Post A7BPCygZp8uIRT5P3Q by orekix@anime.website
(DIR) More posts by orekix@anime.website
(DIR) Post #A7B2gHNf67XjsLF3fk by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T15:19:21.125464Z
2 likes, 1 repeats
it just keeps going up, I don't know what to say
(DIR) Post #A7B4LmSUYVHA5Zr1bU by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T15:38:02.641365Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon I just say "nice". TBH I'm surprised it's still going up considering how it's essentially unusable with the current gas prices. I would have thought this would pause the bull run, but it's barely slowing.
(DIR) Post #A7B4QP3F0ibkwNFPai by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T15:38:53.514906Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy yeah it's really surprising.
(DIR) Post #A7B4hzk9qKb1f7i4oa by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T15:42:03.521101Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon I imagine people have faith EIP-1559 is going to fix gas prices.
(DIR) Post #A7B54KWvEvx4V9AYyG by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T15:46:05.063821Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon if they do they are mistaken, eip1559 will not lower gas prices
(DIR) Post #A7B5PXEHDfO3y7Yjya by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T15:49:54.991732Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon it'll be very interesting to watch if this accelerates adoption of rollups, though. uniswap v3 is supposed to launch on optimism soon.
(DIR) Post #A7B63dbcvlCdKRbUW0 by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T15:57:10.557266Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon Yeah, though somehow people are still using Uniswap. 4,340,898.55$USD in gas fees in the last 3 hours just for V2https://etherscan.io/gastrackerAnd 235,364.93$USD for a Dogecoin knockoff tokens :blobderpy:
(DIR) Post #A7B6CcWELEqUZ0MXw0 by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T15:58:48.036993Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon money printer going brr
(DIR) Post #A7B6gOXSsqh5tP8b9E by crunklord420@kiwifarms.cc
2021-05-12T16:04:11.234191Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @lain @Moon this is why I only care about BCS defi
(DIR) Post #A7B9jJuqpM3oHpAAGu by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T16:38:19.818924Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @lain @Moon All of this is happening with eth yet I've not heard a single sane explain why proof of stake isn't a scam. It's like they know it's a rich get richer scheme and people trick themselves in to thinking they will end up better off, and some will, by betraying themselves and licking the boots of those still above them. It's a pathetic perversion of the libertarian spirit that grew bitcoin from the dirt, and only continues to prove the hypothesis of libertarians being the biggest joke in history.
(DIR) Post #A7BA0xeMLmu8RTrRS4 by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T16:41:31.456841Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim @guizzy @lain I've heard multiple mutually incompatible arguments against proof of stake and I don't know which one to believe if any
(DIR) Post #A7BAVdHQ8SgsF7kylE by admin@happylittle.cloudns.cc
2021-05-12T16:47:01.317659Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon I don't know why this is so shocking to people it's still not 0.1
(DIR) Post #A7BBHYnk5erSFijF7Q by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T16:55:43.415898Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @guizzy @lain I'd be interested to know if you've heard any arguments for proof of stake. I've literally not heard a single one. All I've heard is non-arguments that dance around talking about who is incentivized to want proof of stake and how they're ultimately incentivized to act.
(DIR) Post #A7BBOaVk8FWja9f1ay by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T16:56:59.943155Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim @guizzy @lain just to get away from the obscene resource usage of mining.
(DIR) Post #A7BBpxrjPMRXpm02yG by shpuld@shpposter.club
2021-05-12T17:01:55.885395Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @Tim @guizzy @lain storage devices will be used in an obscene manner instead
(DIR) Post #A7BBviCyXCxv0kg2Vc by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T17:02:58.844449Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @guizzy @lain Exactly, that is an argument that could be used for anything that claims to work better than PoW, and is not an argument for why proof of stake works.
(DIR) Post #A7BBzIpGqbVTRoIl1M by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T17:03:36.670633Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld @Moon @Tim @guizzy that's not proof of stake
(DIR) Post #A7BC21UBm23mXMjo7k by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T17:03:54.941002Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@shpuld @Moon @Tim @lain That's not the proof of stake, that's the new proof of storage stuff. Proof of stake is using the promise of a reward and the threat of slashing a locked stake to enforce proper bookkeeping.
