their timelines ( show them only what it triggers a dopamine reaction ) and positive Pavlovian reinforcements ( showcase positive replies, hide negative replies). You are exactly the reason why people should stay the fuck away from Twitter, Facebook and Instagram. But guess what? Most people on the Fediverse are smart enough to shy away from electronic manipulation and social engineering, so your efforts to turn Fedi into just another social manipulation tool the way Twitter is will fail.
(DIR) Post #APmHOSzQS2YTam8neC by TheMadPirate@detroitriotcity.com
2022-11-20T00:06:20.993608Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon The reason why Animal Farm fails is because its principles are based on false hypothesis, not because "the leaders didn't listen to the animals". You falsely assume that most people here on Fedi are : a) normies who b) only want positive reinforcement and that c) it's users want Fedi to go mainstream. Not a single one of those hypothesis is true, btw. That's the difference between Fediverse and Twitter users.
(DIR) Post #APmJN73EjTldAaPDHs by zoomgoboom@detroitriotcity.com
2022-11-20T00:28:30.836306Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon here's some advice you faggot, kill yourself.
(DIR) Post #APmJVLTmyM2WEckcTo by zoomgoboom@detroitriotcity.com
2022-11-20T00:30:00.290943Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon your faggy empire social engineering isn't welcome here, sit on a cactus you cancerous lump of carbon.
(DIR) Post #APmJYpCutwt3IqWCAa by zoomgoboom@detroitriotcity.com
2022-11-20T00:30:38.020086Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@ChristiJunior @jon HELP! HELP! ABUSE, SOMEONE IS MOCKING MY OWN POSTS ON A PUBLIC PLATFORM!
(DIR) Post #APmJtCc5aWTVgf0dFo by meowski@fluf.club
2022-11-20T00:34:16.669621Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jon newest stuff at the top makes it more timely. not everyone has the patience or desire to keep up with absolutely every post that was made since the last time you checked. also very sus posting 𧔠here in fedi
(DIR) Post #APmL3Pyuq9tBzv7Ztg by kino@fedi.intkos.link
2022-11-20T00:47:19.470Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jon@social.lot23.com Nobody gives a shit. This is the fediverse.
(DIR) Post #APmMbykkAQvJdhXIVk by meowski@fluf.club
2022-11-20T01:04:45.158415Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon flimsy justification for your censorship and shadowbanning tacticsnobody here is buying this now gtfo like u said
(DIR) Post #APmiKkIqpuqotOg3k0 by RevSnappyTwig@dobbs.town
2022-11-20T05:07:48Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@amerika @jon Iâm so happy to be in a place where I follow who I follow and my timeline is just that. When I choose to look outward, I search hashtags I control. Real life is annoying enough with television and radio shoving ads at me, flyers in my postbox, but social networks took the frustration to a whole new level. I scroll through tonnes of Facebook posts curated for me god knows how, see something I like, app crashes and I try to see it again butâŠ
(DIR) Post #APmigSssHRR5EtsplI by RevSnappyTwig@dobbs.town
2022-11-20T05:12:05Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@amerika @jon ⊠itâs gone forever. I cannot get it back. On Twitter it feels like Iâm fed irrelevant garbage half the time. Here I have my house, in a community I chose, federated with a broad world. Itâs so goddamn refreshing. If ânormalâ users prefer noise then theyâre welcome to stay at Twitter. I certainly do not want this to turn into Twitter. I havenât felt this energized about social media since usenet/irc and maybe very early twitterâŠ
(DIR) Post #APmilQivjwUPzFbF1U by RevSnappyTwig@dobbs.town
2022-11-20T05:12:56Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@amerika @jon ⊠Iâm happy to toss in some coins too to keep the servers running without having to scroll past ads too.
(DIR) Post #APmyZzJotCjF4aQ7qS by mayel@sunbeam.city
2022-11-20T07:07:33Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jon "making a better product" you say, well that's the thing, people on the fediverse don't want a product handed to us (say, a more entertaining gladiator show) but instead we curate community spaces together. They are very different goals, and conducting user research with different intentions (both from the researchers and from the users) would undoubtedly yield different results.
(DIR) Post #APmyaz07YXoKNRgGkS by lertsenem@mastodon.lertsenem.com
2022-11-20T08:05:22Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jon You were right, this *is* interesting news that I disagree with. :]I suppose it's pretty much impossible, but I'd love to see how you measured all of this?Since you're leaving for the time being, I guess you're not really open to debate all this at length? So I'll just note that the underlying premise of some of your points is that Mastodon needs to appeal to *everyone* to succeed. While that was true for Twitter, I don't think it really applies to Mastodon.
