Post 9kRVsOr5jdxvEhSNaS by erdnaxeli@framapiaf.org
(DIR) More posts by erdnaxeli@framapiaf.org
(DIR) Post #9kRTjRyWZB44OiXQG0 by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:38:45Z
2 likes, 5 repeats
Chat services unaffected by the Cloudflare outage:✗ Discord✗ Matrix✓ IRC
(DIR) Post #9kRTlZ2dGVBktOT3Lc by lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me
2019-07-02T14:39:53.358321Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@sir Also XMPP is unaffected.
(DIR) Post #9kRTsuMYOKTd2wHt4K by Whidou@lou.lt
2019-07-02T14:40:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir Why would IRC be less affected than Matrix? 🤔
(DIR) Post #9kRTyOMeH2ZhXgwlQ8 by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:40:53Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Whidou cause IRC servers don't use freaking Cloudflare yo
(DIR) Post #9kRTztTy3ygkLK5QEy by gordon@cybre.space
2019-07-02T14:40:24Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lanodan @sir also, dead
(DIR) Post #9kRTzty6Fwn7qmBUCu by lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me
2019-07-02T14:42:27.379240Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@gordon @sir Well if it's about activity and reminder that it's subjective:IRC/Fedi: A lot of hourly messages, easily betterEmail: At least dailyXMPP: WeeklyMatrix: Monthly or easily worse
(DIR) Post #9kRU5cBTI5pOQlAACG by ignaloidas@mastodon.gamedev.place
2019-07-02T14:41:20Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir On the other hand, how would you do DDoS protection for IRC?
(DIR) Post #9kRUF1UQZeOpWNW2BU by ross@social.rbs.io
2019-07-02T14:41:54Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir My matrix server is operating just fine, thanks.
(DIR) Post #9kRUKgfusL9CheafK4 by martijnbraam@fosstodon.org
2019-07-02T14:42:41Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir Matrix is not affected, only the hosted matrix.org is affected, just like those in-the-browser irc clients.
(DIR) Post #9kRUQhizsyF3hDttPU by Whidou@lou.lt
2019-07-02T14:43:16Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir But… Matrix servers don't need it either.
(DIR) Post #9kRUUPEoYqlDWDY2IS by gordon@cybre.space
2019-07-02T14:45:07Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@lanodan @sir no, that’s not even about activity. It’s about the litteral death of a protocol. There is **no** maintained and functional XMPP client, except Conversations maybe (and yet, some messages just aren’t received even with conversations)
(DIR) Post #9kRUYE1CDXgjsc00TQ by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:48:10Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Whidou they might not *need* it but they are still *using* it. No one needs cloudflare.
(DIR) Post #9kRUZke6OWf9MUvPAO by lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me
2019-07-02T14:48:56.491394Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@gordon @sir Dino, Pidgin and gajim are much more maintained than your average Matrix native client as basically they all lack proper maintainance (and Riot or how to take down your browser).Also poezio has been working fine for years.
(DIR) Post #9kRUdFGszC1tDKjQbg by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:48:22Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Whidou I don't know what you're trying to get at but it's not going well
(DIR) Post #9kRUeNSg1L3OuAmphg by hj@shigusegubu.club
2019-07-02T14:49:47.216114Z
0 likes, 1 repeats
@lanodan @gordon @sir kaidan looks promising too
(DIR) Post #9kRUiGUnrQx8SYdQye by transcaffeine@mond-basis.eu
2019-07-02T14:48:48Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir Well, to be fair, part of the matrix network is down. The part that chose to rely on cloudflare
(DIR) Post #9kRUqT7gnTu1wGjf7I by Lou@ltch.fr
2019-07-02T14:49:45Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir my matrix server is unaffected by the cloudflare outage. Sry.
(DIR) Post #9kRV0D1XVZryu6VHO4 by kungtotte@fosstodon.org
2019-07-02T14:52:33Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir if it weren't for your toot I wouldn't have known about the outage, so I feel good about my browsing habits now.
(DIR) Post #9kRV6bFOMKFLlk1vxQ by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:53:00Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kungtotte nice. Nothing I use was affected either, I heard about it secondhand
(DIR) Post #9kRVCo3fdodBEsVVdg by Whidou@lou.lt
2019-07-02T14:53:39Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir Sorry, I'm not looking for a fight.Look: the Matrix server I'm using is not using Cloudflare. I'm sure there are some IRC servers out there that are using it.I am just wondering why you would say that one protocol is affected but not the other when server hosting is a case-by-case choice on the host's part.I see no reason why Matrix would be more affected than IRC: some servers of both are down, but the rest is still working as usual.
