     The  F I D O N E W S      Volume 19, Number 37             16 Sep 2002 
     +--------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
     | |The newsletter of the | | Fido, Fidonet and dog-with-diskette are |
     | |  FidoNet community.  | | US Registered Trademarks of Tom Jennings|
     | |                      | |     San Francisco, California, USA      |
     | |          ____________| |                                         |
     | |         /  __          | Crash netmail articles to:              |
     | |        /  /  \         |          Editor @ 2:2/2 (+46-31-944907) |
     | | WOOF! (  /|oo \        | Routed netmail articles to:             |
     |  \_______\(_|  /_)       |          Bjorn Felten @ 2:203/0         |
     |            _ @/_ \    _  | Email attach to:                        |
     |           |     | \   \\ |          bfelten@telia.com              |
     |           | (*) |  \   ))|                                         |
     |           |__U__| /  \// |         Editor: Bjrn Felten            |
     |   ______   _//|| _\   /  |                                         |
     |  / Fido \ (_/(_|(____/   |   Newspapers should have no friends.    |
     | (________)       (jm)    |                    -- JOSEPH PULITZER   |
     +--------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
            Copyright 2002 by Fidonews Editor for Fidonews Globally.


                        Table of Contents
     1. FOOD FOR THOUGHT  .........................................  1
     2. INSIDE  ...................................................  2
        The Fidonews at a Glance  .................................  2
     3. GENERAL ARTICLES  .........................................  3
        RESURRECT NET 231? HOW ABOUT REGION 11?  ..................  3
        What _does_ "Policy" say about Echomail?  .................  4
        2002 Off Centre Rally - The Big U  ........................  9
     4. OL'WDB'S COLUMN - WARREN BONNER  .......................... 10
        Fido's English  ........................................... 10
     5. QUESTION OF THE WEEK  ..................................... 12
        An effective method for enforcing echomail content sani  .. 12
     6. FRANK'S COLUMN - FRANK VEST  .............................. 13
        Getting Article Submissions  .............................. 13
     7. FIDONET'S INTERNATIONAL KITCHEN  .......................... 15
        Skillet Slaw for 2  ....................................... 15
     8. CLEAN HUMOUR & JOKES  ..................................... 16
        Out of the Mouths of Babes  ............................... 16
        Men are like  ............................................. 18
     9. BEST OF FIDONET  .......................................... 19
        Languages again  .......................................... 19
        Love, Law, and Science  ................................... 23
     10. BEN RITCHEY'S FIDONET SOFTWARE LISTING  .................. 24
        FIDONet Software References  .............................. 24
     11. FIDONET BY INTERNET  ..................................... 29
        Fidonet-related Sites  .................................... 29
     12. SPECIAL INTEREST  ........................................ 34
        Nodelist Stats  ........................................... 34
     13. FIDONEWS INFORMATION  .................................... 36
        How to Submit an Article  ................................. 36
        Credits, Legal Infomation, Availability  .................. 38
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 1                   16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                             FOOD FOR THOUGHT
     =================================================================

     "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well
     please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take
     the consequences."

            -- P.J. O'Rourke (1993)


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     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 2                   16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                                  INSIDE
     =================================================================

                     The Fidonews at a Glance

     First out this week, is an article from former fidonet sysop Bruce
     Bowman about his experiences from once again setting up a fido node,
     in "RESURRECT NET 231? HOW ABOUT REGION 11?". Then we have the travel
     report from Australia, that was promised last week, submitted by David
     Drummond, but, as I understand it, written by his partner and
     ghostwriter. "2002 Off Centre Rally - The Big U", day one.

        In "What _does_ "Policy" say about Echomail?", Matt Mc_Carthy takes
     up a popular question, that often seems to be misinterpreted in many
     different ways. Another article about echomail, "An effective method
     for enforcing echomail..." by Lawrence Garwin, can be found in the
     section The Question of the Week.

        Frank Vest has some suggestions about a new piece of software, that
     could make contributions to the Snooze easier. This in "Getting
     Article Submissions". Unfortunately I think the idea is ten years too
     late, but maybe a template for Window's Word could do the trick?

        Warren Bonner, in his column, writes some about English in general
     and "Fido's English" in particular.

        After this we move on to the kitchen, where Carol is making
     "Skillet Slaw for 2". To our veggies, the dish may be served without
     the bacon.

        The jokes section has a bunch of kiddies jokes from Warren, in "Out
     of the Mouths of Babes". Then there's "Men are like...", a
     contribution that doesn't necessary reflect the opinion of the
     editor.

        In the new section Best of Fidonet, I have two snippets from the
     European sysop echo, ENET.SYSOP. The first is about "Languages again",
     where Petko Bossakov has collected some really funny signs, found in
     various countries that don't have English as the primary language.
     Somewhat of a continuation from Warren's column. Another clip from
     ENET.SYSOP, "Love, Law, and Science", posted by Sean Rima, is about
     possible merits of a mistress.


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     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 3                   16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                             GENERAL ARTICLES
     =================================================================

                  RESURRECT NET 231? HOW ABOUT REGION 11?
                     Bruce Bowman (late of 1:231/710)

     I've been gone from FidoNet for a little over SIX YEARS. A month or so
     ago, I had a bolt of nolstalgia, and decided I should use that phone
     line I have dedicated to Internet access to put the BBS back online. I
     loaded up an old 486 with the BBS (backed up years ago onto tape and
     subsequently transferred to CD-ROM). I got DESQview (yes, DESQview)
     running again. The modem is working, along with a TCP/IP connection to
     my other computer. But my Fido mail is six years old, and some of my
     software isn't Y2K compliant.

     Then I downloaded the nodelist. OUCH. Mostly telnet boards over the
     Internet now. And darn few of THEM. No one seems to be running dial-up
     mailers, or even a BBS (55% are mail-only). To top it off, there isn't
     a single FIDO board in central Indiana.

     So I have to ask...is it even worth it? How am I going to get echo
     feeds, much less regain the camaraderie I had with my old cohorts in
     Net 231? I'm sure I can set up an areafix of some sort with the REC
     and ftp my mail periodically, but to what end? I have no idea if
     anyone is posting, especially in Zone 1. The other nets I used to
     subscribe to (QBBSNet, PlayNet, DoorNet) are surely dead as a
     doornail. I suspect I'll be the only one calling my own board. All the
     DOS programmers have gone on to better things. The shareware concept,
     if not dead, apears to be seriously ill.

     In short, WHERE IS THE FUN IN FIDONET? Where do I go for advice, or
     even a kindred spirit?

     I kinda saw this coming, which was the reason I closed down the
     H.O.M.E. BBS (1:231/710) and opened up a web page. But I've never
     enjoyed the web nearly as much as I enjoyed having a bulletin board.
     So I need to hear that this is still a viable hobby, before I put any
     more work (or money) into it. Even better, if there's anyone out there
     in central Indiana who would like Net 231 to rise from the ashes, get
     in touch.

     Failing that, please direct me to information that will help me put
     this board on the Internet, using Linux and DOSEMU if necessary. I
     just want to recapture some of what we had in 1992, when there were
     over 20 thousand of us.

     If nothing else, it would be nice to hear from anyone in ol' Net 231,
     just to talk over old times.

     Bruce Bowman
     late of the H.O.M.E. BBS
     ikc1@juno.com


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     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 4                   16 Sep 2002


                     What _does_ "Policy" say about Echomail?
                            Matt Mc_Carthy, 1:396/45.17


     For starters, there are exactly 24 instances of the word "echomail" in
     FidoNet Policy Document Version 4.07 (excluding five in the sorry
     example at the end of the document).  All are listed below, in the
     complete paragraphs where the word is found.  No attempt whatever was
     made to take any sentences out of context.

     What does this mean?  My personal comments on each paragraph are
     inserted in "[...]" following each paragraph.


     "2.1.5  No Alteration of Routed Mail

     "You may not modify, other than as required for routing or other
     technical purposes, any message, netmail or echomail, passing through
     the system from one FidoNet node to another.  If you are offended by
     the content of a message, the procedure described in section 2.1.7
     must be used."

     [This paragraph is _certainly_ clear enough, and there is NO QUESTION
     it references AND applies to "Echomail".]


     "2.1.6.1  No Disclosure of in-transit mail

     "Disclosing or in any way using information contained in private
     netmail traffic not addressed to you or written by you is considered
     annoying behavior, unless the traffic has been released by the author
     or the recipient as a part of a formal policy complaint.  This does
     not apply to echomail which is by definition a broadcast medium, and
     where private mail is often used to keep a sysop-only area
     restricted."

     [This paragraph is _certainly_ clear enough also, and there is NO
     QUESTION it references AND applies to "Echomail", however excluding it
     (naturally!)]