(DIR) Post #APnMA9Ak1sUH0JNvcm by SuperDicq@minidisc.tokyo
2022-11-20T12:34:23.148Z
1 likes, 2 repeats
@jon@social.lot23.com I find your takes every interesting, but I think you might be suffering from corpo brainrot. Ask yourself, what is a "healthy user"? What is a "better product"? Whatever you answer to these questions, it's probably not our goal.Let's use McDonald's restaurants as an example:To McDonald's a healthy customer is someone who comes to eat at McDonald;s every day.To McDonald's a better product is a product that gets people hooked and keeps them coming back for more.But as you can expect in reality people that are "healthy" and consume "better" products do not visit McDonald's at all.Vegetables and fruits are a "bad product" because "97% of people don't like eating them compared to McDonald's".I'm sorry about your corpo dreams but all fediverse projects are run by small groups of hobbyists and nonprofit organisations, and we're trying to create a better platform, not a better product.Instead what we're doing is not trying to appeal to the 97%, we're trying to turn the 3% into 5%, then into 10%, then into 20%. If your goal is to make the most amount of money you should give people exactly what they want. If your goal is to improve the world, you should not give people exactly what they want.
(DIR) Post #APnkunstOP53UVohIO by pthenq1@mastodon.la
2022-11-20T17:11:50Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon Thanks for the feedback. I did find stress and manipulation on Twitter.Stress and manipulation allowed by the algorithm. Campaigns. Troll centers. Etc.Twitter creates the false need of keyboard warriors. That was the worst that happened to the world. Twitter convinced millions of individuals that world changes happen in Twitter, and they happen in the world.Battles must be fought in real world. Twitter twisted that and generated drama and suffering.Mastodon doesn't need that. That was bad. It was good to drug people thinking they're were right knowing the Earth is plain and things like that.And the algorithm created monsters all around the world.Like Trump.Like Macri.Like Boris Johnson.Like Bukele.Horrible people with entity thanks to Twitter.Mastodon doesn't need that. The world doesn't need that.That was bad. It was not a glitch. Or a mistake. It was by design and lot of people suffered and die for it.Thanks, but no thanks.
(DIR) Post #APnnm705FZgI2CjADQ by QYME@layer8.space
2022-11-20T17:32:08Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@SuperDicq @jon What i want and what i need can be two vastly different things.Sometimes, i really cannot tell what i need but am just vaguely aware i need something different. I end up gravitating toward what i want, blissfully unaware that i'm starting a reinforcing feedback loop getting me further and further away from what i need if i'm unlucky.But in case of social media, what i want and need is more control. Algo ? Sure, let me have control over it and adjust it to see what happens.
(DIR) Post #APnnm7TVUBDVVSUf4q by SuperDicq@minidisc.tokyo
2022-11-20T17:43:45.779Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@QYME@layer8.space @jon@social.lot23.com Yeah if Twitter really cared about the "better product" using data they would've kept the chronological timeline as an option.You have the data that 3% of people prefer a chronological timeline, that should be enough to keep the chronological timeline around as an option, right?And by ignoring the needs of the 3% of users they have created their own worst competitor. Guess what the 3% started doing when they were no longer catered to on Twitter? We created the fediverse.
(DIR) Post #APnpXJeE92PKpBZohM by amerika@noagendasocial.com
2022-11-20T18:03:37Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@RevSnappyTwig @jon I am always appalled by what social media sites WANT me to pay attention to.Very little of it is relevant. In fact, I have no idea what I "want" to see other than interesting stuff. I like to let the network discover by randomness, not algo...
(DIR) Post #APnpyg8KeUDqNgho5Q by ashfurrow@masto.ashfurrow.com
2022-11-20T11:45:14Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@jon being the lead designer on Twitterâs abuse team does not give you the credibility that you seem to think it does
(DIR) Post #APoFyjFtds20s7vcUy by iska@mk.starnix.network
2022-11-20T22:59:54.723Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jon@social.lot23.com #PACKWATCH #RIPBOZO REST IN PISS ULL NEVER BE MISSED â:02_dab:â â:lfg:â
(DIR) Post #APp0uexGLkEv94bTYO by wolf480pl@mstdn.io
2022-11-21T07:45:37Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon unpopular opinion:Not every software has to serve every user.Maybe Mastodon doesn't need to reach beyond the early adopters.
(DIR) Post #APr9QRaalZC2uOaPFQ by dump_stack@lor.sh
2022-11-22T08:30:36Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon, everything is optional in free and open source software. Even Mastodon itself is optional. There are other implementations on top of ActivityPub protocol.
