Post 9rEBfv939KFrEcOoN6 by quad@weeaboo.space
(DIR) More posts by quad@weeaboo.space
(DIR) Post #9rDqVvq3cLTXS8uZ1s by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T09:53:30.069144Z
5 likes, 1 repeats
I really hope the Librem 5 and Pinephone manage to kick off Linux phones enough for there to be more models down the line.It's already fair to say that at least the Pinephone is a success among enthusiasts, and while the Librem 5 is under a lot of controversy, it seems like they will be able to launch a very good, albeit expensive phone at some point.But if say a Pinephone 2 never ends up being created, then it'll just be another super cool device that enthusiasts loved, but which then falls in to obscurity only to never leave
(DIR) Post #9rDql2cIhODioogJAu by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T09:56:13.973858Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
Also if there is a market, I hope it makes manufacturers of mobile components open up their stuff and/or implementing it in the mainline kernel, because almost every mobile chip out there is just a crappy proprietary locked down black box. That benefits all phones, not just Linux phones, Android phones with custom roms too
(DIR) Post #9rDr7JLjASWt5KY4Zc by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T10:00:15.504341Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
Not to mention that I need me a Pinephone 2 in the future. 2.4 GHz only WiFi has already been obsolete in my house, I've been 5GHz only for like 3-4 years, and only keep a weak 2.4GHz SSID for my Roomba and old video game consoles. Will probably have to raise the transmission power of that just to get usable WiFi for a Pinephone
(DIR) Post #9rDrWgBrNoHlAF1u52 by lain@lain.com
2020-01-21T10:04:51.726278Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@quad i doubt that there's any market for a phone like the pinephone beyond the enthusiasts. even for them, it's essentially a hobby / toy.
(DIR) Post #9rDrZuCTkbcJU4rDoO by pony@blovice.bahnhof.cz
2020-01-21T10:05:27.187938Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@lain @quad there wasn’t even much of a market for an actual phone-thing like n900
(DIR) Post #9rDrhp5MeQfZwCIyOG by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T10:06:51.294608Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@lain That's fine. As long as there's enough enthusiasts to keep it alive and hopefully gradually trickle towards more regular people, even if that takes 20 years.Just let there be enough buyers and community support for there to be more phones with more software
(DIR) Post #9rDrqgqUejZgzLZrZQ by ivesen@miniwa.moe
2020-01-21T10:08:28.918010Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@pony @lain @quad I want my n900 back :blobcatsadlife:
(DIR) Post #9rDrzibzSWiR4X6BiC by lain@lain.com
2020-01-21T10:10:06.695364Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad i'm fine with it being an enthusiast project as well, but i don't see what could even potentially trickle down towards normie users. What innovation should there be?
(DIR) Post #9rDs3cyiLWgWl5akjI by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T10:10:48.007340Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@ivesen @pony @lain Xperia Play but with Linux when
(DIR) Post #9rDsLtDkhBKQLXKkKW by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T10:14:05.632660Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@lain Nah, normies who just want to play Candy crush and post on facebook won't buy it.There already are innovations, i mean heck it's linux. Microsoft failed at their convergence thing, Apple gave up and tries to just call the iPad a laptop and Android hasn't really tried except for some stuff like Samsung's Dex. But with a phone that literally runs Linux it mostly works out of the box as long as you have DisplayPort.But things like that won't attract enough people, especially not normies. I just want more people to understand how much they're throwing their privacy out the window
(DIR) Post #9rDsfniarbDh4XFniy by lain@lain.com
2020-01-21T10:17:43.739846Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad their approach of using cheap, more or less off-the-shelf hardware is great, seems a lot more promising than all those approaches that try to reinvent the hardware side as well.
(DIR) Post #9rDt7EEcNqwl89JNey by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T10:22:38.801018Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@lain Purism are just trying to go too fast. Fantastic concept, but the market for more open components is hot garbage.That said Purism have contributed a lot of software and are putting in tons of effort it seems. So even if their PR is a disaster, there's good intentions behind it.But it's just flat out going to be too expensive and/or difficult to do both software and hardware in one go.The Librem 5 is the more "complete solution" right now but they're doing so by brute force.Pinephone is providing cheaper and more accessible hardware which will probably do much more good long-term.The best strategy imo is to get a solid software base whatever sacrifices must be made, then slowly but gradually replace components revision by revision until who knows, maybe one day there's a Pinephone 10 that's actually fully open.But trying to solve software and hardware by brute force is ridiculous, while Purism have mostly proven that it is possible, it seems far from sustainable. But who knows, I'd happily like to see them prove me wrong
(DIR) Post #9rDzWHWrs7XGJQB3Im by tempo@social.generallyrubbish.net.au
2020-01-21T11:29:35Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad Vast majority of the Wi-Fi networks around me are still 2.4GHz, including my "home" one (2013 laptop hotspot). It's an inconvenience but I'll live with it.Hopefully a decent affordable open source radio module with all mobile bands and both 2.4 and 5GHz WiFi support comes out soonish so we can get a Pinephone 2.
