Post ACZ8fqSKMD2vmTUWI4 by pookito@ninetails.click
(DIR) More posts by pookito@ninetails.click
(DIR) Post #ACYrD4MprDzfJ8cDTM by 11112011@freespeechextremist.com
2021-10-20T16:24:24.109965Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
Screenshot 2021-10-20 at 17-23-22 President Biden no Twitter.png
(DIR) Post #ACYrlzycApcPpFwSR6 by jakub@bitcoinhackers.org
2021-10-20T16:30:41Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@11112011 why is that anyone but the government’s problem? I don’t care
(DIR) Post #ACYrq6LmQ14SkejXo8 by 11112011@freespeechextremist.com
2021-10-20T16:31:27.354936Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jakub no way he wrote that lol
(DIR) Post #ACYry7vmQSAzyEOoQC by jakub@bitcoinhackers.org
2021-10-20T16:32:54Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@11112011 I’ll give you that, I agree
(DIR) Post #ACYtl9WdO0Pl3jZvxw by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T16:52:57.602521Z
2 likes, 1 repeats
@jakub @11112011 depends if you consider corporations people or notif they are people, and you're paying more in taxes than they are there's something inherently unfair going onif they aren't people, but are instead just mechanical fictions, then it really doesn't matter
(DIR) Post #ACYv7dIDUZD3hr7Ni4 by anonymoose@fedi.club
2021-10-20T17:08:10.416714Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jeffcliff @jakub @11112011 Taxes on corporations are never paid by the corporations. Either the customers pay it in higher prices, workers pay it in lower wages, or share holders pay it in lower dividends (e.g., your and my 401ks). Those are literally the only 3 places corporate tax money can come from.But if you think Corporations are people, then not paying taxes is just the norm 🤷♀️
(DIR) Post #ACYvEyBCEYwmVqKhRA by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T17:09:32.705107Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@anonymoose @11112011 @jakub This is flat out wrongApple has something like a trillion dollars, cash, sitting doing nothing in their bank accounts.They could very much be taxed without affecting shareholder profits, employees, or customers.
(DIR) Post #ACYvHv1GRKjna25qrY by pookito@ninetails.click
2021-10-20T17:02:51Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
I think it is our problem not the government. We are the one choosing to pay taxes when the Law clearly state that we don't have to. Even the #IRS on his code says very clearly on the first page, that this code is not law. My opinion is that we should all become US Nationalist instead of US Citizens. In one you have to pay taxes, in the other, you don't, as long as you have earn it for yourself.
(DIR) Post #ACYvJh7n4TJn47zcJ6 by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T17:10:24.868455Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@anonymoose @11112011 @jakub https://www.bbc.com/news/business-31016446 this was awhile ago - they have increased their holdings substantially since but this is what I'm talking about
(DIR) Post #ACYvSpF8FxUwqnmTKa by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T17:12:03.372150Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@11112011 @anonymoose @jakub I mean ...there's (libertarian) reasons why you could argue against taxing apple, why it could be right or wrong based on moral or practical reasons.
(DIR) Post #ACYvdNYZXBdyATuEQi by Prodigal@freespeechextremist.com
2021-10-20T17:13:58.602580Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@11112011 But those 55 major corporations pay employees, benefits for employees, equipment for employees, pay for research, pay insurance, pay govt fees, pay property taxes....Why don't people understand this?I hate that socialists take advantage of the financially illiterate, don't teach them financial literacy as school students, and don't learn financial literacy themselves.
(DIR) Post #ACYw47WnEjNKH5pDqS by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T17:18:48.219069Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@11112011 @anonymoose @jakub actually there's a detail in that article I wasn't aware of > They argue that cash, invested largely in government securities gives a paltry rate of return.One of the things that tax is, is a way of controlling the company through incentives. You're free to burn all the fossil fuels you want in canada....as long as you pay the carbon tax. Of course the easiest way to get out of that tax is to not burn fossil fuels. So there's an imperative there to move towards not doing so.Similarly, the US government could tax proprietary software. Seems like a reasonable thing to do to me.What this kind of investment that Apple has means, though, is that it has a bargaining chip with governments. It can threaten to no longer buy bonds (or whatever securities they use) - and given their size this threat could have drastic consequences to whatever government they are de facto investing in. FAR more than enough to blackmail a government into reducing their corporate taxes, or pushing for laws allowing for them to exploit workers, push copyright/paracopyright laws or legalizing their form of outright bribery and corruption. It's a huge bargaining chip for dealing with governments that normal companies simply do no have.A lot of arguments against taxation on libertarian grounds will, thus, fall apart the moment a company has this much power. Because they are potentially the controlling mechanism of not just some government but THE world monopoly powers, the united states AND china. The ability to whip client states, even as large as the united states and china around, is awesome and frightening.