(DIR) Post #A7BCIVLgVoVnmwcRl2 by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T17:07:04.506052Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim @Moon @guizzy it does the exact same as proof-of-work, proof that you are refraining from other economic opportunities to buy trust on the chain.
(DIR) Post #A7BCQMOLhL0gKEbx1U by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T17:08:30.014524Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @Tim @guizzy btc people will shout about proof of stake because they'll never implement it, eth people will shout about proof of work because they want to look better and the cost of proof-of-stake looks better than proof-of-work unless you take a close look. the truth is somewhere in the middle.
(DIR) Post #A7BCdVyLOB3rnsihmK by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T17:10:53.261069Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @Tim At the direct naive level PoW is clearly very wasteful, but PoW advocates do have a point that the nature of the load it creates could be a great driver for the development of more efficient, less wasteful grids based on cheaper (renewable) energy.
(DIR) Post #A7BD3APGC1LGRnXeTo by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T17:15:31.367478Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon @Tim i think that's the same issue as in the parable of the broken window, you don't see the things that were not created because they were 'wasted' on bitcoin trust.
(DIR) Post #A7BDVX4VW8uOqoMPqK by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T17:20:39.122800Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @Tim For it to be like the broken window fallacy, we would need to have another use for the excess energy outside of peak usage though, and I don't think we have anything that's as flexible in that regard as PoW. Sure, if there's a big enough chunk of it, it might attract some more "useful" notoriously energy intensive industry (aluminum production for instance), but that's not going to be viable everywhere. Mining on the other hand can scale up or down easily.
(DIR) Post #A7BDuGMam9FyGpc0Mi by ademan@thebag.social
2021-05-12T17:17:28.147139Z
4 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Tim @Moon @guizzy The problem with proof of stake, is the staking is stored in the same chain you are supposed to be verifying. It’s essentially circular logic, and gives rise to the “nothing at stake” problem.There are mitigations but they all rely on having enough honest nodes online at the time of a given attack. A node syncing from scratch is unable to distinguish an honest chain from an attack chain.
(DIR) Post #A7BE1InG8feRpnRSSm by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T17:26:23.692918Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @Tim If there's a concern that PoW is not as inherently valuable to society as other industries, it would be easy to control usage by only offering the discounted pricing making them profitable on the condition of them being first shut down when capacity is reached. Or if you wanna go full market have an auction system for energy, though I'm sure that's not going to be an easy sell 😅
(DIR) Post #A7BEFF7KbV54UFTghc by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T17:28:54.028978Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon @Tim the cost of btc is not only cost of 'free' energy but also the servers, the cards, the asics, the people running it etc. essentially a system like btc mining will always expand to the maximum opportunity cost of the mining, energy prices don't really play a role in that because the difficulty on btc is dynamic, so a cost reduction will always lead to more people mining on the margin, keeping the cost the same. and just to be clear, i don't think the money and energy put into btc mining is 'wasted' and i do think you are right that the competitive advantage someone might get out of having cheaper energy will drive energy research. maybe i just don't like it framed as an excuse, because in that case i don't think the argument works.
(DIR) Post #A7BEuK5d1M6LmXGnA0 by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T17:36:19.682591Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon @Tim by the way, feld shared an interesting article with me the other day about PoS: https://ercwl.medium.com/proof-of-stake-is-less-wasteful-b2854a191766from the linked article in that one ("nothing is cheaper than proof-of-work") i was pretty convinced that PoS is just as inefficient as PoW, just that it hides the cost in a place that Greta can't see it. But after reading this one I think there might be a difference in that both PoW and PoS are equally wasteful for a 'good guy', but PoS can be vastly more costly to an attacker, which would indeed be more efficient. Not 100% sure in my thinking yet.
(DIR) Post #A7BFYoZt5PhhvEjOng by Itsuki@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T16:51:40.496951Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim How is it a rich-get-richer scheme?
(DIR) Post #A7BFYp2FNyOBLC030K by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T17:43:39.524998Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Itsuki I don't know how much you know about proof of stake or proof of work. And ultimately I'm not sure how it can't be seen that way if you do understand them. It can be said that proof of work is not immune from the general rule that the rich get richer, since the rich can afford to get in to mining. But mining is an actual investment, it takes work and you have to employ people, acquire chips, consume power and be able to manage and maintain it all. It's actual work. Even for those with existing wealth, it takes work, and continued diligence to keep it going.Proof of stake completely removes that and all associated risks. You literally just have to own coin to hold power indefinitely. It simply does not root itself in the real world, meaning it all the more readily will maintain itself through the same mechanisms of political corruption, monopoly, and population control that maintain our modern hollow power structures.tldr While proof of work doesn't entirely solve the problems of capture, it at least understands that it is wrong to make as easy as possible.
