Post A0SwDHxtjXvNeDem1o by toast@toast.cafe
(DIR) More posts by toast@toast.cafe
(DIR) Post #A0SqTY0RGIfSJ3DMqe by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:22:40.863505Z
11 likes, 4 repeats
while everyone is being mad at the dmcahave you considered that the dmca is an integral part of IP law?
(DIR) Post #A0SqXmLlsBPJx5D6TQ by normandy@biribiri.dev
2020-10-23T20:23:27.192814Z
4 likes, 1 repeats
@toast everything about IP law needs to go into the bin
(DIR) Post #A0SqbF8lHvka6zmFXs by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:23:54.358131Z
4 likes, 0 repeats
@Roujo you'd be surprisedevery single time I've criticized IP law (and variants) in the past I've had um...interesting interactions as a result
(DIR) Post #A0SqmieDv8NeoSxunQ by Roujo@toepi.moe
2020-10-23T20:25:29.848744Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast yeah it depends on the people, true. I do remember that one time I got a wall of text in response of me suggesting that maybe we shouldn’t just repeal copyright right now while people are still dependent on it for a living ¯_(ツ)_/¯
(DIR) Post #A0Sqmj46Mv546j4a8G by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:26:02.901239Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Roujo I could respond with a wall of text here, but instead I'm just going to respectfully disagree 👏
(DIR) Post #A0SqvCYkaqXhtoRyIC by hector@explosion.party
2020-10-23T20:27:37.359146Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@toast @Roujo respectfully agreeing with your disagreement.
(DIR) Post #A0SqyNCZTwr5m4aXZY by Roujo@toepi.moe
2020-10-23T20:28:11.442772Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@toast understandable, have a nice day ^^
(DIR) Post #A0Sr9hfZivAiRJYcF6 by msaunders@activism.openworlds.info
2020-10-23T20:29:52Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast have you considered that they are used as a method of abuse and control where generally unjust and unwarranted?
(DIR) Post #A0Sr9hpr6hOYxCMpGa by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:30:17.849151Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@msaunders I think you misunderstand the point of my post
(DIR) Post #A0SrIrvqw9gisHXdTM by msaunders@activism.openworlds.info
2020-10-23T20:30:55Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast quite possibly :)
(DIR) Post #A0SrIs4iPCmFJlgiHo by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:31:57.022069Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@msaunders (I am notoriously against IP law as a whole, and have famously criticized the GPL and similar for fundamentally being based on copyright, mentioning that MIT is the "compromise" position, encouraging people to use CC0 and similar :^) )
(DIR) Post #A0SrPsaGuZtWvJn2jA by msaunders@activism.openworlds.info
2020-10-23T20:31:41Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast I'm open to being corrected or having more clear explanation
(DIR) Post #A0SrPsqDxGefinFmam by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:33:13.261396Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@msaunders the point of the post is "if you think DMCA is bad, consider that some form of it is required to have IP law function, and that consequently you also think IP law is bad"
(DIR) Post #A0SrUVwWWBDy9RPMky by chase@cocaine.moe
2020-10-23T20:34:03.610641Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@toast it's almost like IP law is bad or something idk :blobcatthink:
(DIR) Post #A0SrVtOSoZ4zAi8Nbk by centi@biribiri.dev
2020-10-23T20:25:17.267175Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@normandy @toast Agreed with Normandy.
(DIR) Post #A0Ss1Xvc9pNnrgjYfo by msaunders@activism.openworlds.info
2020-10-23T20:35:56Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast I don't really believe in IP, much like land "ownership" :) but I do get what you're saying I believe."some form of.." though does not mean it should not be criticised - it can be bad as a whole, or in how it's used, even though part of it is arguably required, right?
(DIR) Post #A0Ss1YMYXevxDFL4fQ by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:40:01.462665Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@msaunders you are still missing the point, somehowyou primed yourself to think I'm defending the DMCA for whatever reasonno, I'm trying to say IP law is also bad, and not saying anything in favor of the DMCA system :blobtongue:
(DIR) Post #A0Ss2DzHmZH8JEm5E8 by lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me
2020-10-23T20:40:08.642628Z
5 likes, 0 repeats
@toast The only IP I recognise is IPv6. :)
(DIR) Post #A0SsVOtUJMVuX6yUqG by msaunders@activism.openworlds.info
2020-10-23T20:43:39Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast ah, I'm with you now :)You might want to check your original wording.Either I'm reading it totally wrong, or it's ambiguous/misleading.Were you meaning that "if someone's mad at dmca, they should probably consider being mad at IP in general" ?
(DIR) Post #A0SsVP6FXuipAgwgjY by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:45:24.755455Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@msaunders yes, but "IP in general" includes DMCA (which is one of the prepositions in the post)also at least 11 other people (number of favs, though it's more than that for sure) have read it and understood it to mean that
(DIR) Post #A0SsbxIhIjuuyrtMVE by nerthos@shitposter.club
2020-10-23T20:46:37.010083Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@toast nuke IP law
(DIR) Post #A0Sswsc1vX2IWPucCm by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2020-10-23T20:50:23.996977Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@toast Remember how the entire IP mafia got fat on the carcass of pulp for 80 years? This is piece of trivia is kinda cool.