(DIR) Post #9kRVMDphBISFmeSaw4 by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:54:07Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Whidou I don't know of any IRC servers which use Cloudflare. Please cite an example before you push this angle.
(DIR) Post #9kRVQF3oYghSkXyt0q by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:54:26Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Whidou the fact is that a huge portion of Matrix's userbase is on a shitty broken homeserver which was affected by the cloudflare outage
(DIR) Post #9kRVWuFoJah2FLlnY8 by kungtotte@fosstodon.org
2019-07-02T14:51:13Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@ignaloidas @sir use another server?
(DIR) Post #9kRVWuouD6lY0CBpFg by andrewt@mastodon.technology
2019-07-02T14:54:36Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kungtotte @ignaloidas @sir Have I misunderstood how IRC works or is that like saying "so what if you lost your book, you can just read a different book"?
(DIR) Post #9kRVWvJONl9VWkSAls by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:55:33Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@andrewt @kungtotte @ignaloidas each IRC network is federated within itself. But DDoS "protection" via running your traffic through the internet's largest single-point-of-failure-as-a-service is turbodumb, major IRC networks are rarely affected by DDoS issues.
(DIR) Post #9kRVbhEKAIybIkMIy0 by Whidou@lou.lt
2019-07-02T14:56:36Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir Oh, I see! you meant Matrix.org! I though you were speaking of Matrix as a whole, I understand what you meant now.
(DIR) Post #9kRVgWnmMdzuPIFLF2 by tindall@cybre.space
2019-07-02T14:56:48Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir eeh, my matrix use was completely unaffected because I use desktop apps and run my own.Matrix has just as much capacity to be decentralized as IRC; in some ways, more, because the federation permits sharing rooms between servers.
(DIR) Post #9kRVl6apEgNqZMN0To by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T14:57:13Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@tindall having the capacity to be decentralized and actually being decentralized are different things. I'm aware of how matrix is designed, don't @ me with aplogist posts
(DIR) Post #9kRVsOr5jdxvEhSNaS by erdnaxeli@framapiaf.org
2019-07-02T14:59:43Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir this is FUD. matrix.org is affected, not matrix which is decentralised. I am still talking to people using matrix, it works perfectly.
(DIR) Post #9kRVxQ2AmQcWL827XM by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T15:00:01Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@erdnaxeli oh, shut up
(DIR) Post #9kRW71CLyRIoD0N9Vo by aladar@mastodon.xyz
2019-07-02T15:00:53Z
1 likes, 2 repeats
@martijnbraam"Only most of the users are affected"@sir
(DIR) Post #9kRWE9uFzn39FAJSJE by tindall@cybre.space
2019-07-02T15:02:51Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir oh sorryi'm genuinely not sure i understand; "apologist" is, in my experience, generally used to mean "coming up with excuses for something bad", and I'm not sure how that applies here? if there's a fundamental problem with Matrix I'd like to stop using it(and, p.s., it's not as if I don't use IRC plenty...)
(DIR) Post #9kRWWPj3uyi3WFmV1M by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-02T15:03:45Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@tindall when the majority of all matrix users are on matrix.org then you can't ignore that and say "b-b-but matrix-the-protocol is well designed!" When half the people you might want to talk to are affected by the outage, it's a big problem.
(DIR) Post #9kRWqzlJe4gn4keJge by ck@chaos.social
2019-07-02T15:07:07Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir @Whidou freenode.net, the probably largest IRC network, had the same issue, namely an "official" web client hosted by cloudflare. Given that web clients are not as popular with IRC users, the impact was probably less noticable.
(DIR) Post #9kRWxGfPhs6ZF5sazg by tindall@cybre.space
2019-07-02T15:08:00Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir it's possible that that's the case in general, and if so I'm sorry for not recognizing that, but it's not the experience I had; i regularly talk to 5 or 6 people on matrix and only one of them is on matrix.org, so i experienced only a very minor disruption.may i ask why you feel so strongly about this? i still feel like I'm missing something.