(DIR) Post #A7BGQVCFMTpLRwH1dI by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T17:53:21.903534Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @guizzy It's funny, this seems to always be the direction PoW vs PoS goes. But the statement, true or not, that "it uses less power than proof of work" says very little about proof of stake, and that it is the "big plus" of proof of stake should have people questioning why that is touted as the big selling point rather than something else.
(DIR) Post #A7BGSq46k8TOkga4Zs by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T17:53:47.031448Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @Tim @guizzy > hiding the cost in a place that Greta can't see itThe carbon is coming, the carbon is coming! Wake up everyone, the carbon is coming!
(DIR) Post #A7BGUUVxq5MWUcOl9s by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T17:54:03.499892Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim @Moon @guizzy i don't care about the energy usage, i'm talking about the economic efficiency
(DIR) Post #A7BGg6INi8JCqza4wq by chuculate@freespeechextremist.com
2021-05-12T17:56:11.778035Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon Nobody looks at gas prices from inside a big centralized exchange regrettably u.u
(DIR) Post #A7BH5uJQszqFDaNViq by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T18:00:50.869871Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @guizzy I'm not sure that changes what I've said. It doesn't matter how market efficient it is if it has fundamental failures in other regards.
(DIR) Post #A7BHT5398BedBCoILI by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T18:05:02.061283Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Tim @Moon @guizzy nobody should care about the energy usage because it's a made up talking point meant to distract you. If we want to fight over energy usage of an industry or product this is not even remotely the most interesting candidate to pick on, nor is it the most wasteful.But it's easy to target something that threatens an entire industry worth trillions of dollars. Nobody was going to lose control over hundreds of billions because washing machines and dryers got popular, or people shopping for clothes they'll only wear once at H&M / TJ Maxx / Macy's.
(DIR) Post #A7BHTMZJzoUbVuzjM0 by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T18:05:03.577158Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim @Moon @guizzy i mean, if you want to know why (eth 2.0) PoS works, you can read wikipedia, the faq on the ethereum wiki or the casper ffg paper. you said you haven't heard any arguments for proof of stake. but the efficiency being higher is the main argument, and by that people mean that it's economically cheaper to run PoS than PoW to get the same security guarantees.
(DIR) Post #A7BHo1IcGpHHd41yfA by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T18:08:49.539281Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@feld @lain @Tim @guizzy the carbon footprint per transaction is pretty bad
(DIR) Post #A7BI3QXsghvsGxW9Xk by orekix@anime.website
2021-05-12T18:11:35.597970Z
4 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon can I buy tortillas with it yet
(DIR) Post #A7BIEG6ppVaZ5g22gS by orekix@anime.website
2021-05-12T18:13:34.039590Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon not a joke, I don't care about the whole crypto nerd stuff or contract techie shit, I want to buy everyday things with this stuff why is it so hard
(DIR) Post #A7BIGkmIm6GKmscKhM by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T18:14:01.120783Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix probably bitcoin cash but it looks like no one cares
(DIR) Post #A7BIjiGrAwGFPRia24 by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T18:19:15.213505Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @Tim @guizzy @lain mining is separate from transactions. the mining is the expensive part, not the transactions.
(DIR) Post #A7BIk8vs34W86B6hZQ by orekix@anime.website
2021-05-12T18:19:18.794127Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon guess it won't work as an alternative to fiat then
(DIR) Post #A7BJHf1jk5v9C7pjDE by chuculate@freespeechextremist.com
2021-05-12T18:25:23.668807Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix @Moon Cryptocurrencies are the sole reason I'd open a store. (I use litecoin btw)
(DIR) Post #A7BJUx3K2EnMreud5E by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T18:27:47.469420Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @Tim @guizzy @lain i guess to other readers:yeah, mining and confirming transactions are directly related, but you have an arbitrary number of transactions that can be included in a single block (1MB right now) that's being mined so it's hard to put a realistic price tag on a single transaction's footprint.(i'd argue the *minting* of new BTC is the truly expensive part)
(DIR) Post #A7BJXAcUYzKZWPQ9QG by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T18:28:10.710727Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @guizzy That’s the thing, people say it’s more efficient, but they never sell it with how it is more efficient. How does it get the same security guarantees? I’ve never heard anyone more than state that it does. I’m not doubting that it can hold together, but how does it hold together? What will that look like? Will the monetary power structures be worse or better than they are now? Why is it worth caring about if it makes things worse? Because you can make some money off of it in the process? That’s literally niggercattle thinking (not saying I think you think this way).