     "2.1.7  Not Routing Mail

     "You are not required to route traffic if you have not agreed to do
     so. You are not obligated to route traffic for all if you route it for
     any, unless you hold a Network Coordinator or Hub Coordinator
     position. Routing traffic through a node not obligated to perform
     routing without the permission of that node may be annoying behavior.
     This includes unsolicited echomail."

     [Again, this paragraph is _certainly_ clear enough also, and there is
     NO QUESTION it both references AND applies to "Echomail".]


     "2.1.8  Exclusivity of Zone Mail Hour

     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 5                   16 Sep 2002


     "Zone Mail Hour is the heart of FidoNet, as this is when network mail
     is passed between systems.  Any system which wishes to be a part of
     FidoNet must be able to receive mail during this time using the
     protocol defined in the current FidoNet Technical Standards Committee
     publication (FTS-0001 at this writing).  It is permissible to have
     greater capability (for example, to support additional protocols or
     extended mail hours), but the minimum requirement is FTS-0001
     capability during this one hour of the day.

     "This time is exclusively reserved for netmail.  Many phone systems
     charge on a per-call basis, regardless of whether a connect, no
     connect, or busy signal is encountered.  For this reason, any activity
     other than normal network mail processing that ties up a system during
     ZMH is considered annoying behavior. Echomail should not be
     transferred during ZMH.  User (BBS) access to a system is prohibited
     during ZMH."

     [This paragraph is _certainly_ clear enough also, and there is NO
     QUESTION it both references AND applies to "Echomail".]


     "2.1.9  Private Nodes

     "The rare exception to ZMH compliance is private nodes.  Persons
     requesting private nodes should be supported as points if possible.  A
     private listing is justified when the system must interface with many
     others, such as an echomail distributor.  In these cases, the exact
     manner and timing of mail delivery is arranged between the private
     node and other systems.  Such an agreement between a private system
     and a hub is not binding on any replacement for that hub.  A private
     node must be a part of a network (they cannot be independents in the
     region.)"

     [That paragraph is _certainly_ clear enough also, and there is NO
     QUESTION it both references AND applies to "Echomail".]


     "2.1.12  Excommunication

     "A system which has been dropped from the network is said to be
     excommunicated (i.e. denied communication).  If you find that you have
     been excommunicated without warning, your coordinator was unable to
     contact you.  You should rectify the problem and contact your
     coordinator.

     "Systems may also be dropped from the nodelist for cause.  See section
     9, and sections 4.3 and 5.2.

     "It is considered annoying behavior to assist a system which was
     excommunicated in circumventing that removal from the nodelist.  For
     example, if you decide to provide an echomail feed to your friend who
     has been excommunicated, it is likely that your listing will also be
     removed."

     [That paragraph is _certainly_ clear enough also, and there is NO
     QUESTION it both references AND applies to "Echomail".]
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 6                   16 Sep 2002


     "3.4  Minimize the Number of Hats Worn

     "Coordinators are encouraged to limit the number of FidoNet functions
     they perform.  A coordinator who holds two different positions
     compromises the appeal process.  For example, if the Network
     Coordinator is also the Regional Coordinator, sysops in that network
     are denied one level of appeal.

     "Coordinators are discouraged from acting as echomail and
     software-distri- bution hubs.  If they do so, they should handle
     echomail (or other volume distribution) on a system other than the
     administrative system.  A coordinator's system should be readily
     available to the levels immediately above and below.

     "Another reason to discourage multiple hats is the difficulty of
     replacing services if someone leaves the network.  For example, if a
     coordinator is the echomail hub and the software-distribution hub,
     those services will be difficult to restore when that person resigns."

     [That paragraph is _certainly_ clear enough also, and there is NO
     QUESTION it both references AND applies to "Echomail".]


     "4.2  Routing Inbound Mail

     "It is your responsibility as Network Coordinator to coordinate the
     receipt and forwarding of host-routed inbound netmail for nodes in
     your network. The best way to accomplish this is left to your
     discretion.

     "If a node in your network is receiving large volumes of mail you can
     request that the sysop contact the systems which are sending this mail
     and request that they not host-route it.  If the problem persists, you
     can request your Regional Coordinator to assign the node a number as
     an independent and drop the system from your network.

     "Occasionally a node will make a "bombing run" (sending one message to
     a great many nodes).  If a node in another network is making bombing
     runs on your nodes and routing them through your inbound host, then
     you can complain to the network coordinator of the offending node.
     (If the node is an indepen- dent, complain to the regional
     coordinator.) Bombing runs are considered to be annoying.

     "Another source of routing overload is echomail.  Echomail cannot be
     allowed to degrade the ability of FidoNet to handle normal message
     traffic.  If a node in your network is routing large volumes of
     echomail, you can ask the sysop to either limit the amount of echomail
     or to stop routing echomail.

     "You are not required to forward encrypted, commercial, or illegal
     mail. However, you must follow the procedures described in section
     2.1.7 if you do not forward the mail."

     [The fourth paragraph of this section is _LESS_ than clear, and is in
     fact outdated, but it is still in Policy.  There is NO QUESTION though
     that it both references AND applies to "Echomail".]
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 7                   16 Sep 2002


     "9.9  Echomail

     "Echomail is an important and powerful force in FidoNet.  For the
     purposes of Policy Disputes, echomail is simply a different flavor of
     netmail, and is therefore covered by Policy.  By its nature, echomail
     places unique technical and social demands on the net over and above
     those covered by this version of Policy.  In recognition of this, an
     echomail policy which extends (and does not contradict) general
     Policy, maintained by the Echomail Coordinators, and ratified by a
     process similar to that of this document, is recognized by the FidoNet
     Coordinators as a valid structure for dispute resolution on matters
     pertaining to echomail.  At some future date the echomail policy
     document may be merged with this one."

     [This one is the "catch all" that is often cited by those believing
     that Policy 4.07 does NOT apply to "echomail".  What does it REALLY
     say?  Lets take it apart line-by-line and see:

     "Echomail is an important and powerful force in FidoNet." [Yep, no
     misunderstanding there at all!]

     "For the purposes of Policy Disputes, echomail is simply a different
     flavor of netmail, and is therefore covered by Policy." [This sentence
     says echomail _is_ covered, but restricts that coverage to: "For the
     purposes of Policy Disputes".  Therefore, if there are _no_ "Policy
     Disputes", echomail is not covered.  In a case where there _is_ a
     Policy Dispute, _then_ echomail "is simply a different flavor of
     netmail".

     "By its nature, echomail places unique technical and social demands on
     the net over and above those covered by this version of Policy." [This
     sentence, particularly the phrase "over and above those covered by
     this version of Policy", reinforces the intent of the writer(s) that
     echomail is _NOT_ covered.

     "In recognition of this, an echomail policy which extends (and does
     not contradict) general Policy, maintained by the Echomail
     Coordinators, and ratified by a process similar to that of this
     document, is recognized by the FidoNet Coordinators as a valid
     structure for dispute resolution on matters pertaining to echomail."
     [Here again the writer(s) acknowledge, by the phrase "an echomail
     policy which extends...", that Policy 4.07 alone is _not_ sufficient
     for echomail.

     "At some future date the echomail policy document may be merged with
     this one." [Once more, the writers acknowledge the need for
     _additional_ policy to cover echomail.]


     I have cited eight instances above, within policy, where the policy
     definitely makes reference to _and_ definitely applies to "echomail".

     However, in the final scene where the fat lady sings, paragraph 9.9,
     the writer(s) have _clearly_ indicated their intent that Policy 4.07
     is _NOT_ adequate to cover echomail, with the sole exception of Policy
     Disputes.
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 8                   16 Sep 2002


     They have further left the door open for a policy covering echomail
     and have even stipulated the process "ratified by a process similar to
     that of this document" to accomplish such a document.  Additionally,
     they have made provision for that "echomail policy" to be merged with
     Policy 4.07.

     In my not so humble opinion, the writers had no intent whatever to
     include echomail _in_ Policy 4.07.

     I can only hope that the drafters of the "proposed revision", now
     believed to be in circulation for review, have included language that
     clarifies this matter in simple terms, _either way_.  All of FidoNet
     has spent way too many years arguing the 'fine points', and although
     arguing _is_ a form of communication, it is not the most desirable
     form.



     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 9                   16 Sep 2002


                 2002 Off Centre Rally - The Big U
               Submitted by David Drummond, 3:640/305

     Day 1 - Sunday 4 August (Brisbane to Bunya Mts)

     Hmm.  So.  The start of another Great Motorcycling Adventure.  Feeling
     a bit "Ho Hum" about it, for some reason.

     For this trip, David was riding my BMW R100 GS PD (on its 5th Off
     Centre Rally) and I was on my BMW F650 GS Dakar (on its 2nd).  The PD
     was packed with its tank bag, two 2 litre water containers slung over
     the tank, its two BMW panniers, three rolls strapped over the rear
     carrier and seat - 1 containing the vinyl ground sheet and
     Thermorests, one with the bivvy bag, sleeping bags, sheet and pillows,
     and one with the contoured fly that fits over the bikes when parked
     parallel 1.5 metres apart, so we could sleep between them.

