Post A37MLKfmd74XQyVGGO by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
(DIR) More posts by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
(DIR) Post #A360yAygDZpIVcUzpY by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-10T13:38:10Z
0 likes, 2 repeats
During these times when the #privacy-invading practices of #WhatsApp are brought into light, it might be good to check back again with #DeltaChat:https://delta.chat/en/I had only checked them back when they were just getting started, and encryption was still in the works. Today, encryption is built-in using #autocrypt and they offer even clients for the desktop.Has anyone tried it?
(DIR) Post #A361m2lp0UklX8GO48 by silkevicious@libranet.de
2021-01-10T13:46:33Z
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@kzimmermann i tried it. It was ok. I don't remember if it had issues about posting images or attachments or i'm confusing it with briar
(DIR) Post #A362kW9ss6ai3PM2Yy by fedops@linuxrocks.online
2021-01-10T13:57:25Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@kzimmermann yes. It works and it's an interesting idea, but has serious security implications. I assume you're fluent in German - here's a summary: https://www.privacy-handbuch.de/handbuch_74f.htmIf you look at it as an easy to use approach to encrypt email contents (but not the metadata) using PGP I think it's a viable solution.From a secure messenger point of view I consider Trifa (tox) and Session as the gold standards. See https://tox.chat/ and https://getsession.org/
(DIR) Post #A3646cyWJ9A9WL96NE by michal@101010.pl
2021-01-10T14:13:17Z
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@kzimmermann tried it a few months ago and I've been an advocate ever since 🤩
(DIR) Post #A365K4VXLzZ4d7Z0fQ by fedops@linuxrocks.online
2021-01-10T14:26:56Z
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@kzimmermann yes. It works and it's an interesting idea, but has serious security implications. I assume you're fluent in German - here's a summary: https://www.privacy-handbuch.de/handbuch_74f.htmIf you look at it as an easy to use approach to encrypt email contents (but not the metadata) using PGP I think it's a viable solution.From a secure messenger point of view I consider Trifa (tox) and Session as the gold standards. See https://tox.chat/ and https://getsession.org/
(DIR) Post #A368qSmMwqGB2HZdj6 by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-10T15:06:26Z
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@michal awesome! How's autocrypt by the way? Can you use it when talking to an email client that supports PGP like? (I assume that raw messages that are exchanged are no more different than a PGP ASCII-armored message, but I haven't read the standard)
(DIR) Post #A369Apvaaj5UccbKwi by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-10T15:10:06Z
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@fedops Ok, I actually don't speak a word of German, but I can see why it suffers from the same limitations as encrypted email (it *is* email, after all, isn't it?).I recently read about Session and think this is really the way to go. If they can operate across Lokinet, then this would be a true revolution.
(DIR) Post #A36CPJocZBCbEWwHnk by michal@101010.pl
2021-01-10T15:46:19Z
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@kzimmermann perhaps, I haven't dug that deep into specs. But when 2 parties use Delta the experience is flawless.
(DIR) Post #A36CR9mQqfBigkn9DU by michal@101010.pl
2021-01-10T15:46:41Z
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@kzimmermann perhaps, I haven't dug that deep into specs. But when both parties use Delta the experience is flawless.
(DIR) Post #A36CchIkYcsbq2PYMC by peter@mastodon.nl
2021-01-10T15:48:37Z
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@kzimmermann Yet another privacy respecting chat app nobody I know uses?
(DIR) Post #A36EHqA0cmgX8oVN56 by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-10T16:07:24Z
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@peter perhaps! But this uses email as a backbone for message delivery. And pretty much everyone uses email.
(DIR) Post #A36Hj2Fi4h9KKCpZ5M by lps@masto.1146.nohost.me
2021-01-10T16:45:54Z
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@kzimmermannI tried it, but unfortunately there are issues in my experience with delayed messages....so not really an IM:( I had an issue with my provider throttling delivery to a certain number per hour as spam prevention. Too bad, I love the idea.
(DIR) Post #A36Hr0ySi8TOg3ZHQO by fedops@linuxrocks.online
2021-01-10T15:34:24Z
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@kzimmermann sorry, just went by your handle sounding German. But yeah you got the jist of it.Yes, Session operates via Lokinet and can use Tor as well. It could conceivably work via USB drops, usenet posts, or carrier pigeon. 😂
(DIR) Post #A36JNZE4zy4081xWcK by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-10T17:04:28Z
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@fedops yeah, sorry, I think the handle confuses more than it helps sometimes haha :DI like the clever use of the anonymizing networks to hide metadata. Have you checked #briar as well? It mixes that with off-the-grid-ness.
(DIR) Post #A36MAmW8ZQQxRs05D6 by smir@fosstodon.org
2021-01-10T17:35:44Z
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@kzimmermann tried to use it and thought it would act as an email client, but never succeeded to receive an email on it, may be it’s me
(DIR) Post #A36P4tf7OPqzjV5R4q by fedops@linuxrocks.online
2021-01-10T18:08:12Z
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@kzimmermann not yet. Agree it looks good. So now we have Tox, Session, Briar, and soon cwtch all doing essentially the same thing but in incompatible ways. Sigh.
