Post 885763 by hanny@radical.town
(DIR) More posts by hanny@radical.town
(DIR) Post #885511 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-31T19:07:00Z
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if you use and defend the use of slurs after learning their meaning you're not necessarily fascist, for sure, but you are a pretty shitty person
(DIR) Post #885525 by evan@radical.town
2018-10-31T19:07:42Z
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@mardiroos can’t wait to read the replies to this one!
(DIR) Post #885696 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-31T19:19:25Z
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if you defend slurs by speaking to a working class experience I think it is worth asking what your understanding of the working class is. I grew up by a council estate, where most of my friends lived, and in my anecdotal experience the kids far more likely to sling slurs were the edgy middle class kids. and that's not even starting in on the actual demographics of poverty in the US.
(DIR) Post #885732 by kel@pickle.zone
2018-10-31T19:21:56Z
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@mardiroos that the working class is racist is right, many unions for quite a long time have suffered from explicit (until not too long ago) or backhanded segregation/exclusion of black workers as well as other POC. This is a pretty stupid reason to justify saying racial slurs though.
(DIR) Post #885738 by thatcosmonaut@monads.online
2018-10-31T19:20:34.283497Z
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@mardiroos i went to a fancy college prep high school on scholarship and the rich kids there were far and away the most racist people i have ever met in my life
(DIR) Post #885739 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-31T19:22:11Z
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@thatcosmonaut yeah I went to a ~somewhat prestigious college (not in the US) and saw rich kids for the first time and was extremely shocked, lol
(DIR) Post #885763 by hanny@radical.town
2018-10-31T19:23:55Z
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@mardiroos @thatcosmonaut lmao yeah the most bigoted people i have ever met were the dudes who has been to the likes of eton when i was at uni. absolute cretins.
(DIR) Post #885772 by hanny@radical.town
2018-10-31T19:24:09Z
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@mardiroos @thatcosmonaut lmao yeah the most bigoted people i have ever met were the dudes who has been to the likes of eton when i was at uni. absolute bellends.
(DIR) Post #885834 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-31T19:27:25Z
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@kel I mean, the point I was gonna make about demographics is that implying the working class is white is a mistake; almost half of people in poverty in the US aren't white (with some grey area surrounding hispanic whites), and POC and black people are (obviously) disproportionately represented
(DIR) Post #885848 by kel@pickle.zone
2018-10-31T19:28:28Z
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@mardiroos when people say that working class people are racist they're usually not talking about POC but that doesn't mean that antiblackness isn't exclusive to white people, for example.
(DIR) Post #885994 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-31T19:36:19Z
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@kel for sure, I don't dispute that. but I would still argue that the framing of the working class being racist elides the different ways that racism functions within and operates on the working class, and that racism and anti-blackness isn't something unique to or even often disproportionately found in the working class.
(DIR) Post #886294 by kel@pickle.zone
2018-10-31T19:53:19Z
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@mardiroos my argument wasn't that the working class is essentially racist. saying that the working class *is* racist is just emphatically stating that racism within the working class is not just a tiny minority problem, not that the functions of that problem are beyond individuals within that class. Just like saying, "George Bush doesn't care about black people" doesn't mean that nobody else doesn't care about black people.
(DIR) Post #886528 by kel@pickle.zone
2018-10-31T19:54:58Z
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@mardiroos If someone is cool with slurs not about them that's a different story, and so is if the working class is essentialized for either case. essentialization should be repudiated in every situation, whether it paints the working class negatively or positively, because ignoring the nuances of a class is refusing to allow mediations resolving those nuances to occur
(DIR) Post #886529 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-31T20:02:56Z
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@kel sorry, I totally agree with all of this! I think I misspoke, didn't mean to characterise your argument as essentialist or talk past you. the framing I was initially discussing was the defence of slurs, and I think my problem there is exactly the essentialization (and exceptionalization) you are talking about. my initial point was not meant to be "working class people aren't racist", just that in my experience edgy slur-saying was far more a feature of the racism of my middle-class peers.
(DIR) Post #886958 by wdraws@knzk.me
2018-10-31T20:27:53Z
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@thatcosmonaut @mardiroos yeah, a lot of people in my kitchen will say racist shit, but their actual material impact on the lives of poc and immigrants is basically the same or less than your average (even liberally minded) urban bourgeois consumer. obviously this isnt a 100% material thing and we should eradicate it in the workplace but it's only a more visible form of the systemic problem