     My bike had my two carrier bags slung across the front (where the tank
     would be on a normal bike) and a small old Army carry bag between
     them, a Gearsack Dirt Bike Bag (with drop side pouches) containing our
     food items, and an old small back pack strapped to the back of it.

     Left Brisbane by going over Mt Glorious, past Splityard Creek, over
     Wivenhoe Dam to Esk, where we had arranged to meet Rick Trenaman on
     his Yamaha 660 Tenere. Waited at the Bakery with some Vietnam Vets
     tour operators on Harleys.  There is always someone to talk to, isn't
     there?

     Rick arrived about half an hour later and we tasted the delights of
     the bakery.  As we were about to go, Murray Brown turned up and wished
     us well, feeling very envious, as his trip was unfortunately aborted
     at the last minute.

     My bike loved the Ravensborne road - despite the new knobbies, then we
     turned north, through Crows Nest to turn off at Haden.  Followed the
     back roads to Quinalow Pub for lunch.  It was an easy matter to follow
     the signs to Bunya Mountains.  Not much dirt left on this road,
     though.

     The single lane road winding through the rainforest at the top was a
     lively ride in the early afternoon.  We set up camp at Burtons Well
     where there is a spectacular view of Tarong Power Station far below.

     As the sun disappeared, so did the other people and all the warmth.
     We hoped to wind would die down, but it remained gusty all evening.
     We heated our pre-cooked stew with toasted Turkish Pide bread while
     the light held, stoked the coals from one of the barbeques and huddled
     around it hugging our Milos for a while.  We decided it would be
     warmer in bed, so hit the sack at 6:30pm.  Rick said he'd never been
     to bed so early (to sleep!), but it didn't stop him from snoring 10
     minutes later!  It took me a little longer to defrost, but I soon
     dropped off as well.


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     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 10                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                      OL'WDB'S COLUMN - WARREN BONNER
     =================================================================

                             Fido's English
                            By Warren Bonner
                          wdbonner@pacbell.net

     Let's face it - English is Fido's language.  Some folks in some zones
     have some trouble with it.  Some folks in ALL zones have trouble with
     it.  I do not believe that is the reason for most of the
     disagreements.  In fact, many who use it as a second language, use it
     better than those folks who are raised on it.  It is a little strange
     though, that it is mostly negative in nature when used as a second
     language.  I thought I may look at it closer to see if there is a
     'built in' reason for this phenomenon.  In a little research these
     facts were found that may be a contributor to some folks inability to
     write a complementary statement about the English speaking pilgrims of
     North America... <grin>

     There is no egg in eggplant, nor ham in hamburger; neither apple in or
     pine in pineapple.  English muffins weren't invented in England or
     French fries in France. Sweetmeats are candies while sweetbreads,
     which aren't sweet, are meat.

     We take English for granted. But if we explore its paradoxes, we'll
     find that quicksand can work slowly, boxing rings are square and that
     a guinea pig is neither from Guinea nor is it a pig.

     And why is it that writers write but fingers don't fing, grocers don't
     groce and hammers don't ham?  And if the plural of tooth is teeth, why
     isn't the plural of booth beeth?

     One goose, 2 geese, so one moose or 2 meese? One index or 2 indice.
     Doesn't it seem crazy that you can make amends but not one amend. If
     you have a bunch of odds and ends and get rid of all but one of them,
     what do you call it? An odd or an end?

     If teachers taught, why didn't preachers praught? If a vegetarian eats
     vegetables, what does a humanitarian eat? Sometimes I think all the
     English speakers should be committed to an asylum for the verbally
     insane. In what other language do people recite at a play and play at
     a recital?

     Ship by truck and send cargo by ship? Have noses that run and feet
     that smell? How can a slim chance and a fat chance be the same, while
     a wise man and a wise guy are opposites?

     You have to marvel at the unique lunacy of a language in which your
     house can burn up as it burns down, in which you fill in a form by
     filling it out and in which an alarm goes off by going on.

     English was invented by people, not computers, and it reflects the
     creativity of the human race, which, of course, is not a real 'race'
     at all. That more or less explains why the English language is so
     misunderstood and misused. It is a real enigma that we try to
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 11                  16 Sep 2002


     communicate with each other.  It is no wonder that some folks of other
     than English speaking lands, have a problem communicating with us as
     we have a problem communicating with each other!  How many times have
     you heard, 'What I meant was...?'

     That is why, when the stars are 'out', they are visible; but when the
     lights are out, they are invisible... <Smile>  Hopefully, this will
     help all of us to be more understanding of each other, and the use of
     Fidos first language.

     Ol'wdb


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     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 12                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                           QUESTION OF THE WEEK
     =================================================================

          An effective method for enforcing echomail content sanity
                   By Lawrence Garvin, 1:106/6018

     Back in the days when echomail was primarily a star-based distribution
     system, with a very, very few nodes at the top of the star, imposing,
     enforcing, and maintaining a feed cut was a very practical thing to
     do, and it worked quite well. The threat of an entire net being "cut
     off" produced a lot of leverage in the NET where a local caller, or
     sysop, had a limited number of nodes to dial into, without involving
     long distance calling.

     However, today, when echomail distribution has become a much flatter
     heirarchy, with multiple meshes across several dozen nodes "at the
     top", and the universal availability of hundreds of
     internet-accessible echomail BBS nodes, it's almost a practical
     impossibility to enforce a feed cut on a node. As a moderator, I can't
     even get an accurate and comprehensive list of nodes that provide
     echomail feeds -- How could I possibly expect to keep an undesirable
     person from posting in my echo.

     All of the above is entirely dependent upon the collective cooperative
     efforts of every sysop and echomail hub in the entire world -- but the
     first challenge is getting the word to EVERY sysop and echomail hub in
     the entire world, that a person's presence is not desired. Add to this
     complication that the only real identifiable mark of an undesirable
     poster is their nom de plume, which can be changed on a moment to
     moment basis -- albeit, doing so does tend to detract from their
     attention-getting efforts.

     Simply stated, feed cuts are no longer an effective method for dealing
     with chronic "problem children".

     Luckily, I have not yet had to deal with this potential scenario in
     any of my echos. However, I do have one that has the potential!

     The unanswered question is: What options exist for echomail
     distribution to overcome this current weakness in the sanity of our
     strangling hobby?

     Lawrence Garvin
     Moderator (BBSLAW, DUNE, TCPIP, UNIX)

     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 13                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                        FRANK'S COLUMN - FRANK VEST
     =================================================================

                          Getting Article Submissions
                                 By Frank Vest
                                  1:124/6308.1

      One of the problems that I, and most Fidonews Editors had/have is
     getting article submissions. In times past, the requirements for
     submitting articles was, in some ways, more difficult than today,
     however, the problem still remains. Many don't write articles for the
     Fidonews due to apathy and other reasons, but, I wonder how many don't
     write articles because it is simply "too much trouble to format the
     article to meet the technical requirements"?

      With this in mind, and as a suggestion to the current Fidonews Editor
     (since he is a programmer :), What would be the chances of writing a
     program for creating and editing articles for submission to the
     Fidonews.

      The vision I have would be to the effect:

     1. Windows, OS/2 and Linux version would be nice.

     2. Menu driven for an "all in one" feel. Menu items could be created
     to format the article title, author and such and then an editor that
     would word wrap properly and meet the requirements for submission.

     3. Mouseable (of course :)

      (NOTE) the below would be neat "features" to have, but not critical.
     :)

     4. Ability to "send" to a mailer's outbound with the proper address
     for the Fidonews Editor.

      This would be good for Nodes and Points since they would not have to
     create the article, export it to a text file then write a Netmail to
     the Editor and either attach or post the article to/in the message.

     5. Ability to do the above for e-mail clients (Netscape, Outlook, and
     others)

     6. Spell checker (this one might be critical :-)


     Yes, I realize this is a large order... still, I wonder if this might
     be of help in getting articles for the Fidonews. If so, it would be
     worth the effort?

     FWIW, I created a batch file for editing received articles when I was
     Fidonews Editor. I still use that batch file to write articles because
     it is easy to (R)un the editor to write the article, then (S)pell
     check the article and finally to (T)est the article for invalid
     character, lines that are too long and such all in one batch file. The
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 14                  16 Sep 2002


     problem is, each operation requires a separate program. The editor is
     "QEdit", the spell checker is "ShareSpell" and the tester is the
     actual "makenews" program that is used to create the Fidonews to begin
     with.

     All of this could be in one program and might help get some article
     submissions. Thoughts??