(DIR) Post #A36dUi06lrrSS96gSm by fredl99@fosstodon.org
2021-01-10T20:49:50Z
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@kzimmermann I have the mobile app for a long time now. Found it an interesting approach. And yes it works.It has also an option to import/export keys.If possible you should create and use a separate email address or else it will handle each incoming mail as a contact request.Apropos handle...I also thought you're German. Success with hide and seek. 😀I also like your profile foto as I'm a huge fan of Tarantino. 🌚😈
(DIR) Post #A37MLKHg4jn2EDE0gq by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-10T18:17:11Z
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@peter @kzimmermann I was looking for something like this a few years back and didn't find it. Might take it for a spin ...
(DIR) Post #A37MLKfmd74XQyVGGO by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-11T02:17:44Z
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@peter @kzimmermann So far: seems to work fine, and have almost everything I'd want
(DIR) Post #A37MLLKYBXgLTPZoo4 by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-11T02:18:48Z
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@peter @kzimmermann No native video calling, unsurprisingly, but facility for starting calls with a third party service like Jitsi
(DIR) Post #A37MLM7pEL65wEdAbw by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-11T02:19:29Z
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@peter @kzimmermann But setting it up for non-gmail domains that use Google for email doesn't seem to work (which means it would be a tough sell for some of my social network)
(DIR) Post #A37MLMtgMPNWKf1OCm by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-11T05:12:20Z
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@robertfromont wait, really? This sounds like a pretty significant letdown, since the big selling point of this project is to make email usable as a mass means to secure communication again.I'll do some more investigation.@peter
(DIR) Post #A37YTRanz9Pkf5oE0e by arbocenc@todon.nl
2021-01-11T07:28:15Z
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@kzimmermann Sure, I'm using it for more than a year ;-) I use it as my main #messaging system
(DIR) Post #A37Z7rAuI3ifaSxvYu by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-11T07:35:36Z
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@arbocenc that is great! Have you got anybody else on board with you? Maybe your family, once you convince them to use email for chatting again? :)
(DIR) Post #A37pFoR9x5FigANojg by arbocenc@todon.nl
2021-01-11T10:36:18Z
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@kzimmermann It's not necessary! You can use it with any #email account... And I know all my familiars and friends mail ;-)So I use it with lots of contacts, and 3 of them are @delta users too
(DIR) Post #A39E1rqfADwzDWif8i by peter@mastodon.nl
2021-01-11T19:50:21Z
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@robertfromont @kzimmermannIt does sound like something I wanted, too. I will have a look.Is it something I can send out to my family members, without them needing a specific app?
(DIR) Post #A39E1scsGyVzd3HAHo by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-12T02:48:36Z
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@peter in theory yes, as if the other people don't use this app delta will fall back to plain email (it is email, after all), so can be read with any email client.But first heed the warnings in this thread about whether this is appropriate for your threat model or not:https://fosstodon.org/@kzimmermann/105531696085344322@robertfromont
(DIR) Post #A39FvHvfztbpzF3Sfg by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-12T03:09:48Z
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@kzimmermann @peter There appeared to be two problems:1) It would successfully detect the domain supported OAuth, and authenticated successfully, but would then get the IMAP/SMTP host names wrong, so failed to connect.I could manually fix up those host names in the settings, but can't expect most of the people I want to use this with to manage that...
(DIR) Post #A39UPVvXutWpRjIiB6 by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-12T03:16:00Z
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@kzimmermann @peter 2) Once the host names were fixed, it would work for a while and then start showing IMAP errors, and not receive messages any more.This rings a bell; I *think* Gmail has a low tolerance for long lived, or numerous, connections or something like that. There seemed to be nothing to tweak in the settings to fix this, and again, even if there were, I can't expect my non-technical contacts to fix it themselves.
(DIR) Post #A39UPWAR1XREBuGbNw by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-12T03:22:14Z
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@kzimmermann @peter I guess I should raise a couple of issues on there GitHub repo <sigh>
(DIR) Post #A39UPWPg6rdCxBOm92 by kzimmermann@fosstodon.org
2021-01-12T05:52:09Z
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@robertfromont it makes sense, I think large providers do something like that as a spam prevention measure or something. But breaks legit usage like delta.There's a small "issue" writeup regarding specifically gmail in their site too, I think it covers at least your point #1 https://providers.delta.chat/gmail@peter
(DIR) Post #A3B1w4mfLYe4SsF2ps by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-12T23:42:24Z
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@kzimmermann @peter I filed an issue, and it turns out the issue is fixed but not released yet, so that's pretty encouraging.https://github.com/deltachat/deltachat-core-rust/issues/2137
(DIR) Post #A3B2qUJBdNVzqPLtWy by robertfromont@mastodon.nzoss.nz
2021-01-12T23:52:42Z
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@kzimmermann @peter I rasied an issue, and it turns out my issue is fixed but not released yet, so that's pretty encouraging.https://github.com/deltachat/deltachat-core-rust/issues/2137