(DIR) Post #9kRX7ssyStvMfhHiU4 by jee@mamot.fr
2019-07-02T15:08:32Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir ✗ Matrix server behind cloudflare✓ Matrix server not behind cloudflare
(DIR) Post #9kRYHFQG8vDF82slZQ by joe@social.thisisjoes.site
2019-07-02T15:29:25Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir @erdnaxeli what a ridiculous and imamture response
(DIR) Post #9kRYObQ0lDxfNKH0Ua by joe@social.thisisjoes.site
2019-07-02T15:29:40Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir @erdnaxeli what a ridiculous and immature response
(DIR) Post #9kRanzpnJtu6FPZNZI by fatboy@fosstodon.org
2019-07-02T15:58:07Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir xmpp?
(DIR) Post #9kRqxtslu1iJwyhsLg by MacLemon@chaos.social
2019-07-02T18:59:01Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir One Instance of the Matrix network. :-)
(DIR) Post #9kRz00aUk8ESxUfqzo by dave@puz.fun
2019-07-02T20:29:07Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir is all Matrix affected or just the original Matrix server? I thought it was decentralized too but I'm not super familiar with it.
(DIR) Post #9kTDtbC5w4iKw1cfmS by tobi@social.kabi.tk
2019-07-03T10:50:43Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sirWrong, #Matrix works, just homeserver using it won't work.
(DIR) Post #9kTJaQWfyTv44UUUN6 by tobi@social.kabi.tk
2019-07-03T11:54:28Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir how could a *protocoll" be offline, like saying e-mail is offline when xy is down. Makes no sense. False facts, fake news spread by self-called "FLOSS advocate". Aha 🤦♂️ 🙄
(DIR) Post #9kTKdmfeCIitZhqrui by Unairedspecifics@linuxrocks.online
2019-07-03T12:02:19Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@tobiWere any other homeserver than matrix.org affected? @sir
(DIR) Post #9kTKdmuXIwdIJsol7Y by selea@social.linux.pizza
2019-07-03T12:07:01Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@Unairedspecifics The homeservers behind cloudflare, but that is just a few.@tobi @sir
(DIR) Post #9kTMpdIV4a0Tt4nojw by musicmatze@mastodon.technology
2019-07-03T11:55:36Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@tobi @sir well I have to admit that tobi got a point here...
(DIR) Post #9kTMpdY68aU2fS6H3I by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-03T12:30:53Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@musicmatze@tobi no, he doesn't. Matrix apologists would like you to think we live in a world where the godawful matrix.org homeserver doesn't reflect poorly on their precious protocol but it's total bollocks. A strong majority of Matrix users are on the crappy matrix.org server and when it has problems a substantial fraction of the network does too.
(DIR) Post #9kTNF17FeYFgzze3jU by tobi@social.kabi.tk
2019-07-03T12:35:29Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir @musicmatze what isn't a problem of the protocol but of the users. To say matrix as in protocol is depending on CF is simply false information. It has nothing to do with it.
(DIR) Post #9kTOrc0V2bleNBSEca by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-03T12:53:43Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@tobi@musicmatze you have no idea what I said. I didn't say "Matrix the protocol" and among peers like "IRC" and esp. "Discord", and in context, you should have understood that I was referring to the subjective experience of using each "service". Now get out of my @'s with the Matrix apologist pedantry.
(DIR) Post #9kTPjoha3egJNnS5Fw by tobi@social.kabi.tk
2019-07-03T13:03:31Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir @musicmatze then just don't spread fake news and false information. If you don't use it.
(DIR) Post #9kTPwLeFOGh92SrtR2 by sir@cmpwn.com
2019-07-03T13:05:53Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@tobi @musicmatze I did no such thing, fuck off
(DIR) Post #9kTSv6fjsvFUAGfKc4 by alexl@mstdn.io
2019-07-03T13:39:09Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir I think you should just consider matrix.org server like a service to try and improve Matrix protocol while appreciate that you can run your own server. I think if you had to create a protocol like Matrix and its ecosystem you would end up making the same choices as the Matrix team
(DIR) Post #9kTUwniLXanZr4ox7I by selea@social.linux.pizza
2019-07-03T14:02:30Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir Most matrix users being on matrix.org STILL does not change the fact that Matrix as the protocol was not affected by the outage. Just admit that you wrote something wrong.@musicmatze @tobi
(DIR) Post #9kV1UFvR458Cb7tpTM by exception@mastodon.savvy.ch
2019-07-04T07:40:55Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@sir @cambid83 Why should Matrix be affected? (unless you host your homeserver in the cloud, which is generally a bad idea)