     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 15                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                      FIDONET'S INTERNATIONAL KITCHEN
     =================================================================

                   Skillet Slaw for 2

           Yield: 3 Servings

           1 sl Bacon
           2 tb Onion, fine chopped
           1 tb Vinigar
           1 tb Water
       1 1/2 ts Sugar
         1/4 ts Salt
             ds Black pepper
           2 c  Cabbage, finely shredded
           1 sm Apple, peeled and chopped
         1/4 c  Sour cream

       Cook the bacon strip until crisp, and save the bacon drippings.
     Remove finished bacon and add the onions, cooking for about 2 mins.
     Now add the vinegar, salt, water, pepper, sugar and bring to a boil.
     Add the slaw and apples and toss to coat.  Cook until the cabbage
     wilts (about 6 mins). Stir in the sour cream and serve topped with the
     crumbled bacon.

       From the kitchen of:  xxcarol


     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 16                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                           CLEAN HUMOUR & JOKES
     =================================================================

                      Out of the Mouths of Babes
                       enjoyed by Warren Bonner
                        wdbonner@pacbell.net

     1.  The math teacher saw that little Johnny wasn't paying attention in
     class.  She called on him and said, "Johnny! What are 4, 2, 28 and
     44?" Little Johnny quickly replied, "NBC, CBS, HBO, and the Cartoon
     Network!"

     2.  When I stopped the bus to pick up Chris for preschool, I noticed
     an older woman hugging him as he left the house.   "Is that your
     grandmother?" I asked.  "Yes, "Chris said.  "She's come to visit us
     for Christmas."  "How nice," I said.  "Where does she live?" "At the
     airport," Chris replied.  "Whenever we want her, we just go out there
     and get her."

      3.  I didn't know if my granddaughter had learned her colors, so I
     decided to test her.  I would point out something and ask what color
     it was. She would tell me and she always  was correct. But it was fun
     for me, so I continued.  At last, she headed for the door, saying
     sagely, "Grandma, I think you should try to figure out some of these
     yourself!"

     4.  When the mother returned from the grocery store, her small son
     pulled out the box of animal crackers he had begged for, then he
     spread the animal-shaped crackers all over the kitchen counter.  "What
     are you doing?" his Mom asked.  "The box says you can't eat them if
     the seal is broken," the boy explained. "I'm looking for the seal."


     5.  This little grandmother was surprised by her 7-year-old grandson
     one morning.  He had made her coffee.  She drank what was the worst
     cup of coffee in her life.  When she got to the bottom, there were
     three of those little green army men in the cup.  She said, "Honey,
     what are these army men doing in my coffee?"  Her grandson said,
     "Grandma, it says on TV 'The best part of waking up is soldiers in
     your cup!'"

     6.  In the supermarket was a man pushing a cart that contained a
     screaming, bellowing baby.  The gentleman kept repeating softly,
     "Don't get excited, Albert; don't scream, Albert; don't yell, Albert;
     keep calm, Albert." A woman standing next to him said, "You certainly
     are to be commended for trying to soothe your son, Albert."  The man
     looked at her and said, "Lady, I'm Albert."

     7.  A three-year-old boy went with his dad to see a new litter of
     kittens. On returning home, he breathlessly informed his mother,
     "There were two boy kittens and two girl kittens." "How did you know
     that?" his mother asked. "Daddy picked them up and looked underneath,"
     he replied.  "I think it's printed on the bottom."

     8.  While working for an organization that delivers lunches to elderly
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 17                  16 Sep 2002


     shut-ins, I used to take my four-year-old daughter on my afternoon
     rounds. She was unfailingly intrigued by the various appliances of old
     age, particularly the canes, walkers and wheelchairs.  One day I found
     her staring at a pair of false teeth soaking in a glass.  As I braced
     myself for the inevitable barrage of questions, she merely turned and
     whispered, "The tooth fairy will never believe this!"

     9.  A little girl was watching her parents dress for a party.  When
     she saw her dad donning his tuxedo, she warned, "Daddy, you shouldn't
     wear that suit." "And why not, darling?" "You know that it always
     gives you a headache the next morning."

     10.  While walking along the sidewalk in front of his church, our
     minister heard the intoning of a prayer that nearly made his collar
     wilt. Apparently, his five-year-old son and his playmates had found a
     dead robin.  Feeling that proper burial should be performed, they had
     secured a small box and cotton batting, then dug a hole and made ready
     for the disposal of the deceased.  The minister's son was chosen to
     say the appropriate prayers and with sonorous dignity intoned his
     version of what he thought his father always said: "Glory be unto the
     Faaaather.  And to the Soonnn.......and into the hole he gooooes."

     Ol'wdb


     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 18                  16 Sep 2002


                               Men are like...

       Placemats.         They only show up when there's food on the table.

       Mascara.           They usually run at the first sign of emotion.

       Bike helmets.      Handy in an emergency, but otherwise they just
                          look silly.

       Government bonds.  They take so long to mature.

       Copiers.           You need them for reproduction, but that's about
                          it.

       Lava lamps.        Fun to look at, but not all that bright.

       Bank accounts.     Without a lot of money, they don't generate much
                          interest.

       High heels.        They're easy to walk on once you get the hang of
                          it.

       Curling irons.     They're always in your hair.


     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 19                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                              BEST OF FIDONET
     =================================================================

                        Languages again
                  Originally posted in ENET.SYSOP
                    By Petko Bossakov, 2:535/1

     People in other countries sometimes go out of their way to
     communicate with their English-speaking tourists. Here is a list of
     signs seen around the world.

     Cocktail lounge, Norway:
     LADIES ARE REQUESTED NOT TO HAVE CHILDREN IN THE BAR.

     At a Budapest zoo:
     PLEASE DO NOT FEED THE ANIMALS. IF YOU HAVE ANY SUITABLE FOOD,
     GIVE IT TO THE GUARD ON DUTY.

     Doctors office, Rome:
     SPECIALIST IN WOMEN AND OTHER DISEASES.

     Hotel, Acapulco:
     THE MANAGER HAS PERSONALLY PASSED ALL THE WATER SERVED HERE.

     Information booklet about using a hotel air conditioner, Japan:
     COOLES AND HEATES: IF YOU WANT CONDITION OF WARM AIR
     IN YOUR ROOM,PLEASE CONTROL YOURSELF.

     Car rental brochure, Tokyo:
     WHEN PASSENGER OF FOOT HEAVE IN SIGHT, TOOTLE THE HORN. TRUMPET
     HIM MELODIOUSLY AT FIRST, BUT IF HE STILL OBSTACLES YOUR PASSAGE
     THEN TOOTLE HIM WITH VIGOUR.

     Sign in men's rest room in Japan:
     TO STOP LEAK TURN COCK TO THE RIGHT

     In a Nairobi restaurant:
     CUSTOMERS WHO FIND OUR WAITRESSES RUDE OUGHT TO SEE THE MANAGER.

     On the grounds of a private school:
     NO TRESPASSING WITHOUT PERMISSION.

     On an Athi River highway:
     TAKE NOTICE: WHEN THIS SIGN IS UNDER WATER, THIS ROAD IS
     IMPASSABLE.

     On a poster at Kencom:
     ARE YOU AN ADULT THAT CANNOT READ? IF SO, WE CAN HELP.

     In a City restaurant:
     OPEN SEVEN DAYS A WEEK, AND WEEKENDS TOO.

     One of the Mathare buildings:
     MENTAL HEALTH PREVENTION CENTRE.

     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 20                  16 Sep 2002


     A sign seen on an automatic restroom hand dryer:
     DO NOT ACTIVATE WITH WET HANDS.

     In a Pumwani maternity ward:
     NO CHILDREN ALLOWED.

     In a cemetery
     PERSONS ARE PROHIBITED FROM PICKING FLOWERS FROM ANY BUT THEIR
     OWN GRAVES.

     Sign in Japanese public bath:
     FOREIGN GUESTS ARE REQUESTED NOT TO PULL COCK IN TUB.

     Tokyo hotel's rules and regulations:
     GUESTS ARE REQUESTED NOT TO SMOKE OR DO OTHER DISGUSTING
     BEHAVIOURS IN BED.

     On the menu of a Swiss restaurant:
     OUR WINES LEAVE YOU NOTHING TO HOPE FOR.

     In a Tokyo bar:
     SPECIAL COCKTAILS FOR THE LADIES WITH NUTS.

     In a Bangkok temple:
     IT IS FORBIDDEN TO ENTER A WOMAN EVEN A FOREIGNER IF
     DRESSED AS A MAN.

     Hotel room notice, Chiang-Mai, Thailand:
     PLEASE DO NOT BRING SOLICITORS INTO YOUR ROOM.

     Hotel brochure, Italy:
     THIS HOTEL IS RENOWNED FOR ITS PEACE AND SOLITUDE.
     IN FACT, CROWDS FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD FLOCK HERE TO ENJOY ITS
     SOLITUDE.