(DIR) Post #A7BJitq6mJC2xANn4y by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T18:30:18.098177Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @Tim @guizzy @lain also how do you accurately measure the "carbon footprint" for a transaction when ~70% of the miners are using renewable energy sources. Do we just slap an average amount of carbon "emitted" per unit of energy consumption and call it a day?it really feels like there has been zero serious scientific approach to calculating this. We just say "look how many gigawatts, that's a big number!"
(DIR) Post #A7BJtjkKe1rapqqfNA by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T18:32:15.943162Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @Tim @guizzy @lain oh it seems there was an article discussing this recently, how topicalhttps://hbr.org/2021/05/how-much-energy-does-bitcoin-actually-consume
(DIR) Post #A7BK0wwVykCxn4zCvA by orekix@anime.website
2021-05-12T18:33:34.264232Z
4 likes, 1 repeats
@chuculate @Moon taco shop, pay with crypto
(DIR) Post #A7BK57qnMkWgmLInSq by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T18:34:18.371732Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @feld @Tim @lain Compared to what though? PoW isn't the cost of doing a transaction, it's the cost of trust in the ledger. If you want to compare to government-backed fiat you're not just comparing to the cost of running a transaction through VISA, but you have to account for everything that's used to built trust in the currency, which would be a very tough comparison to make (and would include such energy guzzlers as the military). Comparisons to PoS are mostly theoretical right now as it's not as battle-tested like PoW or fiat money.
(DIR) Post #A7BKHFJTRihJOlUnvk by chuculate@freespeechextremist.com
2021-05-12T18:36:31.472724Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix My sister is watching "Vaso Chorreado" videos. That's something I could've never considered before, that level of trash food.@Moon
(DIR) Post #A7BKU2i1cQWU4Y56nI by orekix@anime.website
2021-05-12T18:38:48.996820Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@chuculate @Moon we're like a little mexico with those things, street food everywhere and during some holidays there are dedicated places for that stuff
(DIR) Post #A7BKW4i39VPSr73uKG by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T18:39:11.496479Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon @feld @lain The thing is, proof of stake will end up being secured by the same things that secures fiat now.
(DIR) Post #A7BKgP7i6oDF41zRB2 by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T18:41:03.116257Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim @guizzy @Moon @lain fiat is not secured by huge financial risk if you make a big fucky-wucky and crash the economyinstead you get a big badda-boom-bailout from the government
(DIR) Post #A7BLncVUqZsOYP7WUa by Itsuki@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T18:39:20.860052Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim But didn't you accept yourself, that this is only an ideological distinction? What you describe is really just interest and it works without anyone putting in any work at all. I really don't see how this is more of a rich-get-richer scheme than capitalism in general.
(DIR) Post #A7BLnd2Ss0FQCeXqsa by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T18:53:34.109959Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Itsuki I don't know how it can be spelled out more clearly. Someone gains money by holding money vs someone gains money by putting that money to work. Should money be secured by itself or by work? How money structures work will disproportionately effect different groups. It is inherently political, and it does matter to groups who want their group to be more than cattle for another.
(DIR) Post #A7BNVZlEWCeIjU0LWi by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T19:12:43.250989Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Tim @feld @lain if we're talking about the euro do we have to include nato costs
(DIR) Post #A7BNeLW8qPoRAD7yWu by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T19:14:17.681222Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @guizzy @Tim @feld if we're talking about the yen we have to include natto cost
(DIR) Post #A7BNtGveBepjHBAuCu by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T19:16:59.457340Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @Moon @Tim @feld Trust decreases when natto is found inside shoes.
