Post AC1gFgrm6wpsoImOoa by jamie@mstdn.helios.red
(DIR) More posts by jamie@mstdn.helios.red
(DIR) Post #AC0tl31GttgSjxXo92 by xpil@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T07:12:34Z
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No flamewars intended but...Do you think Linux can ever become a mainstream workstation OS? Yeah, yeah, I know you are all devs and dorks using w3wm and whatnot :D but I mean, like, for regular people that cannot tell bash from bush. I mean, a workstation that can compete with the You-Know-Who and get into 2-digit market share percentages rater than sitting at the very edge of the Gauss's Bell.
(DIR) Post #AC0uLeFZxGKQdOglxg by zleap@qoto.org
2021-10-04T07:19:20Z
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@xpil It has done well on the raspberry pi we just need to ensure that having skills in Linux actually leads to something like employment in a world where everyone seems to expect you to have used Windows.
(DIR) Post #AC0xAevZOcnVPbmVlo by jrballesteros05@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T07:50:58Z
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@xpil With red hat in charge it will become mainstream for sure. They will destroy everything that make Linux different but they are doing a great effort to make it.
(DIR) Post #AC0xX6jegiMw1kueSO by kromonos@social.snopyta.org
2021-10-04T07:55:01Z
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@xpil I hope not. We already have enough wannabe Linux Administrators who actually have absolutely no knowledge, but yelling around that they managed to follow a manual with copy & paste 🙄
(DIR) Post #AC0xb9TiQpl5h0NxxY by kromonos@social.snopyta.org
2021-10-04T07:55:47Z
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@xpil I hope not. We already have enough wannabe Linux Administrators who actually have absolutely no knowledge, but yelling around that they managed to follow a manual with copy & paste 🙄 Linux on the mainstream desktop would only increase the problem.
(DIR) Post #AC0zVlL8wwWHI0vxaa by pheonix@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T08:17:12Z
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@xpil Feel like this is a very heavy question, one that I'm not qualified to answer. There's a multitude of factors that lead to something like mainstream adoptance.Do I want this to happen? You betcha. An alternate perspective is that for the snowball effect to be able to take place - one of the two marketplace leader OSs have to fuck up, big time, in some way or the other. Most alternate product get traction when media picks up something. Just my 2 cents.
(DIR) Post #AC11Nsinoxxrm6N0RE by floppy@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T08:38:10Z
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@xpil I think your distinction between "regular" and more technical minded people is fair in this case.But I also think that we "techies" might fall into the thinking that it is imperative to "tell bash from bush". It certainly is for us, but it is necessarily not for them. Different values are important for "regulars", like (excuse the over-simplification) that it just works.I think Linux has reached that point from a technical point of view and in terms of reliability.
(DIR) Post #AC11XGm7lAR4ywOsPw by gruffymax@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T08:39:37Z
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@xpilTrust me, nothing would give me more satisfaction that seeing Linux go mainstream. It would make the likes of MS have to up their game. However, I don't think it will. Its too good to go mainstream. The people who use, develop and care about it won't want to see it torn apart by the capitalist money machine.
(DIR) Post #AC11aD1g9h1GDt4rvk by fedops@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T08:40:25Z
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@xpil it's already there and it's called ChromeOS. It's the ultimate "you don't need the CLI to use Linux" Linux - people don't even realize it IS Linux underneath all the shinyness.
(DIR) Post #AC122Orrinnh3dviJk by tobtobxx@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T08:45:31Z
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@xpil I think Canonical is a driving force for this market. Sure I don't like snap. And yeah, I'm not fond of GNOME. But does it work and is it reliable? Yeah it does. And I'm thankful to have at least this distro I can point to and be sure they won't have to use the shell for some time.
(DIR) Post #AC1PGBfHu7d36radZw by surendrajat@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T13:05:43Z
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@xpil Yes it will and soon(although switching to it might take longer). Now, why do I think so? I think the real pain points of using desktop Linux are mainly: graphics, audio, games & some professional apps (MS-office, Adobe & Autodesk).Now we can't do anything about last one, but let's see other 3:
(DIR) Post #AC1ehh1Yuy5fV3aAj2 by kev@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T15:58:32Z
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@xpil great question - I think it definitely can from an OS level, but would struggle from an application perspective. If it were to be rolled out to non-technical folk, I think it would quickly fall down when people start asking where their applications are.
(DIR) Post #AC1emU7sIgc0wdouIa by kev@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T15:59:26Z
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@xpil the fact that devs with the Linux ecosystem have a perpetual desire to give their applications ridiculous names doesn’t help.
(DIR) Post #AC1eqvLB3jeYVX9uiG by kev@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T15:59:43Z
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@xpil the fact that devs within the Linux ecosystem have a perpetual desire to give their applications ridiculous names doesn’t help.
(DIR) Post #AC1f5R6lkEtN5TL7Cq by r3pek@mastodon.r3pek.org
2021-10-04T16:01:19Z
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@xpil my wifi and kids already use it for they're day-to-day usage. All of them play games, and make school work (and can't understand you-know-who)
(DIR) Post #AC1fEoLOiuoVl5eVAe by obsolete29@indieweb.social
2021-10-04T16:03:53Z
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@xpil I think it can but it'll take some organization to drive it. If it were going to happen organically, I think it would have already happened. I think I could just be trapped in my own echo chamber but I do feel more people are becoming privacy aware. Maybe that's an avenue.
