Post 9k1AM4tVr0RfkleC4e by StuC@social.nasqueron.org
(DIR) More posts by StuC@social.nasqueron.org
(DIR) Post #9k13LPMlYUcvHE414a by kelbot@fosstodon.org
2019-06-19T20:41:16Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
One thing is clear here with the fedilab, tusky etc. gab blocking drama. The app devs are in a no win situation. Half of users were outraged that the app devs arbitrarily blocked a domain they didn't like. Now, the other half is outraged that they are enabling fascists if they change their minds.
(DIR) Post #9k13OvviwM7b8m60pM by kelbot@fosstodon.org
2019-06-19T20:41:53Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
I'm purposely not making any statement in preference for either decision. I don't claim to know the best decision to make in this situation. Just think about it while you're throwing hurtful words at these devs who are working mostly for free and as their passion. I sincerely don't think any of them are purposely supporting or enabling fascists/nazis. It's a complex situation.
(DIR) Post #9k13X6dV1FnIf4T7JI by kemonine@social.holdmybeer.solutions
2019-06-19T20:43:26.068285Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbot There is also the "undue burden" legal argument that goes out the window if they decide to change their mind at a later point.The moment they add a single domain block is the moment their governmental overseeers and/or app store overseers can force them to block any arbirary domains due to "stupid laws" and/or "stupid policies"switter.at is a good example of something the app stores will force a block upon
(DIR) Post #9k13yJnQCN7JIN5MUS by kelbot@fosstodon.org
2019-06-19T20:48:17Z
1 likes, 0 repeats
@kemonine I think it's unreasonable to expect these app devs to be able to make a completely "correct" and informed decision here. Devs aren't experts in law. I really don't envy their predicament.
(DIR) Post #9k14Uo0rOAYAHGrX3A by kemonine@social.holdmybeer.solutions
2019-06-19T20:54:13.689891Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbot I wasn't trying to suggest they should be that well versed in law.However, as a dev myself I know that making any kind of decision regarding any form of censorship must be weighed heavily before making a final decision.Especially when an app store / government wants to meddle in their affairs.I go out of my way to stamp out intolerance and keep in mind the follow on consequences at ever decision point. I really don't want a follow on of "hey, we're the government you need to shut out the LGBQT/Minority users too".Fear, xenophobia, scapegoats and fear are dangerous things in the hand of a government or corporate overlord.
(DIR) Post #9k14fhvaLxzwafargG by architect@linuxrocks.online
2019-06-19T20:56:05Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbotThe whole argument hinges on the assumption that all of Gab is actually fascists/Nazis too, and that users of these apps aren't capable of using the moderation tools already available. I have no idea what the Gab demographics are like, but if they really are the issue so many claim they are, the instance will be quickly separated from much of the fediverse anyway.
(DIR) Post #9k15FEaqtZOi2JpuiW by DistroJunkie@fosstodon.org
2019-06-19T21:02:21Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbot Agreed, it would have been best to leave the decision to instances and individuals. I fear that this just the beginning of the politicization of software.
(DIR) Post #9k19j32MpDbehRB5tY by StuC@social.nasqueron.org
2019-06-19T21:47:43Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@DistroJunkie I disagree.I submit that for this 'political' view to be implemented in software, would mean having a peer to peer social network, not a federated one.IMO federation admins should be able to decide what crosses their network/platform and from whom. Caprice?Nope."The only purpose for which power can be rightfully exercised over any member of a civilized community, against his will, is to prevent harm to others."- John Stuart MillSeems legit to me.@kelbot
(DIR) Post #9k19j3J1pGvxX6yOrg by kelbot@fosstodon.org
2019-06-19T21:52:47Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@StuC I think that is what they ultimately decided and what @DistroJunkie is agreeing with. Letting the instance admins and users themselves do the blocking rather than an app intended for accessing the fediverse.
(DIR) Post #9k1AM4tVr0RfkleC4e by StuC@social.nasqueron.org
2019-06-19T21:59:50Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbot then I apologise to @DistroJunkie for missing the point. ;)
(DIR) Post #9k1DgLvqWAJOFU68lk by Fatih19@fosstodon.org
2019-06-19T22:37:08Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbot @StuC @DistroJunkie I wholeheartedly agree to not have the "higher-ups" making decision for what instance should or should not be allowed.
(DIR) Post #9k1QWK8xbxhzD5mRhw by mikefordays@mstdn.io
2019-06-20T01:00:58Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbotI've already said a bunch about this, but here's how I see it: if you're going to listen to one side of this issue, listen to the side that says "let's use all our tools to defend against Nazis". Let the other side save their outrage for the next ban. Or does a slippery slope mean you only get one chance to object?
(DIR) Post #9k2nqzxgKncQnnIAzo by danarel@mastodon.technology
2019-06-20T16:54:01Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbot I'd say it's a win-win situation. They blocked a fascist domain and they pissed off fascists.
(DIR) Post #9k2xJ4QQEQp8LECCUi by RedLore@todon.nl
2019-06-20T18:43:02Z
0 likes, 0 repeats
@kelbotI agree. What are the developers supposed to do? Do they expect Mozilla to block all far right websites in Firefox by default? Besides I'm not sure I want developers telling me what website I can look at. Sounds rather authoritarian to me... Blocking decisions should be the choice of individuals and instances.