     Hotel lobby, Bucharest:
     THE LIFT IS BEING FIXED FOR THE NEXT DAY. DURING
     THAT TIME WE REGRET THAT YOU WILL BE UNBEARABLE.

     Hotel elevator, Paris:
     PLEASE LEAVE YOUR VALUES AT THE FRONT DESK.

     Hotel, Yugoslavia:
     THE FLATTENING OF UNDERWEAR WITH PLEASURE IS THE
     JOB OF THE CHAMBERMAID.

     Hotel, Japan:
     YOU ARE INVITED TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE CHAMBERMAID.

     In the lobby of a Moscow hotel across from a Russian Orthodox
     monastery:
     YOU ARE WELCOME TO VISIT THE CEMETERY WHERE FAMOUS
     RUSSIAN AND SOVIET COMPOSERS, ARTISTS, AND WRITERS ARE BURIED
     DAILY EXCEPT THURSDAY.

     Hotel catering to skiers, Austria:
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 21                  16 Sep 2002


     NOT TO PERAMBULATE THE CORRIDORS IN THE HOURS OF
     REPOSE IN THE BOOTS OF AS CENSION.

     Taken from a menu, Poland:
     SALAD A FIRM'S OWN MAKE; LIMPID RED BEET SOUP WITH
     CHEESY DUMPLINGS IN THE FORM OF A FINGER; ROASTED DUCK LET LOOSE;
     BEEF RASHERS BEATEN IN THE COUNTRY PEOPLE'S FASHION.

     Supermarket, Hong Kong:
     FOR YOUR CONVENIENCE, WE RECOMMEND COURTEOUS,
     EFFICIENT SELF-SERVICE.

     From the "Soviet Weekly":
     THERE WILL BE A MOSCOW EXHIBITION OF ARTS BY 15,000
     SOVIET REPUBLIC PAINTERS AND SCULPTORS. THESE WERE EXECUTED OVER
     THE PAST TWO YEARS.

     In an East African newspaper:
     A NEW SWIMMING POOL IS RAPIDLY TAKING SHAPE SINCE
     THE CONTRACTORS HAVE THROWN IN THE BULK OF THEIR WORKERS.

     Hotel, Vienna:
     IN CASE OF FIRE, DO YOUR UTMOST TO ALARM THE HOTEL
     PORTER.

     A sign posted in Germany's Black Forest:
     IT IS STRICTLY FORBIDDEN ON OUR BLACK FOREST CAMPING
     SITE THAT PEOPLE OF DIFFERENT SEX, FOR INSTANCE, MEN AND WOMEN,
     LIVE TOGETHER IN ONE TENT UNLESS THEY ARE MARRIED WITH EACH OTHER FOR
     THIS PURPOSE.

     Hotel, Zurich:
     BECAUSE OF THE IMPROPRIETY OF ENTERTAINING GUESTS OF
     THE OPPOSITE SEX IN THE BEDROOM, IT IS SUGGESTED THAT
     THE LOBBY BE USED

     An advertisement by a Hong Kong dentist:
     TEETH EXTRACTED BY THE LATEST METHODISTS.

     A laundry in Rome:
     LADIES, LEAVE YOUR CLOTHES HERE AND SPEND THE
     AFTERNOON HAVING A GOOD TIME.

     Tourist agency, Czechoslovakia:
     TAKE ONE OF OUR HORSE-DRIVEN CITY TOURS. WE
     GUARANTEE NO MISCARRIAGES.

     Advertisement for donkey rides, Thailand:
     WOULD YOU LIKE TO RIDE ON YOUR OWN ASS?

     The box of a clockwork toy made in Hong Kong:
     GUARANTEED TO WORK THROUGHOUT ITS USEFUL LIFE.

     In a Swiss mountain inn:
     SPECIAL TODAY - NO ICE-CREAM.

     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 22                  16 Sep 2002


     Airline ticket office, Copenhagen:
     WE TAKE YOUR BAGS AND SEND THEM IN ALL DIRECTIONS.

     On the door of a Moscow hotel room:
     IF THIS IS YOUR FIRST VISIT TO THE USSR, YOU ARE WELCOME TO IT.


     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 23                  16 Sep 2002


                         Love, Law, and Science
                     Originally posted in ENET.SYSOP
                        By Sean Rima, 2:263/950

     An artist, a lawyer, and a Fidonet Sysop are discussing the possible
     merits of a mistress.

     The artist tells of the passion, the thrill, which comes with the risk
     of being discovered.

     The lawyer warns of the difficulties. It can lead to guilt, divorce,
     bankruptcy. Not worth it. Too many problems.

     The Fidonet Sysop says, "It's the best thing that's ever happened to
     me.  My wife thinks I'm with my mistress.  My mistress thinks I'm home
     with my wife, and I can spend all night on the computer!"


     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 24                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                  BEN RITCHEY'S FIDONET SOFTWARE LISTING
     =================================================================

                    -=:{ FIDONet Software Reference }:=-

         Type: M=Mailer  T=Tosser  B=BBS  D=Door  C=Comm/Terminal
               P=Points  E=Editor  I=Internet  U=Utility  ?=Info

     .- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -.
     |Software: Author     |Type |URL, Contact, Ver, Notes      Help Node|
     `- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -'

      Argus                |M    |http://www.ritlabs.com/argus/  2:469/84
                                 | argus@ritlabs.com  Tel: 373-2-246889
                                 | v3.210 on Mar 20th 2001

      BeeMail:             |M    |http://beemail.gexonline.net   1:105/10
       Stephen Proffit

      BinkleyTerm XE       |M    |http://btxe.sourceforge.net     1:1/102
                                 | v2.60XE/Gamma-6 on Nov 11th 1998

      BinkD                |MI   |http://2f.ru/binkd/
                                 | maloff@corbina.net
                                 | v0.94 on Jul 24th 2000

      Fidonet to Internet: |MI   |http://www.terminate.com
       Bo Bendtsen               | sales@terminate.com
                                 | v2.00 on Mar23rd 1997

      FrontDoor, FD/APX:   |MTPC |http://www.defsol.se          2:201/330
       Definite Solutions        | sales@defsol.se                1:1/101
                                 | v2.26SW & v2.33ml FD, v1.15 APX

      Husky Project        |MTPUI|http://husky.sf.net

      InterMail, InterEcho,|MT   |http://www.ifido.com            1:1/133
       Allfix                    | sales@ifido.com
                                 | v2.50 IM, v1.19 IE, v5.13 AF

      Tmail                |MI   |http://www.tmail.spb.ru  v2608

      WildCat! Interactive |MTBEI|http://www.santronics.com
       Net Server, Platinum      | sales@santronics.com
       Xpress: Santronics        | Tel: (305) 248-3204
       Software, Inc.            | AUP 450.2 on Jul 9th 2002
     +- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+

      Fidogate             |TUI  |http://www.fidogate.org
                                 | Martin_Junius@m-j-s.net  v4.4.4

      FMail                |T    |http://fmail.nl.eu.org       2:280/1076
                                 | wijnstra@fmail.nl.eu.org  v1.60

      JetMail: JetSys      |TU   |http://www.jetsys.de  js@jetsys.de
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 25                  16 Sep 2002


       (ATARI ST only)           | v1.01 on Jan 1st 2000

      Squish               |T    |http://www.lanius.com
                                 | sales@lanius.com  v1.11
                                 |http://www.vector11.com/maximus/

      Synchronet BBS       |TB   |http://www.synchro.net
                                 | sysop(at)vert(dot)synchro(dot)net
                                 | v3.10i Beta on Apr 30th 2002

      Watergate            |TUI  |http://www2.sbbs.se/hp/ramon/
                                 | ramon@sbbs.se
                                 | v0.93p9 on Dec 14th 1998
     +- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+

      BBBS                 |BI   |http://www.bbbs.net  b@bbbs.net
                                 | v4.00MP on Oct 25th 1999      2:22/222

      ELEBBS: The Elevator |B    |http://www.elebbs.com
       Software Production       | elebbs@elebbs.com
                                 | v0.10.RC1 on Jun 9th 2002

      Falken BBS           |B    |http://falkenbbs.com
                                 | v12.0 on Feb 2nd 2002

      Hermes II Project    |B    |http://www.hermesii.org
                                 | info@HermesII.org  v3.5.9 Beta Final

      Maximus BBS          |B    |http://www.lanius.com
                                 | sales@lanius.com  v3.01
                                 |http://www.vector11.com/maximus/

      MBSE BBS:            |BI   |http://mbse.sourceforge.net  2:280/2802
       Michiel Broek             | mbroek@users.sourceforge.net
                                 | v0.33.21 on Jun 4th 2002

      Mystic BBS           |B    |http://www.mysticbbs.com
                                 | v1.07.3 on May 13th 2001

      Nexus BBS            |B    |http://www.nexusbbs.net
                                 | groberts@nexusbbs.net
                                 | v0.99.41.001 beta on Jun 10th 2001