(DIR) Post #AC1fK7Cw16Wvi7Dt9k by nathand@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T16:05:15Z
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@kev @xpil Not to mention the various different app packaging methods.Choice is great, until you need to have grandma choose between AppImage, Snap and Flatpak (or deb, rpm, apk, etc)
(DIR) Post #AC1gFgrm6wpsoImOoa by jamie@mstdn.helios.red
2021-10-04T16:15:54Z
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@xpil I don't think it can, but if it did, and that brought everything with it that make operating systems successful (commercialisation, proprietary software), then the people that currently like Linux would look elsewhere.
(DIR) Post #AC1gQ0Iohd9JzDLWBE by jamie@mstdn.helios.red
2021-10-04T16:17:48Z
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@xpil Open Source development, on the desktop side at least, is too fragmented - and, I hate to say this, the standard is far below commercial offerings in the software that matters for most people.
(DIR) Post #AC1gZNPe9IpgGe0fzM by jamie@mstdn.helios.red
2021-10-04T16:19:17Z
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@xpil I don't think it can, but if it did, and that brought everything with it that makes operating systems successful (commercialisation, proprietary software), then the people that currently like Linux would look elsewhere.
(DIR) Post #AC1h8UnKh8JZIWppeS by mohs@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T16:25:59Z
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@xpil It depends mostly on one aspect: Money thrown at the problem (or development magically getting independent of money issues).As someone who works against licensing of the big tech, I see that many major customers are wasting huge amounts of money, which is flowing to those big tech companies. Sure THEY can use it to improve their product, but you know about their interests.
(DIR) Post #AC1hjiLTHDOw2TYAee by sunweaver@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T16:32:09Z
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@xpil IMHO the hurdle to take is getting some of the Linux desktop environments (so not Linux as an OS, but the software running on desktop Linux) ready for the enterprise market. This also includes different levels of config management (user settings, user defaults, system wide managed settings, etc.) and toolchains for easily supporting large environments of machines running Linux on users' desks.
(DIR) Post #AC1hsvzbuBmqyJimzg by uglyhack@mastodon.technology
2021-10-04T16:34:23Z
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@xpilYesterday I installed kubuntu on a PC, and it just works. 15 min from nothing to working system. Sure, there may be issues, but Windows has those also.I think if Linux had the installed user base Windows has, and you asked the reverse, most people would say Windows isn't ready for normal users.I help with IT jobs at work, and about once a month I find myself cursing and wondering why anyone would pay for windows.
(DIR) Post #AC1myYAVtZTIahJnhw by pheonix@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T17:31:17Z
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@kev to add to this and my point above, the avg linux user cannot imagine a world outside of CLI, there're entire subcultures around it. For the general users, it's the other way around.With some DEs, linux is on a right path by prettifying the UI and adopting the set-it-up and forget philosophies of PC+Macs that most people have come to internalize. As much as some evangelists 'hate' that trend, you gotta play the same game to make it an even fight. And that's good, cause linux can be moulded
(DIR) Post #AC1nAyqeWihQoMxKIC by funnylookinhat@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T17:33:42Z
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@xpil System 76 + PopOS is definitely mainstream consumer ready.
(DIR) Post #AC1s0vt9AxhsVU9Pai by gortbrown@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T18:27:54Z
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@xpil I think if computers started being shipped with a more user friendly distro like Pop! OS or Zorin OS, there would be a chance. I don't think most people really care (or sometimes even know) what OS they run as long as it does what they want, so if a company like Samsung or Lenovo started selling Linux PCs the same way they sell Chromebooks, more people would get them. Idk about 2-digit market share, but it would most likely still see an uptick.
(DIR) Post #AC21ceNfcHeuncUItM by egnun@chaos.social
2021-10-04T20:15:25Z
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@xpil No, because people don't use PCs (and laptops) anymore.They use "smart" devices instead.So, we as a community have to consider this, if we want people to use Free/Libre Software.
(DIR) Post #AC2AU68HxumBqrI2Sm by trhr@fosstodon.org
2021-10-04T21:54:53Z
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@xpil Well, since Android and iOS both have Unix as a core OS, there should be no question that it *could* be made user-friendly, and it would probably suck.
(DIR) Post #AC2okBRfydBZ81aDq4 by Pa6l0@social.tchncs.de
2021-10-05T05:25:58Z
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@xpil the os needs to be minimal, so that everyone can use it and want to use it and still needs ton of features. Windows and macOS just do the job better here. Most of the time I was using a minimal Linux version it still felt shitty while I could easily start working with macOS even though I never used it before.
(DIR) Post #AC2qG7NoiQcLkaZNOi by pixelherodev@fosstodon.org
2021-10-05T05:42:57Z
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@xpil Well, "linux" is just the kernel ;) Linux is used as the core of Android, but it's frankly the least important part of Android.My view: Could a mainstream workstation OS be built using Linux as the kernel? Sure. But, if it happened, the fact that it uses Linux internally wouldn't be something any of its users would know or care about, and it probably wouldn't be relevant to the project.
(DIR) Post #AC571LtQZavLweotVo by chamilad@fosstodon.org
2021-10-06T08:00:08Z
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@xpil I think it absolutely can. But as of its current form, no. There are too many issues on different hardware that takes too much time even for an everyday dev. I think this will have to be done by a company with commercial goals in mind. A community will always be too "dorky" to bridge that gap.
(DIR) Post #AC5thawBp86CZEJvc0 by captain_crucial@fosstodon.org
2021-10-06T17:05:40Z
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@xpil we're too far in the direction of end users just pressing a giant button that says 'DO MY JOB' for that to happen