(DIR) Post #9rDzWHmouoIP6tdnAO by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T11:33:49.630715Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@tempo yeah that's because most people still use the garbage router provided by their ISP.My landlord only got 5GHz when the ISP swapped his 10 year old probably entirely unpatched router last year
(DIR) Post #9rDzZMlgqjsfQha5QG by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T11:34:58.336316Z
0 likes, 2 repeats
@tempo pretty sure i telnetted into it one time and saw that the kernel build date was 2011 or somethingshould honestly be illegal for ISPs to have monthly paying customers use such trash.but no, instead they want to make it illegal for us to replace their insecure boxes ourselves. ISPs are devils
(DIR) Post #9rEBfuhOo88XqrSjGy by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T13:46:27Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad Apologies for the somewhat controversial question: but what is the advantage here?
(DIR) Post #9rEBfv939KFrEcOoN6 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T13:50:37.150594Z
2 likes, 1 repeats
@h3artbl33d The advantage if Linux phones stay alive?Because then people can finally buy a phone with software they can control, should they want to, unlike iOS or Android. (Beyond relying on all kinds of weird Android ROMs on XDA)
(DIR) Post #9rECpQ1tn3XtaA9CBE by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T13:57:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad Thank you for your prompt and thoughtful reply.AOSP or proper forks like GrapheneOS allow the same. But it does require flashing. The way I see it, is that the main advantage of AOSP/GrapheneOS over the Librem 5 is the more secure design. Initially, the Librem product info claimed that there would be SELinux but that got scrapped pre-launch.I fully agree with the choice advantage though :)
(DIR) Post #9rECpQW1z1eH5cFG9A by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T14:03:32.212093Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@h3artbl33d I currently use AOSP on my phone. But it really isn't that great. Since usually you're stuck with whatever Android version your phone last had officially.I'm not a flashing expert but I believe this is generally referred to as a vendor partition.And if that doesn't support Android 10, good luck making an Android 10 build for that phone.On the other hand, these Linux phone projects that attempt to open source their efforts and get changes into mainline Linux, means that support is near guaranteed. If it gets mainline support, it's often likely to stay there for as long as most those devices would live.You can have a phone with the latest software features, that also gets security patches, and is already pretty much converged with desktop use, although most applications aren't optimized (yet)
(DIR) Post #9rECugMOV7dxg8FAO0 by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T13:59:37Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad Perhaps I am being a tidbit negative here, but my real concern is that - whatever phone/OS one goes with, there is still a baseband SoC required, which is closed source, proprietary nastyness.Fixing that, however, requires a industry-wide approach and change of attitude, I am afraid.
(DIR) Post #9rECugj58ln8oUrHkW by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T14:04:30.351499Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@h3artbl33d >whatever phone/OS one goes with, there is still a baseband SoC required, which is closed source, proprietary nastyness.See: https://weeaboo.space/notice/9rDt6ybNlXmF81o07E
(DIR) Post #9rEKZLa5MTnAmjz8zo by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T15:30:17.955701Z
2 likes, 1 repeats
@quad My problem with linux phones, is the same with SBC's, is that they use ARM. ARM on linux right now isn't on a good place where almost every company don't release open-source drivers for the processor, GPU and more and people have to rely on drivers that you can't use in a lot of places.Like on raspberry pi where because Broadcom don't release open-source versions of the GPU drivers makes impossible to do a fully working build of android on it.Would be amazing if appeared an Pinephone or Librem5 with RISC-V, but while you have open-source drivers for everything in RISC-V, the software part isn't good yet
(DIR) Post #9rEOB8hxyFNVj9Nr72 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:10:43.482784Z
3 likes, 2 repeats
@kumicota I just hate ARM in general, especially the boot methods for most boards, fuck u-boot.But I also hope for RISC-V in the future, that would be dope as all heck.