(DIR) Post #APr9UnLLpJQnXJX2ye by dump_stack@lor.sh
2022-11-22T08:31:24Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon, everything is optional in free and open source software. Even Mastodon itself is optional. There are other implementations on top of ActivityPub protocol.
(DIR) Post #APrDeMvJJHhCJCAka0 by neet@refuse2.work
2022-11-22T09:17:55.734519Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon quote tweet is a nice way to retweet as a private account. Mastodon hasn't figured out how to let people RT while keeping their profile locked down, and says quote RT will never be implemented because it just facilitates abuse. Buddy, I can already be abusive as all hell, no QT button needed.
(DIR) Post #APsHR5E2ORXwd5oQJU by sj_zero@social.fbxl.net
2022-11-22T21:35:04.478921Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
Give a heroin addict a hit of heroin, and 97% of heroin addicts will thank you and come to you more often, and 3% will be very vocal about the fact that you're not doing something positive. That doesn't mean you've done a good thing.
(DIR) Post #AVhqsY3j3uWW6bfBdQ by PavelASamsonov@mastodon.social
2022-11-19T20:06:58Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jon@social.lot23.com Reverse-chronological timeline is best for when you are Extremely Online, like me (and the other top percentage of all Rattata, er I mean, Twitter users)
(DIR) Post #AVhqsYx1kIl8s7XLpg by nafnlaus@fosstodon.org
2022-11-21T01:21:57Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@PavelASamsonov @jon@social.lot23.com Adn as someone who can't watch it constantly, it really bugs me.Users should be able to pick their timeline. To sort it by who you interact with most and/or to boost up those who post infrequently over those who are constantly posting.What *shouldn't* happen is *other* people's likes altering *your* feed. And the fights they're involved in getting into your feed. *That's* what makes Twitter toxic.
(DIR) Post #AVhqsZdDDSVGyxH2aO by jonn@social.doma.dev
2022-11-21T02:59:23Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@nafnlaus @PavelASamsonov @jon@social.lot23.com this.The OP mixes up satisfaction with engagement :)I hope I'll live to see a day when engagement engineers will be brought to justice for knowingly creating destructive behaviour loops! When I say "justice", I mean literal prison sentences for Instagram, Twitter and Facebook engineers and managers.
(DIR) Post #AVhqsaLWYhwtCO0Qee by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-16T08:02:53Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jonn> The OP mixes up satisfaction with engagement :)Sadly social.lot23.com seems to be gone so folks can't see the OP, unless they find the archived version:https://web.archive.org/web/20221126113613/https://social.lot23.com/@jon/109372257422277945But you are bang on Jon. You can get people to stay longer at your bar by spiking drinks with morphine, but that doesn't mean you're creating a better experience for them, especially in the long run. @nafnlaus @PavelASamsonov
(DIR) Post #AVhrA2SLIeJBIrW9VA by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-16T08:06:06Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jonn> I hope I'll live to see a day when engagement engineers will [get prison sentences] for knowingly creating destructive behaviour loops!I don't think people ought to be criminalized for doing their job, and doing it well. People who create and fund socially destructive jobs OTOH, for sure.@nafnlaus @PavelASamsonov
(DIR) Post #AVhsUbnbhlwEfBpuqG by _intothevoid@mastodon.nz
2022-11-20T00:13:02Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@zorinlynx@mastodon.social @jon@social.lot23.com Interestingly, I had the opposite experience.I changed to 'latest tweets' at some point, and after a while I noticed I hadn't heard from people. If I checked their profiles, they were still posting, but I had just missed them by not being online at the time.When I turned the algorithm back on, I suddenly got their tweets showing up again, raised to my attention even if they were made 4-5 hours before.Now I use the algo for the first morning visit and change to timeline after
(DIR) Post #AVhsUcZSpqDf3cE8R6 by gedeonm@mastodon.social
2022-11-20T04:23:47Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@_intothevoid @jon@social.lot23.com @zorinlynx this is because Twitter never allowed you to save your reading position and why using 3rd party clients was a superior reading experience on Twitter. I could never use the official client because of these reasons and itâs one of the reasons why we developed Twitterrific in the first place.
(DIR) Post #AVhsUdDsPaXt4x8PQW by pgcommunication@vis.social
2022-11-20T12:04:09Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@gedeonm @_intothevoid @jon@social.lot23.com @zorinlynx I rarely encountered most of the problems people complain about with Twitter. No ads. No crazy tweets elevated by the algorithm. No missed posts from infrequent posters of great content.How was that possible? Third-party browsers (Talon, Plume, etc), chronological mode, extensive use of lists, and TwitterListManager. I really hope a rich ecosystem of 3rd-party software develops around Mastodon.
