Post AB67Wysdzbb5v96HFQ by Barbarian@poa.st
(DIR) More posts by Barbarian@poa.st
(DIR) Post #AB62ipOMb2ucCHlaBk by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T20:46:05Z
2 likes, 1 repeats
feminism had good ideas which got invalidated by other societal and technical developments (like many other movements).take "let's protect sex workers!" for example. probably a great idea, protecting the weak is what a society is about. only now it's a flood of barely legals (of any gender..) who should really do different things than shoving big objects into every orifice of their body, streaming live to a smartphone in your vicinity, for validation and tOkEnZ.instead of saying "hey, great that you explore your sexuality in this way!11" we should put a fucking stop to this stuff. i'm 100% sure it would be better for everyone. it's not about "exploring sexuality" or "rights of sex workers" _at all_. the hippies did explore their sexuality and often noticed that it's probably not about quantity in the end. the difference was that there was nothing to gain but the experience (maybe it's an interesting parallel that todays drugs of choice are downers/uppers, not psychedelics). now we have silicon valley big tech making money off the insecurities of young people. if anything it is anti-emancipatory to encourage the selling out of ones sexuality on livestream.
(DIR) Post #AB63IXqbIv1GD00Oa8 by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-06T21:01:06.937964Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@bonifartius > let's protect sex workers!rescuing exploited women and making sure every woman has an alternative to survival sex is one thing, but enabling a sick vice that erodes society is quite another. (i was struck speechless earlier this year when my partner told me whoring is straight-up legal here). nordic model is pretty okay i think> maybe it's an interesting parallel that todays drugs of choice are downers/uppers, not psychedelicsYES.i read in a drug forum a while back, some dude was griping about Kids Today and told a younger poster sth like "man you aren't supposed to be snortin dope, that's for when you're old and bitter and life sucks. your youth is for havin fun, tripping balls on acid and molly and you're wastin it bucko"popularity of various drugs says a lot about an era> if anything it is anti-emancipatory to encourage the selling out of ones sexuality on livestream.i do wish we could get past this "emancipation" "empowering" "freedom" "liberation" type of language, it's always used to manipulate people
(DIR) Post #AB63laGNOxAM6BuOf2 by Dice@frennet.link
2021-09-06T21:06:20.793725Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius >feminism had good ideas which got invalidated by other societal and technical developments nah, they never did, check declaration of sentiments
(DIR) Post #AB677By0iMnAykJU7E by retroartdt@mastodon.social
2021-09-06T21:17:46Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius so you would punish those who do so?
(DIR) Post #AB677CSUt1B8VIZpdQ by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T21:38:51Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@retroartdt assuming you mean the live streamers:no i wouldn't punish anyone who livestreams shoving things into openings, why would punish the victim?i know that it's not a popular take, but i think that's what the overwhelming majority of the "amateurs" are. we got to the point that they think it's more lucrative for them to sell a livestream of themselves than doing something which doesn't cater to primal insticts. all while making big tech richer. this says a lot about the world we live in.you know, it wouldn't be that hard to just make a law to outlaw these ultra-monetized amateur pr0n platforms and have any company running a video platform implementing strict rules and age verifications.kids shouldn't send videos of themselves to anywhere. out of the same reasoning there are laws why they don't get to watch certain movies or buy booze.
(DIR) Post #AB677Cxh128G43AkG8 by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-06T21:43:52.363275Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius @retroartdt some of these "victims" do make very large amounts of money. one woman bought her own house. i don't know how representative that is
(DIR) Post #AB67Wysdzbb5v96HFQ by Barbarian@poa.st
2021-09-06T21:47:39.399716Z
1 likes, 2 repeats
@velartrill @bonifartius @retroartdt When you think about how dystopian it is that the most basic necessities like housing are seen as winning the lottery or something.Fuck the USA and everyone that profitted in a government rigged economy. Everyone that was involved with creating these real estate bubbles that kept Millennials from buying houses should be gutted and thrown in a ditch with their entire family. I mean this in total seriousness, these people belong in the ground.