(DIR) Post #A0StAkX8lE7bWIEqyu by msaunders@activism.openworlds.info
2020-10-23T20:52:28Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@toast hope my "tone" didn't come across bitchy.was just letting you know it could be read in another way :)
(DIR) Post #A0StAkjC2PlM7fsTlg by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:52:52.464532Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@msaunders alright fair enough ^^I've been primed pretty hard by your original response too, eh?
(DIR) Post #A0StOw4Ag9pVLHS90C by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2020-10-23T20:55:28.176455Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@toast Did you know that Hollywood is a psyop operation and so is the music industry. The people behind Hip-Hop are guilty of a espcecially naste scheme. Behold:http://www.hiphopisread.com/2012/04/secret-meeting-that-changed-rap-music.htmlThis shit kinda stops working if everything becomes public domain after 15 years.
(DIR) Post #A0StmXFQbZ7hJqyIAC by dublinux@mastodon.technology
2020-10-23T20:57:12Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toastNot an expert on this but I'm pretty sure the GPL was deliberately designed to make use of the existing laws to achieve the desired aims.Was it not simply tactical rather than being ideological?The ideological strategy would have been to have rail against the copyright laws and since this would almost certainly have failed one could say the correct path was chosen?
(DIR) Post #A0StmXZzN7ZOLcaiDA by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T20:59:43.221158Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@dublinux this tacticality is the exact same tacticality stallman dislikes in copyrightconsider the following quote:> We thus have a paradox: the developer of useful software is entitled to the support of the users, but any attempt to turn this moral obligation into a requirement destroys the basis for the obligation. A developer can either deserve a reward or demand it, but not both.(source: https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/shouldbefree.en.html)The same paradox applies towards using copyright (the system being criticized) towards making the moral obligation (to share the code) into a requirement (or else we take it away!)It isn't simply tactical, but actively hypocritical.I really don't want to get into another hellthread with 20+ people yelling at me for not bowing down to RMS though, so I'd prefer this be the last message in this subthread.
(DIR) Post #A0SuAuOuAtVu4o1hDM by ivesen@miniwa.moe
2020-10-23T21:04:07.331138Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast it really isn't though
(DIR) Post #A0SuCuoNcNZNvitn8a by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2020-10-23T21:04:30.157292Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@toast Another cool thing: Did you know how things that are out of print are expensive as hell? This goes especially for scientific stuff. Standard works on certain topics cost like 100 Benis each tome. Then there are science journals, were studies are published that are also expensive as hell to get from the publisher of the Journal. It encourages fraud, agenta pushing and a really shit philosophy of science. A scientific publisher notorious for all that: Elsevierhttps://archive.is/Dyv3R
(DIR) Post #A0SuF8IaRa8SL55Lk0 by galena@paws.moe
2020-10-23T21:04:54.142090Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@toast Which is why IP needs to be abolished.
(DIR) Post #A0SuFsY6UDsbmWhOJU by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T21:05:01.760263Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@ivesen if you own X and the law says so, you *must* have a way of saying "I own X, you can't have that"this is fundamentally what the DMCA isthe "takedown" aspect is actually the least dangerous approach to it in the real world
(DIR) Post #A0SuSm9zYFwFjPZQnY by a_breakin_glass@cybre.space
2020-10-23T21:06:52Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@toast real cc0/unlicense/etc hours
(DIR) Post #A0SvizGigLVkyT0lzk by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2020-10-23T21:21:30.228742Z
1 likes, 1 repeats
@toast Did you know that year 2019 was the first year copyrights expired since 1998. Affected; Works from 1923. Yes, 1923. This is how long copyright last in America nowadays.https://everybodyslibraries.com/2019/01/01/public-domain-day-2019-welcome-to-1923/
(DIR) Post #A0SvstZ2kIzqB6J4ng by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T21:23:17.290713Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@maxmustermann dude, yes, I knowI did not sign up for your trivia session either
(DIR) Post #A0Sw6lGgO5J4VCKYa0 by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2020-10-23T21:25:48.031924Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast Just stuffing your thread with tidbits and being too lazy to tag everyone.
(DIR) Post #A0SwDHxtjXvNeDem1o by toast@toast.cafe
2020-10-23T21:26:58.164674Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@maxmustermann the thread doesn't belong to you, and tagging people that don't want to be tagged is a great way to have them ignore your messagefeel free to post all these things on your own timeline, and on your own time, without attempting to borrow mine, thanks
(DIR) Post #A0SwkLZJMCKcNbv5Jg by maxmustermann@shitposter.club
2020-10-23T21:32:56.627945Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@toast fair enough.
(DIR) Post #A0TXILEOiLUTWse9tg by Meeper@blob.cat
2020-10-24T04:22:27.953829Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@toast Let’s keep things simple and remove the clause in which tampering with drm in your personal copy is illeagal
(DIR) Post #A0W8E9uPknGMYWQ2ZE by namark@qoto.org
2020-10-25T10:25:42Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@dublinux @toast The main argument for software copyright today is that the industry hinges upon it. GPL license allows you to escape that and create industries that deprecate the use of copyright, there is no better way to convince people. Otherwise no matter what law you change another (written or unwritten) will be abused and the same culture will be reinvented.A permissive license is not a principal protest, it's a declaration of neutrality, you are basically saying that you are ok with the proprietary software culture. GPL is the closest you can get to a principal protest, without being completely ignorant of reality, and if you are ignorant by choice you shouldn't license at all. Encouraging people to use CC0 today is neither here nor there. It's living in hell and pretending it's heaven.