(DIR) Post #A7BOqicGtBUWEUSTke by shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu
2021-05-12T19:27:42.283038Z
4 likes, 1 repeats
@lain @Moon @guizzy gas prices are too high, so mom won't take me to get fruit rollups for our uniswap （合コン）😥
(DIR) Post #A7BOr5tmKGA4RRpHjU by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T19:27:48.963684Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Tim @feld @lain anyway this is a good point and I'll update my thinking accordingly.
(DIR) Post #A7BOvHZCsyC3mwCWlU by Moon@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T19:28:34.378507Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix incidentally I was in Mexico City last year and ate at a pizza place that did take Bitcoin.
(DIR) Post #A7BP0K9UhWbZFpZuds by vriska@lizards.live
2021-05-12T19:29:28Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@shmibs @lain @guizzy @Moon liberals will never acknowledge that they did this to you
(DIR) Post #A7BPCygZp8uIRT5P3Q by orekix@anime.website
2021-05-12T19:31:46.211869Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon based, so not all hope is lost
(DIR) Post #A7BPHEYCmR4gnxCReq by lain@lain.com
2021-05-12T19:32:31.016549Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix @Moon the payment solutions are there, if (or when) fiat goes away you'll just keep paying with your credit cards mostly and they'll do the hard work in the background.
(DIR) Post #A7BPLEawYece6GO8MC by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T19:33:15.052448Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon @orekix I like DASH as a spendable coin. Fees are low, and it's pretty popular with crypto payment processors.
(DIR) Post #A7BPc7WC7bvt4jDcoa by shmibs@tomo.airen-no-jikken.icu
2021-05-12T19:36:18.134189Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix @Moon agree with this, especially the tortillas part
(DIR) Post #A7BPv7nHJzXrQqGtzU by guizzy@pleroma.guizzyordi.info
2021-05-12T19:39:44.085613Z
4 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix @chuculate @Moon "Cryptaco"The business proposal writes itself
(DIR) Post #A7BQ6mGJCZla7xPHTk by orekix@anime.website
2021-05-12T19:41:51.218583Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@guizzy @Moon @chuculate TacoPay TacoCoin
(DIR) Post #A7BQGZuhy3kcj1ycDo by Itsuki@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T19:39:18.110160Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@feld @Moon > ~70% of miners are using renewable energy sourcessource?
(DIR) Post #A7BQGaMiHw9W7t4ysC by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T19:43:36.924297Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Itsuki @Moon there's a PDF, but I gotta find it
(DIR) Post #A7BQjcThVpGp4oByfQ by feld@bikeshed.party
2021-05-12T19:48:52.037161Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Itsuki @Moon there are like 5 studies in the past few years and they waver between "70%+ renewable" and "~30% powered only by renewables, ~70% mixed renewable and other sources" and I'm unsure what the latest analysis is sayingbut these studies are being done by Universities and stuff and should be trusted; it's not some report put out by bitcoin maxxies
(DIR) Post #A7BRav7evIPcFWIXey by Itsuki@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T19:57:17.084761Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@feld @Moon Interesting thanks, I'll have a look at those
(DIR) Post #A7BUGJDuQC9umI5K0u by chuculate@freespeechextremist.com
2021-05-12T20:28:24.324478Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix @guizzy @Moon Anything trumps Argenpeso https://argenpeso.com/
(DIR) Post #A7BViKVxJZj8qQS2To by Itsuki@shitposter.club
2021-05-12T20:07:21.549058Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Tim I still don't really see the practical difference.If I loan someone money to build up a mining pool and they repay me with interest from the mining rewards, I will have gained money for helping secure the blockchain without doing any "work". This is exactly the same as staking my money with a stake-pool operator. The only difference in "work" being done is in the trivial, physical sense. Which is to say that in the PoW-case we wasted energy while in the PoS-case we didn't.
(DIR) Post #A7BViKxxdS82FHYP8C by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T20:44:39.598627Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Itsuki >trivial, physical senseOnly someone deeply online could mistake the real world as trivial in comparison to the digital. Perhaps the best thing you could do to understand is go outside. I don't mean to insult, it's just that those who find themselves online only are ultimately controlled by those in charge of the physical. Proof of stake only hides this control while dangerously unbinding it from physical reality.There is a lot different between your loan example and staking that you seem to brush under the rug. A loan does not magically make chips or electricity available, or a warehouse or staff. That you do not key in on these things or perhaps regard them all as only a waste is why you appear to be far too engrossed by some hyper-rationalized digitally-framed concept of reality. It is perhaps analogous to the utopic thinking of communists and the broader left that continues to lead us deeper in to hell.The idea of digital currency is already abstract enough as it is, proof of work at least manages to keep it grounded. It is like the fed vs gold backed money. One is grounded and one is designed to be a free floating mechanism of manipulation and control, and not for the better despite what some would tell you out of self interest.