(DIR) Post #AB67bSv4FYicFAN8ca by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-06T21:49:20.648282Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Barbarian @bonifartius @retroartdt agreed 100%, it's completely evil
(DIR) Post #AB69Wyg2wpazCOKlyS by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T21:50:07Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@velartrill well, judging by purely materialist standards that's not being a victim, sure. i naively assumed that that's not the only thing people care about :)@retroartdt
(DIR) Post #AB69WzK6XtddCd4lPc by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-06T22:10:56.525656Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius @retroartdt i get the impression you think camwhoring is motivated primarily by economic incentives. i don't doubt there's a very real group of women that that describes, i've known a few, but a huge proportion of e.g. onlyfans "content creators" are financially secure women who really are just doing this because they love the male attention, and many would probably still be engaging in similar behaviors if it wasn't so profitable. (certainly many women were happy enough to post nudes on tumblr completely gratis back when that was allowed, i, may or may not be speaking from firsthand experience here >_<). i've even heard of middle-class couples breaking up because the girl wanted to whore herself out on onlyfans (to "supplement her income," when money is mentioned at all) and got mad when her boyfriend wasn't okay with it.my read of the field (which could be out of date) is that survival sex work mostly happens offline and is invisible to ordinary people. online sex "work" is mostly a bougie affectation, a safe and sanitized version of the real thing that poor women and children get financially forced or enslaved into, and which pays much better. this stems i think from both a cultural and practical gap. a homeless junkie is not going to get the kind of online attention that a girl with a swanky apartment, porn acting coach, and AV crew is. also ime (in the US at least) "the street" is almost completely divorced from the online world, most of those people, while they probably have smartphones (if they're not literally enslaved), are unlikely to have even heard of onlyfans and would probably be unlikely to consider it as an option, for the same reason they don't generally go around creating patreons and gofundmes (tho i have seen the latter happen once or twice).
(DIR) Post #AB69aXnSpXqKzOVJia by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T21:54:55Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@velartrill @retroartdt @Barbarian it's millenials with no future watching streams of teens with no future, all for the profit of those who are responsible for the "no future" part :)
(DIR) Post #AB6B8JTEhXv0MCi0ae by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T22:28:20Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@velartrill my issue is more with the normalization of it as means to make money. we're on our way raising a generation of people thinking it's perfectly normal to make money this way. if you wan't to post nudes on the net, be my guest, it can go as "experimentation". taking money for it is IMO a completely different thing, ethically and (from my armchair) psychologically. i think this shows in your anecdote of the couple breaking up over it. i agree that it's seperate from street prostitution.@retroartdt
(DIR) Post #AB6BKfAFrzsZ79ifLs by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-06T22:31:08.278450Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius @retroartdt it definitely should not be allowed to become an "acceptable" way to make moneyespecially since from what i read that was the cultural crutch german courts are leaning on to keep the welfare system from being exploited to force poor women into prostitution…
(DIR) Post #AB6CM1DxRCn1m7f5Sy by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T22:39:20Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@velartrill the idea behind the german legalization was that it's not going away anyway, so at least let the women have the same benefits (social insurance stuff). i can follow the reasoning, but it was made for another time.@retroartdt
(DIR) Post #AB6CM2hlvqEUMscPZo by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T22:41:31Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@velartrill i have the feeling that the last sentence was b0rken english :)@retroartdt
(DIR) Post #AB6CM59qoPshyXlrcW by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-06T22:42:33.990899Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius @retroartdt the last sentence is perfect english actually :)
(DIR) Post #AB6CotkSJON6zGdJdQ by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T22:46:09Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@velartrill sometimes i have this weird feeling that the languages are thoroughly mixed up in my brain and that something i wrote/said is completely wrong :D@retroartdt
(DIR) Post #AB6Cs3B7huZL6Rbrm4 by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-06T22:48:22.728009Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius @retroartdt the nice thing about english being a germanic language is more than a few of the low-level idioms transfer over perfectly
(DIR) Post #AB6DH94suW7udger4q by hector@explosion.party
2021-09-06T22:52:54.305304Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@velartrill @bonifartius @retroartdt wELL AKSCHUAlly both Wenglish and Germond are Swedic linguans
(DIR) Post #AB6JYNBgIuNL2zR224 by velartrill@springbo.cc
2021-09-07T00:03:15.158195Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@hector @bonifartius @retroartdt germanic is higher up on the tree
(DIR) Post #AB747ld41BdqsX3fdo by retroartdt@mastodon.social
2021-09-06T22:13:04Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius Of course its not allowed for kids to sell sex anywhere as far as i know.
(DIR) Post #AB747mHpZcFeuy8EBU by retroartdt@mastodon.social
2021-09-06T22:13:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@bonifartius As far as adults go, people do all kinds of stupid shit for living, from playing video games for sport to making videos about painting fingernails or buying shoes. I don't see streaming sex as particularly evil and more senseless or harmful than many other legal occupations and activities. What if they started using some kind of peertube-like decentralized service for that, should it be also legislated against?
(DIR) Post #AB747mlbmu4SPK40bA by bonifartius@qoto.org
2021-09-06T22:32:55Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@retroartdt i was more thinking about sites like onlyfans where it's explicitly in exchange for money. i think decentralized would make this very hard. at least, it wouldn't be some big company making the most profit.
(DIR) Post #AB747nHVsHak0GzUKO by namark@qoto.org
2021-09-07T08:45:01Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@bonifartius you are full on diverting now, your main argument hinges on sex work being an unworthy occupation, pathological akin to drug addiction. The "big tech" is milking every software industry that exists today, nothing specific to sex work. In-before the insecure teenagers (and adults) that are being exploited are insecure (and also uncultured) because of tabooization and demoization of sex that you are advocating for. @retroartdt