(DIR) Post #9rEOJIFQO1Chd9vCsK by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T14:10:49Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad I agree, at least partially. Older/EOL/unsupported phones can be 'hacked' to run a more recent version of Android. For example, Android 10 can run on a Samsung Galaxy S4.That doesn't fix, however, that the firmware (bootloader, vendor, radio, etc) aren't updated anymore and are likely to contain nasty vulnerabilities and bugs.The same goes for the Librem/Pinephone. While you might receive more recent kernels during X years, baseband/firmware updates will stop at some point. [1/2]
(DIR) Post #9rEOJIYZEqW4aWsUiG by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T14:14:03Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad And while it might very well be possible to run a newer kernel/distro on them, it will remain insecure if the baseband is severely out of date. See, eg: https://www.extremetech.com/computing/170874-the-secret-second-operating-system-that-could-make-every-mobile-phone-insecureBut, I refuse to take away the positivity here. I really like that Librem, Pinephone and possibly others are, at the very least, giving it a shot. In the end, nothing changes if no one cares.
(DIR) Post #9rEOJIosGDYnP6VW88 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:12:11.745251Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@h3artbl33d Yeah I know basebands are just about the worst thing ever. Basically same story as Intel ME. If not worse because they're directly responsible for all external communication
(DIR) Post #9rEOz8EO1DgOj7O0OW by clacke@libranet.de
2020-01-21T16:19:41Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @kumicota The problem isn't ARM, it's the boards and firmwares people put around it, and the business incentives that lead there. Give them a CPU with any ISA, including RISC-V, and they'll recreate the same mess.
(DIR) Post #9rEP3aeUIAYW1zikOe by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T16:16:46Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad Totally agreed :) That is one thing I like about the Librem, a hardware toggle to turn off the baseband (same for the microphone, etc).I am keeping a close eye on the Pinephone, really curious to see their accomplishments.
(DIR) Post #9rEP3azl15ZN5xfjY8 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:20:33.427545Z
4 likes, 1 repeats
@h3artbl33d Pinephone has those too.In fact the PinePhone has 6 separate dip switches right above its microSD slot, although only 5 are relevant for privacy. 1 is for the Baseband, 2 is for WiFi/BT, 3 is for Microphone, 4 is for Rear Camera, 5 is for Front Camera.The 6th switch changes the headphone jack into a UART port for serial debugging even if say the screen broke.They're not pretty switches like the Librem 5's though, so you will need some nails or maybe a pen to flip them.
(DIR) Post #9rEPBLrDBNXGSkNCVc by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:21:58.392230Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@clacke @kumicota Oh they definitely will.Same thing happens to x86 too, it's why people hate the whole Intel ME debacle, it's basically the same story as the sketchy firmware running on basebands.
(DIR) Post #9rEPLVFl6TuaV1hBb6 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:23:48.333075Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@h3artbl33d And of course they're under the back cover, which kinda sucks.Again, perhaps a Pinephone 2 would give us at least some of these as easily accessible switches along the side.
(DIR) Post #9rEPOr8sB3zfFu4ck4 by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:24:25.563767Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@clacke Right now there's a few companies like sifive, sipeed and others that their RISC-V boards is fully open-source.What's needs to happen is to people to incentivate(with money or I don't know) this kind of pratices with RISC-V so it won't end like ARM@quad
(DIR) Post #9rEPfL76VnpiqN6dsG by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:27:21.338112Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke Rather other companies need to incentivize. 99.9% of the target demographic for something like a phone will never give a shit if it's open source, even if they care about their privacy they're likely too uninformed to even know what happens under the hood and believe they've solved the problem by using Dropbox instead of Google Drive on their Android phone with Google Play Services.Unless the companies assembling individual components into a complete product, like say a phone, pushes for this openness, the individual component manufacturers will go the same route as past platforms
(DIR) Post #9rEPygrJt4E5muwysC by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:30:54.236409Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @clacke True but saddly most of people today don't care to give all of his data to companies for free and I bet even if they knew what they collect this won't change their minds
(DIR) Post #9rEQ4DbvXoiaoVO208 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:31:53.233879Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke There's two ways to solve this issue, and achieving method 1 is hard without doing method 2 first.Method 1 is convincing "assemblers" to make sure all their components are ethical and open. If they refuse, downstream component manufacturers will have no choice but to comply or go broke, no matter how hard you try, companies will never do this for any reason other than "it's required in order to make money"Method 2 is teaching end-consumers to prioritize buying things that adhere to method 1. Or optimally, teach them to flat out refuse purchasing anything that doesn't adhere to method 1
(DIR) Post #9rEQNemYkIDGaQd2My by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:35:24.869530Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @clacke I think the second method is hard. I have called a lot of friends of mine(Even ones from comp-sci classes) to come to fediverse, to left WhatsApp for plataforms like Pleroma and Wire/Signal but they don't want to change because {Random_Excuse}.People won't care about openess and privacy not until hurt them, which when they realize(if they do) it will be too late
(DIR) Post #9rEQO96nzaEWduKd5k by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:35:27.105388Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke We pay for convenience with our privacy.Same way we paid for cheaper products by giving away our local manufacturing to china.It's hard to swallow the pill for a $1000 "Entirely made in Norway" phone if there's a $100 phone that's literally identical to the dot except for the country it and its components were manufactured in. Whether they admit it or not, people want to save that money, regardless of ethics or morals, at least those without way too much determination.In the same way you'll never manage to convince most people to care about their privacy. The only option is to make the open alternative more convenient, and market it just as much.