      Proboard BBS         |B    |http://www.proboard.be
                                 | v2.17 on Jun 9th 2002

      RemoteAccess BBS:    |B    |http://www.rapro.com            1:1/120
       Bruce Morse               | bfmorse@rapro.com
                                 | v2.62.2SW

      Spitfire BBS: Buffalo|B    |http://www.angelfire.com/ia/buffalo/
       Creek Software            | MDWoltz@aol.com                1:1/150
                                 | v3.6 on Aug 20th 1999

      Telegard BBS         |B    |http://www.telegard.net
                                 | support@telegard.net
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 26                  16 Sep 2002


                                 | v3.09g2 SP4
     +- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+

      Atlantis Software    |D    |http://www.jimmyrose.com/atlantis/
                                 | last update: Jun 2002

      BBS Central          |D    |http://www.rpcomputers.com

      Bentstone            |D    |http://www.srupc.com/mall
       Capabilities Group        | info@stonebenders.com

      Cheepware:           |D    |http://www.midnightshour.org/cheepware/
       Sean Dennis               |                               1:11/200

      DDS (Doorware        |D    |http://www.doorgames.org     1:2404/201
       Distribution System)      | ruth@doorgames.org
       Ruth Argust

      DoorMUD              |D    |http://www.dmud.thebbs.org
                                 | v0.98 Jun 1st 2002

      Elysium Software     |D    |http://www.elysoft.com
                                 | mpreslar@mailcity.com

      Jibben Software      |D    |http://www.jibbensoftware.com
                                 | scott@jibben.com
                                 | 1995-99 Release dates

      JNS Software:        |D    |http://www.geocities.com/jnssoftware/
       Rusty Johnson             | rustyjohnson57@hotmail.com
                                 | Tel: (304) 733-0113

      John Dailey Software |D    |http://www.johndaileysoftware.com
                                 | support@johndaileysoftware.com

      LORD (Legend of the  |D    |http://www.lordlegacy.org
       Red Dragon) Reborn        | mike@lordlegacy.org
                                 | v4.06 on Feb 5th 2001

      Lord-II IGMs         |D    |http://www.shelby.net/wizards/lord2igm/

      PC Pursuits          |D    |http://www.pcpursuits.com
                                 | brucep@pop.kis.net
                                 | Tel: (301) 240-6653

      Shining Star         |D    |http://www.shiningstar.net/bbsdoors/
                                 | nannette@shiningstar.net

      Sunrise Doors:       |D    |http://www.sunrisedoors.com
       Al Lawrence               | al@sunrisedoors.com
                                 | Tel: (404) 256-9518

      The Brainex System   |D    |http://www.brainex.com/brainex_system/
                                 | stanley@brainex.com  1994-99 Releases

      Trade Wars           |D    |http://www.eisonline.com/tradewars/
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 27                  16 Sep 2002


                                 | jpritch@eisonline.com
                                 | v3.09 (DOS-32) in 2002

      Vagabond Software:   |D    |http://www.vbsoft.org        1:124/7013
       Bryan Turner              | vagabond@vbsoft.org
                                 | last update: Jul 17th 2002

      (various)            |D    |http://www.webnexus.com/users/etow/
     +- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+

      APoint               |PI   |http://www.apoint-mail.de
                                 | dirk.pokorny@apoint-mail.de
                                 | v1.25                   2:2426/1210.13

      OpenXP/32            |PI   |http://www.openxp.com        2:248/2004
                                 | mk@openxp.de  v3.8.7 beta Aug 3rd 2002
      OpenXP/16            |P    |http://www.openxp16.de       2:2433/460
                                 | my@openxp16.de v3.40 RC3 Apr 28th 2002
      CrossPoint (XP)      |P    |http://www.crosspoint.de
                                 | pm@crosspoint.de  v3.12d Dec 22nd 1999

      PPoint               |P    |http://www.alcuf.ca           1:249/114
                                 | v3.04 on Jan 10th 2000

      Terminate            |P    |http://www.terminate.com
                                 | v5.00 on Aug 7th 1997
     +- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+

      GoldEd+              |E    |http://mik.nu/golded-plus/   2:203/6600
                                 | v1.1.5 on Aug 8th 2002

      SqEd32               |E    |http://www.sqed.de
                                 | v1.15 on Dec 15th 1999
     +- - - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+

      GiGo                 |UI   |http://www.gigo.com
                                 | v0109 on Jan 9th 1997

      Internet Rex:        |UI   |http://members.shaw.ca/InternetRex/
       Charles Cruden            | (see Register.Zip for Email) 1:342/806
       (Khan Software)           | v2.29 on Oct 21st 2001

      TransNet             |UI   |http://www.ressl.com.ar/transnet/
                                 | transnet@ressl.com.ar
                                 | v2.11 on Jul 18th 1998

      TransX: Multiboard   |UI   |http://www.multiboard.com/software/
       Communications, Inc.      | support@multiboard.com      1:2401/305
                                 | v3.5
     +- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+

      National BBS List    |?    | http://www.usbbs.org

      Hispanic FIDO/BBS's  |?    | http://www.conecta2.org/pucela_bbs/
       (in Spanish only)         |  (Extensive software & BBS Listings)
     +- - - - - - - - - - -+- - -+- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -+
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 28                  16 Sep 2002


      File Archives: http://archives.thebbs.org  http://www.filegate.org
       http://sysopscorner.thebbs.org  http://www.juge.com
       http://www.dmine.com/bbscorner/

      Note: Please send corrections & additions to: Ben Ritchey, 1:393/68
             E-mail FIDONet(at)Bellsouth(dot)net      BBS (337) 232-4155


     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 29                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                            FIDONET BY INTERNET
     =================================================================

                       . -- -- -- -- --- -- -- -- -- .
                       |    FIDONET-RELATED SITES    |
                       ` -- -- -- -- --- -- -- -- -- '
                                2002-09-07

     Send updates, corrections and suggestions to Shannon Talley, 1:275/311
     or fbi@fidotel.com.  Please ensure your website is operational before
     submitting. All websites will be checked at least once per month. If
     your website is down, or if it is a commerical website advertising
     products or services, it will be removed from the queue.


     FidoNet Email subscriptions:
     http://www.fidonews.org
     http://www.fidotel.com

     FidoNet
     Homepage:     http://www.fidonet.org
                   http://www.fidonet.ca
     FidoNews:     http://www.fidonews.org   [HTML]
                   http://www.fidotel.com/public/fidonews [HTML & FTP]
                   ftp://ftp.nwstar.com/fidonet/fidonews/ [FTP]
     Echolist:     http://www.tlchost.net/echolist/
                   ftp://ftp.nwstar.com/fidonet/echolist/
     SDS Files:    None
     FTSC page:    http://www.ftsc.org/
     General:      http://www.writebynight.com/fidonet.html
                   http://www.fidotel.com
     Parody:       http://www.fidonet.ro/

     Zone 1:       http://www.z1.fidonet.org
       Region 10:  http://www.r10.org
         Net 102   http://home.earthlink.net/~kayshapero/net102.htm
         Net 103:  http://www.webworldinc.com/club103/
       Region 12
         Net 229:  http://net229.darktech.org/
       Region 13:  http://www.ispaceonline.org/region13/
         Net 261:  http://www.baltimorepress.com/~net261/
         Net 267:  http://www.angelfire.com/ny4/net267/
         Net 275:  http://www.ispaceonline.org/net275/

       Region 14:
         Net 282:  http://www.rxn.com/~net282/
       Region 15:  http://www.bobsplc.com/public/reg15
       Region 17:  http://www.region17.net
         Net 140:  http://www.nwstar.com/~net140
       Region 19:  http://www.biseonline.com/r19
         Net 124:  http://www.DallasInet.com/net124/
                   http://pages.sbcglobal.net/flv/
         Net 393:  http://www.chatter.com/~wb/

     Zone 2:       http://www.z2.fidonet.org
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 30                  16 Sep 2002


       Region 20:  http://www.fidonet.pp.se (in Swedish)
       Region 23:  http://www.fido.dk (in Danish)

       Region 24:  http://www.was-ist-fido.de/ (German)
         Fido-IP:  http://home.nrh.de/fido/ (English/German)
       Region 26:  http://www.nemesis.ie
       Region 27:  http://telematique.org/ft/r27.htm
       Region 29:  http://www.fidonet.be  (French)
       Region 34:  http://www.pobox.com/cnb/r34.htm  (Spanish)
           REC34:  http://www.fidospain.org
       Region 38:  http://public.st.carnet.hr/~blagi/bbs/adriam.html
       Region 41:  http://www.fidonet.gr (Greek/English)
       Region 50:  http://www.fido7.com/  (Russian)
       Region 53:  http://fido.bitsoft.ro/
        Net 5010:  http://fido.tu-chel.ac.ru/  (Russian)
        Net 5015:  http://www.fido.nnov.ru/  (Russian)