(DIR) Post #AVhsUdulq6rBDzCfHk by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-16T08:20:56Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@pgcommunication> I really hope a rich ecosystem of 3rd-party software develops around MastodonThere is such a rich ecosystem of software you don't even need to use Mastodon. You can follow and interact with accounts on Mastodon using dozens of other software options, each with their own unique flavour and set of features:https://fediverse.party/en/miscellaneous(1/2)@gedeonm @_intothevoid @zorinlynx @penguin_brian
(DIR) Post #AVhsdIP7BVbx7JWSzw by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-16T08:22:34Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@pgcommunicationEven sticking with Mastodon, there are plenty of apps available and many of them taste better than the vanilla Mastodon apps:https://delightful.club/delightful-fediverse-clients/@gedeonm @_intothevoid @zorinlynx @penguin_brian
(DIR) Post #AVhtbXvWbHo8dQPaYy by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-16T08:33:27Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
One thing the #fediverse does need is better documentation of all the many software options. Reviews, guides, feature comparison charts etc that can help people quickly find the apps most likely to suit their needs - and still being actively maintained - without spending frustrating hours playing software roulette.(1/2)@pgcommunication @gedeonm @_intothevoid @zorinlynx @penguin_brian
(DIR) Post #AVhtj6bu2vmeENq2am by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-16T08:34:50Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
Projects like fediverse.party, delightful.club and fediversereport.com do some of the research required, but there's so much more that could be done on presentation.@pgcommunication @gedeonm @_intothevoid @zorinlynx @penguin_brian
(DIR) Post #AVilrSoEvqBIF3A1Wy by jonn@social.doma.dev
2023-05-16T16:55:02Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@strypey @nafnlaus @PavelASamsonov i mean, russian propagandists do amazing job, so did germans who were making gas chambers.
(DIR) Post #AVjXS5Gu6RfTnjX2My by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-17T03:34:40Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jonn> so did germans who were making gas chambersGodwin on your second post in the thread. That's got to be some kind of record đhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law@nafnlaus @PavelASamsonov
(DIR) Post #AVjixKZKNSkXiXFf04 by jonn@social.doma.dev
2023-05-17T05:43:32Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@strypey @nafnlaus @PavelASamsonov dopamine loops are literally destroying lives though, so
(DIR) Post #AVkU3raBF2q7gtGd3w by jonn@social.doma.dev
2023-05-17T07:56:49Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@strypey FTR, you were invoking Godwin's law by using "they're just obeying orders" excuse from Nurnberg, so I would say that it's a Godwin on *your* second post.
(DIR) Post #AVkU3sij0lGjDgGy1I by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-17T14:31:23Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jonn> using "they're just obeying orders" excuse from NurnbergThat interpretation too is a Godwin. What I was saying, was that if a civilian job is legal when the person is doing it, then retrospectively criminalizing it is unjust (and frankly, a bit Dark Knight Rises). Criminal accountability for the outputs of a heirarchy belong at the top of its decision-making pyramid. Proposing to criminalize workers for corporate policy is a failure of solidarity.
(DIR) Post #AVkVg7ADrJVwyQvfbE by jonn@social.doma.dev
2023-05-17T14:49:29Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@strypey read up on gas chambers. Do you think they just appeared out of thin air or were some sort of military grade machine? Nope. They were develop by civilian medical doctors and engineered by civilian engineers[1]. Legally, of course.So yeah, they absolutely should've been retroactively criminalised but wasn't. Probably because the allies were involved in the supply chain or because of the logic you apply.[1]: https://www.referenceforbusiness.com/history2/25/Siemens-A-G.html
(DIR) Post #AVlTrvgQMcSy5lSPHE by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-18T02:03:56Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jonn Comparing people building software to people building gas chambers is obviously hyperbolic and ridiculous. It's a Godwin. However much you harp on about it, it remains a Godwin, ie not worth engaging with. We're done here.
(DIR) Post #AVm8ItIDM84ifBXnua by jonn@social.doma.dev
2023-05-18T09:36:57Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@strypey you're very annoying! I even had to look up my response to your initial toot. It was: "russian propagandists are doing an amazing job, so did germans âŠ". Then you proceeded to ridicule instead of holding an argument; when I responded to what you seemed to have wanted to discuss, you went for it again.Alright, I'll ignore the tantrum part of your reply and keep playing ball, so my response is:I don't agree, but surely comparing them to people who write texts is not.
(DIR) Post #AVmLraD7arZl1L2DxY by strypey@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2023-05-18T12:08:58Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jonnYou're being a sealion. Muted for a week.
(DIR) Post #AVmMvLDRNzJTcxXXzE by jonn@social.doma.dev
2023-05-18T12:20:49Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@strypey oh no. However will I live without your half-witted labels for a whole week?!