(DIR) Post #9rEQTaFIWcGYFptfcG by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:36:28.460360Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke Cue the chicken-and-egg excuse of "I won't switch because my friends haven't switched" which goes in an endless chain unless you manage to gather 100 000 people to switch at once.
(DIR) Post #9rEQjbzjn2R8JQGHMe by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:39:20.781706Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad I find funny that people who complains that the minimum wage is too low, that the country should care more about the workers are the ones who buys most things manufactured by chinese which most of them work as slaves. And that's one of reasons I refuse to buy anything from amazon@clacke
(DIR) Post #9rEQk6ykal4CPL2Qd6 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:39:22.233330Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke Not to mention that a lot of the convenient features people want are basically impossible to without violating privacy.Like typing in your name or phone number and then automatically finding your friends because the service scanned a billion faces or their phones' address books.It's an example of a convenient feature that people demand or have come to expect, whether they realize it or not. Yet the whole feature is pretty much invented around the concept of scanning people's personal data.If you ask me, we lost the privacy wars long ago.
(DIR) Post #9rER0I0tKjkDGQknia by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:42:22.626583Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @clacke I agree and we lost more every with people finding funny and amazing by using the face, cellphone, handprint and more to pay for services or using a "cool" instagram filter. TBH I don't mind to share certain data with companies to use their services for free. The problem I have is I don't know which data is being shared and how much of it
(DIR) Post #9rER13QN3p3IJ42JSS by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:42:30.945404Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke I only buy crap straight from china when no matter where I buy it, it's definitely the same chinese thing but more expensive.For example I can buy a $20 HDMI cable in Norway, or I can get the literal exact same cable for $1 on AliExpress.Same with phone cases.And all store-brand tech. I can basically guarantee that store-brand anything tech has a 99% chance of being a thing of Alibaba with a logo slapped on it. Unfortunately a lot are only sold in bulk, but more often than not you can find the same store-brand tech for half the price on AliExpress except its missing the logo
(DIR) Post #9rERBY5zscZGKOVjaC by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:44:25.186167Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke Transparency and/or regulation are the main issues here.Tech moves so damn much faster than our government that when the government realizes that scanning people's face without consent is a thing, tech companies have been doing it for 10 years already.
(DIR) Post #9rERI42m0k2T9O6reC by Vamp898@social.tchncs.de
2020-01-21T16:44:35Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @clacke @kumicota who is people? Even most of my work mates, all Admins, don't know what Intel ME is, and I think beside admins (what is 99% of the users) nobody knows.So you can't say people hate the Intel ME, a small dedicated group inside a small dedicated group doesn't like it.
