Post 502887 by mardiroos@knzk.me
(DIR) More posts by mardiroos@knzk.me
(DIR) Post #502810 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:38:01Z
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I am really frustrated that I suppressed the stronger parts of my Irish accent for long enough such that when I moved to the US it pretty much entirely disappeared within a year
(DIR) Post #502859 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:40:39Z
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I think I learned to unconsciously switch between my friends' thick north Wicklow accents and my parents' much lighter mid-Atlantic Irish/American accents, which made it much harder to hold on to either when I was surrounded by US accents
(DIR) Post #502866 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:41:43Z
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the North Wicklow accent is a lovely rough accent, but it's a heavy class marker so it rarely survives through third level education
(DIR) Post #502879 by MordecaiPinhas@sunbeam.city
2018-10-12T15:42:30Z
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@mardiroos So how do you talk now?
(DIR) Post #502887 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:43:23Z
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@MordecaiPinhas in a pretty smoothly generic East Coast accent with a smattering of Irishisms
(DIR) Post #502901 by MordecaiPinhas@sunbeam.city
2018-10-12T15:44:15Z
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@mardiroos Deadly
(DIR) Post #502905 by hans@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:44:24Z
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@mardiroos What age did you move? I came to the US when I was 9 and I once ran into a girl at my high school who'd gone to my elementary school but gone to a different middle school. First thing she asked me: "What happened to your accent?"
(DIR) Post #502916 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:44:58Z
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@MordecaiPinhas alri lads π
(DIR) Post #502927 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:45:39Z
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@hans just two years ago, when I was twenty-three
(DIR) Post #502948 by hans@knzk.me
2018-10-12T15:46:52Z
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@mardiroos That's really fast for someone your age! Sadly, I can't do my old accent now even if I try.
(DIR) Post #503013 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T15:52:09Z
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@mardiroos I've got the same angst on a smaller scale about losing my Dallas/Fort Worth accent almost immediately on moving when I was seven. I never lived in DFW but my Dad grew up there and his accent was always more marked than Mom's
(DIR) Post #503586 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T15:54:40Z
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@mardiroos the way I know I picked up his is that, when my accent *does* come out, ah pronounce naht-tahm ('night-time') lahk this; there are only two places in the South where the diphthong in 'eye' ever becomes 'ah' before voiceless consonants, and they're DFW and Tennessee Appalachia
(DIR) Post #503587 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T16:34:00Z
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@byttyrs ahh that's a lovely pronunciation! I'm glad some of it persists
(DIR) Post #503645 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T16:39:43Z
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@mardiroos πππππ I'm p ambivalent abt the side of the family I got my Southern accent from, but the DFW accent is actually super cool!It has among the most advanced versions of the Southern Vowel Shift, AND it's highly (linguistically) conservative- so, unlike almost all Americans, I pronounce 'dew' differently from 'do'!I don't pronounce it like Brits do- it's not 'dyoo' the way 'pew' is 'pyoo'; the DFW accent made a diphthong there, kinda 'dih-w', so yod-dropping didn't neutralize the pair
(DIR) Post #503931 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T16:42:06Z
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@mardiroos (My distribution of that diphthong isn't quite right, though; in my version of the accent, it mostly follows the spelling 'ew'. So I pronounce 'blue' as 'bloo,' but 'blew' as 'blih-w,' even though those are homophonous 'blyoo' in [at least some forms of?] British English)
(DIR) Post #503932 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T17:06:58Z
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@byttyrsreading this and thinking for the 100th time in my life that I need to learn IPA
(DIR) Post #504569 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T17:58:55Z
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@mardiroos π do it!useful for dialects, the vowels look intimidating the way they're usually presented (w/dumb historical weirdness), but they follow a very regular scheme:1. think of the horizontal high/close line as being the top of the mouth, 2. with the low/open line as being the bottom of the mouth;3. the vertical back line goes from the soft palate-ish to the tongue root right above the throat,4. the vertical front line goes from the front of the hard palate to the tongue underside.
(DIR) Post #504655 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T18:02:34Z
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@mardiroos (My drawing is kind of funky as regards the front line, which is too far forward.)This lets you think of vowels in terms of three questions:1. How high is the highest point of your tongue body (i.e., the highest point of not-the-tip) in your mouth?* Highest is high, or close; lowest is low, or open.2. How far forward is that same point?*The farthest forward you can go (at a single height) is front, farthest back is back.3. What are your lips doing?* Rounded or unrounded.
(DIR) Post #504656 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T18:04:36Z
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@byttyrsfascinating. this will make me look very silly at my desk practicing
(DIR) Post #504788 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T18:13:46Z
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@mardiroos that's part of the fun!1st memory of one of my favorite professors: I gave a presentation on the four 'fricatives,' hissing sounds, you can make with your lips; they are [f], [v], [ΙΈ], & [Ξ²]. [f] & [v] sound like you expect them to; [ΙΈ] & [Ξ²] are like F & V, respectively, except using both lips instead of bottom lip & teeth.One researcher's bold claim that you can't round your lips while doing F or V came up, & I watched Dr. L in the audience wrinkle her forehead & try it
(DIR) Post #504925 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T18:17:11Z
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@mardiroos ... *exactly* as I had done when I first read the paper in question. looking stupid while making weird noises is a universal part of learning about phonetics/phonology(FWIW. having tried to do that with my mouth: I dunno, maybe they're right? There are DEFINITELY languages in Wikipedia listing a rounded F, written /fΚ·/, as one of their consonants. But hey, maybe that was a bad call on the part of the field researcher.)
(DIR) Post #504926 by mardiroos@knzk.me
2018-10-12T18:22:24Z
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@byttyrsafter brief experimentation I am about 60% sure I can do a rounded F
(DIR) Post #505074 by byttyrs@queer.party
2018-10-12T18:35:42Z
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@mardiroos yeah that's sorta where I got to, but I'm more inclined to phonology (how do languages use sounds/gestures?) than phonetics (how do speakers make sounds/gestures?), and I have no idea how I'd go about proving it one way or the other