(DIR) Post #A7BXEsXOS7yVaQCxZQ by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-12T21:01:45.060013Z
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@Itsuki Or perhaps in other words, what you look at is waste is a valuable reality check on whoever finds themselves in control. Not a perfect one, again, but much better than nothing.
(DIR) Post #A7CSxJnW9kz8GF55VY by hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info
2021-05-13T07:48:28.114809Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix @Moon inb4 someone makes a shitcoin called TORTILLA (TORT) (ERC-2000)
(DIR) Post #A7CT4hBPbmdiogm7hQ by hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info
2021-05-13T07:49:48.329151Z
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@guizzy @lain @Moon @Tim @feld haha your autocorrect changed "increases" by mistake haha
(DIR) Post #A7CU4HsJnpY8HODIeG by hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info
2021-05-13T08:00:56.232273Z
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@orekix @guizzy @Moon @chuculate tacoin
(DIR) Post #A7CqIPVcPmin08jero by wowaname@anime.website
2021-05-13T12:09:58.263501Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@orekix @chuculate @Moon méxicito
(DIR) Post #A7CqMrOkfJDsele4Tw by wowaname@anime.website
2021-05-13T12:10:48.303866Z
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@orekix @guizzy @Moon @chuculate i want taco now
(DIR) Post #A7D53a0eafSgXLdcjA by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-13T14:55:22.971220Z
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@Itsuki It's more of a political distinction than ideological. It difference between the two has predictable real world outcomes, independent of what ideology you have. Basically if you want to be a niggercattle proof of stake is for you.
(DIR) Post #A7D5JHkMG7A0WrVMYK by Tim@pleroma.inumbra.xyz
2021-05-13T14:58:13.617844Z
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@lain @Moon @guizzy Congrats, Gretta's kike handlers got to Elon Musk https://nitter.kavin.rocks/elonmusk/status/1392602041025843203#m
(DIR) Post #A7EphminXLWsayM63U by clacke@libranet.de
2021-05-14T11:09:15Z
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@Tim @guizzy @lain @Moon There is no difference financially between how PoS and PoW work, it's just cutting out the coal-burning middleman.Also no difference from how passive income in general works.Ironically the clarity of the blockchain as an implementation of pure capitalism was what finally turned me against capitalism.From ancap to ancom-curious in one year.
(DIR) Post #A7EphnDdggCQ8cmj7w by hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info
2021-05-14T11:12:47.102339Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@clacke @Moon @guizzy @lain @Tim blockchain is hardly capitalism, it doesn't produce anything
(DIR) Post #A7Eq3i2dcLtSS35d9k by clacke@libranet.de
2021-05-14T11:15:29Z
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@hakui @guizzy @lain @Moon @Tim In that case, neither does traditional finance.
(DIR) Post #A7Eq3iX7n0HPybLyfw by hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info
2021-05-14T11:16:44.891520Z
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@clacke @Moon @Tim @guizzy @lain finance isn't capitalism
(DIR) Post #A7Etyv93s3i3Sb4B9s by clacke@libranet.de
2021-05-14T11:39:25Z
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@hakui @guizzy @lain @Moon @Tim finance is capitalism eating itself
(DIR) Post #A7EtyvexxREL3Xzet6 by hakui@tuusin.misono-ya.info
2021-05-14T12:00:41.959236Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@clacke @Moon @Tim @guizzy @lain finance is jewish alchemy
(DIR) Post #A7FVw91FcyglsZW4yu by clacke@libranet.de
2021-05-14T18:53:55Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@hakui @guizzy @lain @Moon @Tim aaaand we're done. Thank you for tonight.
(DIR) Post #AAEkJZ8h0cDbBDtenA by jeffcliff@shitposter.club
2021-08-12T03:48:42.436563Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Moon I'm so going to get assassinated