(DIR) Post #9rERI4QWaR2OL3DpfU by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:45:34.023753Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@Vamp898 @clacke @kumicota in this case people was just referring to privacy nuts like us in this conversation, maybe "we" would've been a better word
(DIR) Post #9rEROg5nSY4WtUg4HY by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:46:47.832494Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad I don't see anything wrong with buying from there I won't pay 3x to buy a raspberry pi 4 here where someone is just drop shipping. Just that people don't care with a thing until it happens with them@clacke
(DIR) Post #9rERpuPgK6xT7yxmd6 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:51:42.403110Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke Here's a white $30 switch "from Norway" lmao
(DIR) Post #9rESH6ooJCqnQ9gesC by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:56:38.571517Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad bruh and it may come with custom labels and sticker so that they don't need to expend a penny on it@clacke
(DIR) Post #9rESOTyWbxA9GckMxk by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:57:56.997412Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke The effort is is absolute zero.The model number of the chink switch is TH-1008. This switch "invented in Norway" has the name Lynx 1008
(DIR) Post #9rESWfbNGeUNdvp3PE by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T16:59:25.782430Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke The worst is that they have the balls to put "Developed in Norway" on it
(DIR) Post #9rESmwJWtqkG6mEYAy by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T17:02:22.957898Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad lol, maybe they do this to pay less taxes. At least here if they manufacture the product here they don't need to pay a lot of taxes so what's bussiness like sony and microsoft usually do is to ship everything disassembled in containers and assemble it here in a simple factory and ship to customes to pay save on taxes@clacke
(DIR) Post #9rETATUzgXpNgpoo6a by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T17:06:37.193709Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @clacke No it's marketing. They have their HQ in Norway, but sell their products elsewhere too. The whole point is to make buyers think "Scandinavia is rich, so if it's made there it's gotta be good". Which is also why they went as far as slapping "Scandinavia" in their name.It's to inflate perceived value and absolutely nothing else.
(DIR) Post #9rETCM7e59fdOInJSK by hj@shigusegubu.club
2020-01-21T17:06:59.150830Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @clacke @kumicota "made with german equipment" is still the best tho
(DIR) Post #9rETNPuEM4Y6JLnHmq by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T17:08:57.659395Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@hj @clacke @kumicota they probably just sent a german screwdriver down and asked them to use it at some point in the manufacturing process, or at least pretend to.
(DIR) Post #9rETVbIBu7xvwTu51U by pony@blovice.bahnhof.cz
2020-01-21T17:10:27.604011Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @hj @clacke @kumicota someone yelled scheisse during assembly
(DIR) Post #9rETy7HGZtjzFb4J2e by kumicota@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T17:15:37.338041Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @hj @clacke now the problem is.Was the screwdriver made in China?
(DIR) Post #9rEUcQfRuCwkyGbPBQ by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T17:16:25Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad Wow - that is awesome! I'll take switches behind the back cover over my current phone - without switches - anytime.I hope they would seperate the WiFi/BT switch though. Disabling baseband and BT would require a half-baked fix now (baseband through the dipswitch, BT through software). But hey - it is more than nothing and workable.Thanks for the info and details :)
(DIR) Post #9rEUcR14boFC3KiftA by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T17:22:52.024973Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@h3artbl33d That's because it's one chip, they're both handled by a Realtek RTL8723CS. If they were separate components pine probably would've had two switches.
(DIR) Post #9rEUeXQPkhl4VZZkR6 by h3artbl33d@bsd.network
2020-01-21T17:21:11Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@quad Do you have a BreaveHeart Pinephone by the way?
(DIR) Post #9rEUeXgMnOWDJ32UIi by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T17:23:16.582834Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@h3artbl33d I do not have a BraveHeart (yet)
(DIR) Post #9rF00Y5F582rV5eEYS by clacke@libranet.de
2020-01-21T23:14:30Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kumicota @quad True, if the early companies establish some de facto standard way of doing things and provide tooling around it, later joiners will just pick it up.Maybe they will, I guess some of them mean well and are still young enough to be founder-driven rather than pen-and-paper AIs.
(DIR) Post #9rF05PSiYyfkD3wjR2 by quad@weeaboo.space
2020-01-21T23:15:29.313551Z
3 likes, 0 repeats
@clacke @kumicota The largest companies that start growing are pretty ethical surprisingly often.Then they get bought out or the founder replaced and everything goes to hell.
(DIR) Post #9rF0y1KzxWOpJeNNUu by clacke@libranet.de
2020-01-21T23:24:53Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @kumicota My multi-port USB charger isn't even designed in Europe, but has "German-inspired engineering".
(DIR) Post #9rF1FdUJN2hEYl8Eca by besserwisser@kawen.space
2020-01-21T23:28:32.667365Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@quad @hj @clacke @kumicota Germany still exports a lot of machinery, so it might even be true.
(DIR) Post #9rF1ldlFtF6kfqJmTo by besserwisser@kawen.space
2020-01-21T23:34:19.785789Z
2 likes, 0 repeats
@clacke @quad @kumicota That's a totally meaningless term, since obviously every engineering is German-inspired.