(DIR) Post #ACYwLbxtKF93b2qAa0 by anonymoose@fedi.club
2021-10-20T17:21:55.696695Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jeffcliff @jakub @11112011 If you take cash out of assets, what happens to the balance sheet? This is just simple addition and subtraction. Either you make up the deficit by increasing margin (paid by customers), or reducing payroll (paid by the workers), or you have to take it out of owner equity. That's the whole balance sheet, there is no magic "for the good of the people" column to put it in. 🤷♀️
(DIR) Post #ACYwnuKCepBkeAlksC by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T17:27:03.352995Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@anonymoose @11112011 @jakub > If you take cash out of assets, what happens to the balance sheet?They start adding back to it. If it worked once, it can work again.> This is just simple addition and subtraction. of assets carrying real political power> Either you make up the deficit by increasing margin (paid by customers), if they aren't already in a monopoly or oligopoly position where they are already extracting monopoly rent from their customers.> or reducing payroll (paid by the workers),Unless they are already using slave labour and paying below the minimum necessary to sustain a workforce and relying on governments to provide them with a cheaper-than-market workforce (coincidentally, governments that they have successfully blackmailed with their massive cash assets)> or you have to take it out of owner equity.Yeah. Owner equity that is defined by mark-to-market. That's the question: how much spending power should those who own the company have?> That's the whole balance sheet, there is no magic "for the good of the people" column to put it in. 🤷♀️But there's definitely a 'for the bad of the people' that companies like Apple are capable. https://www.defectivebydesign.org/apple
(DIR) Post #ACYxf6hzLVpQOzGJpA by jakub@bitcoinhackers.org
2021-10-20T17:36:40Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@jeffcliff @anonymoose @11112011 I wouldn't be paying taxes either if I knew it was funding terrorists this entire time
(DIR) Post #ACYxvAW2xS58qNKqUS by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T17:39:35.826476Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jakub @anonymoose @11112011 obv if you pay no taxes yourself, i can understand why you'd have no problems with others paying taxesbut most people have to pay taxes. When I was born, there were 2 things in life that were guaranteed, taxes and death. Now it's beginning to be thinkable that we could eliminate the normal causes for both, but for most people, there's an inherent question of fairness if person A pays no taxes but person B doesn't
(DIR) Post #ACYy54d1haUdTpK5c8 by jakub@bitcoinhackers.org
2021-10-20T17:41:23Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@jeffcliff @anonymoose @11112011 truth be told, more than half of the US doesn't even pay taxes, and I'm talking about the lower/middle class. It's not just the corpos not paying their fair share
(DIR) Post #ACYygQCWSVQ36IjcqO by anonymoose@fedi.club
2021-10-20T17:48:07.584600Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@jeffcliff @jakub @11112011 "Shareholders SHOULD pay the corporation's taxes" is a very different argument than "it's flat out false that shareholders end up paying corporate taxes".I get it, you hate apple and/or the rich, but crippling return on the one inflation-beating (😬 maybe not any longer) investment vehicle most working class people have access to in order to 'soak the rich' seems like a rather sub-optimal strategy by your own stated goals 🤷♀️
(DIR) Post #ACYyrGe4KKkCeKn74q by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-20T17:50:04.269771Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@anonymoose @11112011 @jakub Most working class people *do not* have access to buying apple shares, sorry and definitely don't have access to buying them in any kind of quantity necessary to offset the cost of apple shaking down their government
(DIR) Post #ACYys20MFHV3X4a4qO by jakub@bitcoinhackers.org
2021-10-20T17:50:14Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@anonymoose @11112011 @jeffcliff I don't hate anyone for not paying taxes, to me that's between the entity and their government. I actually have no beef with Apple, I own many of their products myself
(DIR) Post #ACYzCZoMGOtEAmlU12 by anonymoose@fedi.club
2021-10-20T17:53:56.446220Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@jeffcliff @jakub @11112011 >Most working class people *do not* have access to buying apple sharesThis is wrong in about 6 different ways. And anyways, are we talking about corporate taxes, or a special apple-only tax? These goal-posts keep moving....
(DIR) Post #ACZ8fqSKMD2vmTUWI4 by pookito@ninetails.click
2021-10-20T19:30:40Z
2 likes, 1 repeats
Sadly, this is what we get with public education. That is why my kid is going to private school 🏫. For those who cannot afford private school they can do home school alright.
(DIR) Post #ACZbtmMxFHD7payUcK by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-10-21T01:07:32.115026Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@anonymoose @11112011 @jakub > are we talking about corporate or special apple-only taxDoes it matter? It's whatever Biden was talking about. https://freespeechextremist.com/objects/659e6ea6-0e50-4587-af4e-593e4015abc5