     Zone 3:       http://www.z3.fidonet.org

     Zone 4:
       Region 80:  http://www.rbt.com.br (Portuguese)
         Net 904:  http://members.tripod.com/~net904 (Spanish)

     Zone 5:       http://www.eastcape.co.za/fidonet/

     Zone 6:       http://www.z6.fidonet.org
       Region 64:  http://www.fidonet.ph (Pacific Islands/Japan,
                   Guam, Indoesia and the Phillipines)
       Region 65:  http://www.cfido.com (Chinese)


               Fidonet Via Internet Hubs provided by FidoTel.com



     Node#      | Operator          | Facilities (*) | Speed,| Basic Rate
                |                   |                |latency|
     -----------+-------------------+----------------+-------+------------
     Zone 1     |                   |                |       |
       10/3     | Brenda Donovan    | FTP,UUE,BinkP  | 384K,30| n/c
       10/345   | Todd Cochrane     | FTP,BinkP,VMOT | T1,!  | n/c
       18/500   | Ross Cassell      | FTP, BinkP     |128K+,!| n/c
      103/5     | Mark Luetger      | BinkP          | CABLE | n/c
      103/301   | Joe Jared         | BinkP,FTP,NFS  | 384k,!| n/c
      103/401   | Warren Bonner     | BinkP          | aDSL,!| n/c
      105/8     | Russ Johnson      | FTP,BinkP,VMoT | 384k  | n/c
      105/72    | Larry James       | FTP, BinkP     | aDSL  | $50/yr
      106/1     | Steve Loupe       | BinkP, FTP     | 768k  | FREE
      106/2000  | Bob Juge        | BinkP VMoT FTP TX| ???   | n/c
      106/6018  | Lawrence Garvin   | FTP, VMoT      | aDSL,60| n/c
      107/453   | Jeffrey Estevez| FTP,BinkP,VMoT,UUE| 56k,60| $10 mo.
      134/11    | Michael Grant  | FTP, BinkP, VMoT UUE, IFCICO,TransX
                                                    aDSL, 60 | n/c
      138/146   | Marc Blakely      | BinkP,FTP      | ???   | n/c
      140/1     | Bob Seaborn       | FTP,BinkP      | T3,30 | $5/$16
      142/906   | Chris Griffin     | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 31                  16 Sep 2002


      150/220   | Dave Nemeth       | UUE            | ???   | n/c
      153/7715  | Dallas Hinton     | BinkD, FTP     | CABLE | ???
      167/133   | Stephen Monteith  | BinkP          | 128k+ | n/c
      167/166   | Jesse Dooling     | POP? UUE TX FTP| ???   | n/c
      218/109   | Matt Munson       | BinkP,UUE,TX   | 33.6k | n/c
      220/10    | groberts|nexusbbs.net |BinkP,FTP,UUE|1.5M+ | n/c
      229/1     | Phil Simpson      | BinkP UUE FTP  | ???   | n/c
      229/2000  | Robert Couture    |BinkP FTP UUE TX| ???   |
      229/622   | Dave Hamilton     | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      250/98    | Darin McBride     | BinkP FTP TX   | ???   | n/c
      250/99    | Brent McLaren     | FTP BinkP      | ???   | n/c
      250/102   | Darin McBride     | BinkP FTP      | ???   | n/c
      267/169   | Philip Lozier     | FTP TX         | ???   | n/c
      261/1380  | Joe Davis         | UUE TX         | ???   | n/c
      275/311   | Shannon Talley|FTP,BinkP,FTP,VMoT,QWK| T1  |n/c
      280/169   | Brian Greenstreet | FTP            | 33.6  | $2mo.
      297/11    | Michael McCabe    | TX             | ???   | n/c
      323/120   | Craig Healy       | VMoT FTP       | ???   | n/c
      342/3     | Richard Dodsworth | BinkP,FTP      | 128K+ | n/c
      393/48    | Ben Ritchey       | UUE:BFDS?      | 33.6k | n/c
      379/1     | Dale Ross         | FTP, BinkP,UUE | 256K+,! n/c
      379/1200  | Chris Cranford    | BinkP FTP TX   | ???   | n/c
      396/45    | Marc Lewis        |BinkP FTP UUE TX| ADSL  | n/c
     2215/300   | Dennis Haddox     | UUE,TX         | CABLE | n/c
     2320/38    | Janis Kracht      | BinkP FTP      | ???   | n/c
     2410/400   | Gary Gilmore      | FTP BinkP      | 384K,60| n/c
     2410/213   | Kevin Bentz       | FTP, BinkP, UUE| Cable | n/c
     2604/104   | Jim Mclaughlin    | FTP,VMoT,UUE   | 33.6  | $1mo
     2624/306   | David Calafrancesco  | VMoT        | 33.6  | n/c
     3613/1275  | @ jyates@bsdi.ldl.net | UUE,FTP    | 28.8  | n/c
     3407/4     | Robert Todd    |FTP,VMoT,UUE,BinkP | 57.6k | n/c
     3632/84    | Robert Todd    |FTP,VMoT,UUE,BinkP | 57.6k | n/c
     3830/5     | Jeff Schrunk      |BinkP FTP TX UUE| ???   | n/c
     3830/9     | Steve Quarrella   |BinkP FTP IFCICO VMoT UUE|?|?
     --------------------------------------------------------------
     Zone 2     |
       20/11    | Henrik Lindhe     | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
       22/222   | Kim Heino         | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
       28/1     | Lody Caenen       | BinkP FTP      | ???   | n/c
       31/1     | Gabriel Plutzar   | BinkP          | T1+   | n/c
       37/37    | Gabor Z. Papp     | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
       47/999   | Andrej Kirejev    | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
       53/558   |Vladimir Hrusca|POP,VMoT,UUE,BinkP,ifcico|2mbs|??
      201/329   | Mats Wallin       | VMoT TX        | ???   | n/c
      201/505   | Gran Eriksson    | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      201/600   | Hkan Andersson   |BinkP,FTP       |512kbps| n/c
      203/600   | Mikael Karlsson   |BinkP,FTP,TX,UUE| 512k  | n/c
      211/37    | Torbjorn Mohn     | BinkP          | 8/2mb | n/c
      221/360   | Tommi Koivula     | BinkP,UUE      | ???   | n/c
      236/205   | Michael Kaaber    | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      240/6298  | Steve Tell        | BinkP UUE      | ???   | n/c
      246/2098  | Volker Imre       | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      252/110   | David Rance       | UUE            | ???   | n/c
      255/90    | Simon Avery       | UUE            | ???   | n/c
      263/950   | Sean Rima         | TX UUE         | ???   | n/c
      280/1027  | Lukas de Groen    | BinkP FTP      | ???   | n/c
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 32                  16 Sep 2002


      280/1601  | Jeroen VanDeLeur  | FTP,UUE        | 64k   | n/c
      280/4312  | Jos Huijnen   | BinkP ifcico UUE TX| ???   | n/c
      280/5003  | Kees van Eeten    | BinkP ifcico   | ???   | n/c
      292/624   | Steven Leeman     | UUE, BinkP     | 128k  | n/c
      292/854   | Ward Dossche      | BinkP UUE TX   | ???   | n/c
      292/2003  | Eric Vaneberck    | BinkP          | 768k  | n/c
      301/1     | Peter Witschi     | BinkP          | 768k  | n/c
      332/807   | Roberto Mascolo   | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      333/0     | M Gianformaggio   | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      335/534   | Mario Mure        | BinkP,VMot,UUE | 64k   | n/c
      335/610   | Gino Lucrezi      | UUE            | 33.6  | n/c
      341/14    | Rafael Suarez     | BinkP VMoT     | ???   | n/c
      341/51    | Jose.Maria Tejada | VMoT           |       |
      341/66    | Angel Ripoll      | VMoT           |       |
      343/168   | Jose Casanova     | VMoT           |       |
      344/201   | Julio Garcia      | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      346/3     | Carlos Navarro    | UUE            | ???   | n/c
      347/1     | Javi Polo         | UUE            |       |
      348/105   | Alejandro Estraviz| BinkP UUE      |       |
      382/100   | Sinisa Burina     | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
      400/555   | Ofir Michaeli     | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
      400/557   | Marius Kaizerman  | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
      423/81    | Milos Bajer       | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      461/256   | Andrew Rutkas     | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
      461/640   | Alex Semenyaka    |BinkP ifcico UUE| ???   | n/c
      465/204   | Va Milushnikov    | BinkP          | 33.6k | n/c
      469/84    | Max Masyutin      | VMoT           | 256k  | n/c
      469/128   | Oleg Vasenyoff    | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
      480/112   | Adam Sarapata| FTP, VMoT, UUE,BinkP| 128k  | n/c
      550/4077  | Serguei Trouchelle| UUE            | ----- | n/c
     2410/201   | Karsten Ebeling   | BinkP UUE      | ???   | n/c
     2411/413   | Dennis Dittrich   | UUE,BinkP      | 64k   | n/c
     2432/200   | Sven Dueker       | BinkP TX UUE   | ???   | n/c
     2446/301   | Lothar Behet  | BinkP,VMoT,UUE,FTP | 64K   | n/c
     2474/275   | Christian Emig    | UUE            | 64k   | unkn
     2487/3000  | Steffen Gross     | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5002/5002  | Victor Belyakov   | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5014/4     | Alex Bagmanov     | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
     5020/52    | Peter Didenko     | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5020/54    | Serge Wizgounoff  | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
     5020/69    | B Chernivetsky    | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5020/238   | Sergey Gubanov    | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5030/115   | Andrey Podkolzin  | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5030/1251  | K Stepanekov      | UUE            | ???   | n/c
     5100/8     | Egons Bush        | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5020/1159  | Gennady Kudryashoff | UUE          | 33.6  | n/c
     5049/12    | Amir Shabashvili  | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5054/3     | Andrew Popov      | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5080/80    | Eugene Zorin      | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
     5083/21    | Alexander Uskov   | BinkP,ifcico   | ???   | n/c
     5090/2     | Andrew Titov      | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     5100/8     | Egons Bush        | BinkP          | ???   | n/c
     --------------------------------------------------------------
     Zone 3
      633/260   | Malcolm Miles     | FTP,BinkP      | 64K   | n/c
      640/954   | Rick Van Ruth     | FTP,VMot,UUE,BinkP| 56K| n/c
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 33                  16 Sep 2002


      712/311   | Bob James         | TX             | ???   | n/c
      774/605   | Barry Blackford|BinkP,VMoT:10023,ifcico,FTP |33.6| n/c
     --------------------------------------------------------------
     Zone 4
      801/161   | Renato Zambon     | UUE            | 33.6  |n/c
      902/18    | Javier Tejedor    | UUE            | 33,6  | n/c
     --------------------------------------------------------------
     Zone 6
       65/3000  | Lawrence Fan      | UUE            | 33600 | free
      653/1009  | Maorong Chen      | UUE            | ???   | free
      654/0     | Bin Li            | UUE,BinkP      | 33600 | free
      654/1501  | Lawrence Fan      | UUE,BinkP      | 28800 | free

     --
     * FTP    = Internet File Transfer Protocol
     * VMoT   = Virtual Mailer over Telnet (various)
     * UUE    = uuencode<->email type transfers
     * BinkP  = front end mailer for TCPIP networks
     * TX     = TransX
     * NFS    = Linux Networking
     * ifcico = ifcico-compatible virtual mailer
     * QWK    = Quick Packets/Offline mailer "networking" capable
     ----------------------------------------------
     Fidonet oriented news servers

     news.fidotel.com (currently offline)
     news.osirusoft.com
     news.tardis.net
     nntp://fido.bitsoft.ro
     nntp://bbs.bitsoft.ro

     Fidonet oriented chat rooms.

     room #fidonet  5PM (PDT 11AM GMT) Sundays
     irc.osirusoft.com  (Peers wanted)
     irc.sinoptix.ro : malay, chinesse, english, #fido, #fidonet, #wwb
     irc.bitsoft.ro : 6667 russian, english, hebrew, #fido, #wwb
     irc.tsua.net : 6668 russian, english #fido

     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 34                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                             SPECIAL INTEREST
     =================================================================

                         Nodelist Stats

      Input nodelist  nodelist.256
                size  1063.9kb
                date  2002-09-13

      The nodelist has   9400 nodes in it
        and a total of  12307 non-comment entries

              including     6 zones
                           58 regions
                          454 hosts
                          649 hubs
         admin overhead  1167 ( 12.41 %)

                    and   953 private nodes
                          448 nodes down
                          339 nodes on hold
      off line overhead  1740 ( 18.51 %)


      Speed summary:

               >9600 =    730 (  7.77 %)
                9600 =   8198 ( 87.21 %)
                              (HST  =  174 or   2.12 %)
                              (CSP  =    1 or   0.01 %)
                              (PEP  =   12 or   0.15 %)
                              (MAX  =    0 or   0.00 %)
                              (HAY  =    1 or   0.01 %)
                              (V32  = 4478 or  54.62 %)
                              (V32B =  460 or   5.61 %)
                              (V34  = 5397 or  65.83 %)
                              (V42  = 4451 or  54.29 %)
                              (V42B =  479 or   5.84 %)
                2400 =     98 (  1.04 %)
                1200 =      8 (  0.09 %)
                 300 =    366 (  3.89 %)

                ISDN =    941 ( 10.01 %)

     ----------------------------------------------------------
      File Req Flag   Applicable software     Number of systems
     ----------------------------------------------------------
      XA              Frontdoor <1.99b             3337
                      Frontdoor  2.02+
                      Dutchie 2.90c
                      Binkleyterm >2.1
                      D'Bridge <1.3
                      TIMS
                      Xenia
     --------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 35                  16 Sep 2002


      XB              Binkleyterm 2.0                 8
                      Dutchie 2.90b
     --------------------------------------
      XC              Opus 1.1                       10
     --------------------------------------
      XP              Seadog                          6
     --------------------------------------
      XR              Opus 1.03                      55
     --------------------------------------
      XW              Fido >12M                     384
                      Tabby
                      KittenMail
     --------------------------------------
      XX              D'Bridge 1.30                4172
                      Frontdoor 1.99b
                      Intermail 2.01
                      T-Mail
     --------------------------------------
      None            QMM                          1428
     --------------------------------------

      CrashMail capable =   2992 ( 31.83 %)
      MailOnly nodes    =   5101 ( 54.27 %)
      Listed-only nodes =    728 (  7.74 %)
      Other             =    579 (  6.16 %)

      [Report produced by NETSTATS - A PD pgm available from 1:106/100]
      [                                 Revised by B Felten, 2:203/208]

     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 36                  16 Sep 2002


     =================================================================
                           FIDONEWS INFORMATION
     =================================================================

                            How to Submit an Article

     If you wish to submit an article for inclusion in the Fidonews, here
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     b) Put a title to the article. Put the title in two times. The first
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     c) Deadline for article submission is Sunday, 12:00 UTC.

     Help the Editor by following the above guides. Below are some subjects
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     Ideas for Subject areas:

         Subject                  File |      Subject                 File
     ----------------------------------|----------------------------------
      From the *C's              *.css |  Rebuttals to articles      *.reb
      Fidonet Regional News      *.reg |  Fidonet Net News           *.net
      Retractions                *.rtx |  General Fidonet Articles   *.art
      Guest Editorial            *.gue |  Fidonet Current Events     *.cur
      Fidonet Interviews         *.inv |  Fidonet Software Reviews   *.rev
      Fidonet Web Page Reviews   *.web |  Fidonet Notices            *.not
      Getting Fidonet Technical  *.ftc |  Question Of The Week       *.que
      Humor in a Fido Vein       *.hfv |  Comix in ASCII             *.cmx
      Fidonet's Int. Kitchen     *.rec |  Poet's Corner              *.poe
      Clean Humor & Jokes        *.jok |  Other Stuff                *.oth
      Fidonet Classified Ads     *.ads |  Corrections                *.cor
      Best of Fidonet            *.bof |

     If you don't know or are not sure, send the article anyway. Put a .TXT
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     If you follow these simple guidelines, there should be little problem
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     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 37                  16 Sep 2002


     Send Articles via E-mail or Netmail, file attach or message to:

              Bjrn Felten
     Fidonet  2:2/2
     E-Mail   bfelten@telia.com

     Please include a message, telling me that you have sent an article.
     That way I will know to look for it.


     -----------------------------------------------------------------
     FIDONEWS 19-37               Page 38                  16 Sep 2002


                    Credits, Legal Infomation, Availability

     + -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --  FIDONEWS STAFF - -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
     |                                                                |
     | Editor:        Bjrn Felten, 2:2/2, editor@fidonews.org        |
     |                Crash mail attached: Editor@2:2/2               |
     |                E-Mail attached:     bfelten@telia.com          |
     | Webmaster:     Jim Barchuk, jb@fidonews.org                    |
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     |                                                                |
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     + -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -  EDITORS EMERITI - -- -- -- -- -- -- -- +
     |                                                                |
     |       Tom Jennings, Thom Henderson, Dale Lovell, Vince         |
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     |                                                                |
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     at one of the addresses above.

     The weekly edition of Fidonews is distributed through the file
     area FIDONEWS, and is published as echomail in the echo FIDONEWS.
     These sources are normally available through your Network
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     + -- -- -- -- -- -- -  FIDONEWS AVAILABILITY - -- -- -- -- -- -- +
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